| Has Mick won everyone over yet 08:48 - Feb 19 with 7519 views | Bluefish |
Or are the modern fans still demanding a change?
We have repeatedly been told the following need to change and them they will support him
Entertaining football
Change the formation
Stop playing Douglas
Pick the young full backs
Change the midfield
Be less direct
Move chambers to the middle
Make us hard to beat
Get the feel good factor back
He has done everything that could be asked of him despite the requirements changing regularly but I expect there will be new requirements or it will be claimed as too late. The fact is these fans don't care about those things they just want a change because that is what happens in modern football. Keeping the manager is old school and not I line with the desperation for Premier league football at all costs.
Mick has turned us round after a horror show of a season with injuries. Yes he has been stubborn at times but he has pulled us thorough it and we look good.
Ups and down, thick and thin
Believe! |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:40 - Feb 19 with 1101 views | Garv |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 10:45 - Feb 19 by Guthrum |
Or you could say that poor transfer dealings and injuries forced McCarthy's team to play badly until he was able to sort things out with players returning, youngsters proving they were ready and some judicious, but cheap, additions (which he couldn't make until January).
There's no longer an "Emergency" Loan window to make running repairs to the squad if players get injured or don't work out. McCarthy's comments, particularly post-match, over recent months showed he knew how bad it was.
Look at the players he had available: With Hyam, Bishop, Coke and Williams injured, he had the options in central midfield of the primarily defensive Skuse, the less mobile Douglas, Bru, whose performances can be patchy and the inexperienced, physically slight, 17-year-old Dozzell. Ward had to go wide right and Lawrence on the left as there were no other real candidates for those roles. People groan when Douglas comes on, but who else was there?
Up front (having lost our mobile big man right at the end of the window) we were stuck with the out-of-form Sears, Pitman who is more of an impact goalpoacher and Best, who just didn't work.
When Berra's form started to wobble at the back, there was nobody to replace him with, given Webster was already injured.
It's all very well to say that the Manager should have signed better players back in the summer, but so many recent transfer windows have shown that ITFC does not have the available budget to compete with many other teams in the division for players of already proven quality. When you're shopping amongst the disregarded and the undiscovered, there's always going to be an appreciable failure rate (same as with youths graduating from the Academy).
You can't make a nice table with a blunt saw and a broken hammer. But at least we're not having to eat our tea off our laps any more. |
If you ask the manager he will say Cole Skuse is a premier league player in waiting. And he never leaves him out, so don't take pity on Mick for having to rely on him. |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:48 - Feb 19 with 1078 views | Superfrans |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:31 - Feb 19 by braveblue |
Will need to see it for more than a couple of games. |
Seven games including the QPR game on Jan 2, more like. |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:51 - Feb 19 with 1071 views | Garv |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 10:49 - Feb 19 by Reuser_is_God |
If we refuse to pay £2m for Huws we may as well give up. |
You'd seriously go that far? After 4 games? | |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:54 - Feb 19 with 1067 views | No9 |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 10:45 - Feb 19 by Guthrum |
Or you could say that poor transfer dealings and injuries forced McCarthy's team to play badly until he was able to sort things out with players returning, youngsters proving they were ready and some judicious, but cheap, additions (which he couldn't make until January).
There's no longer an "Emergency" Loan window to make running repairs to the squad if players get injured or don't work out. McCarthy's comments, particularly post-match, over recent months showed he knew how bad it was.
Look at the players he had available: With Hyam, Bishop, Coke and Williams injured, he had the options in central midfield of the primarily defensive Skuse, the less mobile Douglas, Bru, whose performances can be patchy and the inexperienced, physically slight, 17-year-old Dozzell. Ward had to go wide right and Lawrence on the left as there were no other real candidates for those roles. People groan when Douglas comes on, but who else was there?
Up front (having lost our mobile big man right at the end of the window) we were stuck with the out-of-form Sears, Pitman who is more of an impact goalpoacher and Best, who just didn't work.
When Berra's form started to wobble at the back, there was nobody to replace him with, given Webster was already injured.
It's all very well to say that the Manager should have signed better players back in the summer, but so many recent transfer windows have shown that ITFC does not have the available budget to compete with many other teams in the division for players of already proven quality. When you're shopping amongst the disregarded and the undiscovered, there's always going to be an appreciable failure rate (same as with youths graduating from the Academy).
You can't make a nice table with a blunt saw and a broken hammer. But at least we're not having to eat our tea off our laps any more. |
Don't loose sight of the fact this is now a MM squad.
Many time he has said he is happy with the squad and even suggested it was / is the best in the division.
Berra's capabilty began to wobble long before this season & there have been many groans about this player, that player, the other player - including Hyam & Douglas, can't play with Skuse.
Any problems with the squad are clearly of MM's making. I have no doubt he would have stuck with his failing formula had circumstances played him a hand he would never have wanted.
What we have seen since reading is inspite of MM not bacause of his managerial abilities. |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:00 - Feb 19 with 1065 views | J4ck22 |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:54 - Feb 19 by No9 |
Don't loose sight of the fact this is now a MM squad.
Many time he has said he is happy with the squad and even suggested it was / is the best in the division.
Berra's capabilty began to wobble long before this season & there have been many groans about this player, that player, the other player - including Hyam & Douglas, can't play with Skuse.
Any problems with the squad are clearly of MM's making. I have no doubt he would have stuck with his failing formula had circumstances played him a hand he would never have wanted.
What we have seen since reading is inspite of MM not bacause of his managerial abilities. |
I'm sure all of us fans really wanted Knudsen and Spence to play in a back three... Yes Mick's hand was forced, but let's not act like that's what we were crying out for. Before Huws and Diagouraga, we didn't have much option for the physical, tough midfielder and the box to box style other than Skuse, Douglas or Bru. Mick brought those players in and now our midfield looks much better because we've got better players in those positions. I also saw no one demanding that Ward be played centrally but we seem to be taking credit for that one as well. | | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:07 - Feb 19 with 1059 views | Guthrum |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 11:55 - Feb 19 by ClausThomsen |
" he had the options in central midfield of the primarily defensive Skuse, the less mobile Douglas, Bru, whose performances can be patchy and the inexperienced, physically slight, 17-year-old Dozzell. Ward had to go wide right and Lawrence on the left as there were no other real candidates for those roles. People groan when Douglas comes on, but who else was there? "
Grant Ward as it turns out - played there for Rotherham last season and when he came on as a substitute and scored a hattrick on his debut. And he's started playing there again in our recent run of form... Douglas' constant inclusion is indefensible. If we enter a season with no players to play in certain positions, that's Mick's fault.
If McCarthy's style of play was so dependent on a targetman, then he shouldn't have entered a season with just the one, who was 33 anyway and had just played in the Euros (and looked a bit knackered the previous season). But he stubbornly stuck with his "winning football" while we struggled to even test the opposition keeper.
We could have played in our current shape all season - only Huws and Spence were additions to the XI yesterday. Bru/Bishop could have played instead of Huws and Emmanuel instead of Spence - we could have signed Spence any time after his trial anyway.
But we've wasted all that time "matching up"...
Wait till we're safe then get Rowett in, Birmingham's loss is going to be someone else's gain - might as well be ours. |
Put Ward in the middle, who plays wide right?
f the club are shopping on a budget and some of those signings don't work out, how much of that is McCarthy's fault? Particularly true for strikers, generally the most expensive of players.
Bru is hardly a direct match for the job Huws is doing. Bishop has been injured for much of the season.
At the start of this season Emmanuel, a few days short of his 19th birthday, had played only two full Championship games (plus a half struggling against Brighton, one very late sub, three cup games and a loan to Crawley where he only played twice). Was he at that time clearly ready to play 46 games at right (wing) back? No. |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:31 - Feb 19 with 1035 views | Guthrum |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:54 - Feb 19 by No9 |
Don't loose sight of the fact this is now a MM squad.
Many time he has said he is happy with the squad and even suggested it was / is the best in the division.
Berra's capabilty began to wobble long before this season & there have been many groans about this player, that player, the other player - including Hyam & Douglas, can't play with Skuse.
Any problems with the squad are clearly of MM's making. I have no doubt he would have stuck with his failing formula had circumstances played him a hand he would never have wanted.
What we have seen since reading is inspite of MM not bacause of his managerial abilities. |
If that were true, why is he not still starting Douglas in midfield and Chambers at RB? There's nothing to stop him - apart from his 'managerial abilities' telling him there are better alternatives.
McCarthy started experimenting with the setup some time before Reading. Douglas hasn't started a League game since Boxing Day. Three at the back appeared with the new year.
It is a McCarthy squad, but not one assembled with complete freedom of choice. There has, very obviously, been a limit on the budget available and thus the (known) quality of the players he's been able to sign. I'm sure he would have liked a Kightly out wide, or a Hugill up front, would have improved the team, but that was beyond his means.
And the manager is hardly going to come out and publicly label his squad as below par, is he? In terms of performing beyond its face value, we do have one of the best units in the division, consistently top ten/play-off challengers for all of McCarthy's full seasons at the club, without big spending. | |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:38 - Feb 19 with 1026 views | Guthrum |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:48 - Feb 19 by Superfrans |
Seven games including the QPR game on Jan 2, more like. |
Somebody on the radio last night sent in a text "one swallow doesn't make a summer" - how many swallows do they need? | |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet (n/t) on 14:40 - Feb 19 with 1018 views | Superfrans |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:38 - Feb 19 by Guthrum |
Somebody on the radio last night sent in a text "one swallow doesn't make a summer" - how many swallows do they need? |
Reality is, we've been trying to play a more passing game since September. We brought in players specifically designed to do that - Ward, Lawrence, Williams - and didn't even target a big man up front when we sold Murphy (we bid for Conor Washington, not at all a Murphy type). But we lost key players to injury (McGoldrick, Williams, Pitman). We're now seeing more what MM was trying to achieve this season. And it looks good. [Post edited 19 Feb 2017 14:43]
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:44 - Feb 19 with 1011 views | Guthrum |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:40 - Feb 19 by Garv |
If you ask the manager he will say Cole Skuse is a premier league player in waiting. And he never leaves him out, so don't take pity on Mick for having to rely on him. |
Skuse does do a pretty good job. He just doesn't have that extra, attacking, dimension to his game which Diagouraga displays.
And, again, unless you genuinely mean not to use them ever again (e.g. Best), are you really going to talk down your players in the press? Especially when it isn't due to lack of effort. | |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:49 - Feb 19 with 998 views | PJH |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 13:48 - Feb 19 by Superfrans |
Seven games including the QPR game on Jan 2, more like. |
I think we have played well in part or all of 9 of the last 14 games,the exceptions being Lincoln(twice),Fulham,Huddersfield and Derby.
We have had 4 good performances on the bounce since the very poor one against Derby. |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:00 - Feb 19 with 991 views | ClausThomsen |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:07 - Feb 19 by Guthrum |
Put Ward in the middle, who plays wide right?
f the club are shopping on a budget and some of those signings don't work out, how much of that is McCarthy's fault? Particularly true for strikers, generally the most expensive of players.
Bru is hardly a direct match for the job Huws is doing. Bishop has been injured for much of the season.
At the start of this season Emmanuel, a few days short of his 19th birthday, had played only two full Championship games (plus a half struggling against Brighton, one very late sub, three cup games and a loan to Crawley where he only played twice). Was he at that time clearly ready to play 46 games at right (wing) back? No. |
Who plays wide right? Ask Mick - we went into the season with only Grant Ward able to play there (and it seems he's much better suited to central midfield - where he was playing for Rotherham). Like I said, if the squad only has one player that can play a position then that's the manager's fault.
Bru, Bishop or Dozzell could play in Huws spot, even Lawrence could play there in a 3 - all options available to MM for most of the season.
Mick himself stated that Emmanuel and Kenlock were first team players he could rely upon, Spence has been available since his trial.
I'd love to know what Mick's plan was for this season, the squad was unbalanced before Murphy left. I don't think he had a first XI until he'd seen the other team play, then he works on "matching up" and picking the XI players that have the most busted nuts from training. It's been a good month but far too many months before it have been pure drivel. There's no excuses for Mick, he's an experienced manager. | | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:00 - Feb 19 with 987 views | No9 |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:44 - Feb 19 by Guthrum |
Skuse does do a pretty good job. He just doesn't have that extra, attacking, dimension to his game which Diagouraga displays.
And, again, unless you genuinely mean not to use them ever again (e.g. Best), are you really going to talk down your players in the press? Especially when it isn't due to lack of effort. |
A point you may wish to consider is that after Bru cam on yesterday (60 Min's) Town had 5 of their 9 corners in that last half hour.
A question is why di Chambers have to spend so much time supporting Berra - unfortunately this lead to the Leeds goal when Woods had lost Berra & Chambers just could not out jump Woods.
Woods tunred up several times in the second half with Chambers tightly marking him. Was it a deliberate move to get Chambers on Woods or was it just good marking by the skipper?
As an aside, anyoen notice how poor the playing surface looked? | | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:06 - Feb 19 with 965 views | ClausThomsen |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 12:58 - Feb 19 by LankHenners |
So you are critical of Mick's style of football but advocate Rowett as a replacement? Wow. |
Have you seen Birmingham's squad?
They were 7th when he was sacked, we were umpteenth.
He did alright at Burton as well. | | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:06 - Feb 19 with 965 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:00 - Feb 19 by No9 |
A point you may wish to consider is that after Bru cam on yesterday (60 Min's) Town had 5 of their 9 corners in that last half hour.
A question is why di Chambers have to spend so much time supporting Berra - unfortunately this lead to the Leeds goal when Woods had lost Berra & Chambers just could not out jump Woods.
Woods tunred up several times in the second half with Chambers tightly marking him. Was it a deliberate move to get Chambers on Woods or was it just good marking by the skipper?
As an aside, anyoen notice how poor the playing surface looked? |
Fred - were you even there?
Berra had his best game for a long while and had Wood in his pocket for most of the game |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet (n/t) on 15:27 - Feb 19 with 941 views | No9 |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet (n/t) on 14:40 - Feb 19 by Superfrans |
Reality is, we've been trying to play a more passing game since September. We brought in players specifically designed to do that - Ward, Lawrence, Williams - and didn't even target a big man up front when we sold Murphy (we bid for Conor Washington, not at all a Murphy type). But we lost key players to injury (McGoldrick, Williams, Pitman). We're now seeing more what MM was trying to achieve this season. And it looks good. [Post edited 19 Feb 2017 14:43]
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You really don't think MM's hand has been forced to do what we are seeing now? | | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:44 - Feb 19 with 932 views | monty_radio |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 14:00 - Feb 19 by J4ck22 |
I'm sure all of us fans really wanted Knudsen and Spence to play in a back three... Yes Mick's hand was forced, but let's not act like that's what we were crying out for. Before Huws and Diagouraga, we didn't have much option for the physical, tough midfielder and the box to box style other than Skuse, Douglas or Bru. Mick brought those players in and now our midfield looks much better because we've got better players in those positions. I also saw no one demanding that Ward be played centrally but we seem to be taking credit for that one as well. |
I get your point. Yet fans can only suggest among themselves, managers are paid to find solutions. Indeed, "we" cannot claim credit for the specific changes". But wide calls for change there surely were, and, whether forced or not, Mick took so much time to effect it (preferring to criticise the critics and continue to go over the top as ill-prepared for battle as was plain to see) that folk are entitled to say, "about time". | |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:51 - Feb 19 with 921 views | Johnny_Boy |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 10:31 - Feb 19 by ElderGrizzly |
Cardiff were prepared to swap Huws for Leon Best, but unfortunately Best was injured.
So unless Best is a £2m striker.... |
Best will be a freebie very soon. Why would they want to pay for him or swap him for a player of their own, with actual value? |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:51 - Feb 19 with 920 views | ITFC_Forever |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 11:55 - Feb 19 by ClausThomsen |
" he had the options in central midfield of the primarily defensive Skuse, the less mobile Douglas, Bru, whose performances can be patchy and the inexperienced, physically slight, 17-year-old Dozzell. Ward had to go wide right and Lawrence on the left as there were no other real candidates for those roles. People groan when Douglas comes on, but who else was there? "
Grant Ward as it turns out - played there for Rotherham last season and when he came on as a substitute and scored a hattrick on his debut. And he's started playing there again in our recent run of form... Douglas' constant inclusion is indefensible. If we enter a season with no players to play in certain positions, that's Mick's fault.
If McCarthy's style of play was so dependent on a targetman, then he shouldn't have entered a season with just the one, who was 33 anyway and had just played in the Euros (and looked a bit knackered the previous season). But he stubbornly stuck with his "winning football" while we struggled to even test the opposition keeper.
We could have played in our current shape all season - only Huws and Spence were additions to the XI yesterday. Bru/Bishop could have played instead of Huws and Emmanuel instead of Spence - we could have signed Spence any time after his trial anyway.
But we've wasted all that time "matching up"...
Wait till we're safe then get Rowett in, Birmingham's loss is going to be someone else's gain - might as well be ours. |
Why appoint Rowett when Mick McCarthy already exists? |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:07 - Feb 19 with 905 views | The_Romford_Blue |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 10:49 - Feb 19 by Reuser_is_God |
If we refuse to pay £2m for Huws we may as well give up. |
100% agree
He looks like he likes it here. His affect has been excellent.
If Cardiff say they want their money back on him, we should snap him up for 2m. No dragged out haggling or a QPR might come along, offer 2.5m and double his wages and we've lost him.
Signing Huws wouldn't be a punt. Not a risky 2m signing. He looks already to have proven himself and is one of the first names on the team sheet for me already. |  |
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:17 - Feb 19 with 894 views | Luk38644 |
As you say OP, all we wanted was for Mick to change it up and it got so far down the line that it felt Mick wasn't going to change, so we needed to change Mick.
Thankfully, Mick is now playing a certain system and amended several inconsistencies and we're playing a hell of a lot better. That's all we ask, play well and we'll get behind them. |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:21 - Feb 19 with 886 views | Pilgrimblue |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 15:51 - Feb 19 by ITFC_Forever |
Why appoint Rowett when Mick McCarthy already exists? |
Because like some here I think Mick will be off "by mutual consent". His hand has been forced by fans/injuries/results until QPR away when he at last went 352 (much appreciated by us who were there!). His attitude to fans hasn't been good and I can't see him changing as he might have to accept that he was wrong (too stubborn for that).
Rowett would be a good replacement, bearing in mind what has happened to Brum since he was sacked! |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:24 - Feb 19 with 879 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:07 - Feb 19 by The_Romford_Blue |
100% agree
He looks like he likes it here. His affect has been excellent.
If Cardiff say they want their money back on him, we should snap him up for 2m. No dragged out haggling or a QPR might come along, offer 2.5m and double his wages and we've lost him.
Signing Huws wouldn't be a punt. Not a risky 2m signing. He looks already to have proven himself and is one of the first names on the team sheet for me already. |
Cardiff apparently paid £1m for him from Wigan, so they'd be getting 2x their money in 12 months when he's been unable to break into their team?
I think we all need to calm down, (he's only played 4 games for us!) and also look at Bishop as someone who should be doing what Huws currently is for us. He certainly has the ability
If he is £2m, i think that will be too rich for us and until the manager situation at both clubs is resolved, nothing will happen.
[Post edited 19 Feb 2017 16:28]
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| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:26 - Feb 19 with 876 views | peterleeblue |
This is not a negative post but crikey are we really playing that well? I'm remote and rely on the occasional Northern game and TV matches to make my opinion so happy to stand corrected BUT....
The reaction on here would indicate 5 straight wins, now be on the fringes of the playoffs with a squad that we can call our own. The reality is actually somewhat different. Win, Lose or draw next week our season is effectively over, the players we have on loan are simply playing for their futures there is no guarantee they will be with us next season. This sorry stay in this division may yet go on for years to come. I welcome the positivity and actually want Mick to stay but there is a long way to go before we can start to celebrate any sort of success. In fact what I would give to experience what Millwall, Lincoln or even Oxford (at 2-2) enjoyed yesterday. I look forward to the Norwich game to see at first hand this turn around everyone speaks of. |  | | |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:39 - Feb 19 with 857 views | The_Romford_Blue |
| Has Mick won everyone over yet on 16:24 - Feb 19 by ElderGrizzly |
Cardiff apparently paid £1m for him from Wigan, so they'd be getting 2x their money in 12 months when he's been unable to break into their team?
I think we all need to calm down, (he's only played 4 games for us!) and also look at Bishop as someone who should be doing what Huws currently is for us. He certainly has the ability
If he is £2m, i think that will be too rich for us and until the manager situation at both clubs is resolved, nothing will happen.
[Post edited 19 Feb 2017 16:28]
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Oh 1m if that is what they paid, even better.
Pay them a million | |
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