| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! 20:42 - Jul 19 with 8482 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
Apartheid emboldened by Trump and the rise of the right.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2018/07/israel-passes-controversial-je
Doesn't denying their right to a Jewish state fail those anti semitism tests?
Here it is...........
"Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist endeavor. "
......Well if this is the state they are creating I'll take my chances. Which camp are you in racist or anti semite, you decide! [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 21:23]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:48 - Jul 19 with 2338 views | Clapham_Junction |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:34 - Jul 19 by Ryorry |
Depends what (or who) you mean by "native population". Who ousted who originally? (might need Guthers' assistance here!). |
Well, quite. How long does a group have to live in an area before they're considered indigenous.
The point was that this is an area where I think you should be able to have a valid debate (and there is certainly a lot to debate) without automatically being deemed to be racist for holding certain viewpoints. [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 23:48]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:57 - Jul 19 with 2306 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:34 - Jul 19 by Ryorry |
Depends what (or who) you mean by "native population". Who ousted who originally? (might need Guthers' assistance here!). |
Indeed. There is a very good reason that it was originally called Judea/ Judah [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 23:57]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:00 - Jul 20 with 2306 views | WeWereZombies |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:41 - Jul 19 by syntaxerror |
Apartheid South Africa had no right to exist. Very few argue with that.
But Israel is allowed to exercise the same lack of self determination to a part of its indigenous population, aggressively, and occasionally causing loss of life at times.
Apartheid South Africa drew widespread condemnation, and correctly so, for its justification of 'hot pursuit' - chasing armed opponents of the regime into foreign countries with deadly force, and often with serious collateral damage.
Israel can do the same with impunity from most western governments.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like double standards. |
There was a South Africa before apartheid, and now there is one after it. The good of the nation was what Mandela, Tutu and their followers (and eventually De Klerk) were struggling for. We can only hope for similarly gifted individuals to emerge in Israel and Palestine. |  |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:00 - Jul 20 with 2306 views | syntaxerror |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:57 - Jul 19 by GlasgowBlue |
Indeed. There is a very good reason that it was originally called Judea/ Judah [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 23:57]
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If you go back 1000-2000 years, does that mean the Welsh (original celtic Britons) have a right to petition to remove the Angles and Saxons from England?
How far do you go back? [Post edited 20 Jul 2018 0:00]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:05 - Jul 20 with 2289 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:41 - Jul 19 by syntaxerror |
Apartheid South Africa had no right to exist. Very few argue with that.
But Israel is allowed to exercise the same lack of self determination to a part of its indigenous population, aggressively, and occasionally causing loss of life at times.
Apartheid South Africa drew widespread condemnation, and correctly so, for its justification of 'hot pursuit' - chasing armed opponents of the regime into foreign countries with deadly force, and often with serious collateral damage.
Israel can do the same with impunity from most western governments.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like double standards. |
Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t South Africa still South Africa? | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:12 - Jul 20 with 2286 views | jeera |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 23:41 - Jul 19 by syntaxerror |
Apartheid South Africa had no right to exist. Very few argue with that.
But Israel is allowed to exercise the same lack of self determination to a part of its indigenous population, aggressively, and occasionally causing loss of life at times.
Apartheid South Africa drew widespread condemnation, and correctly so, for its justification of 'hot pursuit' - chasing armed opponents of the regime into foreign countries with deadly force, and often with serious collateral damage.
Israel can do the same with impunity from most western governments.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like double standards. |
Israel is claimed in the name of religion.
No other reason. |  |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:15 - Jul 20 with 2283 views | syntaxerror |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:05 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t South Africa still South Africa? |
Geographically, yes.
But you aren't stupid, so why would you ask that question? | | | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 01:34 - Jul 20 with 2263 views | SpruceMoose |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 21:11 - Jul 19 by wkj |
dunno, he's got a nibble, this could be the start of a glorious meltdown. |
You are a naughty boy. But I love it! |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 03:44 - Jul 20 with 2248 views | Ryorry |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 00:12 - Jul 20 by jeera |
Israel is claimed in the name of religion.
No other reason. |
100% incorrect. |  |
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| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 06:11 - Jul 20 with 2221 views | connorscontract |
You don't even need to go that far.
If denying Semitic people self-determination is anti-Semitic, then anyone denying the right to self-determination of Palestinian Arabs is anti-Semitic, what with Arabic being a Semitic language.
So anybody speaking up in favour of Palestinian self-determination is the very opposite of anti-Semitic. |  | | |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 07:02 - Jul 20 with 2207 views | acj |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 22:09 - Jul 19 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Morning!
Non of these states have first class citizens based on religion. You will not have to worry about double standards if our government follows the Thatcher model towards South Africa snd Chile! [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 22:11]
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The Chile model? Thatcher was a big supporter of Pinochet and his dictatorship despite all of the attrocities committed, that was why Chile was the only South American country to back our side in the Falklands conflict.
That aside though, I think Israel has a right to exist and it's citizens have every right to self-determination. Palestine and it's citizens surely also have that same right. To my mind Netanyahu and his ilk stand firmly in the way of progress in the region. |  |
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| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 08:11 - Jul 20 with 2185 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 06:11 - Jul 20 by connorscontract |
You don't even need to go that far.
If denying Semitic people self-determination is anti-Semitic, then anyone denying the right to self-determination of Palestinian Arabs is anti-Semitic, what with Arabic being a Semitic language.
So anybody speaking up in favour of Palestinian self-determination is the very opposite of anti-Semitic. |
That’s utter nonsense.
From the description of antisemetic:
The root word Semite gives the false impression that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic people, e.g., including Arabs and Assyrians. The compound word antisemite was popularized in Germany in 1879 as a scientific-sounding term for Judenhass ("Jew-hatred"),and has been its common use since then.
https://www.adl.org/resources/fact-sheets/response-to-common-inaccuracy-arabs-ca
https://www.quora.com/If-Arabs-are-also-Semitic-then-why-does-the-term-Anti-Semi [Post edited 20 Jul 2018 8:21]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 08:33 - Jul 20 with 2162 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 03:44 - Jul 20 by Ryorry |
100% incorrect. |
Indeed. Although created as a Jewish homelands after the holocaust the Israeli Declaration of Independence states “ written that the State of Israel 'will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or gender“.
This latest law is from a right wing leader if a right wing party. You can be a Zionist and believe Israel has the right o exist but at the same time be highly critical of its current policies. Just as we can with every state in the world.
Israel’s right to exist should not be questioned because if the policies if it’s government. We don’t do it with any other government we disagree with and that is where the antisemitism comes in. | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:02 - Jul 20 with 2143 views | Cotty |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 21:10 - Jul 19 by GlasgowBlue |
You really are trying too hard banksy. Israel was born out of the Balfour declaration which called for a "national home for the Jewish people" in 1917.
Has this come as news to you some 101 years later?
The need to establish a Jewish homeland was obviously obviously a matter of some urgency after 6 million Jews were exterminated by a madman in Europe.
Does denying Jews the right to self determination make one an anti semite? Yes. As per the IHRA definition. Does that mean you can't call out Israel for the things you believe they are doing wrong? Absolutely not. Criticise away.
just because you don't like the government or the actions of a government doesn't mean you can deny the country's right to exist.
I don't like what Assad is doing in Syria. Nor do I like what Kim Kim Jong-un is doing in North Korea. But I wouldn't suggest that either country no longer has the right to exist. [Post edited 19 Jul 2018 21:11]
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Your last paragraph is the key one, and this argument seems to have completely passed the leadership in the labour party by, unfortunately. Probably going to resign my membership this week, between that the weakest opposition to this Brexit shambles. |  | | |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:26 - Jul 20 with 2130 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:02 - Jul 20 by Cotty |
Your last paragraph is the key one, and this argument seems to have completely passed the leadership in the labour party by, unfortunately. Probably going to resign my membership this week, between that the weakest opposition to this Brexit shambles. |
Welcome to the politically homeless club. I chucked it after May went in with the DUP. | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:38 - Jul 20 with 2128 views | GlasgowBlue |
Further to your op I’d like to link two articles from Haaretz, which is a liberal left of centre Israeli publication. The first demonstrates that you can be highly critical of the policies of the Israeli government without resorting to antisemitic language, whilst the second, from a left if centre viewpoint highlights how badly wrong U.K. Labour is dealing with the definition of antisemitism.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/progressive-jews-blast-israel-s-new-nation-s
With the rise of antisemitsm across Europe, from both the far right and the far left, the need for Israel to exist as a homeland for Jews to go and live in safety is more important than any other time since the war. [Post edited 20 Jul 2018 10:24]
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:45 - Jul 20 with 2124 views | Bluefish |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:26 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Welcome to the politically homeless club. I chucked it after May went in with the DUP. |
If Chuka and Anna made it happen and took the sensible from both parties would you sign up? |  |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:47 - Jul 20 with 2119 views | Cotty |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:26 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Welcome to the politically homeless club. I chucked it after May went in with the DUP. |
I only joined to vote out Jeremy. Look how that went! | | | |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 10:17 - Jul 20 with 2100 views | Ryorry |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 08:33 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
Indeed. Although created as a Jewish homelands after the holocaust the Israeli Declaration of Independence states “ written that the State of Israel 'will ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or gender“.
This latest law is from a right wing leader if a right wing party. You can be a Zionist and believe Israel has the right o exist but at the same time be highly critical of its current policies. Just as we can with every state in the world.
Israel’s right to exist should not be questioned because if the policies if it’s government. We don’t do it with any other government we disagree with and that is where the antisemitism comes in. |
Quite.
Unfortunately some people still get mixed up between being Jewish by race/descent (inherited via the maternal line) and electing to follow the Jewish religion. The first is not a choice, the second is. | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 10:20 - Jul 20 with 2096 views | Ryorry |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:45 - Jul 20 by Bluefish |
If Chuka and Anna made it happen and took the sensible from both parties would you sign up? |
Dunno about him, but I might - depending on other policies - as might possibly millions of others too! | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 10:25 - Jul 20 with 2086 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 09:45 - Jul 20 by Bluefish |
If Chuka and Anna made it happen and took the sensible from both parties would you sign up? |
If it wasn't a one issue EU obsessed party then there would be a possibility. | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 10:37 - Jul 20 with 2073 views | Bluefish |
| Victory for Israeli racist rigt wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 10:25 - Jul 20 by GlasgowBlue |
If it wasn't a one issue EU obsessed party then there would be a possibility. |
My hope is a party that picks the best (generally the moderate) parts of both parties and give an actual choice again, opposed to polar opposites that don't want to budge because the other will jump all over them and say it all fails. It isn't real politics at the moment, it shouldn't be just about point scoring it should be about being the best we can be and treating people in the best way | |
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| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 13:21 - Jul 20 with 2022 views | connorscontract |
It's not utter nonsense. It's factually accurate. Arabs are Semites.
Wanting to own the language and define the terms is a part of how the Zionists fight criticism of Israel, as evidenced by that "soft anti-Semitism" article that you posted a few days ago.
Pointing out the Semitic common ancestry of Jews and Arabs muddies the waters for those wanting a Single State solution.
It's an inconvenient fact, but Arabs are Semites. The state of Israel doesn't own that name and they don't get to drive Arabs out of their Semitic identity. | | | |
| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 13:35 - Jul 20 with 2008 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Victory for Israeli racist right wing jews........apply your own parallels! on 13:21 - Jul 20 by connorscontract |
It's not utter nonsense. It's factually accurate. Arabs are Semites.
Wanting to own the language and define the terms is a part of how the Zionists fight criticism of Israel, as evidenced by that "soft anti-Semitism" article that you posted a few days ago.
Pointing out the Semitic common ancestry of Jews and Arabs muddies the waters for those wanting a Single State solution.
It's an inconvenient fact, but Arabs are Semites. The state of Israel doesn't own that name and they don't get to drive Arabs out of their Semitic identity. |
Well that didn’t take long to bring Zionist and Israel into it.
Perhaps read the links and the origins of the term anti semite and you will be aware that it has nothing to do with being anti Arab.
That excuse is a well used diversionary tactic to excuse antisemtism.
https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/us/anti-semitism
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anti-Semitism
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/anti-semitism?q=anti-Semi
http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/the-arabs-are-semites-too-fallacy/
Edit. What was the soft abtisemitism article I posted the other day.
2nd edit. I’m amazed that anyone is still trying to muddy the waters by attempting to claim that the term antisemitic refers to anything other than prejudice against Jews. I’m very surprised that it’s coming from you. [Post edited 20 Jul 2018 13:52]
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