| Some inside news 10:14 - Oct 16 with 11549 views | hampstead_blue |
This is hardly new I know but.
At a dinner last week I had a chat with one of the most senior civil servants, a mate I play cricket with.
1) Jeremy Hunt for PM
2) The EU are doing everything they can to annex NI from the UK. They see it as a suitable punishment for wanting the leave their club.
3) Regardless of what the EU say, they are not interested in negotiating, they just want to make us suffer. All their talk of a settlement is spin and BS.
It doesn't matter who or which party negotiates, they just want to nail us to a post.
Doesn't show them in a good light.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| Some inside news on 12:21 - Oct 16 with 2945 views | No9 |
| Some inside news on 12:12 - Oct 16 by chicoazul |
And Corbyn & McDonnell's desire to do the same, dont forget them too. In the interests of fairness. |
You've missed two important points
1/ labour aren't in power
2/ a 5 year fixed parliament makes it near impossible for this to be anythign other than a tory show.
You don't think any tory or DUP will vote against May do you? and if they did & there was a vote of no confidence they would all support her - why else do you think Cameron arranged things that way?
Unless there are a number of tories who quit the party this is going to continue in the same way |  | | |
| Some inside news on 12:29 - Oct 16 with 2931 views | eireblue |
Surely point 2 and 3 are just opinions?
If the civil servant was advising Michel Barnier, then that would be more relevant.
I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss. |  | | |
| Some inside news on 12:33 - Oct 16 with 2930 views | lowhouseblue |
if i was negotiating with someone and I knew there was something they simply couldn't concede, I would also try to convince them that that was the thing I really wanted. so the eu's negotiating strategy seems to be paying off if senior people really do believe that the uk will have to give ever greater concessions elsewhere in order to protect northern Ireland. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Some inside news on 12:38 - Oct 16 with 2913 views | MattinLondon |
| Some inside news on 12:04 - Oct 16 by crunchie1978 |
Well apart from the 1st point the other 2 are clearly happening so drinking or being daft has nothing to do with it!
Anyone can see it. |
Considering how patriotic a lot of leavers are it’s amazing how paranoid and insecure some are regarding nationality. |  | | |
| Some inside news on 12:45 - Oct 16 with 2885 views | No9 |
| Some inside news on 12:33 - Oct 16 by lowhouseblue |
if i was negotiating with someone and I knew there was something they simply couldn't concede, I would also try to convince them that that was the thing I really wanted. so the eu's negotiating strategy seems to be paying off if senior people really do believe that the uk will have to give ever greater concessions elsewhere in order to protect northern Ireland. |
The UK is wanting to leave. The UK government don't like what that means. | | | |
| Some inside news on 12:53 - Oct 16 with 2868 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Some inside news on 11:22 - Oct 16 by bracknell_blue |
The EU cannot break their rules for a member who wants to be an ex-member. Our wonderful (!) politicians should have realised this before they started "negotiating". Anyone with half a brain could see how it would play out with our red lines. On the NI issue, anything bar being in the CU and SM means a hard border which breaches the Good Friday Agreement. Therefore illegal unless this is repealed. NI voted to remain, more want to do so now there, even to the point of accepting it may lead to a united Ireland; it is just the stone age DUP who won't budge an inch.
There are only 2 options in play now: no deal and remain. And our politicians are too pig-headed and scared to back down now, so no deal it is. A government, aided and abetted by the opposition, deciding deliberately to impoverish this country. Only the disaster capitalists and tax dodgers will do OK (includes Rees-Mogg, May's hubby, Redwood, etc). |
Good analysis. The Irish border issue is simple to understand, but impossible to resolve unless May drops her red lines. A crash-out Brexit requires a hard border, exactly as an agreement that takes us out of CU/SM. Nothing has changed since the vote, in that respect. | | | |
| Some inside news on 12:53 - Oct 16 with 2868 views | titanicclown |
I wouldn't be surprised if any of this is true.
What is surprising is anyone would think this 'doesnt put them in a very good light.'
At the summit of the mountain of brexit idiocy is the assumption that the EU would or should do us a favour. Of course they wont! We have delivered a massive blow to their security and propects.
Of course they wont roll over, of course they want to make an example of us and of course they need to make being outside the EU less favourable than being in the EU. All the 'easy deal to do' and 'they need us' rhetoric is just blind arrogance.
They are now in the business of protecting their interests. And just because they are doing a better job of that than our government - it doesnt put them in a bad light. |  | | |
| Some inside news on 13:13 - Oct 16 with 2845 views | hampstead_blue |
| Some inside news on 12:29 - Oct 16 by eireblue |
Surely point 2 and 3 are just opinions?
If the civil servant was advising Michel Barnier, then that would be more relevant.
I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss. |
Points 2 and 3 are true and far from just his view. It's been stated behind closed doors that the EU has no interest in negotiating.
All they want to do is spin against us.
"I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss."
How can it be lose/lose? I don't agree. We are the EU's biggest customer. It should be win'win but alas Germany and France won't have that. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| Some inside news on 13:19 - Oct 16 with 2836 views | SomethingBlue |
| Some inside news on 13:13 - Oct 16 by hampstead_blue |
Points 2 and 3 are true and far from just his view. It's been stated behind closed doors that the EU has no interest in negotiating.
All they want to do is spin against us.
"I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss."
How can it be lose/lose? I don't agree. We are the EU's biggest customer. It should be win'win but alas Germany and France won't have that. |
You're obsessing yourself with petty "them vs us" nonsense, just like the UK side as a whole, rather than the grown-up stuff I'm afraid. Time we snapped out of it, no? | |
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| Some inside news on 14:04 - Oct 16 with 2794 views | No9 |
| Some inside news on 13:13 - Oct 16 by hampstead_blue |
Points 2 and 3 are true and far from just his view. It's been stated behind closed doors that the EU has no interest in negotiating.
All they want to do is spin against us.
"I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss."
How can it be lose/lose? I don't agree. We are the EU's biggest customer. It should be win'win but alas Germany and France won't have that. |
"We are the EU's biggest customer."
That is completely incorrect isn't it?
Cut & paste:-
List of the largest trading partners of the European Union
hideRank Partners Exports (million euro)
- Total EU 1,789,063
1 United States 369,549
2 China 170,399
3 Switzerland 150,833 | | | |
| Some inside news on 14:12 - Oct 16 with 2787 views | GeoffSentence |
| Some inside news on 10:20 - Oct 16 by Darth_Koont |
That sounds credible. |
It certainly is credible, that's not to judge if it is true or not, but it is definitely credible. The EU has a political imperative to make leaving difficult and painful in order to discourage the others.
Anyone who thought that a good trade deal with the EU was going to be straightforward as it is in both party's interests was naive and deluded. |  |
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| Some inside news on 14:22 - Oct 16 with 2778 views | chicoazul |
| Some inside news on 12:21 - Oct 16 by No9 |
You've missed two important points
1/ labour aren't in power
2/ a 5 year fixed parliament makes it near impossible for this to be anythign other than a tory show.
You don't think any tory or DUP will vote against May do you? and if they did & there was a vote of no confidence they would all support her - why else do you think Cameron arranged things that way?
Unless there are a number of tories who quit the party this is going to continue in the same way |
All I am saying is, there are people on both sides of the "divide" who want out of the EU. That's it. The simple statement of this fact never fails to annoy you. |  |
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| Some inside news on 14:23 - Oct 16 with 2774 views | No9 |
| Some inside news on 14:12 - Oct 16 by GeoffSentence |
It certainly is credible, that's not to judge if it is true or not, but it is definitely credible. The EU has a political imperative to make leaving difficult and painful in order to discourage the others.
Anyone who thought that a good trade deal with the EU was going to be straightforward as it is in both party's interests was naive and deluded. |
Remind me what Liam Fox said?
But irrespective UK politicians still have to learn what leave means. | | | |
| Some inside news on 16:42 - Oct 16 with 2722 views | braveblue |
Don’t think a civil servant would know party plans or grassroots support.
Watch this space. German industry will demand and get a deal. Trouble is Corbyn will vote against regardless of damage to the country in order to force an election.
The Euro politicians will force Brussels to do a deal. They know the UK will not consider splitting up to suit them. | | | |
| Some inside news on 16:53 - Oct 16 with 2710 views | braveblue |
| Some inside news on 11:22 - Oct 16 by bracknell_blue |
The EU cannot break their rules for a member who wants to be an ex-member. Our wonderful (!) politicians should have realised this before they started "negotiating". Anyone with half a brain could see how it would play out with our red lines. On the NI issue, anything bar being in the CU and SM means a hard border which breaches the Good Friday Agreement. Therefore illegal unless this is repealed. NI voted to remain, more want to do so now there, even to the point of accepting it may lead to a united Ireland; it is just the stone age DUP who won't budge an inch.
There are only 2 options in play now: no deal and remain. And our politicians are too pig-headed and scared to back down now, so no deal it is. A government, aided and abetted by the opposition, deciding deliberately to impoverish this country. Only the disaster capitalists and tax dodgers will do OK (includes Rees-Mogg, May's hubby, Redwood, etc). |
Terrible the way the politicians are not ignoring democracy just because you lost!!
Also, how did Ireland manage before we joined. No hard border and not an issue. Entirely possible to have a soft border.
Finally, if you believe the majority in NI are happy with a united Ireland you are deluded. Who do you think votes for the DUP? | | | |
| Some inside news on 17:00 - Oct 16 with 2699 views | eireblue |
| Some inside news on 13:13 - Oct 16 by hampstead_blue |
Points 2 and 3 are true and far from just his view. It's been stated behind closed doors that the EU has no interest in negotiating.
All they want to do is spin against us.
"I have heard many EU politicians say any deal will just be a lose/lose. The negotiation is what degree of loss."
How can it be lose/lose? I don't agree. We are the EU's biggest customer. It should be win'win but alas Germany and France won't have that. |
Of course it can be lose/lose.
Thinking in terms of the UK being the EU's biggest customer is part of the issue.
The UK was part of the EU and there wasn't a UK and EU for many things.
There will now be a a EU without the income from the UK. That is a loss.
The UK will no longer be in the common market, that will be a loss. Even Brexiters state that there will be a loss in GDP, with possibly a brighter outlook in 5 to 10 years. And we all know how difficult predictions can be in the short term. | | | |
| Some inside news on 17:30 - Oct 16 with 2679 views | Binner |
| Some inside news on 16:42 - Oct 16 by braveblue |
Don’t think a civil servant would know party plans or grassroots support.
Watch this space. German industry will demand and get a deal. Trouble is Corbyn will vote against regardless of damage to the country in order to force an election.
The Euro politicians will force Brussels to do a deal. They know the UK will not consider splitting up to suit them. |
So you don't really have a clue. You are just hoping for the best. |  |
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| Some inside news on 18:25 - Oct 16 with 2649 views | bluejacko |
| Some inside news on 16:53 - Oct 16 by braveblue |
Terrible the way the politicians are not ignoring democracy just because you lost!!
Also, how did Ireland manage before we joined. No hard border and not an issue. Entirely possible to have a soft border.
Finally, if you believe the majority in NI are happy with a united Ireland you are deluded. Who do you think votes for the DUP? |
There already are border “checks” between NI and ROI but it is done electronically! VAT etc is done on goods at source and the supplier and receiver have to ensure everything is paid and above board before delivery. But hey that would be to hard to do with any tarrifs wouldn’t it. | | | |
| Some inside news on 18:48 - Oct 16 with 2636 views | jaykay |
dont forget brexit means brexit and the will of the people or any other sound bite you want |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Some inside news on 18:51 - Oct 16 with 2633 views | braveblue |
| Some inside news on 17:30 - Oct 16 by Binner |
So you don't really have a clue. You are just hoping for the best. |
No idea what you mean. Please explain yourself. | | | |
| Some inside news on 19:42 - Oct 16 with 2610 views | Swn98 |
Whaton earth is this trash doing on football threads. | | | |
| Some inside news on 19:50 - Oct 16 with 2604 views | Binner |
| Some inside news on 18:51 - Oct 16 by braveblue |
No idea what you mean. Please explain yourself. |
Well, throughout the supposed negotiations it has been clear that the EU will stick to its principles of open borders etc, ie its own red lines. Various members of our dreadful governing party have consistently made one or another promise to the UK populace that they could deliver a deal, somehow overlooking the fact that such a deal would require the EU to abandon its principles. Mrs May is chief among them as are several of her more swivel-eyed cohorts.
In 29 months our Conservatives have still not grasped that the EU is not bluffing.
German industry will not "demand and get a deal" as you put it because the EU is not bluffing; and, in any case, it is far from clear that there would be any benefit to "German Industry" if such a deal could be made.
The Euro politicians (who?) will not "force Brussels to do a deal" as you put it because the EU is not bluffing. They probably, mostly, are not bothered whether the UK splits up. Why would they be? Did you notice many of our politicians losing sleep when Czechoslovakia split up?
And, as for your comment re Corbyn... he has said what he would support though there seems little likelihood of the government accomodating him. And to try to blame him for "damage to the country" is absurd considering the full-on destruction being wreaked upon us by the incompetent incumbents. | |
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| Some inside news on 08:24 - Oct 17 with 2521 views | hampstead_blue |
| Some inside news on 19:42 - Oct 16 by Swn98 |
Whaton earth is this trash doing on football threads. |
To answer your point directly.
We have a broad population on this boar. I can honestly say that I only personally know two people who post,and enjoy the anonymity of the debate.
Politics and economics "can" spark an interesting debate. It does break up the monotony of 'def info' footy stuff. There were a couple of crackers knocking around during conference season.
Feel free to join in. The water is warm and all views are welcome. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| Some inside news on 08:32 - Oct 17 with 2510 views | lowhouseblue |
| Some inside news on 19:50 - Oct 16 by Binner |
Well, throughout the supposed negotiations it has been clear that the EU will stick to its principles of open borders etc, ie its own red lines. Various members of our dreadful governing party have consistently made one or another promise to the UK populace that they could deliver a deal, somehow overlooking the fact that such a deal would require the EU to abandon its principles. Mrs May is chief among them as are several of her more swivel-eyed cohorts.
In 29 months our Conservatives have still not grasped that the EU is not bluffing.
German industry will not "demand and get a deal" as you put it because the EU is not bluffing; and, in any case, it is far from clear that there would be any benefit to "German Industry" if such a deal could be made.
The Euro politicians (who?) will not "force Brussels to do a deal" as you put it because the EU is not bluffing. They probably, mostly, are not bothered whether the UK splits up. Why would they be? Did you notice many of our politicians losing sleep when Czechoslovakia split up?
And, as for your comment re Corbyn... he has said what he would support though there seems little likelihood of the government accomodating him. And to try to blame him for "damage to the country" is absurd considering the full-on destruction being wreaked upon us by the incompetent incumbents. |
perhaps the eu is good enough at bluffing to fool you into thinking they're not bluffing?
it's a negotiation. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Some inside news on 09:36 - Oct 17 with 2531 views | xrayspecs |
1) Quite plausible. He would not come with the baggage that a lot of the other potential candidates will bring - Boris, Davis, Gove etc. Not very inspiring though.
2 and 3) Quite. This is all about making an example of an exiting member state. There is a lot of work going on to force companies to relocate into the EU. This is hardly a conspiracy theory, it has been a naked agenda from the outset. | | | |
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