| Poor bloke... 13:19 - May 20 with 8061 views | SitfcB |
|  |
| |  |
| Poor bloke... on 15:19 - May 20 with 543 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:16 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
I see your point. What I meant was you and me probably agree that the death penalty is wrong in all cases (we now know we do agree on that). I was making the point that some people do truly evil things and you could argue they deserve to die. That doesn't change our blanket opposition to it though.
Admittedly not the smoothest point i've ever made but it was just that sometimes things that are wrong are wrong in all cases. That's my opinion |
I don't really understand what that has to do with protesting people who espouse hateful views, sorry. |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 with 540 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:16 - May 20 by Luk38644 |
I think the point you're trying to make that no one can deny is that there is no place in politics for physical force and assault. It wasn't OK when it happened to Corbyn, Jo Cox, Miliband, Prescott or Farage.
As others have said, if a milkshake can be thrown on someone you disagree with, why can't acid? It shouldn't be accepted in any shape or form. |
Well said. Exactly this.
It also emboldens the other side. If Farage can be assaulted why can't Soubry? If Rees-Mogg can be targeted at home, why can't Vince Cable?
None of them should have to face things like that. IMO. |  |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 with 535 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Poor bloke... on 15:16 - May 20 by blueblueburleymcgrew |
My point is more general in nature, chucking milk shakes or smashing eggs on people’s heads is not the way to conduct political debate whatever side of the fence you are on.
Sadly the term “dangerous liar and hypocrite” could be describing a fair cross section of politicians of all persuasions. |
"chucking milk shakes or smashing eggs on people’s heads is not the way to conduct political debate " I agree, it's not. I'm not overly comfortable with it as it'll only encourage worse.
But what happens when debate is no longer an option? Debating is impossible when people blatantly lie, mislead and won't acknowledge the truth. Or when they break rules and there are no consequences? People then lose faith in the normal rules of society, and when that happens mockery is at least a harmless way of carrying on. And that's pretty much all this is; mockery. |  |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:21 - May 20 with 528 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:19 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
I don't really understand what that has to do with protesting people who espouse hateful views, sorry. |
Nothing is wrong with peaceful protest. | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:21 - May 20 with 525 views | BlueBadger |
| Poor bloke... on 14:49 - May 20 by giant_stow |
He won't have a proper discussion - that's the trouble. |
As evidenced by his use of the Grimboy manouvre here. |  |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:22 - May 20 with 525 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:16 - May 20 by Luk38644 |
I think the point you're trying to make that no one can deny is that there is no place in politics for physical force and assault. It wasn't OK when it happened to Corbyn, Jo Cox, Miliband, Prescott or Farage.
As others have said, if a milkshake can be thrown on someone you disagree with, why can't acid? It shouldn't be accepted in any shape or form. |
I appreciate what you are saying, but is there not a grey line around:
1) who is actually a politician and who is someone just spouting hateful rhetoric in public?
2) what happens when legitimate politicians are advocating for the abuse and harm of others? I feel like in those cases they have opened the gates to whatever repercussions they receive.
Advocate hate, don't be surprised when hate comes back at you. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:22 - May 20 with 518 views | footers |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
Well said. Exactly this.
It also emboldens the other side. If Farage can be assaulted why can't Soubry? If Rees-Mogg can be targeted at home, why can't Vince Cable?
None of them should have to face things like that. IMO. |
Because the others you mention aren't racist?
Farage is not the same as other politicians. His views embolden some of the worst members of society with their hateful, narrow-minded worldview. He encourages, or hints at, violence on our streets. That should not be tolerated in British political discourse.
It isn't black-and-white. |  |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:24 - May 20 with 498 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
Well said. Exactly this.
It also emboldens the other side. If Farage can be assaulted why can't Soubry? If Rees-Mogg can be targeted at home, why can't Vince Cable?
None of them should have to face things like that. IMO. |
Because Soubry and Cable aren't spouting hateful rhetoric and dogwhistling encouragement for the hatred and abuse of others. You just can't link the two.
The likes of Farage opened the door to hateful behaviour. They shouldn't be surprised when they now receive what is in reality minor pushback. [Post edited 20 May 2019 15:24]
| |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Poor bloke... on 15:24 - May 20 with 496 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:22 - May 20 by footers |
Because the others you mention aren't racist?
Farage is not the same as other politicians. His views embolden some of the worst members of society with their hateful, narrow-minded worldview. He encourages, or hints at, violence on our streets. That should not be tolerated in British political discourse.
It isn't black-and-white. |
I'm not suggesting that people like you are going to assault Soubry. Can you really say you would rule out one of Tommy Robinson/Farage's supporters targeting remain MPs in revenge attacks? | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:26 - May 20 with 484 views | blueblueburleymcgrew |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 by Swansea_Blue |
"chucking milk shakes or smashing eggs on people’s heads is not the way to conduct political debate " I agree, it's not. I'm not overly comfortable with it as it'll only encourage worse.
But what happens when debate is no longer an option? Debating is impossible when people blatantly lie, mislead and won't acknowledge the truth. Or when they break rules and there are no consequences? People then lose faith in the normal rules of society, and when that happens mockery is at least a harmless way of carrying on. And that's pretty much all this is; mockery. |
Ha your second paragraph sounds like a description of the plight of the Labour Party over antisemitism. In which case I assume you have no problem in JC getting the milk shake treatment? |  | | |
| Poor bloke... on 15:26 - May 20 with 487 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:24 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
Because Soubry and Cable aren't spouting hateful rhetoric and dogwhistling encouragement for the hatred and abuse of others. You just can't link the two.
The likes of Farage opened the door to hateful behaviour. They shouldn't be surprised when they now receive what is in reality minor pushback. [Post edited 20 May 2019 15:24]
|
You are an intelligent person opposes the values of the likes of Farage. You aren't who i'm talking about. Retaliation against the likes of Soubry would come from his supporters, not the likes of you.
I keep mentioning Soubry because we know she is facing threats and abuse. She should be able to go home without feeling threatened and vulnerable. | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:27 - May 20 with 485 views | BlueBadger |
| Poor bloke... on 15:20 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
Well said. Exactly this.
It also emboldens the other side. If Farage can be assaulted why can't Soubry? If Rees-Mogg can be targeted at home, why can't Vince Cable?
None of them should have to face things like that. IMO. |
Far right activists have been targeting people at home for years. And they're generally not slinging milkshakes, either. | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:27 - May 20 with 485 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:24 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
I'm not suggesting that people like you are going to assault Soubry. Can you really say you would rule out one of Tommy Robinson/Farage's supporters targeting remain MPs in revenge attacks? |
Can you really say you would rule out one of Tommy Robinson/Farage's supporters targeting anyone who isn't like them anyway? They need no encouragement to hate people. They hate people everyday, people who have nothing to provoke them
Like it or not, these people fall back on violence and abuse time and time again throughout history. Sometimes, regrettably, you have to meet force with force. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 with 469 views | Luk38644 |
| Poor bloke... on 15:22 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
I appreciate what you are saying, but is there not a grey line around:
1) who is actually a politician and who is someone just spouting hateful rhetoric in public?
2) what happens when legitimate politicians are advocating for the abuse and harm of others? I feel like in those cases they have opened the gates to whatever repercussions they receive.
Advocate hate, don't be surprised when hate comes back at you. |
Ofc Farage is a politician, he's an MEP and the leader of a high-polling political party. If people disagree with his views and find what he says abhorrent, they should challenge him and his supporters, not just chuck something at him because it achieves absolutely nothing.
2) is an interesting point but surely is subjective? Someone more left-leaning will tend to see Farage as a hate-spewing racist, where as someone more right-leaning will probably think the same of Corbyn and some members of Momentum with the anti-semitism row.
I just think the best way to avoid any physical harm in politics is to stamp it out no matter who it's against or how minor. Once you open the door to throwing a drink, you open the door to much more extreme methods. |  | | |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 with 468 views | footers |
| Poor bloke... on 15:24 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
I'm not suggesting that people like you are going to assault Soubry. Can you really say you would rule out one of Tommy Robinson/Farage's supporters targeting remain MPs in revenge attacks? |
They've already been trying to intimidate remain MPs. The worry here is allowing people like NF/TR to have an equal perception in the public eye. People should be seen to be rejecting their nasty brand of racist gutter politics, whether that be through debate or milkshakes.
In fact, there's an idea. How about Nige takes a stroll down Cable Street. [Post edited 20 May 2019 15:29]
| |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 with 466 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:26 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
You are an intelligent person opposes the values of the likes of Farage. You aren't who i'm talking about. Retaliation against the likes of Soubry would come from his supporters, not the likes of you.
I keep mentioning Soubry because we know she is facing threats and abuse. She should be able to go home without feeling threatened and vulnerable. |
And you're an intelligent person. How does letting Farage and Robinson go about their hateful business throughout Britains towns and cities unmeddled with and unchallenged protect the likes of Soubry?
They're a cancer on our country mate. They need to be stamped out. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 with 464 views | Luk38644 |
| Poor bloke... on 15:27 - May 20 by BlueBadger |
Far right activists have been targeting people at home for years. And they're generally not slinging milkshakes, either. |
Two wrongs don't make a right. | | | |
| Poor bloke... on 15:31 - May 20 with 452 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
And you're an intelligent person. How does letting Farage and Robinson go about their hateful business throughout Britains towns and cities unmeddled with and unchallenged protect the likes of Soubry?
They're a cancer on our country mate. They need to be stamped out. |
Fair question. How does throwing a milkshake help stamp it out? | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:33 - May 20 with 446 views | giant_stow |
Just a point of fact question: is throwing a milkshake over someone assault?
There seems to be a lot of conflating of this despicable act with more clear cut acts of violence. |  |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:33 - May 20 with 443 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:31 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
Fair question. How does throwing a milkshake help stamp it out? |
We are talking about it aren't we? They are making it difficult for the likes of Farage to get his words out there. They are disrupting whatever political plan these 'politicians' have put in place. It is contributing, in a small way, in preventing a hateful message reach ears. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:34 - May 20 with 439 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:29 - May 20 by Luk38644 |
Two wrongs don't make a right. |
Throwing a milkshake is a different scale of wrong than driving a car into protesters and murdering one.
Different country, same hateful worldview. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:35 - May 20 with 435 views | SpruceMoose |
| Poor bloke... on 15:33 - May 20 by giant_stow |
Just a point of fact question: is throwing a milkshake over someone assault?
There seems to be a lot of conflating of this despicable act with more clear cut acts of violence. |
Maybe they just slipped?  | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:35 - May 20 with 435 views | giant_stow |
| Poor bloke... on 15:31 - May 20 by J2BLUE |
Fair question. How does throwing a milkshake help stamp it out? |
mockery is a powerful tool - hard to rant about Britain ruling the waves covered in milkshake. | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:35 - May 20 with 433 views | J2BLUE |
| Poor bloke... on 15:34 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
Throwing a milkshake is a different scale of wrong than driving a car into protesters and murdering one.
Different country, same hateful worldview. |
I didn't know what that was about when you first mentioned it in an earlier post. What happened? | |
| |
| Poor bloke... on 15:37 - May 20 with 424 views | giant_stow |
| Poor bloke... on 15:35 - May 20 by SpruceMoose |
Maybe they just slipped? |
understandable in all the excitement of a star turn showing up in your city. | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
