| 5G Fake News 10:09 - May 20 with 4014 views | StokieBlue |
So a couple of weeks ago there was some talk about the alleged adverse health effects of 5G despite the evidence to the contrary.
This is a rather good article from the NYT highlighting how media such as RT manipulate language and sources to sow the seed of doubt about these things (5G specifically in the article).
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/12/science/5g-phone-safety-health-russia.html
It’s interesting that some people are willing to believe anything that’s from an alternative source to the government or scientific norms without actually considering the source or motivations. The internet and forums such as ours are a sea of false equivalencies nowadays.
Sure, it's NYT article so they are likely to point to RT as one of the offenders but they also link to the science behind the myths. Unfortunately often that is just dismissed by those who want to take the contrary view and are distrusting of anything said by officials and point to historical events as evidence for contemporary misdemeanors.
It’s a worrying trend.
SB
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| 5G Fake News on 10:16 - May 20 with 2437 views | crunchie1978 |
What's more worrying is the amount of posters on this board that believe what they read in the guardian! |  | | |
| 5G Fake News on 10:18 - May 20 with 2428 views | BlueBadger |
| 5G Fake News on 10:16 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
What's more worrying is the amount of posters on this board that believe what they read in the guardian! |
Not nearly as scary as the ones claiming that paedophile nazi terrorists have been 'fitted up' in the face of the evidence. |  |
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| 5G Fake News on 10:24 - May 20 with 2407 views | Oldsmoker |
One trend, and this illustrates it, is to rubbish your opponents. You make them look worse than you.
If you have a product that is 5/10 at best then make your competitors appear to be 3/10. Your product appears to be the best but its still 5/10 and therefore not good enough.
The remarks left on Tripadvisor have shown that a small business can be ruined by vexatious comments. [Post edited 20 May 2019 10:25]
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| 5G Fake News on 10:25 - May 20 with 2403 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 10:16 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
What's more worrying is the amount of posters on this board that believe what they read in the guardian! |
Surely any reasonable person would weight up multiple sources.
It's just that said individual shouldn't apply equal or greater weighting to sources that are clearly nonsense, that is where the issue is and it's highlighted on here all the time.
It's the willingness to believe something that is provably false that is worrying.
SB | |
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| 5G Fake News on 10:29 - May 20 with 2372 views | Oldsmoker |
| 5G Fake News on 10:16 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
What's more worrying is the amount of posters on this board that believe what they read in the guardian! |
Some of the posts this morning have linked to stories from
The Guardian
The Independent
The NY Times
Private Eye
Byline Times
I never use just one source for my information.
However there are rags that I never read - The Daily Fail for one. | |
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| 5G Fake News on 10:29 - May 20 with 2369 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 10:25 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
Surely any reasonable person would weight up multiple sources.
It's just that said individual shouldn't apply equal or greater weighting to sources that are clearly nonsense, that is where the issue is and it's highlighted on here all the time.
It's the willingness to believe something that is provably false that is worrying.
SB |
Totally agree reasonable people should....and reasonable people do.
But reasonable people can still come to a different conclusion based on researching the same evidence at hand. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 10:32 - May 20 with 2356 views | BlueBadger |
| 5G Fake News on 10:29 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
Totally agree reasonable people should....and reasonable people do.
But reasonable people can still come to a different conclusion based on researching the same evidence at hand. |
So, how did you come to the conclusion that serial criminal, friend of nazis and defender of paedophiles Stephen Yaxley-Lennon is a top chap given the overwhelming wealth of evidence to support this? | |
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| 5G Fake News on 10:32 - May 20 with 2355 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 10:29 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
Totally agree reasonable people should....and reasonable people do.
But reasonable people can still come to a different conclusion based on researching the same evidence at hand. |
Depends on the subject and internal bias.
For some subjects there just isn't another conclusion, yet nominally reasonable people will come to a different conclusion.
It's a symptom of the distrust of experts. For some reason some people think they know better than people who have spent their entirely lives researching the subject matter. People are also capable of immense amounts of self-denial if it lets them reach a conclusion they want to reach.
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 10:33]
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| 5G Fake News on 10:39 - May 20 with 2321 views | Oldsmoker |
| 5G Fake News on 10:32 - May 20 by BlueBadger |
So, how did you come to the conclusion that serial criminal, friend of nazis and defender of paedophiles Stephen Yaxley-Lennon is a top chap given the overwhelming wealth of evidence to support this? |
Yaxley-Lennon hates milkshakes.
Definitley a wrong 'un. | |
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| 5G Fake News on 11:00 - May 20 with 2291 views | caught-in-limbo |
The problem is that there is a lot of conspiracy actually going on. And historic examples show that the Western democracies don't hesitate to lie in order to whip the public on a war path when they need it. The Tomkin incident triggering the Vietnam war, the false weapons of mass destruction to get to war with Iraq and various others. The suspicious fact that media which normally disagree on every topic are all goosestepping in the same direction as soon as a narrative against geopolitical competitors is useful and don't even ask any questions.
So we know we can't necessarily believe that our government and intelligence agencies are always telling the truth, hence conspiracy theories thrive.
source: https://www.ft.com/content/fffb59b0-3ef9-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4 |  |
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| 5G Fake News on 11:05 - May 20 with 2280 views | BlueBadger |
| 5G Fake News on 11:00 - May 20 by caught-in-limbo |
The problem is that there is a lot of conspiracy actually going on. And historic examples show that the Western democracies don't hesitate to lie in order to whip the public on a war path when they need it. The Tomkin incident triggering the Vietnam war, the false weapons of mass destruction to get to war with Iraq and various others. The suspicious fact that media which normally disagree on every topic are all goosestepping in the same direction as soon as a narrative against geopolitical competitors is useful and don't even ask any questions.
So we know we can't necessarily believe that our government and intelligence agencies are always telling the truth, hence conspiracy theories thrive.
source: https://www.ft.com/content/fffb59b0-3ef9-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4 |
Good job that our scientists ARE telling us the truth then here, isn't it? | |
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| 5G Fake News on 11:07 - May 20 with 2279 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 11:00 - May 20 by caught-in-limbo |
The problem is that there is a lot of conspiracy actually going on. And historic examples show that the Western democracies don't hesitate to lie in order to whip the public on a war path when they need it. The Tomkin incident triggering the Vietnam war, the false weapons of mass destruction to get to war with Iraq and various others. The suspicious fact that media which normally disagree on every topic are all goosestepping in the same direction as soon as a narrative against geopolitical competitors is useful and don't even ask any questions.
So we know we can't necessarily believe that our government and intelligence agencies are always telling the truth, hence conspiracy theories thrive.
source: https://www.ft.com/content/fffb59b0-3ef9-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4 |
That's fair up to a point. However historical precedent has to stop being a valid argument at some point unless there is contemporary evidence. Historical evidence is cited on here all the time as justification for contemporary situations without contemporary facts - it's bad reasoning.
It's also not valid in the context I was citing, science is totally different to geopolitics.
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 11:08]
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| 5G Fake News on 11:19 - May 20 with 2252 views | CoachRob |
| 5G Fake News on 11:07 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
That's fair up to a point. However historical precedent has to stop being a valid argument at some point unless there is contemporary evidence. Historical evidence is cited on here all the time as justification for contemporary situations without contemporary facts - it's bad reasoning.
It's also not valid in the context I was citing, science is totally different to geopolitics.
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 11:08]
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This is an interesting point, are you making the case for logical positivism.
Logic + facts = truth? |  | | |
| 5G Fake News on 11:21 - May 20 with 2250 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 11:19 - May 20 by CoachRob |
This is an interesting point, are you making the case for logical positivism.
Logic + facts = truth? |
That's a philosophical argument isn't it. I would have thought in most cases for real-world situations the equation could be better written as:
It would be better to write it as:
Bad Logic + Facts = Misconception
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 11:22]
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| 5G Fake News on 11:34 - May 20 with 2231 views | caught-in-limbo |
| 5G Fake News on 11:07 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
That's fair up to a point. However historical precedent has to stop being a valid argument at some point unless there is contemporary evidence. Historical evidence is cited on here all the time as justification for contemporary situations without contemporary facts - it's bad reasoning.
It's also not valid in the context I was citing, science is totally different to geopolitics.
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 11:08]
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What comes out of scientists' mouths is not always good science. Assuming that it is, is like believing the Pope or any religious leader speaks only The Word. | |
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| 5G Fake News on 11:45 - May 20 with 2220 views | CoachRob |
| 5G Fake News on 11:21 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
That's a philosophical argument isn't it. I would have thought in most cases for real-world situations the equation could be better written as:
It would be better to write it as:
Bad Logic + Facts = Misconception
SB [Post edited 20 May 2019 11:22]
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Absolutely but it is becoming an increasing part of the tool box of "experts" to misdirect the public. I wonder whether the crisis in a "soft" science like economics, which has this philosophy at its core, has led to a general distrust of experts. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 11:48 - May 20 with 2217 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 11:34 - May 20 by caught-in-limbo |
What comes out of scientists' mouths is not always good science. Assuming that it is, is like believing the Pope or any religious leader speaks only The Word. |
Who said anyone should do that?
You are trying to obfuscate the point. Despite you disliking the process the scientific process including peer review is pretty robust.
In fact, the people who believe what comes out of a single scientists mouth tend to be the ones looking for a scientist to reference in order to support their alternative view. It happens all the time.
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| 5G Fake News on 11:48 - May 20 with 2211 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 10:18 - May 20 by BlueBadger |
Not nearly as scary as the ones claiming that paedophile nazi terrorists have been 'fitted up' in the face of the evidence. |
Or the robot type algorithm posters who cannot seem to decipher humour....that are programmed only to see identity....and oppose opposite speech....regardless of truth. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 11:49 - May 20 with 2211 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 11:45 - May 20 by CoachRob |
Absolutely but it is becoming an increasing part of the tool box of "experts" to misdirect the public. I wonder whether the crisis in a "soft" science like economics, which has this philosophy at its core, has led to a general distrust of experts. |
Got any examples of this deliberate misleading of the public, specifically with regards to science which was what this thread was about?
SB | |
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| 5G Fake News on 12:07 - May 20 with 2198 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 10:32 - May 20 by BlueBadger |
So, how did you come to the conclusion that serial criminal, friend of nazis and defender of paedophiles Stephen Yaxley-Lennon is a top chap given the overwhelming wealth of evidence to support this? |
And these two individuals have what do to with the truth behind 5g?
I actually do think your a bot. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 12:19 - May 20 with 2178 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 11:49 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
Got any examples of this deliberate misleading of the public, specifically with regards to science which was what this thread was about?
SB |
That modern man is only 200,000 years old. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 12:26 - May 20 with 2165 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 11:00 - May 20 by caught-in-limbo |
The problem is that there is a lot of conspiracy actually going on. And historic examples show that the Western democracies don't hesitate to lie in order to whip the public on a war path when they need it. The Tomkin incident triggering the Vietnam war, the false weapons of mass destruction to get to war with Iraq and various others. The suspicious fact that media which normally disagree on every topic are all goosestepping in the same direction as soon as a narrative against geopolitical competitors is useful and don't even ask any questions.
So we know we can't necessarily believe that our government and intelligence agencies are always telling the truth, hence conspiracy theories thrive.
source: https://www.ft.com/content/fffb59b0-3ef9-11e8-b7e0-52972418fec4 |
I think where big tech corporations and ultimately a s#@t load of money and share holders are concerned...conspiracy theory can become rampant....and cloud(good pun) peoples otherwise good perception of scientific data. | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 12:27 - May 20 with 2162 views | CoachRob |
| 5G Fake News on 11:49 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
Got any examples of this deliberate misleading of the public, specifically with regards to science which was what this thread was about?
SB |
Anything that adds matter to our current system (civilisation) leads to greater energy use and therefore as a result of increasing Co2 concentration (415ppm at the moment), the risk of collapse of our system increases. That's the broad point.
Are you trying to link unsubstantiated claims about the effects of 5G made by RT and there being no "cost" to having a 5G network? Or just making a broader point about how people have become entrenched in disbelieving science? | | | |
| 5G Fake News on 12:53 - May 20 with 2141 views | StokieBlue |
| 5G Fake News on 12:19 - May 20 by crunchie1978 |
That modern man is only 200,000 years old. |
Who said that?
The genus homo is highly complex as virtually all scientists agree.
How old do you think it is?
SB | |
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| 5G Fake News on 13:01 - May 20 with 2127 views | crunchie1978 |
| 5G Fake News on 12:53 - May 20 by StokieBlue |
Who said that?
The genus homo is highly complex as virtually all scientists agree.
How old do you think it is?
SB |
An extremely popular search engine would u believe.
A prime example of misleading. | | | |
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