| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah 09:04 - Jun 28 with 32877 views | Steve_M |
Worth a read.
"[H}is growing ranks of cheerleaders wish to simply see what they want to see, project what they want onto him, and contort all fact and reason to pretend that there are no questions, no downsides - and that anyone who raises those questions, or points out those downsides, is part of the cabal of dark forces out to bring down the messiah"
http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-analysis/2017/06/27/jeremy-corbyn-is-a-politic
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:53 - Jun 28 with 5809 views | DanTheMan |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:52 - Jun 28 by clive_baker |
I actually find it quite worrying the levels of blind faith so many people have in Corbyn, the guy can do no wrong according to some. At least most Tory voters I've spoken to seemingly were minded to vote with a 'best of a bad bunch' mentality and recognise limitations and criticism of their party and leader. Balance is vital.
The labour party is no longer a political institution, it's a cult. |
I've met quite a few Tory voters who vote for them "because they always have".
How is it any different? |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:58 - Jun 28 with 5782 views | monytowbray |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 09:19 - Jun 28 by homer_123 |
I've not come across many who look at him as a messiah to be fair. |
Yeah but the right need something to clutch at. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:00 - Jun 28 with 5784 views | clive_baker |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:53 - Jun 28 by DanTheMan |
I've met quite a few Tory voters who vote for them "because they always have".
How is it any different? |
Not a fan of that logic either, it's ridiculous. Or 'because my parents do' etc. I've voted labour and Tory previously, it vastly depends on personal circumstances, political landscape, economic risks + reward etc. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:01 - Jun 28 with 5769 views | monytowbray |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:00 - Jun 28 by clive_baker |
Not a fan of that logic either, it's ridiculous. Or 'because my parents do' etc. I've voted labour and Tory previously, it vastly depends on personal circumstances, political landscape, economic risks + reward etc. |
So your original response was complete b0llocks then. Thanks for clarifying. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:03 - Jun 28 with 5769 views | Dolly2.0 |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:12 - Jun 28 by StokieBlue |
Aren't you proving the point by immediately saying my opinion is wrong and how dare I agree with the article?
SB |
No. I'm not judging all people as being the same. Can you appreciate some people aren't swept up in the cult of Corbyn, they just appreciate the majority of Labour's policies, and do so with intelligence? |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:04 - Jun 28 with 5764 views | StokieBlue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:01 - Jun 28 by monytowbray |
So your original response was complete b0llocks then. Thanks for clarifying. |
Surely it was his opinion and because it was against JC you've shouted him down and sworn.
Wouldn't you say that pretty much proves the point of the article?
SB |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:05 - Jun 28 with 5763 views | Steve_M |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:20 - Jun 28 by Superfrans |
They're clearly trying to play on his "messiah status" to raise him to a level from which defeat is nigh on impossible. Problem is that this will begin to grate, especially those in the middle ground. It also leads to a greater chance of a five year term for the Tories, which means he'll be 73 by the time of the next election - although Vince Cable will be 79, of course.
If Labour are smart, they will play the long game, use Corbyn to approve a new, younger version of himself (Keir Starmer?), elevate Corbyn to president of the party and fight an election that way. |
Yes, exactly the sort of reasons I posted it. The next election will be interesting as a lot voted Labour because they thought Corbyn had no chance of becoming PM, thus the inconsistencies of Labour's position could either be ignored, consciously or unconsciously.
Against that the Tories are highly likely to make a mess of Brexit negotiations because they a) don't really know what they want and b) what they do know they want is pretty much impossible.
I don't think Momentum/McDonnell/Milne see Starmer as a successor to Corbyn. That's not where they want to take the party or indeed are taking the party. A sensible party would try to encompass both but the left sees a chance for an ideological remake. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:15 - Jun 28 with 5735 views | clive_baker |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:01 - Jun 28 by monytowbray |
So your original response was complete b0llocks then. Thanks for clarifying. |
No it wasn't at all, and your attitude is just illustrating the point further. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:21 - Jun 28 with 5716 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 09:19 - Jun 28 by homer_123 |
I've not come across many who look at him as a messiah to be fair. |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:23 - Jun 28 with 5706 views | Coastalblue |
I agree with some of what's written there, which means I'm probably now a Tory to a number of people on here.
I don't think you have to be right wing to disagree with Corbyn, but it now appears you are if you do. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:27 - Jun 28 with 5684 views | lowhouseblue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:23 - Jun 28 by Coastalblue |
I agree with some of what's written there, which means I'm probably now a Tory to a number of people on here.
I don't think you have to be right wing to disagree with Corbyn, but it now appears you are if you do. |
that's the thing with cults they identify themselves largely by defining others as the enemy. you're either a member of the cult or you're the enemy. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:53 - Jun 28 with 5648 views | Dubtractor |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 10:32 - Jun 28 by stickymockwell |
My Personal feeling towards him is that he is bringing a much needed alternative. It's never been so divided in my lifetime and he is going for the obvious vote and doing a very good job. |
This was my feeling from the outset.
Corbyn isn't perfect, and I don't necessarily agree with everything he proposes, but if he plays a role in bringing the political and social debate back over to the left a little, then it is a job well done in my eyes. |  |
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| Mick McCarthy is just a football manager not the messiah (n/t) on 12:54 - Jun 28 with 5642 views | Reuser_is_God |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:05 - Jun 28 with 5611 views | BorisOrTrevor |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 09:19 - Jun 28 by DanTheMan |
I heard he's a prick, someone will have to confirm though. |
Specifically the bit shaped like a ringing instrument.
But, personally, I dislike the Three Horsemen more - McDonut, Abbott, Thornberry. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:09 - Jun 28 with 5599 views | monytowbray |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:15 - Jun 28 by clive_baker |
No it wasn't at all, and your attitude is just illustrating the point further. |
No, I'm critical of Corbyn on many matters.
I just found your one-size-fits-all analysis of the situation complete b0llocks.
I'll let you pretend I'm illustrating your point if it makes you feel better though. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:10 - Jun 28 with 5590 views | monytowbray |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:27 - Jun 28 by lowhouseblue |
that's the thing with cults they identify themselves largely by defining others as the enemy. you're either a member of the cult or you're the enemy. |
Like being a Blairite then? | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:13 - Jun 28 with 5585 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:27 - Jun 28 by lowhouseblue |
that's the thing with cults they identify themselves largely by defining others as the enemy. you're either a member of the cult or you're the enemy. |
One of them on here compared voting Tory at last month's election to supporting the IRA when they were murdering British civilians.
That is how low the bar is now set on political debate. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:20 - Jun 28 with 5558 views | lowhouseblue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:10 - Jun 28 by monytowbray |
Like being a Blairite then? |
not really, no. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:25 - Jun 28 with 5539 views | Dubtractor |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:13 - Jun 28 by GlasgowBlue |
One of them on here compared voting Tory at last month's election to supporting the IRA when they were murdering British civilians.
That is how low the bar is now set on political debate. |
Come on. There was one party, more than any other, guilty of lowering the tone of political debate in the recent election and it wasn't Labour. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:27 - Jun 28 with 5532 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:25 - Jun 28 by Dubtractor |
Come on. There was one party, more than any other, guilty of lowering the tone of political debate in the recent election and it wasn't Labour. |
I'm talking about the sad fanboys on here. [Post edited 28 Jun 2017 13:27]
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:29 - Jun 28 with 5527 views | WD19 |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:25 - Jun 28 by Dubtractor |
Come on. There was one party, more than any other, guilty of lowering the tone of political debate in the recent election and it wasn't Labour. |
Ah, the old 'It wasn't the Labour Party, it was just people standing near the Labour Party' defence. |  | | |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:30 - Jun 28 with 5520 views | Superfrans |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 12:05 - Jun 28 by Steve_M |
Yes, exactly the sort of reasons I posted it. The next election will be interesting as a lot voted Labour because they thought Corbyn had no chance of becoming PM, thus the inconsistencies of Labour's position could either be ignored, consciously or unconsciously.
Against that the Tories are highly likely to make a mess of Brexit negotiations because they a) don't really know what they want and b) what they do know they want is pretty much impossible.
I don't think Momentum/McDonnell/Milne see Starmer as a successor to Corbyn. That's not where they want to take the party or indeed are taking the party. A sensible party would try to encompass both but the left sees a chance for an ideological remake. |
I find the tactics which we will see over the next 4/5 years fascinating.
The fact is, the Tories are in charge now until June 2022, if they want to be. The DUP shows they will do anything they can to cling to power - hardly surprising, as this is a party made of people who are bred for power. They will even leave the wrong person in charge, if it means they can see this five years through, and even if it means she gets thrown to the lions half way to 2023.
Labour, on the other hand, are being run as a party of protest. Even though they didn't win the last election, they are clearly hopeful of claiming power sometime soon. I just don't think it will come to pass, because the Tories won't let loose their grip. |  |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:31 - Jun 28 with 5516 views | Dubtractor |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:27 - Jun 28 by GlasgowBlue |
I'm talking about the sad fanboys on here. [Post edited 28 Jun 2017 13:27]
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I know that, but I'm not sure that the comments of a few people on message boards are that relevant. | |
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| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:34 - Jun 28 with 5509 views | WD19 |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:31 - Jun 28 by Dubtractor |
I know that, but I'm not sure that the comments of a few people on message boards are that relevant. |
I'm pretty sure that the comments of a lots of people on this message board are not very relevant. | | | |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 13:35 - Jun 28 with 5497 views | Superfrans |
| Jeremy Corbyn is just a politician not the messiah on 11:33 - Jun 28 by blueislander |
Interesting article in The Times today. Purports the theory that Corbyn and McDonnell have a different concept of democracy to that most people hold. They believe that democracy is the basic right to protest, and this overrides parliamentary democracy. It seems true that Corbyn and McDonnell are more activists than politicians. They are much more comfortable taking the side of the underdog than leading the majority. |
I haven't read the Times article, but I agree that their view of democracy is different from many people - not sure about most...
There does seem to be two schools of thought - on one side that democracy is about casting your vote once every five years and otherwise shutting up; on the other that democracy is about casting your vote, but in between having the freedom to protest and shape the debate.
I'm not sure that Corbyn and McDonnell believe the protesting/debating is more important than casting the vote. They seem very keen on taking power. And they now seem emboldened by the GE result, which indicates that they're not far away - if they can force another election. | |
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