| Independent Group 15:26 - Feb 18 with 40370 views | ZedRodgers |
What do we know so far?
1. They won't stand a by-election and will abandon their constituencies for more 'winable' seats at the next election.
2. They won't reveal anything about their funding and have set themselves up as a private company to avoid publicly declaring anything.
3. Their website is sh1te.
4. They've said what they're against but nobody can name a single policy they are for.
5. They've been endorsed by Katie Hopkins and Pickles.
6. Angela Smith was only 5 mins into BBC Politics appearance today talking about leaving due to racism before she described non-white people as having a funny tinge.
Integrity indeed. I'm delighted that the politically homeless are now able to come in from the cold. |  |
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| Independent Group on 19:20 - Feb 20 with 2953 views | ZedRodgers |
Update - Day 2:
At least we can now see some policies starting to roughly take shape. Chris Leslie has said he wants to oppose Labour's suggestion of a 50% top rate tax, doesn't want to abolish tuition fees and is against any renationalisation. Is this the centre ground people wanted? Doesn't sound like much of a new politics to me. Surely you have to be for something?
Soubry praised the work of the George Osbourne and the coalition government, reminding everybody of her love of austerity.
Their refusal to stand in a by-election is understandable but deeply undemocratic. Allen admitted today they aren't ready and would lose. It reeks of hypocrisy - They're lacking self-awareness if they think saying "The last thing the country needs right now is a general election or any kind of by-election" but insisting on a 2nd referendum is a noble stance to take. As somebody who voted remain, I've lost a lot of patience with this narrow-minded and patronising approach to reconsidering Brexit.
Their whole "I was elected as an MP and my values haven't changed" thing is fundamentally flawed.
The group have today stated they would not support any motions of no confidence against the government, presumably as they know it would see a premature end to their Blair rich project. What position does that leave them in when we're staring down the barrel of a no deal Brexit? An insane position to take. I have a feeling that despite Soubry's strong words about her former party today, she was able to support it in a no-confidence vote as she knew her new path would not have been possible if the government had lost it. Shameful.
Angela Smith has been doing the rounds saying her funny tinge comment was her "misspeaking" due to being tired from 6 hours of press interviews. It happened at midday. They gave their first press conference at 10am. I know what she means - After a couple of hours at work I can't help blurting out bizarre racism.
The sad thing is that I'm all for moving away from party politics, but that's not what this is. They might pretend that's what they're doing with a slick logo and a hashtag, but this is simply 90s-flavoured neoliberalism digging it's clutching at straws before it disappears for good.
To top it off, it looks they've attempted to steal Labour's data to use for themselves. Good, honest people. A new politics you can trust.
[Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:28]
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| Independent Group on 19:26 - Feb 20 with 2939 views | StokieBlue |
| Independent Group on 19:20 - Feb 20 by ZedRodgers |
Update - Day 2:
At least we can now see some policies starting to roughly take shape. Chris Leslie has said he wants to oppose Labour's suggestion of a 50% top rate tax, doesn't want to abolish tuition fees and is against any renationalisation. Is this the centre ground people wanted? Doesn't sound like much of a new politics to me. Surely you have to be for something?
Soubry praised the work of the George Osbourne and the coalition government, reminding everybody of her love of austerity.
Their refusal to stand in a by-election is understandable but deeply undemocratic. Allen admitted today they aren't ready and would lose. It reeks of hypocrisy - They're lacking self-awareness if they think saying "The last thing the country needs right now is a general election or any kind of by-election" but insisting on a 2nd referendum is a noble stance to take. As somebody who voted remain, I've lost a lot of patience with this narrow-minded and patronising approach to reconsidering Brexit.
Their whole "I was elected as an MP and my values haven't changed" thing is fundamentally flawed.
The group have today stated they would not support any motions of no confidence against the government, presumably as they know it would see a premature end to their Blair rich project. What position does that leave them in when we're staring down the barrel of a no deal Brexit? An insane position to take. I have a feeling that despite Soubry's strong words about her former party today, she was able to support it in a no-confidence vote as she knew her new path would not have been possible if the government had lost it. Shameful.
Angela Smith has been doing the rounds saying her funny tinge comment was her "misspeaking" due to being tired from 6 hours of press interviews. It happened at midday. They gave their first press conference at 10am. I know what she means - After a couple of hours at work I can't help blurting out bizarre racism.
The sad thing is that I'm all for moving away from party politics, but that's not what this is. They might pretend that's what they're doing with a slick logo and a hashtag, but this is simply 90s-flavoured neoliberalism digging it's clutching at straws before it disappears for good.
To top it off, it looks they've attempted to steal Labour's data to use for themselves. Good, honest people. A new politics you can trust.
[Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:28]
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I look forward to your daily updates. It's a useful public service.
How's Hatton doing?
Have you ever considered that really could be the centre ground? Until you have a full range of policies it seems a bit churlish to be writing essays about it.
I eagerly await the Day 3 update.
SB |  |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Independent Group on 19:31 - Feb 20 with 2916 views | footers |
| Independent Group on 19:26 - Feb 20 by StokieBlue |
I look forward to your daily updates. It's a useful public service.
How's Hatton doing?
Have you ever considered that really could be the centre ground? Until you have a full range of policies it seems a bit churlish to be writing essays about it.
I eagerly await the Day 3 update.
SB |
You've been a bit harsh on old Zed recently, SB! I think it's refreshing to have someone posting alternative views on the happenings in recent politics. It's pretty important, after all- nothing quite like it since the SDP.
Were you on your holibobs or something, btw? Didn't see you around for a while. |  |
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| Independent Group on 19:33 - Feb 20 with 2910 views | giant_stow |
| Independent Group on 20:16 - Feb 18 by GlasgowBlue |
Who on here remembers Burer? An absolute legend of a poster. |
I do. He gave me some excellent advice on growing cannabis in hedgerows (not that I ever dared) |  |
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| Independent Group on 19:37 - Feb 20 with 2885 views | slump |
| Independent Group on 19:33 - Feb 20 by giant_stow |
I do. He gave me some excellent advice on growing cannabis in hedgerows (not that I ever dared) |
He also had quite a few tellings off because of his boob obsession.
Far too easily led astray. TWTD |  |
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| Independent Group on 19:41 - Feb 20 with 2872 views | BloomBlue |
| Independent Group on 19:20 - Feb 20 by ZedRodgers |
Update - Day 2:
At least we can now see some policies starting to roughly take shape. Chris Leslie has said he wants to oppose Labour's suggestion of a 50% top rate tax, doesn't want to abolish tuition fees and is against any renationalisation. Is this the centre ground people wanted? Doesn't sound like much of a new politics to me. Surely you have to be for something?
Soubry praised the work of the George Osbourne and the coalition government, reminding everybody of her love of austerity.
Their refusal to stand in a by-election is understandable but deeply undemocratic. Allen admitted today they aren't ready and would lose. It reeks of hypocrisy - They're lacking self-awareness if they think saying "The last thing the country needs right now is a general election or any kind of by-election" but insisting on a 2nd referendum is a noble stance to take. As somebody who voted remain, I've lost a lot of patience with this narrow-minded and patronising approach to reconsidering Brexit.
Their whole "I was elected as an MP and my values haven't changed" thing is fundamentally flawed.
The group have today stated they would not support any motions of no confidence against the government, presumably as they know it would see a premature end to their Blair rich project. What position does that leave them in when we're staring down the barrel of a no deal Brexit? An insane position to take. I have a feeling that despite Soubry's strong words about her former party today, she was able to support it in a no-confidence vote as she knew her new path would not have been possible if the government had lost it. Shameful.
Angela Smith has been doing the rounds saying her funny tinge comment was her "misspeaking" due to being tired from 6 hours of press interviews. It happened at midday. They gave their first press conference at 10am. I know what she means - After a couple of hours at work I can't help blurting out bizarre racism.
The sad thing is that I'm all for moving away from party politics, but that's not what this is. They might pretend that's what they're doing with a slick logo and a hashtag, but this is simply 90s-flavoured neoliberalism digging it's clutching at straws before it disappears for good.
To top it off, it looks they've attempted to steal Labour's data to use for themselves. Good, honest people. A new politics you can trust.
[Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:28]
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Why is it undemocratic for them not to call a by-election? In the UK in a general election you vote for your member of parliament, the person who you believe will represent you best in the HoC. |  | | |
| Independent Group on 19:43 - Feb 20 with 2867 views | WD19 |
| Independent Group on 19:41 - Feb 20 by BloomBlue |
Why is it undemocratic for them not to call a by-election? In the UK in a general election you vote for your member of parliament, the person who you believe will represent you best in the HoC. |
Its undemocratic because they don't play for his team and he doesn't like them. Please do try to keep up. |  | | |
| Independent Group on 19:43 - Feb 20 with 2865 views | giant_stow |
| Independent Group on 19:37 - Feb 20 by slump |
He also had quite a few tellings off because of his boob obsession.
Far too easily led astray. TWTD |
I'd forgotten the boobs thing, yes! (shows where my priorities are) | |
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| Independent Group on 19:45 - Feb 20 with 2855 views | slump |
| Independent Group on 19:43 - Feb 20 by giant_stow |
I'd forgotten the boobs thing, yes! (shows where my priorities are) |
That's what having babies does to you... ;) | |
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| Independent Group on 19:45 - Feb 20 with 2854 views | StokieBlue |
| Independent Group on 19:31 - Feb 20 by footers |
You've been a bit harsh on old Zed recently, SB! I think it's refreshing to have someone posting alternative views on the happenings in recent politics. It's pretty important, after all- nothing quite like it since the SDP.
Were you on your holibobs or something, btw? Didn't see you around for a while. |
It's hardly an alternative view my friend unless you've had him on ignore by accident. It's an all out pre-emptive strike before the other side have their weapons ready. I agree is exciting whilst zed could never understand it a centralist movement does appeal to many including me.
I was having a break, there was no joy in posting anymore, I was demoralised by the agenda driven lies of a few posters (for the record zed wasn't one of them and it wasn't even about UK politics).
Hope life is treating you well.
SB [Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:50]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Independent Group on 19:47 - Feb 20 with 2846 views | ZedRodgers |
| Independent Group on 19:41 - Feb 20 by BloomBlue |
Why is it undemocratic for them not to call a by-election? In the UK in a general election you vote for your member of parliament, the person who you believe will represent you best in the HoC. |
Not sure why you're asking me to say why I think it's undemocratic again. I explained my reasons in the post you replied to.
You can't say a by-election is wrong for the country at the same time as banging on about a 2nd referendum, when your reasons for a by-election being wrong are that your values haven't changed since the 2017 campaign in which you said you wouldn't support a 2nd referendum. | |
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| Independent Group on 19:52 - Feb 20 with 2828 views | footers |
| Independent Group on 19:45 - Feb 20 by StokieBlue |
It's hardly an alternative view my friend unless you've had him on ignore by accident. It's an all out pre-emptive strike before the other side have their weapons ready. I agree is exciting whilst zed could never understand it a centralist movement does appeal to many including me.
I was having a break, there was no joy in posting anymore, I was demoralised by the agenda driven lies of a few posters (for the record zed wasn't one of them and it wasn't even about UK politics).
Hope life is treating you well.
SB [Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:50]
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I see what you mean, but other posters, who shall remain nameless, seem to get away with much the same without reproach. Tbh I find all this ganging up a bit distasteful. Play the ball not the man. Not that I'm suggesting you're doing that.
Was there ever any joy in posting? It's better than working, but that's not much of a joy!
Life is grand, thank you. Back in the saddle after a bit of a nasty illness this week and looking forward to enjoying a life without Lemsip! | |
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| Independent Group on 20:04 - Feb 20 with 2792 views | BloomBlue |
| Independent Group on 19:47 - Feb 20 by ZedRodgers |
Not sure why you're asking me to say why I think it's undemocratic again. I explained my reasons in the post you replied to.
You can't say a by-election is wrong for the country at the same time as banging on about a 2nd referendum, when your reasons for a by-election being wrong are that your values haven't changed since the 2017 campaign in which you said you wouldn't support a 2nd referendum. |
But a second referendum and a by-election are two completely different things. The referendum was about voting to stay in or come out the EU. During a GE you're asked to vote for the individual to represent you in the HoC and those individuals won that vote which means under our democracy they are allowed to remain until the next GE. | | | |
| Independent Group on 20:08 - Feb 20 with 2785 views | Championship |
| Independent Group on 20:04 - Feb 20 by BloomBlue |
But a second referendum and a by-election are two completely different things. The referendum was about voting to stay in or come out the EU. During a GE you're asked to vote for the individual to represent you in the HoC and those individuals won that vote which means under our democracy they are allowed to remain until the next GE. |
If you defect from your party it voids the manifesto you stood on for your constituents. They should be facing a by-election. They are forming a new party. They haven't simply become independents.
No surprise Chuka doesn't want a by-election. He comes across like a spoilt child in interviews. |  | | |
| Independent Group on 20:12 - Feb 20 with 2775 views | footers |
| Independent Group on 20:08 - Feb 20 by Championship |
If you defect from your party it voids the manifesto you stood on for your constituents. They should be facing a by-election. They are forming a new party. They haven't simply become independents.
No surprise Chuka doesn't want a by-election. He comes across like a spoilt child in interviews. |
Carswell did when he defected to UKIP. Fair's fair- put it to the vote.
Edit: Though they don't actually have a manifesto, so not sure where that leaves matters?! [Post edited 20 Feb 2019 20:12]
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| Independent Group on 20:23 - Feb 20 with 2754 views | ZedRodgers |
| Independent Group on 20:04 - Feb 20 by BloomBlue |
But a second referendum and a by-election are two completely different things. The referendum was about voting to stay in or come out the EU. During a GE you're asked to vote for the individual to represent you in the HoC and those individuals won that vote which means under our democracy they are allowed to remain until the next GE. |
Yes, I’m referring to their position on Brexit as a policy, not making a comparison between the two votes. That doesn’t make any sense.
They stood on a set of policies in 2017. They are now pursuing different policies and refusing to give their constituents a chance to decide whether they are happy with that change of course. To those people, it is undemocratic. Of course they don’t have to stand in a by-election but it would be the right thing to do.
Is the only argument for not doing so is to protect their own careers? Unless you can think of something else? | |
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| Independent Group on 20:43 - Feb 20 with 2726 views | WestStanderLaLaLa |
| Independent Group on 19:20 - Feb 20 by ZedRodgers |
Update - Day 2:
At least we can now see some policies starting to roughly take shape. Chris Leslie has said he wants to oppose Labour's suggestion of a 50% top rate tax, doesn't want to abolish tuition fees and is against any renationalisation. Is this the centre ground people wanted? Doesn't sound like much of a new politics to me. Surely you have to be for something?
Soubry praised the work of the George Osbourne and the coalition government, reminding everybody of her love of austerity.
Their refusal to stand in a by-election is understandable but deeply undemocratic. Allen admitted today they aren't ready and would lose. It reeks of hypocrisy - They're lacking self-awareness if they think saying "The last thing the country needs right now is a general election or any kind of by-election" but insisting on a 2nd referendum is a noble stance to take. As somebody who voted remain, I've lost a lot of patience with this narrow-minded and patronising approach to reconsidering Brexit.
Their whole "I was elected as an MP and my values haven't changed" thing is fundamentally flawed.
The group have today stated they would not support any motions of no confidence against the government, presumably as they know it would see a premature end to their Blair rich project. What position does that leave them in when we're staring down the barrel of a no deal Brexit? An insane position to take. I have a feeling that despite Soubry's strong words about her former party today, she was able to support it in a no-confidence vote as she knew her new path would not have been possible if the government had lost it. Shameful.
Angela Smith has been doing the rounds saying her funny tinge comment was her "misspeaking" due to being tired from 6 hours of press interviews. It happened at midday. They gave their first press conference at 10am. I know what she means - After a couple of hours at work I can't help blurting out bizarre racism.
The sad thing is that I'm all for moving away from party politics, but that's not what this is. They might pretend that's what they're doing with a slick logo and a hashtag, but this is simply 90s-flavoured neoliberalism digging it's clutching at straws before it disappears for good.
To top it off, it looks they've attempted to steal Labour's data to use for themselves. Good, honest people. A new politics you can trust.
[Post edited 20 Feb 2019 19:28]
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Busy cnt |  |
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| Independent Group on 21:02 - Feb 20 with 2690 views | ZedRodgers |
Hi beautiful x | |
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| Independent Group on 06:52 - Feb 21 with 2549 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Independent Group on 19:52 - Feb 20 by footers |
I see what you mean, but other posters, who shall remain nameless, seem to get away with much the same without reproach. Tbh I find all this ganging up a bit distasteful. Play the ball not the man. Not that I'm suggesting you're doing that.
Was there ever any joy in posting? It's better than working, but that's not much of a joy!
Life is grand, thank you. Back in the saddle after a bit of a nasty illness this week and looking forward to enjoying a life without Lemsip! |
Little bit rich given the way you, along with the likes of Sprucemoose and wkj, spend plenty of time ganging up on posters who have alternative views on subjects like Brexit. See Benters, pickles, this new Mulleysplace chap etc |  |
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| Independent Group on 07:24 - Feb 21 with 2533 views | footers |
| Independent Group on 06:52 - Feb 21 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Little bit rich given the way you, along with the likes of Sprucemoose and wkj, spend plenty of time ganging up on posters who have alternative views on subjects like Brexit. See Benters, pickles, this new Mulleysplace chap etc |
Never said I wasn't a hypocrite, hun x | |
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| Independent Group on 09:06 - Feb 21 with 2496 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Independent Group on 07:24 - Feb 21 by footers |
Never said I wasn't a hypocrite, hun x |
LOL, fair enough | |
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| Independent Group on 09:16 - Feb 21 with 2485 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Independent Group on 19:26 - Feb 20 by StokieBlue |
I look forward to your daily updates. It's a useful public service.
How's Hatton doing?
Have you ever considered that really could be the centre ground? Until you have a full range of policies it seems a bit churlish to be writing essays about it.
I eagerly await the Day 3 update.
SB |
You seem to be playing the man rather than the ball a lot nowadays Stokie........maybe you ard not quite the impartial voice of reason I believe you perceive yourself to be. |  |
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| Independent Group on 09:24 - Feb 21 with 2474 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Independent Group on 20:12 - Feb 20 by footers |
Carswell did when he defected to UKIP. Fair's fair- put it to the vote.
Edit: Though they don't actually have a manifesto, so not sure where that leaves matters?! [Post edited 20 Feb 2019 20:12]
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Imagine......a new party that has announced its confidence in the existing government (supposedly?....nobody on here has rebuked it that I have seen) | |
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| Independent Group on 09:25 - Feb 21 with 2472 views | pickles110564 |
| Independent Group on 20:23 - Feb 20 by ZedRodgers |
Yes, I’m referring to their position on Brexit as a policy, not making a comparison between the two votes. That doesn’t make any sense.
They stood on a set of policies in 2017. They are now pursuing different policies and refusing to give their constituents a chance to decide whether they are happy with that change of course. To those people, it is undemocratic. Of course they don’t have to stand in a by-election but it would be the right thing to do.
Is the only argument for not doing so is to protect their own careers? Unless you can think of something else? |
Do you think the voters where they stand will vote for Labour? At the moment they are behind in the polls because of Corbyn not standing by his principles and getting fully behind a No Deal Brexit. |  | | |
| Independent Group on 09:27 - Feb 21 with 2466 views | StokieBlue |
| Independent Group on 09:16 - Feb 21 by BanksterDebtSlave |
You seem to be playing the man rather than the ball a lot nowadays Stokie........maybe you ard not quite the impartial voice of reason I believe you perceive yourself to be. |
If you think that's playing the man you must not have been reading much of the forum recently. I don't remember there being daily updates on how Labour didn't have policies after JC took over or inconsistencies between the positions of the leadership and the PLP. It's silly, give them time to formulate what they want to say.
Pushing out daily updates littered with links isn't the right thing to do in my opinion.
SB [Post edited 21 Feb 2019 9:30]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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