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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing 09:22 - Jul 20 with 37540 viewsmonytowbray

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jul/17/uk-has-nearly-800-livestock-

As I've said previously, there is simply no way we can sustain our current level of animal product consumption in terms of both volume and competitive pricing.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 12:26 - Jul 20 with 6534 viewsTractorWood

Global population is the issue though, right? if everyone was a vegetarian we'd need more land to grow crops. Which would result in over farming of land, desertification, exposure to local and global harvests etc.

I know that was then, but it could be again..
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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 12:55 - Jul 20 with 6504 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 12:26 - Jul 20 by TractorWood

Global population is the issue though, right? if everyone was a vegetarian we'd need more land to grow crops. Which would result in over farming of land, desertification, exposure to local and global harvests etc.


Are you taking into account how much crop is used to feed the animals we eat though?

http://vegansci.com/2017/03/12/animals-account-for-85-of-uk-food-land-footprint/

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 12:57 - Jul 20 with 6501 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 10:02 - Jul 20 by blue_oyster

A good article article, thanks for posting.

It's about economics and farming. The economic pressure on British farming is now so great, this is the result of how farming is changing in the UK, something highlighted by the Daily Mail back in 2010.

Leaving the EU will help this situation, the UK being a net contributor to the CAP, and improve conditions for farming.


Got any links to read on EU impact on UK farming animal link wise? Not seen too much on that myself.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 13:56 - Jul 20 with 6472 viewssparks

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 12:57 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

Got any links to read on EU impact on UK farming animal link wise? Not seen too much on that myself.


The answer is to eat seagulls and maybe pigeons. Free range. A real nuisance for many. And plentiful. And eating seagulls would help replenish fish stocks at sea.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 13:57 - Jul 20 with 6464 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 13:56 - Jul 20 by sparks

The answer is to eat seagulls and maybe pigeons. Free range. A real nuisance for many. And plentiful. And eating seagulls would help replenish fish stocks at sea.


I've seen Seagulls in Ipswich centre kill and eat pigeons.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 14:15 - Jul 20 with 6450 viewsDolly2.0

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 09:51 - Jul 20 by chicoazul

callis is your life so dull and devoid of meaning that you have to come on here and try to start the same old tired boring arguments that were had last week?

[offensive section removed by admin]

This post has been edited by an administrator


You really are an odious prick. I can only assume you must have a miserable life yourself, the fact that you make yourself feel better by attacking others on here.

That post was nasty and utterly unnecessary. As someone else said, if you're not interested in the debate you didn't need to click on it. Some of us ARE interested.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 14:37 - Jul 20 with 6433 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 14:15 - Jul 20 by Dolly2.0

You really are an odious prick. I can only assume you must have a miserable life yourself, the fact that you make yourself feel better by attacking others on here.

That post was nasty and utterly unnecessary. As someone else said, if you're not interested in the debate you didn't need to click on it. Some of us ARE interested.


The saddest thing is it still reads like that after being edited (I didn't flag it either FYI so evidently I wasn't alone in thinking it was OTT).

Original post then went off to have a pop at my girlfriend and my sex life.

I don't understand how someone who continually posts nothing but confrontational and personal nonsense gets away with it.
[Post edited 20 Jul 2017 14:38]

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:02 - Jul 20 with 6411 viewsGavTWTD

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 14:37 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

The saddest thing is it still reads like that after being edited (I didn't flag it either FYI so evidently I wasn't alone in thinking it was OTT).

Original post then went off to have a pop at my girlfriend and my sex life.

I don't understand how someone who continually posts nothing but confrontational and personal nonsense gets away with it.
[Post edited 20 Jul 2017 14:38]


Taking that post in isolation, I thought it was out of order so I removed that offensive part. But yet another thread about anti-meat eating when I was deleting them left, right and centre last week.

Anyway, insects are the answer.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:04 - Jul 20 with 6405 viewsclive_baker

I blame the chicken for tasting so fecking good in breadcrumbs.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:12 - Jul 20 with 6396 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:02 - Jul 20 by GavTWTD

Taking that post in isolation, I thought it was out of order so I removed that offensive part. But yet another thread about anti-meat eating when I was deleting them left, right and centre last week.

Anyway, insects are the answer.


Surely it's no worse than any of the politics posts we get every day?

These threads go fine when the usual suspects don't get involved ;)

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:13 - Jul 20 with 6392 viewsGlasgowBlue

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 09:34 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

I was vegetarian for 3 years well over a decade ago. I've been experimenting on/off with veganism for over 2 years.


This what I don't understand Callis. And I ask this with genuine interest.

You have stated on several occasions that you have been a vegan/ vegetarian on and off over the course of a decade. You have also stated on several occasions that, as well as the health issues, for you it is one of morality. That eating meat is cruel to animals.

Now I understand that as a former meat eater who enjoys/ enjoyed the taste of meat that you may have occasionally slipped off the veggie wagon. Completely understandable. I stopped drinking for three years because I wanted to live a healthier lifestyle but at Christmas I had a couple of glasses og wine and now I drink at weekends again.

The circle that I can't square is that holding the moral view, you still just a year ago went fishing which is completely different to having a sudden urge to eat meat. It's not a spur of the moment decision ,like opening a fridge, seeing a rare slice of roast beef and shoving it down your gob.

The decision to fish was made. You had plenty of time to then change your mind and say that it is wrong.

Not only that but after your day out fishing you then came onto this board and asked for advice on the best places locally to catch fish. You then went on to describe how "a decent sized carp can take up to 45 minutes to land from the moment you hook it as you have to wear the b*stard out".

You see the problem I am having with your moral case for veganism don't you?

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:16 - Jul 20 with 6386 viewsC_HealyIsAPleasure

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:12 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

Surely it's no worse than any of the politics posts we get every day?

These threads go fine when the usual suspects don't get involved ;)


You?

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:25 - Jul 20 with 6375 viewsRyorry

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 09:35 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

That's what they are seen as though. It's pretty grim. My logic to getting where I am was if you saw it happen to a dog or a cat would it bother you? Once my head was in that way of thinking it was hard to continue supporting it.


Perhaps the difference is that cows, sheep, pigs & chickens don't have thousands of years history of having developed a symbiotic relationship with us humans, don't live inside our homes with us, don't get taken for walks or in the car or on holiday with us, don't get trained as guide dogs, hearing dogs, assistance dogs, sheep-dogs, police dogs, sniffer dogs; and generally speaking aren't considered part of the family.*

*Except possibly in Norfolk, where it might be considered normal.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:29 - Jul 20 with 6361 viewsgiant_stow

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:02 - Jul 20 by GavTWTD

Taking that post in isolation, I thought it was out of order so I removed that offensive part. But yet another thread about anti-meat eating when I was deleting them left, right and centre last week.

Anyway, insects are the answer.


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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:30 - Jul 20 with 6360 viewsmonytowbray

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:13 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue

This what I don't understand Callis. And I ask this with genuine interest.

You have stated on several occasions that you have been a vegan/ vegetarian on and off over the course of a decade. You have also stated on several occasions that, as well as the health issues, for you it is one of morality. That eating meat is cruel to animals.

Now I understand that as a former meat eater who enjoys/ enjoyed the taste of meat that you may have occasionally slipped off the veggie wagon. Completely understandable. I stopped drinking for three years because I wanted to live a healthier lifestyle but at Christmas I had a couple of glasses og wine and now I drink at weekends again.

The circle that I can't square is that holding the moral view, you still just a year ago went fishing which is completely different to having a sudden urge to eat meat. It's not a spur of the moment decision ,like opening a fridge, seeing a rare slice of roast beef and shoving it down your gob.

The decision to fish was made. You had plenty of time to then change your mind and say that it is wrong.

Not only that but after your day out fishing you then came onto this board and asked for advice on the best places locally to catch fish. You then went on to describe how "a decent sized carp can take up to 45 minutes to land from the moment you hook it as you have to wear the b*stard out".

You see the problem I am having with your moral case for veganism don't you?


I get that, however I've always been very much of the same opinion I have now. I guess I'm just finally in a position spread the word without being a total hypocrite to myself.

As for the "a decent sized carp can take up to 45 minutes to land from the moment you hook it as you have to wear the b*stard out" comment, I've never caught one, I'm just aware that is the case.

Like many I guess I just blocked out the aspects of it I don't want to face. I just want people to see that too, even if it makes one person here eat less meat I've made a difference.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:31 - Jul 20 with 6352 viewsitfcjoe

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:13 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue

This what I don't understand Callis. And I ask this with genuine interest.

You have stated on several occasions that you have been a vegan/ vegetarian on and off over the course of a decade. You have also stated on several occasions that, as well as the health issues, for you it is one of morality. That eating meat is cruel to animals.

Now I understand that as a former meat eater who enjoys/ enjoyed the taste of meat that you may have occasionally slipped off the veggie wagon. Completely understandable. I stopped drinking for three years because I wanted to live a healthier lifestyle but at Christmas I had a couple of glasses og wine and now I drink at weekends again.

The circle that I can't square is that holding the moral view, you still just a year ago went fishing which is completely different to having a sudden urge to eat meat. It's not a spur of the moment decision ,like opening a fridge, seeing a rare slice of roast beef and shoving it down your gob.

The decision to fish was made. You had plenty of time to then change your mind and say that it is wrong.

Not only that but after your day out fishing you then came onto this board and asked for advice on the best places locally to catch fish. You then went on to describe how "a decent sized carp can take up to 45 minutes to land from the moment you hook it as you have to wear the b*stard out".

You see the problem I am having with your moral case for veganism don't you?


I was obviously arguing with Callis in the monster thread - but I don't see the issue with someone changing their mind about things.

Without being too poncey about it, he has obviously been on a journey towards becoming a Vegan - and journey's aren't straight lines.

Does it really matter? He can't change the past no more than any of us can

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:48 - Jul 20 with 6320 viewsDolly2.0

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:25 - Jul 20 by Ryorry

Perhaps the difference is that cows, sheep, pigs & chickens don't have thousands of years history of having developed a symbiotic relationship with us humans, don't live inside our homes with us, don't get taken for walks or in the car or on holiday with us, don't get trained as guide dogs, hearing dogs, assistance dogs, sheep-dogs, police dogs, sniffer dogs; and generally speaking aren't considered part of the family.*

*Except possibly in Norfolk, where it might be considered normal.


I'm not sure all that is an excuse for mistreating the animals we have less of a connection with.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:51 - Jul 20 with 6311 viewsDolly2.0

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:02 - Jul 20 by GavTWTD

Taking that post in isolation, I thought it was out of order so I removed that offensive part. But yet another thread about anti-meat eating when I was deleting them left, right and centre last week.

Anyway, insects are the answer.


It's yours and Phil's website so you can do what you want with it, but I personally don't think this censorship is right. This thread is about intensive farming, not specifically anti-meat eating. If people aren't interested they don't have to read it. I'm not interested in wrestling threads but wouldn't expect you to delete them.

I say this as a meat eater BTW.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:51 - Jul 20 with 6305 viewsRyorry

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:48 - Jul 20 by Dolly2.0

I'm not sure all that is an excuse for mistreating the animals we have less of a connection with.


Yeah cos I really support mistreating animals, having spent 20 years running my own 100% ethical organic smallholding, half a century opposing factory farming, and now only buying ethically produced, freerange or wild meat
[Post edited 20 Jul 2017 15:53]

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:54 - Jul 20 with 6296 viewschicoazul

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:51 - Jul 20 by Ryorry

Yeah cos I really support mistreating animals, having spent 20 years running my own 100% ethical organic smallholding, half a century opposing factory farming, and now only buying ethically produced, freerange or wild meat
[Post edited 20 Jul 2017 15:53]


You think raising animals to be eaten is treating them well then?

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:02 - Jul 20 with 6275 viewsStokieBlue

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 09:51 - Jul 20 by monytowbray

Lab grown meat I am 100% for. I'd eat it.


What about insects?

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:03 - Jul 20 with 6269 viewsGlasgowBlue

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 13:56 - Jul 20 by sparks

The answer is to eat seagulls and maybe pigeons. Free range. A real nuisance for many. And plentiful. And eating seagulls would help replenish fish stocks at sea.


I was sat on Weymouth beach two weeks ago making a ham baguette and a seagull swooped down and grabbed the whole bloody thing. Clean as a whistle.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:04 - Jul 20 with 6263 viewsJ2BLUE

Hate that photo at the top of the article. I'm pretty much mostly vegetarian anyway now (based on complete vegetarian days). When I eat meat I'm ultra selective about three quarters of the time. The other 25% I'll eat at McDonalds (fully intending to try their veggie burger next time) or similar.

With that said my diet is heavy on low fat yoghurt and reduced fat cheese so vegans would still take issue.

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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:10 - Jul 20 with 6243 viewstcblue

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:02 - Jul 20 by StokieBlue

What about insects?

SB


Wrong board mate, you want WOTB
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Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 16:12 - Jul 20 with 6231 viewsRyorry

Intensive farming in Britain - The problem is growing on 15:54 - Jul 20 by chicoazul

You think raising animals to be eaten is treating them well then?


Absolutely.

They didn't know a thing about dying. One second they were here, the next they were completely oblivious to anything. Hope I go the same way - could have done with less pain/problems along the way myself tho!

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