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No MV3 15:39 - Mar 18 with 27890 viewsZedRodgers

Bercow says no.

He's making a statement now in his typical long-winded fashion. Government benches didn't seem to know he was going to do this and are in disbelief.

Remarkable stuff.

EDIT: Essentially he's said he won't allow them to bring back the same deal back for another vote. Something would need to change.

Meaningful Edit 2: Bercow clarifies to JRM that it could be brought back in a new parliamentary session. Make of that what you will.
[Post edited 18 Mar 2019 15:52]

No, not at the moment

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No MV3 on 20:41 - Mar 18 with 2370 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 20:30 - Mar 18 by BloomBlue

But the irony is people asking for a 2nd referendum are doing the same, we've already had a vote to leave or remain, and now they want the same vote again.


You're comparing apples and a thong.

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No MV3 on 20:53 - Mar 18 with 2363 viewsXYZ

No MV3 on 20:30 - Mar 18 by BloomBlue

But the irony is people asking for a 2nd referendum are doing the same, we've already had a vote to leave or remain, and now they want the same vote again.


How so?

One is an advisory referendum specifically legislated for in 2016 massively tainted by illegality; the other is a House of Commons Standing Order that's been in place since 1604.

Don't tell me "pah! detail" - "the detail" is the subject of discussion.

Anyone telling you that they have any comparability is at best mistaken, probably just lying.
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No MV3 on 20:56 - Mar 18 with 2355 viewssparks

No MV3 on 20:53 - Mar 18 by XYZ

How so?

One is an advisory referendum specifically legislated for in 2016 massively tainted by illegality; the other is a House of Commons Standing Order that's been in place since 1604.

Don't tell me "pah! detail" - "the detail" is the subject of discussion.

Anyone telling you that they have any comparability is at best mistaken, probably just lying.


There are clearly comparisons- but parliament has already had two goes. The tension here is more about the argument for refusing a second referndum being very difficult having pursued multiple votes in parliament...

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No MV3 on 21:01 - Mar 18 with 2346 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 18:11 - Mar 18 by ZedRodgers

I didn’t realise Thomas ‘Erskine’ May was Phillip May’s great great grandfather.

Imagine being fcked over by your great great grandfather-in-law like this.


How, May is a remainer, never wanted to leave, don't you think this is all to convenient for her?
This has been her plan all along and she gets to blame the Speaker for the failure.
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No MV3 on 21:02 - Mar 18 with 2340 viewsfooters

No MV3 on 20:30 - Mar 18 by BloomBlue

But the irony is people asking for a 2nd referendum are doing the same, we've already had a vote to leave or remain, and now they want the same vote again.


No, that's not the case. It would be a substantially different vote given that:

a) There would be more than two simplistic options

b) They would be able to see the detail of any agreed deal which we would agree to

Much has come to light since the initial Leave ref. Don't the Google searches for 'What is the EU?' the day after concern you slightly?

I know you are some hardcore Leave type, but the ref was purely advisory. If this one were to be legally binding, would that make you any happier?

This it the political and economic future of the country at stake, not some political football. Cameron's weakness was in not realising the right-wing press and UKIP ran the country, when in fact he did. But oh well.

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No MV3 on 21:03 - Mar 18 with 2337 viewsfooters

No MV3 on 21:01 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

How, May is a remainer, never wanted to leave, don't you think this is all to convenient for her?
This has been her plan all along and she gets to blame the Speaker for the failure.


Not a fan of parliamentary sovereignty, pickles?

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No MV3 on 21:11 - Mar 18 with 2322 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 20:56 - Mar 18 by sparks

There are clearly comparisons- but parliament has already had two goes. The tension here is more about the argument for refusing a second referndum being very difficult having pursued multiple votes in parliament...


I'm not sure you've quite grasped what's gone on today.

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No MV3 on 21:13 - Mar 18 with 2317 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 21:01 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

How, May is a remainer, never wanted to leave, don't you think this is all to convenient for her?
This has been her plan all along and she gets to blame the Speaker for the failure.


Lol.

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No MV3 on 21:16 - Mar 18 with 2315 viewsm14_blue

No MV3 on 21:01 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

How, May is a remainer, never wanted to leave, don't you think this is all to convenient for her?
This has been her plan all along and she gets to blame the Speaker for the failure.


You think she’s gone through all this for the last 2 years, which must have been pretty much a personal hell, with almost daily humiliations, because of some master plan conspiracy to remain in the EU?

That would seem like an extraordinary thing for a fairly lukewarm remainer to do.

I think you’re being paranoid.
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No MV3 on 21:18 - Mar 18 with 2314 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 20:01 - Mar 18 by ZedRodgers

A general election is obviously my preferred way forward. A longer extension seems the most feasible and realistic request to put to the EU. Would they not be sceptical of a short term extension which promises the immediate return of the same type of deal which has left us in this mess?

The election outcome should then provide a mandate for a confirmatory Brexit decision. Whether the Conservatives have a new leader with a softer or harder approach is down to them. Labour will put forward their soft deal + people’s vote. There may be a return of UKIP / Farage’s new mob, but seems unlikely given UKIP’s polling being down 20%ish for prospective EU elections. I think the tide is finally turning from those types of reckless lunatics without a plan.

I admit that a hung parliament would be difficult situation, especially if Conservatives have gone harder and Labour even softer than 2017. Would that situation not force the cross-party compromise which has been missing for the last two years? It would take a very naive new Tory leader to continue May’s blinkered approach and Corbyn and other leaders have attempted to reach out for cross-party talks from the beginning.

What are May’s options apart from that?

Go back to the EU abandoning red lines? - A fairly honourable option at one stage but not now. She wouldn’t be able to face her party.
Try to do away with the Erskine May convention? - Surely that wouldn’t pass.
Prorogue parliament? - Seems even riskier than a GE to me.
Chuck Olly Robbins under a bus and hope for the best? - Embarrassing.
Call a press conference outside Downing St. and pretend things are fine, spewing out meaningless sound bites about the national interest and the will of the people? - Probably.

The madness has to stop.
[Post edited 18 Mar 2019 20:05]


Zed, reckless lunatics without a plan, why you being so harsh on Corbyn and his cronies?
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No MV3 on 21:19 - Mar 18 with 2312 viewsWeekender

No MV3 on 16:30 - Mar 18 by BanksterDebtSlave

Patterson was on about leaving on 29th under GATT rule 24 (?) ....0 tarriffs between us and Europe for up to 10 years while the final trade deal is negotiated and Irish issue goes away too......but we will have left.


GATT is a red herring, see:

https://tradebetablog.wordpress.com/2019/02/16/one-last-go-article-24/

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No MV3 on 21:20 - Mar 18 with 2307 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 21:03 - Mar 18 by footers

Not a fan of parliamentary sovereignty, pickles?


This is not what we voted for Footers, we voted to leave the EU and everything it stands for.
Not a deal agreed by the remainers and the EU.

This is not Parliamentary sovereignty just the rich elite getting one over us yet again.
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No MV3 on 21:21 - Mar 18 with 2302 viewsfooters

No MV3 on 21:18 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

Zed, reckless lunatics without a plan, why you being so harsh on Corbyn and his cronies?


Corbyn and cronies used in the same sentence... are we playing 'I've swallowed attack lines hook, line and sinker' bingo tonight?

Where's this Red, White and Blue Brexit? Or is that not the one we're getting now?

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No MV3 on 21:21 - Mar 18 with 2300 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 21:20 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

This is not what we voted for Footers, we voted to leave the EU and everything it stands for.
Not a deal agreed by the remainers and the EU.

This is not Parliamentary sovereignty just the rich elite getting one over us yet again.


Vote Leave ran on a platform of a negotiated deal.

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No MV3 on 21:23 - Mar 18 with 2298 viewsm14_blue

No MV3 on 21:20 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

This is not what we voted for Footers, we voted to leave the EU and everything it stands for.
Not a deal agreed by the remainers and the EU.

This is not Parliamentary sovereignty just the rich elite getting one over us yet again.


When you say ‘we’, you mean ‘I’
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No MV3 on 21:23 - Mar 18 with 2301 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 21:16 - Mar 18 by m14_blue

You think she’s gone through all this for the last 2 years, which must have been pretty much a personal hell, with almost daily humiliations, because of some master plan conspiracy to remain in the EU?

That would seem like an extraordinary thing for a fairly lukewarm remainer to do.

I think you’re being paranoid.


Lukewarm remainer who has Ollie Robbins doing the negotiating?
It has been a stitch up from day one, should have said in the beginning that we will leave in two years on a hard Brexit unless you (EU) puts an acceptable deal on the table that gives us a clean break.
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No MV3 on 21:24 - Mar 18 with 2293 viewsfooters

No MV3 on 21:23 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

Lukewarm remainer who has Ollie Robbins doing the negotiating?
It has been a stitch up from day one, should have said in the beginning that we will leave in two years on a hard Brexit unless you (EU) puts an acceptable deal on the table that gives us a clean break.


Yeah, trashing our economy would really show 'em, eh?

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No MV3 on 21:24 - Mar 18 with 2296 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 21:21 - Mar 18 by Herbivore

Vote Leave ran on a platform of a negotiated deal.


Nope that was not on the ballot paper, we voted to leave end of.
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No MV3 on 21:25 - Mar 18 with 2292 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 21:23 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

Lukewarm remainer who has Ollie Robbins doing the negotiating?
It has been a stitch up from day one, should have said in the beginning that we will leave in two years on a hard Brexit unless you (EU) puts an acceptable deal on the table that gives us a clean break.


Wait, you think the EU should have been doing our work for us? You leavers won't take responsibility for anything. Your strategy is laughable.

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No MV3 on 21:26 - Mar 18 with 2290 viewsWeekender

No MV3 on 21:24 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

Nope that was not on the ballot paper, we voted to leave end of.


That’s daft even for you.

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No MV3 on 21:26 - Mar 18 with 2287 viewsHerbivore

No MV3 on 21:24 - Mar 18 by pickles110564

Nope that was not on the ballot paper, we voted to leave end of.


No, it was in their campaign though. Nobody was campaigning to leave without a deal. It's revisionist bollox from lying Brexiteers.

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No MV3 on 21:28 - Mar 18 with 2284 viewsWeekender

No MV3 on 21:23 - Mar 18 by m14_blue

When you say ‘we’, you mean ‘I’


Therein lies the problem, Brexiteers all think their version of brexit is the one that was voted for.

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No MV3 on 21:29 - Mar 18 with 2281 viewsZedRodgers

No MV3 on 20:30 - Mar 18 by BloomBlue

But the irony is people asking for a 2nd referendum are doing the same, we've already had a vote to leave or remain, and now they want the same vote again.


We get it - you’re staunchly opposed to any kind of rational dialogue on how we can move forward from this situation and you’re happy to just say “we won, get over it” without any acknowledgement of the consequences or implications of what that actually means.

You have made this clear countless times already. Perhaps it’s time to stop repeating yourself and let people who are actually interested in a solution to this mess have a reasoned conversation without injecting this kind of unconstructive gibberish.

There are plenty of leave voters who don’t feel the need to repeat the same tedious soundbites over and over again. It’s such a shame they’re in the minority.

No, not at the moment

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No MV3 on 21:29 - Mar 18 with 2275 viewsfooters

No MV3 on 21:28 - Mar 18 by Weekender

Therein lies the problem, Brexiteers all think their version of brexit is the one that was voted for.


"I didn't vote for this!"

The sooner our sovereign parliament can stop this ridiculous charade the better. Why are we beholden to a bunch of crackpots?

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No MV3 on 21:30 - Mar 18 with 2276 viewspickles110564

No MV3 on 21:29 - Mar 18 by ZedRodgers

We get it - you’re staunchly opposed to any kind of rational dialogue on how we can move forward from this situation and you’re happy to just say “we won, get over it” without any acknowledgement of the consequences or implications of what that actually means.

You have made this clear countless times already. Perhaps it’s time to stop repeating yourself and let people who are actually interested in a solution to this mess have a reasoned conversation without injecting this kind of unconstructive gibberish.

There are plenty of leave voters who don’t feel the need to repeat the same tedious soundbites over and over again. It’s such a shame they’re in the minority.


Zed, how about you take your own advice?
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