| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:04 - Jun 22 with 5637 views | No9 |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:03 - Jun 22 by CaptainObvious |
also it's good manners to let people know they're living in a potential deathtrap |
There are things that can be done as interim measures but you seem to be against any HSE measures? |  | |  |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:09 - Jun 22 with 5626 views | CaptainObvious |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:01 - Jun 22 by No9 |
What is uneccessarily excessive? I am not sure I get what you mean.
There are regulations and the correct application of the regulations or ignoring the regluations altogether. |
wearing hi-vis jackets in broad sunshine, wearing a hat-hard-on when there is no danger of anything falling on your head, reams and reams of paperwork, that sort of thing. i have it on good authority that european countries don't have any of this, yet do not seem to suffer a significantly greater number of accidents. there is more emphasis on personal responsibility, we are more of a nanny state. |  |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:10 - Jun 22 with 5622 views | CaptainObvious |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:04 - Jun 22 by No9 |
There are things that can be done as interim measures but you seem to be against any HSE measures? |
i do seem against them, if you wilfully misinterpret what i say, yes. | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:18 - Jun 22 with 5615 views | hampstead_blue |
We have just bought a place in Wiltshire and were going to be using Celotex on the floor slab and external walls for insulation.
Just cancelled that. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:20 - Jun 22 with 5604 views | GeoffSentence |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:18 - Jun 22 by hampstead_blue |
We have just bought a place in Wiltshire and were going to be using Celotex on the floor slab and external walls for insulation.
Just cancelled that. |
I imagine that Celotex will suffer badly. |  |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:23 - Jun 22 with 5604 views | itfcjoe |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:20 - Jun 22 by GeoffSentence |
I imagine that Celotex will suffer badly. |
Unnecessarily so in my opinion - their product is the same as anyone else broadly speaking
Nothing is going to hold up being burned to 1000 degrees, you can't test against that in reality and it isn't going to be an issue ina domestic fire which will be much easier to control |  |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:29 - Jun 22 with 5588 views | Deano69 |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:18 - Jun 22 by hampstead_blue |
We have just bought a place in Wiltshire and were going to be using Celotex on the floor slab and external walls for insulation.
Just cancelled that. |
Out of interest what are the alternatives? Celotex must be in literally 100,000' of homes. Its certainly buried in the floor of ours..... |  |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:30 - Jun 22 with 5584 views | itfcjoe |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:29 - Jun 22 by Deano69 |
Out of interest what are the alternatives? Celotex must be in literally 100,000' of homes. Its certainly buried in the floor of ours..... |
There are alternatives, like Kingspan, but it will be much of a muchness | |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:36 - Jun 22 with 5579 views | hampstead_blue |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:29 - Jun 22 by Deano69 |
Out of interest what are the alternatives? Celotex must be in literally 100,000' of homes. Its certainly buried in the floor of ours..... |
We are now using Dukkaboard, or a version of it from a local contractor.
You get two layers of cement either side of an insulating board.
It's normally used in wet rooms but we need about 300 square meters so are getting a great deal.
You also can out it straight onto a wall/floor and tile/skim straight on top.
With Kingspan you need a supporting layer on top, plasterboard for walls, or two layers of ply and a fracture mat for tiles on floors.
Saves us £ooo's in labour and doesn't eat up that much space. We are using 30mm boards rather than 100mm for Kingspan and everything else.
No brainer. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:39 - Jun 22 with 5566 views | Deano69 |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:36 - Jun 22 by hampstead_blue |
We are now using Dukkaboard, or a version of it from a local contractor.
You get two layers of cement either side of an insulating board.
It's normally used in wet rooms but we need about 300 square meters so are getting a great deal.
You also can out it straight onto a wall/floor and tile/skim straight on top.
With Kingspan you need a supporting layer on top, plasterboard for walls, or two layers of ply and a fracture mat for tiles on floors.
Saves us £ooo's in labour and doesn't eat up that much space. We are using 30mm boards rather than 100mm for Kingspan and everything else.
No brainer. |
Are they likely to experience the same terrible gases if burning? | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:41 - Jun 22 with 5568 views | squiz |
My worry with naming the blocks is that any extremist with a can of petrol and a lighter could cause terrible damage. |  | | |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:48 - Jun 22 with 5557 views | itfcjoe |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:36 - Jun 22 by hampstead_blue |
We are now using Dukkaboard, or a version of it from a local contractor.
You get two layers of cement either side of an insulating board.
It's normally used in wet rooms but we need about 300 square meters so are getting a great deal.
You also can out it straight onto a wall/floor and tile/skim straight on top.
With Kingspan you need a supporting layer on top, plasterboard for walls, or two layers of ply and a fracture mat for tiles on floors.
Saves us £ooo's in labour and doesn't eat up that much space. We are using 30mm boards rather than 100mm for Kingspan and everything else.
No brainer. |
Is that going to pass building regs for the U value of the insulation - doesn't sound anywhere near enough | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:53 - Jun 22 with 5547 views | No9 |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:10 - Jun 22 by CaptainObvious |
i do seem against them, if you wilfully misinterpret what i say, yes. |
I did say I didn't understand one of your posts | | | |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:53 - Jun 22 with 5548 views | hampstead_blue |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:39 - Jun 22 by Deano69 |
Are they likely to experience the same terrible gases if burning? |
The fact that the insulation in encapsulated fully within cement should give us enough time. Also it is further sealed by being under tiles and adhesive.
On the walls there is a plaster skim.
I think that is a better solution than Celotex | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 15:02 - Jun 22 with 5540 views | No9 |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:09 - Jun 22 by CaptainObvious |
wearing hi-vis jackets in broad sunshine, wearing a hat-hard-on when there is no danger of anything falling on your head, reams and reams of paperwork, that sort of thing. i have it on good authority that european countries don't have any of this, yet do not seem to suffer a significantly greater number of accidents. there is more emphasis on personal responsibility, we are more of a nanny state. |
EU countries do complain about the amount of HSE regulations the Uk has forced upon them, that is true.
But more recently they have started to look at some of the stuff and are changing what they do. Like the USA, much of this is put on them not by the HSE regulations but by the Insurers who, if there is an incident/ acident wont pay out.
20 years ago the USA laughed at HSE now they are among the most strin gent because they have been sued for so much money their insurance premiums have been so expensive the shareholders ahve complained.
I can assure you the reams and reams of paperwork to stay on the right side of legislation anre nothing compared with the reams, reams and more reams of paperwork that one has to deal with if you have an accident. | | | |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 15:23 - Jun 22 with 5515 views | giant_stow |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 14:41 - Jun 22 by squiz |
My worry with naming the blocks is that any extremist with a can of petrol and a lighter could cause terrible damage. |
yeah thats what I was worried about. |  |
| |
| on 15:33 - Jun 22 with 5502 views | _ |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 11:59 - Jun 22 by CaptainObvious |
We are absolutely strangled by petty health and safety regulations in the uk and at the same time we've got 600, 600!, tower blocks with flammable cladding presumably with health and safety notices telling residents to stay in their flat in the event of a fire. What a shambles we've become. |
| | | |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 15:42 - Jun 22 with 5498 views | giant_stow |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 15:23 - Jun 22 by giant_stow |
yeah thats what I was worried about. |
just a little update that I missed, you may not have, but they have actually named some blocks in Camden which will be reclad. Really dangerous imho, although the council will put on 24/7 fire safety patrols until this is completed, I'm not sure that would be enough to stop someone malicious. [Post edited 22 Jun 2017 15:43]
| |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:15 - Jun 22 with 5465 views | Steve_M |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 15:42 - Jun 22 by giant_stow |
just a little update that I missed, you may not have, but they have actually named some blocks in Camden which will be reclad. Really dangerous imho, although the council will put on 24/7 fire safety patrols until this is completed, I'm not sure that would be enough to stop someone malicious. [Post edited 22 Jun 2017 15:43]
|
It still takes a lot for one of these to go up and cause the sort of devastation seen at Grenfall. It's not like these are flammable if someone chicks a match at them. I suspect the fire investigation will show that whilst the panels caused the rapid spread there were other failings there too.
The Camden ones aren't clad to ground level from memory but from second floor up. |  |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:30 - Jun 22 with 5454 views | giant_stow |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:15 - Jun 22 by Steve_M |
It still takes a lot for one of these to go up and cause the sort of devastation seen at Grenfall. It's not like these are flammable if someone chicks a match at them. I suspect the fire investigation will show that whilst the panels caused the rapid spread there were other failings there too.
The Camden ones aren't clad to ground level from memory but from second floor up. |
Its ages since I drove past them, but hope you're right. | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:31 - Jun 22 with 5451 views | Steve_M |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:30 - Jun 22 by giant_stow |
Its ages since I drove past them, but hope you're right. |
Yes, went on Google Maps for Adelaide Road, two floors of brick before any cladding. | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:41 - Jun 22 with 5445 views | giant_stow |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:31 - Jun 22 by Steve_M |
Yes, went on Google Maps for Adelaide Road, two floors of brick before any cladding. |
nice one. I'm such a panic merchant - apols. | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:54 - Jun 22 with 5440 views | Steve_M |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 16:41 - Jun 22 by giant_stow |
nice one. I'm such a panic merchant - apols. |
This is interesting on the other failings point:
“The arrangement of the cladding and insulation used on Camden Council’s buildings significantly differs from that on Grenfell Tower. It includes fire-resistant rock wool insulation designed to prevent the spread of fire and fire resistant sealant between floors, designed to stop a high-intensity flat fire from spreading to neighbouring flats. This arrangement previously contained a fire at a flat in Taplow block in 2012. These are significant and proven arrangements to stop the spread of fire.
http://news.camden.gov.uk/camden-set-to-remove-cladding-from-chalcots-estate-tow
I remember seeing the outside of that fire, very black just around the flat and a bit above but nothing anywhere else. | |
| |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 20:44 - Jun 22 with 5404 views | TVRBlue |
I may be mistaken but I wasn't aware Celotex "cladding" was used on the Grenfell tower block.
Reports state the engineering and manufacturing company Arconic were involved in the manufacture (and I assume supply) of the cladding called Reynobond PE (polyethylene).
If this is true it is wrong for people to be suggesting the cladding was supplied by someone else - Celotex or otherwise, which could do untold damage to that particular Company.
Another thing is how did the incorrect cladding end up being put on the tower block? One assumes an architectural practice (or "in-house" Local Authority architect/s) produced a specification for the refurbishment works including the cladding system.
Was the correct cladding specified?
If so, who agreed to change the cladding to the type that was not suitable (or compliant with the building regulations in place at the time the refurb works were undertaken)?
Furthermore, was the installation of the cladding (compliant or otherwise) undertaken correctly with regards horizontal and vertical fire-stopping in the correct places?
All of these things should be contained as part of the overall Contract for the refurbishment of the tower block, let alone within the HSE Safety File for the project.
Anyway, these are some of the questions that should be being asked if they haven't already. |  | | |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 22:41 - Jun 22 with 5375 views | lowhouseblue |
| These tower blocks that have the same cladding on 13:56 - Jun 22 by GeoffSentence |
I think the insulation was provided by Hadleigh firm Celotex. There's probably some seriously concerned people over in Lady Lane at the moment. |
is the insulation implicated in the fire? the issue is the cladding surely - and celotex insulation is actually reported as reaching high fire resistance standards. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
