| My big fear. 12:04 - Feb 11 with 6333 views | TheBoyBlue |
Is not relegation. Like most I accepted that a long time ago. It's that the gap between us and 21st stays at 9 or 10 points and is perceived doable. Which will mean that we still stand a mathematical chance up until 3 or 4 games to go and will see us wasting time chasing a gap we'll never bridge but the players and manager will feel obliged to try and bridge, despite the fact that we're clearly incapable of stringing a couple of wins together or even picking up draws.
In the circumstances I wish that the teams above would properly pull away and relegate us as soon as possible so that we can spend as much time preparing for next season as possible. Because lets face it, we need it. |  |
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| My big fear. on 12:06 - Feb 11 with 5806 views | Championship |
If we play like we did yesterday, get Collins back in and score a few goals we have an outside chance. Admittedly we are almost certainly down but not sure we should be giving up or wishing for them to pull away. We have some (on paper) winnable games. There are 4 very poor teams this year. We can't just give up. |  | | |
| My big fear. on 12:17 - Feb 11 with 5744 views | Swailsey |
Mine’s spiders. |  |
| Who said: "Colin Healy made Cesc Fabregas look like Colin Healy"? | We miss you TLA |
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| My big fear. on 12:18 - Feb 11 with 5732 views | TheBoyBlue |
| My big fear. on 12:06 - Feb 11 by Championship |
If we play like we did yesterday, get Collins back in and score a few goals we have an outside chance. Admittedly we are almost certainly down but not sure we should be giving up or wishing for them to pull away. We have some (on paper) winnable games. There are 4 very poor teams this year. We can't just give up. |
That's just the issue though. We can't score goals. They aren't going to come from the blue. We're doing a lot of things right and still can't score enough. | |
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| My big fear. on 12:20 - Feb 11 with 5713 views | Bluefish |
| My big fear. on 12:17 - Feb 11 by Swailsey |
Mine’s spiders. |
Mine is goths |  |
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| My big fear. on 12:28 - Feb 11 with 5677 views | itfctim |
| My big fear. on 12:20 - Feb 11 by Bluefish |
Mine is goths |
Mine is budgies. | | | |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 with 5662 views | Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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| My big fear. on 12:55 - Feb 11 with 5558 views | maccyd9 |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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We are in a catch 22 situation. As you say, you can't just throw the towel in but the facts tell you no team has ever stayed up from our position and there is simply no chance we can get the 6/7 wins needed between now and the end of the season.
Looking ahead to next season, I do think it's the time to start thinking about it. But I wouldn't be chucking in the youngsters. Losing is a habit and some of the younger lads could get destroyed between now and the season.
If there was an argument to plan for next season, I'd do it by playing as strong a side as possible based around those unlikely to be here so it's a fresh start come May. | | | |
| My big fear. on 13:08 - Feb 11 with 5483 views | Darth_Koont |
Problem is that if we put 3 wins in a row together like Millwall did in October or November, then the situation would be very different.
Not saying that’s going to happen but the teams around us aren’t great so whoever can get momentum going or at least start grabbing points will stay up.
The other thing is that this season will feel brutal if we give up now with months left to play. |  |
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| My big fear. on 13:20 - Feb 11 with 5424 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 12:55 - Feb 11 by maccyd9 |
We are in a catch 22 situation. As you say, you can't just throw the towel in but the facts tell you no team has ever stayed up from our position and there is simply no chance we can get the 6/7 wins needed between now and the end of the season.
Looking ahead to next season, I do think it's the time to start thinking about it. But I wouldn't be chucking in the youngsters. Losing is a habit and some of the younger lads could get destroyed between now and the season.
If there was an argument to plan for next season, I'd do it by playing as strong a side as possible based around those unlikely to be here so it's a fresh start come May. |
Not quite. History tells us that it has not been done before. But that is not the same as saying it is impossible. Indeed, Hull's run in December suggests exactly the opposite.
Whether we're capable of replicating that is another issue, altho if Keith Stroud had got his decisions the other way around at Villa, we would be talking about a 2 - 1 away win. More significantly, if we can cut out the errors at the back which are leading us to concede soft goals, that will make a huge difference (has cost us at least four points since Jan 1st).
I genuinely can't see that the best approach is anything other than always to play the strongest possible side in every match, aiming for a win. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 13:22]
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| My big fear. on 13:25 - Feb 11 with 5377 views | maccyd9 |
| My big fear. on 13:20 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
Not quite. History tells us that it has not been done before. But that is not the same as saying it is impossible. Indeed, Hull's run in December suggests exactly the opposite.
Whether we're capable of replicating that is another issue, altho if Keith Stroud had got his decisions the other way around at Villa, we would be talking about a 2 - 1 away win. More significantly, if we can cut out the errors at the back which are leading us to concede soft goals, that will make a huge difference (has cost us at least four points since Jan 1st).
I genuinely can't see that the best approach is anything other than always to play the strongest possible side in every match, aiming for a win. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 13:22]
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It's an impossible situation.
You are right, we should be trying to win every game with our best eleven but frankly I don't think anyone knows our best eleven.
Right now it would probably have Chambers, Collins, Skuse and Judge but everything else is a toss up really.
I've digressed clearly.
All I'd say is that outwardly we should be going for that improbable run of results that would give us a chance, but inwardly keeping one eye on next season. | | | |
| My big fear. on 13:25 - Feb 11 with 5376 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 13:08 - Feb 11 by Darth_Koont |
Problem is that if we put 3 wins in a row together like Millwall did in October or November, then the situation would be very different.
Not saying that’s going to happen but the teams around us aren’t great so whoever can get momentum going or at least start grabbing points will stay up.
The other thing is that this season will feel brutal if we give up now with months left to play. |
There's a third of the season left. That's a heck of a long time to endure if we throw in the towel now. It won't make those games any easier, unless people just want an excuse not to go. | |
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| My big fear. on 13:28 - Feb 11 with 5344 views | PJH |
| My big fear. on 12:17 - Feb 11 by Swailsey |
Mine’s spiders. |
Don't mind them but I can't stand rats. |  | | |
| My big fear. on 13:30 - Feb 11 with 5327 views | BecclesITFC |
It's important to go down fighting. Keep the good spirit. Players, manager and supporters. We know our fate pretty much. We all go down together. Last thing we need is protests, booing and hammering PL before the start of the new season. It's a fresh start in a new league. Preparation starts now..... |  | | |
| My big fear. on 13:31 - Feb 11 with 5309 views | Superfrans |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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If our season was over, I'd drop out those players who won't be here next season and start building with those who will - which means the contracted players, the youngsters and any of the others we may have a chance of holding onto. So, for instance, good though he was yesterday, we won't have Chalobah here next season - we could send him back and give more gametime to Downes, Bishop etc.
Of course, the season isn't over, we still have a chance to stay up, however slim. So we can't do this. We have to continue running until the race is run (for us, in any case). |  |
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| My big fear. on 13:40 - Feb 11 with 5240 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 13:25 - Feb 11 by maccyd9 |
It's an impossible situation.
You are right, we should be trying to win every game with our best eleven but frankly I don't think anyone knows our best eleven.
Right now it would probably have Chambers, Collins, Skuse and Judge but everything else is a toss up really.
I've digressed clearly.
All I'd say is that outwardly we should be going for that improbable run of results that would give us a chance, but inwardly keeping one eye on next season. |
Agree. My point was what can we currently do, in practical terms, to prepare for next season anyway? | |
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| My big fear. on 13:40 - Feb 11 with 5240 views | Pinewoodblue |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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While we have conceded 2, or 3, goals in every away league game bar one amazingly we haven't actually been to tonked. If only we could defend for 95 minutes, and score ourselvesofcourse. |  |
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| My big fear. on 13:50 - Feb 11 with 5187 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 13:31 - Feb 11 by Superfrans |
If our season was over, I'd drop out those players who won't be here next season and start building with those who will - which means the contracted players, the youngsters and any of the others we may have a chance of holding onto. So, for instance, good though he was yesterday, we won't have Chalobah here next season - we could send him back and give more gametime to Downes, Bishop etc.
Of course, the season isn't over, we still have a chance to stay up, however slim. So we can't do this. We have to continue running until the race is run (for us, in any case). |
Thing is, if we go down, there's every possibilty that even the contracted players - especially the better ones - may leave in the summer. That includes the younger players (Bishop, Downes, Lankester, Dozzell). So we'd still be giving game time to those who could quite possibly not be here come August.
I know we theoretically can refuse to sell, but with transfer requests and possibly decent sized offers, it's going to be very hard to hang on to those who want out. | |
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| My big fear. on 13:55 - Feb 11 with 5166 views | Superfrans |
| My big fear. on 13:50 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
Thing is, if we go down, there's every possibilty that even the contracted players - especially the better ones - may leave in the summer. That includes the younger players (Bishop, Downes, Lankester, Dozzell). So we'd still be giving game time to those who could quite possibly not be here come August.
I know we theoretically can refuse to sell, but with transfer requests and possibly decent sized offers, it's going to be very hard to hang on to those who want out. |
I just can't see anyone offering for our kids anywhere near what we would accept for them. Potentially, if we were offered £5m for one of them, it would help bridge the financial gap. But who is going to pay that for any of them?
Bishop hasn't proven himself yet, after 3 injury hit seasons.
Lankester is out injured, unlikely to play again this season. Hasn't done enough yet.
Downes isn't going to command that sort of fee.
Dozzell is simply not proven, for all his potential. He's not played anywhere near enough football in the past two years. | |
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| My big fear. on 14:02 - Feb 11 with 5135 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 13:55 - Feb 11 by Superfrans |
I just can't see anyone offering for our kids anywhere near what we would accept for them. Potentially, if we were offered £5m for one of them, it would help bridge the financial gap. But who is going to pay that for any of them?
Bishop hasn't proven himself yet, after 3 injury hit seasons.
Lankester is out injured, unlikely to play again this season. Hasn't done enough yet.
Downes isn't going to command that sort of fee.
Dozzell is simply not proven, for all his potential. He's not played anywhere near enough football in the past two years. |
But if a club in the Championship offers £1.25m for, say, Downes, like we did for Jackson, then the player's head is turned by the status and it becomes hard to decline the money. If a player really wants to leave, then it gets very hard to hold on (c.f. Garner). | |
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| My big fear. on 14:59 - Feb 11 with 5065 views | Superfrans |
| My big fear. on 14:02 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
But if a club in the Championship offers £1.25m for, say, Downes, like we did for Jackson, then the player's head is turned by the status and it becomes hard to decline the money. If a player really wants to leave, then it gets very hard to hold on (c.f. Garner). |
I'm not sure £1.25m would turn our heads - and the associated salary wouldn't either.
Worth remembering that we will still have one of the biggest salary budgets in the division, even if everybody's wages are cut in half.
As an example, Accrington Stanley's last figures show a turnover of £2.2m; compared to our £17m. Even if we lose £7m in TV money, we'll still have a turnover 4/5 times theirs. | |
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| My big fear. on 15:08 - Feb 11 with 5023 views | Oxford_Blue |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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It means:
- sending the loan players back
- getting rid of the dross who are coming to the end of their contracts
- playing youngsters and blooding them on the basis that they will be the core of the side
- getting a rapport going with the fans again somehow eg by continuing discount tickets and events
- reducing ST prices and matchday prices
- starting to line up targets for the close season | | | |
| My big fear. on 15:10 - Feb 11 with 5013 views | Benters2 |
| My big fear. on 13:40 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
Agree. My point was what can we currently do, in practical terms, to prepare for next season anyway? |
We need one of your magic tables to cheer us up! 😒 | | | |
| My big fear. on 15:14 - Feb 11 with 4991 views | MrTown |
To be fair to Lambert, it's very hard to prepare for next season right now.
We have so many players on short team deals, 6 loans, out contract players, want away players, loaned out players, players Lambert doesn't fancy.
It's such a tough job at the moment. He needs a big transfer window to try and build a squad that he wants, and we obviously can't do that until the summer. |  |
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| My big fear. on 17:44 - Feb 11 with 4811 views | jontysnut |
| My big fear. on 12:34 - Feb 11 by Guthrum |
How do we 'prepare for next season' (in the sense of post-relegation) now?
A lot of people are speaking about this, but what exactly do they mean? We don't have any idea the squad will look like in August, who will have departed (including among the younger players), who might have come in. Personnel to some extent dictate structure and system, there's no point in building them now around those who may be off in the summer. It's like trying to put together a jigsaw with half the pieces missing.
Is a series of thundering defeats caused by playing, essentially, the U23s (as some seem to be suggesting) actually better for overall player, club and fan morale than fighting until the end? Will it merely damage the Youths' chances of success in their own league?
If we keep battling, there's a slim chance we may even stay up. If we give up, there is none and everyone knows it. I'd hate in May to be talking about throwing the game against Leeds in some pathetic (tinpot, even) attempt to stymie Norwich.
It's not exactly going to encourage our better players to stay on if we submit so feebly to a fate which is not yet inevitable. Doubt people like Judge would have come here at all if he thought that was going to happen.
I really don't understand what we gain by throwing in the towel now. [Post edited 11 Feb 2019 12:37]
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My lad is an ex pro - even when he was with the under 9s I used to tell him to play to the very end - whether he was 5 up or 5 down. Its about pride in the shirt and respect for the team and the game. Without that there's nothing. |  | | |
| My big fear. on 19:29 - Feb 11 with 4626 views | Guthrum |
| My big fear. on 15:10 - Feb 11 by Benters2 |
We need one of your magic tables to cheer us up! 😒 |
They wouldn't do that at the moment! | |
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