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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 12:39 - May 22 with 16836 viewsWarkTheWarkITFC

He was asked about the sacking of his mate Chris Hughton and immediately turned it to ANOTHER dig at us.

‘Well they wanted a change just like they did at Ipswich. That went well’.

As I said before he’s just eroding the memory of the good stuff he did here by constantly acting like a bitter child.

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:30 - May 23 with 1095 viewsRyorry

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:23 - May 23 by PJH

I am hoping to meet Phil next season as you will see from earlier in this thread.

You will also see from earlier in this thread that I theorised that MM saw Phil as fronting the ITFC supporters including the element that were, and always will be to my mind, idiots and I speculated that MM treated Phil as he did because of that.
Phil indicates that MM was much the same with everyone in the local media so that demolished my theory.

I do not doubt that Phil is a very nice bloke but what that has got to do with me taking MM's side in any MM v "supporters" debates I am not sure.


Yes, had seen that, hence my reply.

What that (my post) had to do with your "taking MM's side in any MM v "supporters" debates I am not sure" is re MM's ability to relate to and handle, get on with (or not) people of all sorts, incl his attitude to us fans & someone he might have seen as representing at least some of us - his general "man-management" if you like. It wasn't all about you!

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:46 - May 23 with 1079 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:30 - May 23 by Ryorry

Yes, had seen that, hence my reply.

What that (my post) had to do with your "taking MM's side in any MM v "supporters" debates I am not sure" is re MM's ability to relate to and handle, get on with (or not) people of all sorts, incl his attitude to us fans & someone he might have seen as representing at least some of us - his general "man-management" if you like. It wasn't all about you!


Maybe you and I can continue this discussion when we next meet at a Northern League One ground although all of our previous meetings have been at Championship grounds for some reason.

I think MM's general man management where it really mattered, with his players, was pretty good.
As I have said, his comments about fans have frequently tended to be too general rather than purely targeting those that needed targeting.
No doubt he could have handled his reactions to the way that he was treated differently but it is a matter of opinion as to whether handling it differently would necessarily have been handling it better.
I suppose we all react to different things in a way that seems correct and natural to us at the time.

Anyway, may see you at some exotic location in the North but it ain't going to be Leeds.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:47 - May 23 with 1074 viewsitfcjoe

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:46 - May 23 by PJH

Maybe you and I can continue this discussion when we next meet at a Northern League One ground although all of our previous meetings have been at Championship grounds for some reason.

I think MM's general man management where it really mattered, with his players, was pretty good.
As I have said, his comments about fans have frequently tended to be too general rather than purely targeting those that needed targeting.
No doubt he could have handled his reactions to the way that he was treated differently but it is a matter of opinion as to whether handling it differently would necessarily have been handling it better.
I suppose we all react to different things in a way that seems correct and natural to us at the time.

Anyway, may see you at some exotic location in the North but it ain't going to be Leeds.


Mick always was about Us vs Them, unfortunately for him the fans went from being 'Us' to being 'Them'

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:01 - May 23 with 1047 viewsGeoffSentence

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 09:46 - May 23 by PhilTWTD

Wasn't just referring to him but some other managers similarly affected by criticism, although I agree Mick got some over the top stick. Similarly, from my perspective, he wasn't particularly pleasant to deal with a lot of the time.


Controversial stuff. Media insider claims Mick was an @rse.

Don't boil a kettle on a boat.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:04 - May 23 with 1042 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:47 - May 23 by itfcjoe

Mick always was about Us vs Them, unfortunately for him the fans went from being 'Us' to being 'Them'


I agree that in 2014/15 there was an all inclusive togetherness incorporating the team and the fans and obviously eventually that togetherness disappeared.
MM did nothing to try to heal the split once it started and it cannot be denied that some of his actions made the split worse but I will always maintain that MM did not start the split.

I think the first signs of a split was negative chanting at Wigan during a game that we went from 2-1 down to win 3-2 which confused those that had been doing the negative chanting.
When McG got our winning goal in that game he screamed something to us behind the goal and judging by his facial expression it was not "thank you for your support".

At various times over the months that followed the now wonderful North Stand had supported Rotherham and Hull amongst others and generally I think the players were a lot happier playing away.

None of this exonerates MM from any blame in the split but right from that game at Wigan until the terrible actions of some at Brentford and the reaction of some of the North Stand during what turned out to be MM's last game I knew which side of the fence that I was on and will always be on.

Hopefully everything will continue to be sweetness and light between PL and the fans because I would not want PL to see what ITFC followers can really be like, a very different breed to what he currently thinks they are.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:14 - May 23 with 1020 viewsitfcjoe

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:04 - May 23 by PJH

I agree that in 2014/15 there was an all inclusive togetherness incorporating the team and the fans and obviously eventually that togetherness disappeared.
MM did nothing to try to heal the split once it started and it cannot be denied that some of his actions made the split worse but I will always maintain that MM did not start the split.

I think the first signs of a split was negative chanting at Wigan during a game that we went from 2-1 down to win 3-2 which confused those that had been doing the negative chanting.
When McG got our winning goal in that game he screamed something to us behind the goal and judging by his facial expression it was not "thank you for your support".

At various times over the months that followed the now wonderful North Stand had supported Rotherham and Hull amongst others and generally I think the players were a lot happier playing away.

None of this exonerates MM from any blame in the split but right from that game at Wigan until the terrible actions of some at Brentford and the reaction of some of the North Stand during what turned out to be MM's last game I knew which side of the fence that I was on and will always be on.

Hopefully everything will continue to be sweetness and light between PL and the fans because I would not want PL to see what ITFC followers can really be like, a very different breed to what he currently thinks they are.


Mick couldn't help but drive a wedge once the crack had started (clearly by the fans), even when there was a chance for an olive branch he'd fan the flames - after good wins he'd come out with "I still remember Mick McCarthy your football is sh*te" and just set the agenda again

Like I said, we became the 'them' and he always used too broad a brush stroke to do so, and once you are out you are out, there was no coming back from that.

Shows a lack of leadership from above, Evans should never have let the rift get that bad - he should really have been sacked after the Norwich game for me, despite the fans conduct being ridculous and totally counterproductive

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:19 - May 23 with 1007 viewsMach_foreignBlue

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:04 - May 23 by PJH

I agree that in 2014/15 there was an all inclusive togetherness incorporating the team and the fans and obviously eventually that togetherness disappeared.
MM did nothing to try to heal the split once it started and it cannot be denied that some of his actions made the split worse but I will always maintain that MM did not start the split.

I think the first signs of a split was negative chanting at Wigan during a game that we went from 2-1 down to win 3-2 which confused those that had been doing the negative chanting.
When McG got our winning goal in that game he screamed something to us behind the goal and judging by his facial expression it was not "thank you for your support".

At various times over the months that followed the now wonderful North Stand had supported Rotherham and Hull amongst others and generally I think the players were a lot happier playing away.

None of this exonerates MM from any blame in the split but right from that game at Wigan until the terrible actions of some at Brentford and the reaction of some of the North Stand during what turned out to be MM's last game I knew which side of the fence that I was on and will always be on.

Hopefully everything will continue to be sweetness and light between PL and the fans because I would not want PL to see what ITFC followers can really be like, a very different breed to what he currently thinks they are.


mccarthy did start the split and created animosity so you need to get your facts right.

Just because you adore this odious person so much doesn't mean that people can't say what they think of him and you aren't in position to slate them. Where was your 'such a loyal' support for the club when Keane was in charge?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 15:28]
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:33 - May 23 with 971 viewsKieran_Knows

What a berk.

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:39 - May 23 with 952 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:19 - May 23 by Mach_foreignBlue

mccarthy did start the split and created animosity so you need to get your facts right.

Just because you adore this odious person so much doesn't mean that people can't say what they think of him and you aren't in position to slate them. Where was your 'such a loyal' support for the club when Keane was in charge?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 15:28]


I have got my facts right but I imagine your report of that Wigan game said something different.

My conscience is clear regarding my support for ITFC but I do wonder how any of those that verbally abused MM and his players can now be claiming to be fans, perhaps none of them go any more.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:42 - May 23 with 939 viewsChurchman

I have no time for McCarthy and I am glad he is gone. I hated his ‘Ipswich are lucky to have me’ kind of arrogance, his dismissiveness and his abuse towards all of the supporters of this club at the end and not least his suffocatingly awful football. His decision making wasn’t always as good as he thinks either e.g. leaving Hyam on after he busted that Brentford player’s leg. Yes, he has had some success using his methods and yes he has the right to have a go at individuals if they have a personal go at him. But that doesn’t give him the right to have a go at us all, including me. I never abused him though there were many times I felt like doing so.
McCarthy was paid handsomely and we did some of the paying. He earns a living in a world where people are passionate, players, managers and supporters and the chipping away about the past because he can stuff seems a bit pathetic to me. That is not excusing some of the OTT abuse he got btw.
Our current mess is nothing to do with him. It’s all about Evans, a clueless manager and one for whom the jury is out. He should keep his trap shut because it doesn’t help anyone.
Change is not always a good thing, but sometimes it just has to be and after 5 years of McCarthy it was right for him and us. Shame Evans made a dogs dinner of it, as he has most things ITFC.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:43 - May 23 with 936 viewsKieran_Knows

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:39 - May 23 by PJH

I have got my facts right but I imagine your report of that Wigan game said something different.

My conscience is clear regarding my support for ITFC but I do wonder how any of those that verbally abused MM and his players can now be claiming to be fans, perhaps none of them go any more.


If you'd like to come to the front of the class, you can collect your gold sticker and lollipop.

Poll: We’ve got super KM, he knows exactly what we need. Woolfie at the back…

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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:46 - May 23 with 925 viewsMach_foreignBlue

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:39 - May 23 by PJH

I have got my facts right but I imagine your report of that Wigan game said something different.

My conscience is clear regarding my support for ITFC but I do wonder how any of those that verbally abused MM and his players can now be claiming to be fans, perhaps none of them go any more.


No you haven't got your facts right as this was mccarthy who had started an animosity by his ignorant comments and digs at fans.

How did they abuse him? By singing : 'm**k mccarthy your football is s**t'? Is it an abuse? People can vote their displeasure after watching parking the bus at home to Burton for example. So stop preaching.
Moreover mccarthy abusing us is fine but when people singing his football is s**t is wrong? Think about what you're saying.

I know nothing about who is going and who isn't nowadays. You question their support and loyalty, right? But obviously there was nothing wrong though with walking away like you did under Keane you rank hypocrite, eh?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 15:47]
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:46 - May 23 with 923 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:14 - May 23 by itfcjoe

Mick couldn't help but drive a wedge once the crack had started (clearly by the fans), even when there was a chance for an olive branch he'd fan the flames - after good wins he'd come out with "I still remember Mick McCarthy your football is sh*te" and just set the agenda again

Like I said, we became the 'them' and he always used too broad a brush stroke to do so, and once you are out you are out, there was no coming back from that.

Shows a lack of leadership from above, Evans should never have let the rift get that bad - he should really have been sacked after the Norwich game for me, despite the fans conduct being ridculous and totally counterproductive


I am not denying any of that, I said that he did nothing to mend the split and on occasions made it worse.

He could have handled it differently-I do not think that that situation would get to anything like that stage in similar circumstances with Paul Lambert because MM and PL seem to be totally different characters.

I was just pointing out who the split was started by and where I witnessed the first signs of it-on that day at Wigan I made up my mind which side I was on and that is where I remain and always will remain.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:48 - May 23 with 921 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:43 - May 23 by Kieran_Knows

If you'd like to come to the front of the class, you can collect your gold sticker and lollipop.


and a signed Paul Lambert photo?
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:01 - May 23 with 891 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:46 - May 23 by Mach_foreignBlue

No you haven't got your facts right as this was mccarthy who had started an animosity by his ignorant comments and digs at fans.

How did they abuse him? By singing : 'm**k mccarthy your football is s**t'? Is it an abuse? People can vote their displeasure after watching parking the bus at home to Burton for example. So stop preaching.
Moreover mccarthy abusing us is fine but when people singing his football is s**t is wrong? Think about what you're saying.

I know nothing about who is going and who isn't nowadays. You question their support and loyalty, right? But obviously there was nothing wrong though with walking away like you did under Keane you rank hypocrite, eh?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 15:47]


I would think that something is started by something that comes first-with first meaning before something else happened.

As I said, my conscience regarding my support for ITFC is clear.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:08 - May 23 with 872 viewsMach_foreignBlue

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:01 - May 23 by PJH

I would think that something is started by something that comes first-with first meaning before something else happened.

As I said, my conscience regarding my support for ITFC is clear.


No-one really insulted him when he started showing his attitude: 'I know best and no-one is going to question my decisions'. He is an utterly odious character.

No wonder that two really sick characters like mccarthy and Keane had had a famous fall-out during World Cup in 2002.

Your turned your back on the club when Keane was in charge so you aren't in the position to slate those who 'abused' mccarthy by singing his football was s**t. Real abuse, so disgusting, so nasty, eh?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 16:09]
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:08 - May 23 with 872 viewsReuser_is_God

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 13:07 - May 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure

He walked into a job that many think is pretty much his dream one?


He's caretaker until they get the man they actually want.

Evans out
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:09 - May 23 with 865 viewsReuser_is_God

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:18 - May 22 by PJH

Imagine how many pages we would be at now if he had said something that was untrue.

I still love you Mick.


Ooooo love you Mick

Pathetic

Evans out
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:09 - May 23 with 864 viewsGeoffSentence

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 15:42 - May 23 by Churchman

I have no time for McCarthy and I am glad he is gone. I hated his ‘Ipswich are lucky to have me’ kind of arrogance, his dismissiveness and his abuse towards all of the supporters of this club at the end and not least his suffocatingly awful football. His decision making wasn’t always as good as he thinks either e.g. leaving Hyam on after he busted that Brentford player’s leg. Yes, he has had some success using his methods and yes he has the right to have a go at individuals if they have a personal go at him. But that doesn’t give him the right to have a go at us all, including me. I never abused him though there were many times I felt like doing so.
McCarthy was paid handsomely and we did some of the paying. He earns a living in a world where people are passionate, players, managers and supporters and the chipping away about the past because he can stuff seems a bit pathetic to me. That is not excusing some of the OTT abuse he got btw.
Our current mess is nothing to do with him. It’s all about Evans, a clueless manager and one for whom the jury is out. He should keep his trap shut because it doesn’t help anyone.
Change is not always a good thing, but sometimes it just has to be and after 5 years of McCarthy it was right for him and us. Shame Evans made a dogs dinner of it, as he has most things ITFC.


"that Brentford player's leg"

That was Alan Judge.

Don't boil a kettle on a boat.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:18 - May 23 with 840 viewsChurchman

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:08 - May 23 by Mach_foreignBlue

No-one really insulted him when he started showing his attitude: 'I know best and no-one is going to question my decisions'. He is an utterly odious character.

No wonder that two really sick characters like mccarthy and Keane had had a famous fall-out during World Cup in 2002.

Your turned your back on the club when Keane was in charge so you aren't in the position to slate those who 'abused' mccarthy by singing his football was s**t. Real abuse, so disgusting, so nasty, eh?
[Post edited 23 May 2019 16:09]


In any case, what constitutes abuse? Booing at half time? Unsettled groans and comments towards the dugout as the ‘Real Madrid are calling’ trio of Douglas Hyam and Skuse stagger round the field? In my view discontent with McCarthy methods well pre-dated Wigan away.

The paying public are allowed to express a view and he should have been big enough to leave it. But he wasn’t and isn’t. The very latest he should have been fired is after his behaviour at the Norwich game
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:20 - May 23 with 833 viewsChurchman

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:09 - May 23 by GeoffSentence

"that Brentford player's leg"

That was Alan Judge.


Sorry, of course it was. Ta
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:26 - May 23 with 817 viewsMach_foreignBlue

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:18 - May 23 by Churchman

In any case, what constitutes abuse? Booing at half time? Unsettled groans and comments towards the dugout as the ‘Real Madrid are calling’ trio of Douglas Hyam and Skuse stagger round the field? In my view discontent with McCarthy methods well pre-dated Wigan away.

The paying public are allowed to express a view and he should have been big enough to leave it. But he wasn’t and isn’t. The very latest he should have been fired is after his behaviour at the Norwich game


Booing, moans and groans, 'your football is s**t'........... and some claim mccarthy was 'abused' by the fans.

Some clearly crossed the line by singing paedo songs in Brentford but that happened only once.

Is there any manager in the country that tells his 'club's' fans to fook off? No, that was only him. No-one else.
[Post edited 23 May 2019 16:32]
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:36 - May 23 with 780 viewsC_HealyIsAPleasure

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:08 - May 23 by Reuser_is_God

He's caretaker until they get the man they actually want.


They already have Stephen Kenny, he manages their U21’s. McCarthy will be their manager for nearly 2 years including the next major tournament if he takes them there - it’s a dream job him clearly so again odd to pretend it isn’t

You’re better than this

Highlighting crass stupidity since sometime around 2010
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:50 - May 23 with 754 viewsPJH

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 16:09 - May 23 by Reuser_is_God

Ooooo love you Mick

Pathetic


It was a response to alternating between laughing at and getting annoyed with anti MM threads and posts.
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Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 19:40 - May 23 with 680 viewsRyorry

Mick unable to help himself - Part 328 on 14:46 - May 23 by PJH

Maybe you and I can continue this discussion when we next meet at a Northern League One ground although all of our previous meetings have been at Championship grounds for some reason.

I think MM's general man management where it really mattered, with his players, was pretty good.
As I have said, his comments about fans have frequently tended to be too general rather than purely targeting those that needed targeting.
No doubt he could have handled his reactions to the way that he was treated differently but it is a matter of opinion as to whether handling it differently would necessarily have been handling it better.
I suppose we all react to different things in a way that seems correct and natural to us at the time.

Anyway, may see you at some exotic location in the North but it ain't going to be Leeds.


Yes, I've been going through the list with interest! Bolton's a bit of a stretch for me these days, ditto Blackpool, but Sunderland, Accrington Stanley and Rochdale look possible. Shame about Bradford in more ways than one; gotta be pleased for Barnsley but a bit sad about not going there next season.

Re the debate -

1. You said "I think MM's general man management where it really mattered, with his players, was pretty good." I'd say it also really mattered with the fans, can't you see that it does?

2. "As I have said, his comments about fans have frequently tended to be too general rather than purely targeting those that needed targeting." Agreed.

3."No doubt he could have handled his reactions to the way that he was treated differently but it is a matter of opinion as to whether handling it differently would necessarily have been handling it better."

I'm a bit gobsmacked that you can't see it would have been better if, eg, he'd handled it the PL way - you even said on your later post of 3.46 this afternoon "He could have handled it differently-I do not think that that situation would get to anything like that stage in similar circumstances with Paul Lambert because MM and PL seem to be totally different characters."

Well exactly! Can you honestly see PL getting angry at fans & telling them to eff off, simply because they behaved like some football fans do, told him his football was sh1t etc.? A good manager is able to handle that, it's a standard part of the job - a professional should have risen above it - not behaved like a fan himself, giving it back and creating an antagonistic spiral of reaction in the same kind of way that happens in some threads on football forums!

Anyway, looking forward to the fixture list coming out!

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