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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard 21:26 - May 21 with 3700 viewshermir10

This has surely been pointed out before, but Lampard wouldn't be the first to take over at Portman Road with a glittering playing career behind him but very little managerial experience.

Ramsey - aged 35, no managerial experience when he took over.
Robson - aged 36, one bad experience (Fulham), little to recommend him then..

So what's wrong with Lampard, aged 39, no managerial experience, but like Ramsey and Robson, a fine international playing career....

He could inspire our crop of talented young midfielders, and would bring a real buzz to the place.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 21:38 - May 21 with 3625 viewsVic

Totally agree.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 21:40 - May 21 with 3619 viewsIllinoisblue

that's a very fair point. the bigger point, though, is that whoever gets the job will have one tied behind their back when it comes to playing budget. We are championship paupers with a multimillionaire owner. Funny ol' game.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 00:54 - May 22 with 3342 viewsDarth_Koont

Sorry, but I think the game's got harder to manage and the margins even tighter since then.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 07:54 - May 22 with 3160 viewspowinswitch

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 00:54 - May 22 by Darth_Koont

Sorry, but I think the game's got harder to manage and the margins even tighter since then.


Sorry, all this it’s more difficult now tosh is exactly that. They were two awesome managers in any era. But they managed in their own era, and excelled.
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 07:57 - May 22 with 3155 viewsHerbivore

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 00:54 - May 22 by Darth_Koont

Sorry, but I think the game's got harder to manage and the margins even tighter since then.


Yep. Totally different game now. It's like when people point out that SBR only signed 14 players as Town manager, all that highlights is what a radically different beast football is now compared to 45 years ago.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 08:31 - May 22 with 3096 viewsVic

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 07:54 - May 22 by powinswitch

Sorry, all this it’s more difficult now tosh is exactly that. They were two awesome managers in any era. But they managed in their own era, and excelled.


They were people of their time and would struggle today. But Lampard is a man of this generation and understands how things work. No reason that with an experienced set of hands he couldnt do it - imho.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 08:38 - May 22 with 3087 viewssolemio

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 08:31 - May 22 by Vic

They were people of their time and would struggle today. But Lampard is a man of this generation and understands how things work. No reason that with an experienced set of hands he couldnt do it - imho.


I believe that the greatest in almost any field would still be great in any other era. They would have had different experiences and with their talent and personality would be successes.

Sir Donald Bradman would have been the greatest in any era.
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 08:49 - May 22 with 3065 viewsLeoMuff

Also William Pitt the younger was a great prime minister at 24....

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:16 - May 22 with 2999 viewsDarth_Koont

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 07:54 - May 22 by powinswitch

Sorry, all this it’s more difficult now tosh is exactly that. They were two awesome managers in any era. But they managed in their own era, and excelled.


I'm sure they would have been a success now. But that's with the benefit of hindsight and us knowing they were great managers.

But this sort of appointment now is a little naive. Is football the only modern sport where the demands at the the top level for players and coaches haven't increased dramatically? We do seem to be one of the few sports that would employ a novice coach at elite level but that says more about club chairmen whereas other sports' governing bodies tend to be a bit more switched on to what's needed.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:36 - May 22 with 2972 viewsnc41

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:16 - May 22 by Darth_Koont

I'm sure they would have been a success now. But that's with the benefit of hindsight and us knowing they were great managers.

But this sort of appointment now is a little naive. Is football the only modern sport where the demands at the the top level for players and coaches haven't increased dramatically? We do seem to be one of the few sports that would employ a novice coach at elite level but that says more about club chairmen whereas other sports' governing bodies tend to be a bit more switched on to what's needed.


I'm with Vic on this. A player who has learned from some of the best managers; in the most successful teams, playing in a position (midfield) that has been our weakest area for years. I would have liked Lampard.

I am just not convinced that Ross's experience is all that relevant to us. We'll see, but I can see ITFC being the club that Ross learns from rather than excels at.

Hurst's experience, maybe a little more relevant.
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 11:03 - May 22 with 2951 viewsHerbivore

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:36 - May 22 by nc41

I'm with Vic on this. A player who has learned from some of the best managers; in the most successful teams, playing in a position (midfield) that has been our weakest area for years. I would have liked Lampard.

I am just not convinced that Ross's experience is all that relevant to us. We'll see, but I can see ITFC being the club that Ross learns from rather than excels at.

Hurst's experience, maybe a little more relevant.


At least we know Ross can manage.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:12 - May 22 with 2916 viewsPJH

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:16 - May 22 by Darth_Koont

I'm sure they would have been a success now. But that's with the benefit of hindsight and us knowing they were great managers.

But this sort of appointment now is a little naive. Is football the only modern sport where the demands at the the top level for players and coaches haven't increased dramatically? We do seem to be one of the few sports that would employ a novice coach at elite level but that says more about club chairmen whereas other sports' governing bodies tend to be a bit more switched on to what's needed.


Regarding your first sentence I think that very likely SBR would match or even better what he did with us at the right club in the modern era but I very much doubt if SAR(or anyone else)would replicate what he did with us.
SAR might well be a success in the modern game but I do not think that that success would get close to what he actually achieved.
Our League win in 1961/62 was largely based on him coming up with a system of playing that formation wise was totally unique at the time,I can't see that happening again.
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:13 - May 22 with 2915 viewsDarth_Koont

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 11:03 - May 22 by Herbivore

At least we know Ross can manage.


Indeed. Ross at least has been in most (if not all) of the situations he will face next season. There'll be differences of course but hardly completely new experiences.

It's all very well having the potential to succeed or talk a good game in theory, but it's natural for people to have difficulties when faced with real situations — especially for the first time too in many cases.

And in our case we want him to hit the ground running as a good manager.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:31 - May 22 with 2884 viewsnc41

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 11:03 - May 22 by Herbivore

At least we know Ross can manage.


We know can manage in Scotland yeah.
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:40 - May 22 with 2871 viewsHerbivore

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:31 - May 22 by nc41

We know can manage in Scotland yeah.


Whilst things like budgets and standard of football will be rather different, the fundamentals of managing - coaching, tactics, man management, recruitment etc. - are not wildly different in Scotland compared to England, mate. Some people seem to be under the misapprehension that just because Ross and Hurst haven't managed in the Championship they are as much of an unknown quantity as Lampard, and that simply isn't true.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:55 - May 22 with 2848 viewsnc41

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:40 - May 22 by Herbivore

Whilst things like budgets and standard of football will be rather different, the fundamentals of managing - coaching, tactics, man management, recruitment etc. - are not wildly different in Scotland compared to England, mate. Some people seem to be under the misapprehension that just because Ross and Hurst haven't managed in the Championship they are as much of an unknown quantity as Lampard, and that simply isn't true.


Yeah I get that, but personally I think Hurst, Ross and Lampard ALL have unknown quantities. Each have positives and negatives. OK Lampard hasn't managed yet, but the position of club captain is a sizable step. I just can't decide how substantial that step is when compared to Ross.

From a rugby point of view (I am a former head coach). I found managing players the easy bit. The challenge was realising your shortcomings and responding quickly enough. I agree football is very different, but I can't imagine we have too many difficult players. The response times of dealing with the shortcomings is the unknown value of X and none of those have that experience at this level.

If it's Ross I really hope he does well, I'm not saying I prefer Lampard, but don't feel (personally) Ross's experience is above Lampard
[Post edited 22 May 2018 12:56]
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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 13:13 - May 22 with 2821 viewsDarth_Koont

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:55 - May 22 by nc41

Yeah I get that, but personally I think Hurst, Ross and Lampard ALL have unknown quantities. Each have positives and negatives. OK Lampard hasn't managed yet, but the position of club captain is a sizable step. I just can't decide how substantial that step is when compared to Ross.

From a rugby point of view (I am a former head coach). I found managing players the easy bit. The challenge was realising your shortcomings and responding quickly enough. I agree football is very different, but I can't imagine we have too many difficult players. The response times of dealing with the shortcomings is the unknown value of X and none of those have that experience at this level.

If it's Ross I really hope he does well, I'm not saying I prefer Lampard, but don't feel (personally) Ross's experience is above Lampard
[Post edited 22 May 2018 12:56]


I think it certainly is initially. Whether Lampard's higher playing experience or potential as a manager can kick in later is a separate matter.

But here's a simple difference for you: Never mind if he's any good at it, what if Lampard finds out he hates management? That everything he liked about being a footballer is turned on its head when you alone have to carry the can and have to keep a certain distance from the players? All that without the release of getting out on the pitch and playing? That's the sort of unknown quantity we're talking about.

FWIW I'm also not against Lampard or similar but think his number two then becomes a critical appointment to fill some big gaps. With Hurst or Ross, they bring their tried or tested right-hand men or at least have a very clear idea of what they need.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 22:41 - May 22 with 2720 viewsHerbivore

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 12:55 - May 22 by nc41

Yeah I get that, but personally I think Hurst, Ross and Lampard ALL have unknown quantities. Each have positives and negatives. OK Lampard hasn't managed yet, but the position of club captain is a sizable step. I just can't decide how substantial that step is when compared to Ross.

From a rugby point of view (I am a former head coach). I found managing players the easy bit. The challenge was realising your shortcomings and responding quickly enough. I agree football is very different, but I can't imagine we have too many difficult players. The response times of dealing with the shortcomings is the unknown value of X and none of those have that experience at this level.

If it's Ross I really hope he does well, I'm not saying I prefer Lampard, but don't feel (personally) Ross's experience is above Lampard
[Post edited 22 May 2018 12:56]


Of course his experience is above Lampard, he's actually been a manager and has managed over 100 games. Lampard hasn't even been the lead coach for a youth team, a first team coach or assistant manager let alone having actual management experience. Being a captain is not the same thing.

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Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 10:11 - May 23 with 2617 viewsnc41

Ramsey, Robson...Lampard on 22:41 - May 22 by Herbivore

Of course his experience is above Lampard, he's actually been a manager and has managed over 100 games. Lampard hasn't even been the lead coach for a youth team, a first team coach or assistant manager let alone having actual management experience. Being a captain is not the same thing.


Maybe not. When I went in to coaching (ok it was rugby) The first appointment was easy enough.

As an experienced manager it became more difficult. People expect you to play (historically) when faced with a different league, different players and stronger opposition that becomes quite a challenge. If results don't work out at that stage it becomes a tricky question with variables. It's much harder to break a once working system down and re-organise it than it is to start a new build.

I think Alex Neil learned this. He bought his experience and came out better for it. I don't think, what Jack Ross has learned (and I am not against him by any means) puts him as far ahead of others as is being made out.

The management side of things (from an administrative point of view) are the satisfying side of things. I used to love sitting down watching videos and plotting; very therapeutic. Dealing with players and contracts was never a big deal and quite enjoyable.

The maker or breaker of many a coach is the training regime. If the players find his system limiting and unfulfilling they won't buy into the concept. I would imagine Lampard would excel in that department; I couldn't comment on Ross.

We will see. I like the idea of Ross, but not adverse to Lampard. I think the value of experience can be over-rated. I found position one easy - the dips come with expectancy.
[Post edited 23 May 2018 10:27]
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