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Heathrow.....the big question 07:10 - Jun 5 with 3455 viewsBanksterDebtSlave

....Will Boris lie down in front of the bulldozers or just down the side of a bus?

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Heathrow.....the big question on 09:56 - Jun 5 with 882 viewsNo9

Heathrow.....the big question on 09:16 - Jun 5 by Guthrum

The problem with "Boris Island" was that it would have been a long way the wrong end of London for all the transport links (imagine coming from the north or west and having to go all the way around the M25 to get there). Even with Crossrail, it would require a load more rail infrastructure to be built. It would be too far out for the Tube.

That without the cost (financial and environmental) of building a large enough artificial island in the Thames to begin with.


But, in the 60's when the infrastruture needed to be established a high speed link into the capital would have been no problem & Essex could have had better roads to the East
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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:00 - Jun 5 with 877 viewsGuthrum

Heathrow.....the big question on 09:39 - Jun 5 by StokieBlue

I do agree to a point, however:

The NW should be doing point-to-point journeys from Manchester to basically anywhere it needs to go. Modern twin engine planes are more than capable of doing this.

It would require more rail infrastructure but that was all included in the plans. The government is happy to spend 80bn on HS2 infrastructure - would be better off cancelling that and using it better for things such as this.

Is the environmental impact any worse than building another huge runway in central London? That's not going to do much good for the air pollution levels of the many people living in and around the airport.

It's not perfect but it's doable much like Hong Kong did. The third runway at Heathrow is a mess of an idea in my opinion.

SB


Boris' island was actually going to be about as far from central London as Stanstead and Gatwick. They might as well add a second runway to those airports (with motorway and rail links already in place).

The thing for me about the proposed third runway at Heathrow is not just where they're going to put it, but how it will be handled in terms of air traffic control. Two runways makes sense - one for arrivals, the other for departures. Is the third going to handle both? If on the same alignment as the other two, could it lead to confusion? Given 'planes are coming in and going out about as close together as reasonably possible, how do you add another stream of aircraft into that, without getting too close?

There's also a shibboleth with Heathrow about prestige and the association with BA.

Manchester airport is good (I've flown from there) and would agree for people in the NW. But I was thinking more the northern Home Counties and Midlands (i.e. north and west of London).

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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:05 - Jun 5 with 873 viewsStokieBlue

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:00 - Jun 5 by Guthrum

Boris' island was actually going to be about as far from central London as Stanstead and Gatwick. They might as well add a second runway to those airports (with motorway and rail links already in place).

The thing for me about the proposed third runway at Heathrow is not just where they're going to put it, but how it will be handled in terms of air traffic control. Two runways makes sense - one for arrivals, the other for departures. Is the third going to handle both? If on the same alignment as the other two, could it lead to confusion? Given 'planes are coming in and going out about as close together as reasonably possible, how do you add another stream of aircraft into that, without getting too close?

There's also a shibboleth with Heathrow about prestige and the association with BA.

Manchester airport is good (I've flown from there) and would agree for people in the NW. But I was thinking more the northern Home Counties and Midlands (i.e. north and west of London).


Neither of those airport can run 24 hours a day though which was the clear benefit of Boris island. Also it's proximity to Thames Gateway port for cargo was a benefit and the fact the air pollution wouldn't be over a populated city.

With regards to the Midlands it could be argued that money would be well spent increasing capacity at Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow to allow easier point-to-point travel for more of British people.

SB

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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:10 - Jun 5 with 868 viewsCoachRob

Heathrow.....the big question on 09:41 - Jun 5 by StokieBlue

You actually basing that on anything or just going for the banker bashing trope?

SB


Er who sponsors Liverpool? Maybe you would like to breakdown the wisdom of taxpayer owned RBS shares being sold at £2bn loss + borrowing costs or Barclays/Qatar deal or HBOS or TSB. Would love to hear your wisdom on shadow banking industry in China and Asia more widely - place for British banking expansion Freddy Goodwin style?
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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:13 - Jun 5 with 869 viewsNo9

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:05 - Jun 5 by StokieBlue

Neither of those airport can run 24 hours a day though which was the clear benefit of Boris island. Also it's proximity to Thames Gateway port for cargo was a benefit and the fact the air pollution wouldn't be over a populated city.

With regards to the Midlands it could be argued that money would be well spent increasing capacity at Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow to allow easier point-to-point travel for more of British people.

SB


You are overlooking the fact the tories have to have LHR a success even if it means damaging the rest of the country.
The options to expand the regional airorts has been there for a few decades, there is no need to expand LHR other than to assuage the businesses that pay into the tory coffers.
Since 2010 travel from some of the regional airports has become extremely expensive making LHR a viable option for the traveller despit eht sost of getting to LHR which is significant.
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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:20 - Jun 5 with 861 viewsStokieBlue

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:10 - Jun 5 by CoachRob

Er who sponsors Liverpool? Maybe you would like to breakdown the wisdom of taxpayer owned RBS shares being sold at £2bn loss + borrowing costs or Barclays/Qatar deal or HBOS or TSB. Would love to hear your wisdom on shadow banking industry in China and Asia more widely - place for British banking expansion Freddy Goodwin style?


None of that has anything to do with Heathrow airport or it's extension being linked to where certain people want to fly to.

It's a bit weird to blame something you don't like on a completely different subject. You can discuss those points in another thread, I am sure you'll get many takers.

SB

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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:20 - Jun 5 with 862 viewsLord_Lucan

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:13 - Jun 5 by No9

You are overlooking the fact the tories have to have LHR a success even if it means damaging the rest of the country.
The options to expand the regional airorts has been there for a few decades, there is no need to expand LHR other than to assuage the businesses that pay into the tory coffers.
Since 2010 travel from some of the regional airports has become extremely expensive making LHR a viable option for the traveller despit eht sost of getting to LHR which is significant.
All money into the pockets of donors


Whilst I agree with a new airport a la Boris Island you simply can't mothball Heathrow. I used to live close to it and still have connections there. LHR is such a massive employment hub, you could not rebuild 100,000 jobs very easy.

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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:20 - Jun 5 with 863 viewsGuthrum

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:05 - Jun 5 by StokieBlue

Neither of those airport can run 24 hours a day though which was the clear benefit of Boris island. Also it's proximity to Thames Gateway port for cargo was a benefit and the fact the air pollution wouldn't be over a populated city.

With regards to the Midlands it could be argued that money would be well spent increasing capacity at Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow to allow easier point-to-point travel for more of British people.

SB


The people who work on Boris Island would have to live somewhere close (and object to late-night noise). You're not going to get bar staff, catering people and WH Smith assistants commuting all the way from London - they'd have no wages left, for a start.

Agree about Manchester, Birmingham and Glasgow. The former city (plus Salford) is growing hugely at the moment, masses of building, as more businesses move to the area from expensive London. This, I think, is a trend likely to continue. So the long-distance transport needs upgrading too. I actually believe HS2* is likely to be a good thing, allowing people to live and mostly work from home in the North, going into the London office for meetings one or two days a week.

* Edit: If it ever gets built/finished/done properly.
[Post edited 5 Jun 2018 10:28]

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Heathrow.....the big question on 10:25 - Jun 5 with 856 viewsGuthrum

Heathrow.....the big question on 09:56 - Jun 5 by No9

But, in the 60's when the infrastruture needed to be established a high speed link into the capital would have been no problem & Essex could have had better roads to the East


Unfortunately, planners lacked the foresight to get anywhere close to the levels of growth, building and concentration in the capital over the subsequent 20 years.

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Heathrow.....the big question on 12:46 - Jun 5 with 836 viewsLord_Lucan

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:25 - Jun 5 by Guthrum

Unfortunately, planners lacked the foresight to get anywhere close to the levels of growth, building and concentration in the capital over the subsequent 20 years.


The problem with the UK in general is it is a short term thinking country.

When they designed the M25 they designed two and three lanes, it should have been four and five.

By the time they build a third runway at LHR they will need another. Charles De Gaulle and Frankfurt already have four runways each and Schiphol has six.

The reason why potholes are everywhere on our roads is because the roads are cheaply restored after works have been done on them. Successive governments under invest in Great Britains infrastructure.

I have to disagree with HS2 Guth, we don't actually live in a large country, it doesn't take long to get to Manchester on a normal train. That money should have been spent upgrading our original system.

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Heathrow.....the big question on 13:01 - Jun 5 with 819 viewsNo9

Heathrow.....the big question on 10:25 - Jun 5 by Guthrum

Unfortunately, planners lacked the foresight to get anywhere close to the levels of growth, building and concentration in the capital over the subsequent 20 years.


The real problem with the new Lomndon airport not being built in the Thames estuary was Essex - they wanted to ex RAF airfiled at Stansted developed as a commercial airport.
I don't think anyone at the time foresaw the problems STN would bring in the future.

LHR approved - on the news just now
But it will be another cluster F
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