| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today 13:40 - Dec 12 with 10998 views | tractordownsouth |
Oh dear |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:31 - Dec 12 with 4257 views | No9 |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 14:57 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
A legally enforced hard border between NI and the ROI as per WTO rules. |
A lot still haven't awoken to that fact |  | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:33 - Dec 12 with 4245 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:29 - Dec 12 by Withnail |
The EU are not mentioned once in the GFA. Just sayin. |
No, but an open border IS.
*Trigger warning: long words, facts*
https://fullfact.org/europe/leave-without-deal-irish-border/
Key phrase:
'If there is no withdrawal agreement or backstop in place Ireland will need to observe the EU’s rules on both customs and on protecting the single market which normally require checks at a border with a third country (which is what the UK will be).' |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:36 - Dec 12 with 4247 views | BloomBlue |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 13:43 - Dec 12 by giant_stow |
They'll be first out of the door in a recession then. |
10 years ago we suffered one of our worst recessions while being part of the EU, so staying in the EU won't stop a recession. Obviously project fear have fooled you with their fake news |  | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said on 15:37 - Dec 12 with 4242 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Two of my colleagues have said on 15:26 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
Trouble is, those solutions involve doing things that the hardcore gammon element don't like, though. [Post edited 12 Dec 2018 15:28]
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Like what? |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:39 - Dec 12 with 4235 views | blueislander |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:36 - Dec 12 by BloomBlue |
10 years ago we suffered one of our worst recessions while being part of the EU, so staying in the EU won't stop a recession. Obviously project fear have fooled you with their fake news |
Did the slogan on the bus about increasing NHS spending by 350 million fool you.? | | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:41 - Dec 12 with 4228 views | No9 |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:36 - Dec 12 by BloomBlue |
10 years ago we suffered one of our worst recessions while being part of the EU, so staying in the EU won't stop a recession. Obviously project fear have fooled you with their fake news |
Did you not notice the crash didn't start in the EU but in America- that's who the brexiteers want to cuddle up to.
maybe you haven't listened to Fox et al? | | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said on 15:41 - Dec 12 with 4216 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said on 15:37 - Dec 12 by Lord_Lucan |
Like what? |
The current deal, which keeps the country in the in the single market and custom union. Because having ease of trade and low-red-tape access to our largest single trading partner is a BAD thing.
https://fullfact.org/europe/irish-backstop/ | |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:41 - Dec 12 with 4226 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:33 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
No, but an open border IS.
*Trigger warning: long words, facts*
https://fullfact.org/europe/leave-without-deal-irish-border/
Key phrase:
'If there is no withdrawal agreement or backstop in place Ireland will need to observe the EU’s rules on both customs and on protecting the single market which normally require checks at a border with a third country (which is what the UK will be).' |
And this is where our government has completely failed.
UK doesn't want a border, Ireland doesn't want a border. If we crash out who is going to build it, an army from Brussels?
I would also like to see how it contravenes the GFA - not from a news report or think tank but from the GFA itself. | |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:51 - Dec 12 with 4185 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:36 - Dec 12 by BloomBlue |
10 years ago we suffered one of our worst recessions while being part of the EU, so staying in the EU won't stop a recession. Obviously project fear have fooled you with their fake news |
Well, I for one can't see any way in which making trade more difficult, the country a less attractive place for employers and investors and increasing the prices of most, if not all imported items due to increased import duty and a devalued currency would be in any way detrimental to the economy. | |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:54 - Dec 12 with 4179 views | SpruceMoose |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:51 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
Well, I for one can't see any way in which making trade more difficult, the country a less attractive place for employers and investors and increasing the prices of most, if not all imported items due to increased import duty and a devalued currency would be in any way detrimental to the economy. |
Don't feed the troll, Badger, you'll bring the Woodland Lad's Alliance into disrepute. |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:56 - Dec 12 with 4166 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:54 - Dec 12 by SpruceMoose |
Don't feed the troll, Badger, you'll bring the Woodland Lad's Alliance into disrepute. |
It's alright, he tends to run off when actually faced with facts, difficult questions or having holes in his argument pointed out. | |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:58 - Dec 12 with 4171 views | SpruceMoose |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:56 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
It's alright, he tends to run off when actually faced with facts, difficult questions or having holes in his argument pointed out. |
I genuinely think he's one of the strangest posters on here. He rarely engages with anyone, just makes some short, harebrained statement then toddles off. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:59 - Dec 12 with 4160 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:58 - Dec 12 by SpruceMoose |
I genuinely think he's one of the strangest posters on here. He rarely engages with anyone, just makes some short, harebrained statement then toddles off. |
He's basically the latest in a long line of TB tribute acts. At least Tb would hang around long enough to complain to Phil that he was being 'bullied' when people started pointing out he was talking b0llocks. | |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 16:12 - Dec 12 with 4152 views | Withnail |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:56 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
It's alright, he tends to run off when actually faced with facts, difficult questions or having holes in his argument pointed out. |
Lucan and I are waiting for you to reply to his GFA question.
Remember, no news reports or think tanks. |  | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 16:15 - Dec 12 with 4140 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:41 - Dec 12 by Lord_Lucan |
And this is where our government has completely failed.
UK doesn't want a border, Ireland doesn't want a border. If we crash out who is going to build it, an army from Brussels?
I would also like to see how it contravenes the GFA - not from a news report or think tank but from the GFA itself. |
I have to say, of all the reasons leaving the EU appears to be a bad idea, the fact the EU will basically be bullying Ireland into having a hard border they don’t want isn’t the best one... |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said on 16:52 - Dec 12 with 4106 views | manchego |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 16:15 - Dec 12 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
I have to say, of all the reasons leaving the EU appears to be a bad idea, the fact the EU will basically be bullying Ireland into having a hard border they don’t want isn’t the best one... |
The EU does not want a hard border in Ireland. Are you making stuff up again ? Or just buying into the "EU are bullies" B.S.
"Britain would have to enforce controls on the Irish border if the U.K. leaves the European Union without a deal, Chancellor Philip Hammond said Monday"
"Under World Trade Organization rules, London would have no choice but to reinstate checks."
From the Irish Times:
What backstop has the EU proposed?
Brussels believes a hard border can be avoided and the Belfast Agreement upheld if Northern Ireland remains fully aligned with the EU’s customs union and parts of the single market after Brexit.
This would mean matching the rules north and south of the Border for customs, energy, environmental regulations and laws covering agriculture and fisheries.
[Post edited 12 Dec 2018 16:58]
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| Two of my colleagues have said on 17:45 - Dec 12 with 4059 views | BlueBadger |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 16:12 - Dec 12 by Withnail |
Lucan and I are waiting for you to reply to his GFA question.
Remember, no news reports or think tanks. |
You're welcome to go wading through the whole bloody thing yourself.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attac
/edit - a simple search of the word 'border' demonstrates the need for cross-border co-operation in a huge variety of aspects of life throughout the whole document. A hard Brexit and subsequent hard border would essentially destroy all that. [Post edited 12 Dec 2018 17:50]
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| Two of my colleagues have said on 18:08 - Dec 12 with 4035 views | syntaxerror |
| Two of my colleagues have said on 17:45 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
You're welcome to go wading through the whole bloody thing yourself.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attac
/edit - a simple search of the word 'border' demonstrates the need for cross-border co-operation in a huge variety of aspects of life throughout the whole document. A hard Brexit and subsequent hard border would essentially destroy all that. [Post edited 12 Dec 2018 17:50]
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to follow on from that, WTO rules do not explicitly forbid a hard border. However the clearest issue is the Most Favoured Nation rule.
Every other WTO trading partner needs to be treated as a Most Favoured Nation. So if there is no hard border with Ireland, then either there needs to be no hard border for all, or other member states can get the WTO to force the UK to impose a hard border. |  | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 18:21 - Dec 12 with 4010 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:29 - Dec 12 by Withnail |
The EU are not mentioned once in the GFA. Just sayin. |
Yes they are:
The Council to consider the European Union dimension of relevant matters, including the implementation of EU policies and programmes and proposals under consideration in the EU framework. Arrangements to be made to ensure that the views of the Council are taken into account and represented appropriately at relevant EU meetings. |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 18:39 - Dec 12 with 3987 views | BloomBlue |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 15:51 - Dec 12 by BlueBadger |
Well, I for one can't see any way in which making trade more difficult, the country a less attractive place for employers and investors and increasing the prices of most, if not all imported items due to increased import duty and a devalued currency would be in any way detrimental to the economy. |
Again if you want to believe the fake news from remain then I'm not going to change your mind.
Same as when we had the vote to stay with the £ or take the € , businsses leaders, economists warned about if we stayed with the £ it would result in increased cost, the supply chain from Europe would grind to a halt, thankfully lots of people knew the experts were talking cr$p and voted to keep the £ and project fear were proved wrong ie the supply chain didnt grind to a halt and the fact the experts had lied | | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 18:43 - Dec 12 with 3984 views | syntaxerror |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 18:21 - Dec 12 by Ewan_Oozami |
Yes they are:
The Council to consider the European Union dimension of relevant matters, including the implementation of EU policies and programmes and proposals under consideration in the EU framework. Arrangements to be made to ensure that the views of the Council are taken into account and represented appropriately at relevant EU meetings. |
The EU as a trading block are a member of the WTO.
As an interesting aside, if we were to leave with a No Deal Brexit, one of the guidelines people have suggested to carry on trade between the EU and UK is to open an Irish office for services, or warehouse for goods.
Mainland EU company trades to Ireland, Irish branch then sends of to UK, with no duty etc, and only one extra leg of the journey.
This is a short term fix of course, as very quickly someone like the US or China would kick up a fuss about breaching the Most Favoured Nation Rule. But as it would take some time (months), people who have set up Dublin branches, particularly in the financial markets, could make a LOT of money. | | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 19:34 - Dec 12 with 3945 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 18:43 - Dec 12 by syntaxerror |
The EU as a trading block are a member of the WTO.
As an interesting aside, if we were to leave with a No Deal Brexit, one of the guidelines people have suggested to carry on trade between the EU and UK is to open an Irish office for services, or warehouse for goods.
Mainland EU company trades to Ireland, Irish branch then sends of to UK, with no duty etc, and only one extra leg of the journey.
This is a short term fix of course, as very quickly someone like the US or China would kick up a fuss about breaching the Most Favoured Nation Rule. But as it would take some time (months), people who have set up Dublin branches, particularly in the financial markets, could make a LOT of money. |
Except if we leave with no deal we couldn’t trade between IE and the UK tarrif free as we will no longer be covered by the EU free trade terms. WTO tariffs will apply and we’ll need checks for goods, services and people. Which is against the GFA. Which is the problem. Or have I misunderstood your post? |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 20:09 - Dec 12 with 3912 views | syntaxerror |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 19:34 - Dec 12 by Swansea_Blue |
Except if we leave with no deal we couldn’t trade between IE and the UK tarrif free as we will no longer be covered by the EU free trade terms. WTO tariffs will apply and we’ll need checks for goods, services and people. Which is against the GFA. Which is the problem. Or have I misunderstood your post? |
WTO rules don't force a hard border. They merely say that trade with all its members must be equal.
So if the neither the UK nor the EU impose a hard border after a No Deal Brexit, free trade could continue between Ireland and the UK until one of the other WTO states decided to oppose that on the grounds that the Ireland had an unfair advantage. | | | |
| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 20:11 - Dec 12 with 3910 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
I still think there was a deliberate play on words when she said that because she realised at the time there is no such thing as a deal that is better than a bad deal.
Of course no deal is worse. |  |
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| Two of my colleagues have said " no deal is better than a bad deal" to me today on 20:13 - Dec 12 with 3901 views | Oxford_Blue |
They speak sense.
A bad deal is a bad deal.
No deal is fine. | | | |
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