| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:54 - Feb 17 with 1148 views | RegencyBlue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 10:06 - Feb 17 by CaptainObvious |
another one who "accepts the verdict" then illustrates 100 ways in which he hasn't accepted the verdict. |
Indeed!
This seems to be coming down to a 'Democracy is fine as long as the plebs vote the way you want them to argument!' |  | |  |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:55 - Feb 17 with 1136 views | feelingblue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:31 - Feb 17 by chicoazul |
German manufacturers and French farmers and Dutch chessemakers and Benelux bureaucrats in nice suits & Oliver People glasses. The people the EU was designed to support. |
Another reasoned piece of analysis. Do you really believe that?
Do you think that is why we, the Swedes, Danes and Finns, the Spanish and Portuguese, the Italians, the Irish, The Baltic States, the Central European countries all wanted to join? So that we could support 'German manufacturers and French farmers and Dutch chessemakers and Benelux bureaucrats in nice suits & Oliver People glasses.'
Are all Europeans, except the minority of the UK electorate who voted out that stupid? |  | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:02 - Feb 17 with 1113 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:37 - Feb 17 by feelingblue |
I looked at the automaticearth Greece website, and there is nothing there which disagrees with anything I wrote. Indeed some of the historic economic analysis supports my post exactly.
Suggest that you reread my post and have a think before handing out insults. |
https://www.theautomaticearth.com/2015/07/was-greece-set-up-to-fail/
If after reading this you think the crisis was down to Greeks rather than global finance (Goldman Sachs cooked the books) interests I would be surprised (It's a whole lot bigger than their elites not paying taxes) Golem is full of info on the derivatives minefield within Deutschebank.
In my experience Greeks (the normal ones)work bl00dy hard. |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:06 - Feb 17 with 1100 views | chicoazul |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:55 - Feb 17 by feelingblue |
Another reasoned piece of analysis. Do you really believe that?
Do you think that is why we, the Swedes, Danes and Finns, the Spanish and Portuguese, the Italians, the Irish, The Baltic States, the Central European countries all wanted to join? So that we could support 'German manufacturers and French farmers and Dutch chessemakers and Benelux bureaucrats in nice suits & Oliver People glasses.'
Are all Europeans, except the minority of the UK electorate who voted out that stupid? |
There you go, at least youre not disingenuous about it, you have the bravery to say what you think. "People who voted leave are stupid". |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:09 - Feb 17 with 1090 views | Darth_Koont |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:06 - Feb 17 by chicoazul |
There you go, at least youre not disingenuous about it, you have the bravery to say what you think. "People who voted leave are stupid". |
You're certainly being a bit thick yourself today if you couldn't spot the angle to the question. |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:10 - Feb 17 with 1084 views | feelingblue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:02 - Feb 17 by BanksterDebtSlave |
https://www.theautomaticearth.com/2015/07/was-greece-set-up-to-fail/
If after reading this you think the crisis was down to Greeks rather than global finance (Goldman Sachs cooked the books) interests I would be surprised (It's a whole lot bigger than their elites not paying taxes) Golem is full of info on the derivatives minefield within Deutschebank.
In my experience Greeks (the normal ones)work bl00dy hard. |
Most of that is referring to post 2008.
I was talking about Greece joining the Euro, something in which they were entirely complicit. No-one forced them to fiddle their books or to take allegedly/apparently dodgy loans from GS.
As for your last point
It's the same the whole world over,
It's the poor what gets the blame,
It's the rich what gets the pleasure,
Ain't it all f**ing shame?
Yes it is and I applaud anyone who is trying to change that. | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:26 - Feb 17 with 1033 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 12:27 - Feb 17 by chicoazul |
"People who voted leave are stupid" |
Maybe but, I believe it safe to say a hell of a lot of people have no idea of what leaving means.
That much is evident listening to MP's during the debate in the HoC even they have no idea what might happen. |  | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:29 - Feb 17 with 1047 views | Vic |
He's lost all credibility as far as I'm concerned. He might be right, but I just can't believe anything he says anymore. |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:32 - Feb 17 with 1035 views | Benters |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 08:50 - Feb 17 by factual_blue |
So people no longer have the right to protest about things they think are wrong? |
As long as its peaceful they can protest all they like.
It wont change anything . |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:32 - Feb 17 with 1022 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:29 - Feb 17 by Vic |
He's lost all credibility as far as I'm concerned. He might be right, but I just can't believe anything he says anymore. |
Doesn't that go for most politicians?
Look at the front bench of this unelected government - would you trust any of the with a five pence piece? | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:39 - Feb 17 with 1014 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:10 - Feb 17 by feelingblue |
Most of that is referring to post 2008.
I was talking about Greece joining the Euro, something in which they were entirely complicit. No-one forced them to fiddle their books or to take allegedly/apparently dodgy loans from GS.
As for your last point
It's the same the whole world over,
It's the poor what gets the blame,
It's the rich what gets the pleasure,
Ain't it all f**ing shame?
Yes it is and I applaud anyone who is trying to change that. |
Then I think we are largely in agreement...when I read "the Greeks are to blame...", I picture the average man/woman, not that country's elites (who clearly are complicit but get to sail off into the distance on their swanky yachts.
So a matter of semantics, sorry if I offended but the 'feckless Greek' thing really gets my goat. | |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:41 - Feb 17 with 1008 views | feelingblue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:32 - Feb 17 by No9 |
Doesn't that go for most politicians?
Look at the front bench of this unelected government - would you trust any of the with a five pence piece? |
Sorry, but I wish that people would stop all this 'unelected government' stuff.
The Tories had the largest number of MPs after the last election, and were therefore asked to form a government by our hereditary head of state. They then changed party leader and chose another one. Thereis no duty to elect a party leader. The party leader of the largest party is usually the Prime Minister.
That is what always happens. None of of us have ever elected a Prime Minister.
Having said that, I think that this a particularly incompetent and unqualified front bench, and I also think that the entire first past the post system is not fit for purpose and makes it easy for governments to get away with appointing incompetent and unqualified ministers. | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:56 - Feb 17 with 985 views | Guthrum |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:41 - Feb 17 by feelingblue |
Sorry, but I wish that people would stop all this 'unelected government' stuff.
The Tories had the largest number of MPs after the last election, and were therefore asked to form a government by our hereditary head of state. They then changed party leader and chose another one. Thereis no duty to elect a party leader. The party leader of the largest party is usually the Prime Minister.
That is what always happens. None of of us have ever elected a Prime Minister.
Having said that, I think that this a particularly incompetent and unqualified front bench, and I also think that the entire first past the post system is not fit for purpose and makes it easy for governments to get away with appointing incompetent and unqualified ministers. |
Your last paragraph certainly true when, through entrenched party systems and fear of coalitions, they are only able to draw on what talent is available in their own lot, rather than the House as a whole. |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:57 - Feb 17 with 976 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:41 - Feb 17 by feelingblue |
Sorry, but I wish that people would stop all this 'unelected government' stuff.
The Tories had the largest number of MPs after the last election, and were therefore asked to form a government by our hereditary head of state. They then changed party leader and chose another one. Thereis no duty to elect a party leader. The party leader of the largest party is usually the Prime Minister.
That is what always happens. None of of us have ever elected a Prime Minister.
Having said that, I think that this a particularly incompetent and unqualified front bench, and I also think that the entire first past the post system is not fit for purpose and makes it easy for governments to get away with appointing incompetent and unqualified ministers. |
My view about the 'unelected government' is simply this.
The tories election manifesto was based on the EU being its cornerstone of political & economical policy based on the UK staying in the EU. It won the 2015 on that manifesto.
That is clear as they had no plans to leave th EU & had no alternative policies.
They won the election but lost the referendum. That result was as big a vote of no confidence in the tories as you could get. The sheer arrogance of people who lose then continue to adminster without any madate other than to leave the EU is outrageous ( Cameron even believed he could continue as PM), particularly when you see all the changes thay are making in ediuucation & public services which are in no policy documents other than those made on the hoof hoping the public won't notice.
I do appreciate that another election may well have given us more UKip MP's but as it is we are now leaving the EU on UKips T's & C's and who knows what they will do next?
Our electoral system needs urgent change but we are unlikely to get that unless Blair can get enough support to bring is a genuine experienced person to head up change because the enxt move by the tories will, if they feel threatened in the Lords will be to just inject a whole bunch more tame tories, then we may as well concede democarcy is dead.
Sorry to be so gloomy
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:03 - Feb 17 with 969 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
For a footie angle Blair's argument can be summed up as " you don't know what you're doing....."......just what you want to hear from a perceived elite. | |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:19 - Feb 17 with 951 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:03 - Feb 17 by BanksterDebtSlave |
For a footie angle Blair's argument can be summed up as " you don't know what you're doing....."......just what you want to hear from a perceived elite. |
Well you may say that but look at the elite & money on the 'leave' side? | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:23 - Feb 17 with 949 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:32 - Feb 17 by Benters |
As long as its peaceful they can protest all they like.
It wont change anything . |
& what will you (we & us) do when the NHS goes and the council tax escalates up the scale to pay for this?
Take a good look at what is coming out of the tories now, you don't even have to be clever to work it out | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:36 - Feb 17 with 936 views | GlasgowBlue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:23 - Feb 17 by No9 |
& what will you (we & us) do when the NHS goes and the council tax escalates up the scale to pay for this?
Take a good look at what is coming out of the tories now, you don't even have to be clever to work it out |
Have you given up hoping for a Labour government then?
Surely the things you are talking about are not related to the EU and are under the control of the UK government? |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:46 - Feb 17 with 924 views | DoobDude |
I do agree that someone should speak up for the 48% of the population.
However that person should not be Blair, who is completely discredited and will only make this debate even more toxic.
And the suspicion is he is only worried about the money he lost now he can no longer be EU Commissioner. |  |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:07 - Feb 17 with 896 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:36 - Feb 17 by GlasgowBlue |
Have you given up hoping for a Labour government then?
Surely the things you are talking about are not related to the EU and are under the control of the UK government? |
You know you must be the thickest poster on this site.
How many times do I have to tell you I have no political affiliations?
As for your second para, it is now matter of record you don't know enough about the EU to comment on any of its workings | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:11 - Feb 17 with 890 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:46 - Feb 17 by DoobDude |
I do agree that someone should speak up for the 48% of the population.
However that person should not be Blair, who is completely discredited and will only make this debate even more toxic.
And the suspicion is he is only worried about the money he lost now he can no longer be EU Commissioner. |
It is more than 48% of the population isn't it?
In the Scottish referendum in the 70's it was made very clear to the Scottish electorate that a non vote would be considered as a vote for the status quo.
If Cameron had been serious about the UK staying in the EU he would have had a similar statement attached to the EU referendum. & On that basis we would not be where we are now which is a place where we find ourselves now. | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:13 - Feb 17 with 886 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 14:19 - Feb 17 by No9 |
Well you may say that but look at the elite & money on the 'leave' side? |
Yep, they've got their fingers in all of the pies haven't they. | |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:17 - Feb 17 with 876 views | GlasgowBlue |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:07 - Feb 17 by No9 |
You know you must be the thickest poster on this site.
How many times do I have to tell you I have no political affiliations?
As for your second para, it is now matter of record you don't know enough about the EU to comment on any of its workings |
Now now. There is no need to be abusive. | |
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| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 16:00 - Feb 17 with 830 views | No9 |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 15:17 - Feb 17 by GlasgowBlue |
Now now. There is no need to be abusive. |
Just taking another leaf out of your book old boy | | | |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 16:46 - Feb 17 with 806 views | walang |
| I agree with Tony Blair.... on 13:02 - Feb 17 by BanksterDebtSlave |
https://www.theautomaticearth.com/2015/07/was-greece-set-up-to-fail/
If after reading this you think the crisis was down to Greeks rather than global finance (Goldman Sachs cooked the books) interests I would be surprised (It's a whole lot bigger than their elites not paying taxes) Golem is full of info on the derivatives minefield within Deutschebank.
In my experience Greeks (the normal ones)work bl00dy hard. |
https://www.theautomaticearth.com/2015/07/was-greece-set-up-to-fail/
If after reading this you think the crisis was down to Greeks rather than global finance (Goldman Sachs cooked the books) interests I would be surprised (It's a whole lot bigger than their elites not paying taxes) Golem is full of info on the derivatives minefield within Deutschebank.
In my experience Greeks (the normal ones)work bl00dy hard.
In my experience I agree but only those self employed !
Oh and I think Tony Bliar should be taken to court for trying to subvert the will of the people, an odious individual with absolutely no credibility ! [Post edited 17 Feb 2017 16:50]
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