| Safe standing types 13:38 - Jun 1 with 2996 views | Mullet |
This really is of interest to you I think. A chance to get behind the movement. |  |
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| Safe standing types on 13:41 - Jun 1 with 2977 views | itfcjoe |
I have had an invite to Parliamentery Roundtable on this next Wednesday as a rep of ITFC fans - I'm not sure this is to do with previously being in Supporters Trust. |  |
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| Safe standing types on 14:03 - Jun 1 with 2895 views | MattinLondon |
| Safe standing types on 13:41 - Jun 1 by itfcjoe |
I have had an invite to Parliamentery Roundtable on this next Wednesday as a rep of ITFC fans - I'm not sure this is to do with previously being in Supporters Trust. |
Do you know if the club has an official line on this? In favour in principle or against? |  | | |
| Safe standing types on 14:05 - Jun 1 with 2894 views | itfcjoe |
| Safe standing types on 14:03 - Jun 1 by MattinLondon |
Do you know if the club has an official line on this? In favour in principle or against? |
I don't sorry - from limited conversations I've had with them they are fairly ambivalent to it........mainly because they turn a blind eye to standing in Lower North, we don't sell out the ground and there is a financial implication to install it so no real need. | |
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| Safe standing types on 14:11 - Jun 1 with 2864 views | MattinLondon |
| Safe standing types on 14:05 - Jun 1 by itfcjoe |
I don't sorry - from limited conversations I've had with them they are fairly ambivalent to it........mainly because they turn a blind eye to standing in Lower North, we don't sell out the ground and there is a financial implication to install it so no real need. |
That makes sense. From previous posts regarding the stadium I get the impression that nothing real be done unless we achieve promotion. And as you mentioned they do turn a blind eye to standing.
Thanks. | | | |
| Safe standing types on 19:44 - Jun 1 with 2668 views | strikalite |
Taking out those lock in position seats, if only they'd have made the rails as long as that all those years ago, that's all it needed.. |  | | |
| Safe standing types on 08:09 - Jun 2 with 2543 views | Jon_456 |
Governments view on safe standing/seating at football really angers me.
Safety is always the key aspect when talking about safe standing, emphasising that seating is by far the safest option to watch a football match. However for some reason they always seem to overlook the fact that probably 15% of home crowd and 75% of away crowds (at a guess, I don’t have actual figures) stand through all 90 minutes and no matter how many stewards there are telling fans to sit, they’re going to continue to stand because it’s part of English football.
Surely then the most obvious solution to it all is to introduce safe standing so those who want to stand can and then won’t interfere with people who want to sit.
Over the years since the introduction of safe standing in other countries, I’m yet to hear a valid argument against safe standing. Unfortunately like so many things in life, the people making the decisions seem to have no understanding of the actual issue. |  | | |
| Safe standing types on 08:46 - Jun 2 with 2515 views | Herbivore |
| Safe standing types on 08:09 - Jun 2 by Jon_456 |
Governments view on safe standing/seating at football really angers me.
Safety is always the key aspect when talking about safe standing, emphasising that seating is by far the safest option to watch a football match. However for some reason they always seem to overlook the fact that probably 15% of home crowd and 75% of away crowds (at a guess, I don’t have actual figures) stand through all 90 minutes and no matter how many stewards there are telling fans to sit, they’re going to continue to stand because it’s part of English football.
Surely then the most obvious solution to it all is to introduce safe standing so those who want to stand can and then won’t interfere with people who want to sit.
Over the years since the introduction of safe standing in other countries, I’m yet to hear a valid argument against safe standing. Unfortunately like so many things in life, the people making the decisions seem to have no understanding of the actual issue. |
My thoughts entirely. Currently fans are standing in areas not designed for standing, this is less safe than standing in a designated safe standing area. It's impossible to stop standing at football so have a sensible debate about how to make it as safe as possible. The problem is that the handling of Hillsborough was so shockingly bad at all levels that there is zero appetite amongst politicians to do anything that might upset the families. Whilst their views need to be respected, it shouldn't be a case of them being able to just immediately shut down any sensible debate about safe standing. |  |
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| Safe standing types on 08:50 - Jun 2 with 2507 views | TractorWood |
| Safe standing types on 08:46 - Jun 2 by Herbivore |
My thoughts entirely. Currently fans are standing in areas not designed for standing, this is less safe than standing in a designated safe standing area. It's impossible to stop standing at football so have a sensible debate about how to make it as safe as possible. The problem is that the handling of Hillsborough was so shockingly bad at all levels that there is zero appetite amongst politicians to do anything that might upset the families. Whilst their views need to be respected, it shouldn't be a case of them being able to just immediately shut down any sensible debate about safe standing. |
It's just the answer. Anyone in government who has any understanding of football would just make it happen. T |  |
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| Safe standing types on 09:19 - Jun 2 with 2473 views | Jon_456 |
| Safe standing types on 08:46 - Jun 2 by Herbivore |
My thoughts entirely. Currently fans are standing in areas not designed for standing, this is less safe than standing in a designated safe standing area. It's impossible to stop standing at football so have a sensible debate about how to make it as safe as possible. The problem is that the handling of Hillsborough was so shockingly bad at all levels that there is zero appetite amongst politicians to do anything that might upset the families. Whilst their views need to be respected, it shouldn't be a case of them being able to just immediately shut down any sensible debate about safe standing. |
Spot on. Obviously we should respect the victims families but burying our heads in the sand isn’t going to solve anything ether.
You would hope common sense will prevail eventually. | | | |
| Safe standing types on 11:52 - Jun 2 with 2389 views | Slambo |
| Safe standing types on 13:41 - Jun 1 by itfcjoe |
I have had an invite to Parliamentery Roundtable on this next Wednesday as a rep of ITFC fans - I'm not sure this is to do with previously being in Supporters Trust. |
When you speak to them Joe, see if you can get them to consider standing sections that aren't just those rail seats. I'm worried that that rail seat design is not the panacea fans think. They're still incredibly restrictive, and the whole point of terracing is to afford fans the ability to move around so that those that want to sing and jump about can congregate...
I know it's an emotive issue, but it needs to be stressed that - as proved in the highest court in the land - terracing was NOT the cause of the Hillsborough disaster. People cite Germany when talking about safe standing sections, forgetting that the vast majority of grounds don't have rail seating, just old school terracing..! |  |
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| Safe standing types on 11:55 - Jun 2 with 2384 views | Herbivore |
| Safe standing types on 11:52 - Jun 2 by Slambo |
When you speak to them Joe, see if you can get them to consider standing sections that aren't just those rail seats. I'm worried that that rail seat design is not the panacea fans think. They're still incredibly restrictive, and the whole point of terracing is to afford fans the ability to move around so that those that want to sing and jump about can congregate...
I know it's an emotive issue, but it needs to be stressed that - as proved in the highest court in the land - terracing was NOT the cause of the Hillsborough disaster. People cite Germany when talking about safe standing sections, forgetting that the vast majority of grounds don't have rail seating, just old school terracing..! |
We need rail seating so we can comply with UEFA regulations when Hurst leads us into the Champions League in 2021. | |
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| Safe standing types on 12:11 - Jun 2 with 2369 views | linhdi |
| Safe standing types on 08:09 - Jun 2 by Jon_456 |
Governments view on safe standing/seating at football really angers me.
Safety is always the key aspect when talking about safe standing, emphasising that seating is by far the safest option to watch a football match. However for some reason they always seem to overlook the fact that probably 15% of home crowd and 75% of away crowds (at a guess, I don’t have actual figures) stand through all 90 minutes and no matter how many stewards there are telling fans to sit, they’re going to continue to stand because it’s part of English football.
Surely then the most obvious solution to it all is to introduce safe standing so those who want to stand can and then won’t interfere with people who want to sit.
Over the years since the introduction of safe standing in other countries, I’m yet to hear a valid argument against safe standing. Unfortunately like so many things in life, the people making the decisions seem to have no understanding of the actual issue. |
You're about right re home crowds, SBR Lower being roughly 15% of our home attendance. Away games are trickier to assess, but I've been gathering some info over the last couple of seasons by observation. Where it's a smallish away following (up to 1000 and plenty of spare seats), around 15% choose to stand. It has been as low as 10%, and exceptionally has been up to 50%, but 15% plus or minus 5% covers most games. Full away ends are 90% standing ( up to 100%), because there is no choice once the front rows stand.
When Spurs put season tickets on sale at their new ground, they indicated on the plan the blocks that have been designed for standing once the law changes. Basically, the bottom half of the Park Lane single tier, I'd guess around 8000 seats, or 20% of available season tickets. Demand was strong, but that area did not sell noticeably quicker than other areas, and sold if anything a bit slower than other similarly priced areas.
That all supports the suggestion of 15% - 20% being the way to go for home ends. I feel that 50% is the better mix for away ends, though, as it is clear that the bigger the away crowd, the higher the proportion who want to stand (e.g. Brentford away, old Ninian Park).
I am convinced that an official standing SBR Lower would be financially worthwhile, despite the high cost of installing rail seats. | | | |
| Safe standing types on 12:23 - Jun 2 with 2343 views | Slambo |
| Safe standing types on 12:11 - Jun 2 by linhdi |
You're about right re home crowds, SBR Lower being roughly 15% of our home attendance. Away games are trickier to assess, but I've been gathering some info over the last couple of seasons by observation. Where it's a smallish away following (up to 1000 and plenty of spare seats), around 15% choose to stand. It has been as low as 10%, and exceptionally has been up to 50%, but 15% plus or minus 5% covers most games. Full away ends are 90% standing ( up to 100%), because there is no choice once the front rows stand.
When Spurs put season tickets on sale at their new ground, they indicated on the plan the blocks that have been designed for standing once the law changes. Basically, the bottom half of the Park Lane single tier, I'd guess around 8000 seats, or 20% of available season tickets. Demand was strong, but that area did not sell noticeably quicker than other areas, and sold if anything a bit slower than other similarly priced areas.
That all supports the suggestion of 15% - 20% being the way to go for home ends. I feel that 50% is the better mix for away ends, though, as it is clear that the bigger the away crowd, the higher the proportion who want to stand (e.g. Brentford away, old Ninian Park).
I am convinced that an official standing SBR Lower would be financially worthwhile, despite the high cost of installing rail seats. |
In terms of cost of converting back to terracing, I reckon if fans started up a crowdfunding page they could get the cash pretty quickly... | |
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| Safe standing types on 16:39 - Jun 2 with 2249 views | linhdi |
| Safe standing types on 12:23 - Jun 2 by Slambo |
In terms of cost of converting back to terracing, I reckon if fans started up a crowdfunding page they could get the cash pretty quickly... |
Or ask fans in that area whether they'd be prepared to pay £2 per month extra on their direct debit for year 1 only?
I'm not convinced the crowdfunded option would work, but doing it the route that money is only taken if the target is reached, it would be worth a try! | | | |
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