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Is it just me? 19:51 - Jun 10 with 8872 viewsSpruceMoose

Or does anyone else find the thought of Boris Johnson being our PM, something we can never erase from our history books, utterly and thoroughly depressing?

I mean, ffs, what's the point of anything if that sh!tstain is our representative?

Britain's fall to complete laughing stock will be complete should this come to pass.

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Is it just me? on 11:21 - Jun 11 with 522 viewsblueislander

Is it just me? on 09:57 - Jun 11 by flimflam

They wont. Which leaves just the one option.


So there won’t be negotiations with backbone? We will just throw the toys out of the Pham, and ruin our economy?
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Is it just me? on 11:25 - Jun 11 with 512 viewsBrixtonBlue

Is it just me? on 11:02 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

You do realise many people disagree with his policies too, and his personality his intertwined with that.

The poster has said if Labour was more centrist he'd vote for them, he clearly doesn't like Corbyn's polciies


I don't see even much mention of his policies on this site, it's usually post after post attacking the man. The poster I was replying to did indeed mention centrist - he also said "We are stuck with current Tories or 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."

There is more to Labour than "a 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."

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Is it just me? on 11:29 - Jun 11 with 498 viewsC_HealyIsAPleasure

Is it just me? on 11:25 - Jun 11 by BrixtonBlue

I don't see even much mention of his policies on this site, it's usually post after post attacking the man. The poster I was replying to did indeed mention centrist - he also said "We are stuck with current Tories or 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."

There is more to Labour than "a 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."


Some 40, 50 and 60 something blokes and women that shout at rallies too?

All joking aside the problem with the current Labour regime is they have completely failed to put any pressure whatsoever on the worst government in living memory. The fact that large swathes of the population don’t actually consider them to be a better alternative is quite the damning indictment

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Is it just me? on 11:29 - Jun 11 with 494 viewsChurchman

Is it just me? on 08:11 - Jun 11 by Herbivore

Corbyn is going to implement Marxism now? He's going to start a revolution then?


The choice of word was lazy on my part. No, the aim will be a classless stateless society based on the principle of common ownership. But bread and circuses will come first of course, along with an expansion of police and internal security services to make sure the state can exercise ‘control’ - for the good of the ‘many’

It’s just my opinion on how it will go over the next 10 plus years when Corbyn’s people get control, which I believe will be later this year.
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Is it just me? on 11:32 - Jun 11 with 486 viewsitfcjoe

Is it just me? on 11:25 - Jun 11 by BrixtonBlue

I don't see even much mention of his policies on this site, it's usually post after post attacking the man. The poster I was replying to did indeed mention centrist - he also said "We are stuck with current Tories or 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."

There is more to Labour than "a 70 something bloke who shouts at rallies."


Corbyn and his cronies take positions on foreign affairs that I couldn't vote for - they are just anti-West in all reality and regardless of policies those things are a massive turn off to a lot of voters.

Whilst he is the leader of the party, and surrounds himself with the people with the views that he consistently does their policies will take a back seat - in the same way that whatever Johnson's policies are will do so because I don't trust the man and who he surrounds himself with (Steve Bannon etc)

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Is it just me? on 11:33 - Jun 11 with 477 viewsSpruceMoose

Is it just me? on 09:57 - Jun 11 by flimflam

They wont. Which leaves just the one option.


Calling it all off! Yay!

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Is it just me? on 11:37 - Jun 11 with 464 viewsBlueBadger

Is it just me? on 08:51 - Jun 11 by Darth_Koont

It's been sh!t for a lot longer than that.

Brexit has served a certain purpose in that regard. By being an inescapably real situation instead of the usual posturing with words, it's exposed our Westminster politicians, the system and a self-interested media that keep fuelling it for what they are. Basically, they're not fit for purpose.

The question is what do we do about that instead of this being exploited by populist chancers like Farage. In Scotland, the truth has been inescapable for longer and has resulted in the SNP. So perhaps this surge of support to the LibDems can last a bit longer and stem a slide to the silly right-wing?


I like how you mentioned 'populist chancers' and the SNP as if the two things were completely different, there.

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Is it just me? on 11:42 - Jun 11 with 447 viewsBrixtonBlue

Is it just me? on 11:32 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Corbyn and his cronies take positions on foreign affairs that I couldn't vote for - they are just anti-West in all reality and regardless of policies those things are a massive turn off to a lot of voters.

Whilst he is the leader of the party, and surrounds himself with the people with the views that he consistently does their policies will take a back seat - in the same way that whatever Johnson's policies are will do so because I don't trust the man and who he surrounds himself with (Steve Bannon etc)


It's nonsense that they're "anti-West", but the fact that you describe them right at the start as cronies shows I'm never going to change your mind regardless of the truth, so I'll leave it there.

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Is it just me? on 11:52 - Jun 11 with 433 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 11:37 - Jun 11 by BlueBadger

I like how you mentioned 'populist chancers' and the SNP as if the two things were completely different, there.


I'll forgive you for not following Scottish politics very closely.
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Is it just me? on 11:59 - Jun 11 with 419 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 11:29 - Jun 11 by C_HealyIsAPleasure

Some 40, 50 and 60 something blokes and women that shout at rallies too?

All joking aside the problem with the current Labour regime is they have completely failed to put any pressure whatsoever on the worst government in living memory. The fact that large swathes of the population don’t actually consider them to be a better alternative is quite the damning indictment


That's more an issue of how useless and self-serving the Parliamentary Labour Party had become as typified by Chukka Umunna, the pretty nasty infighting resisting the move away from the Labour right and generally how our right-wing media has stoked the flames.

Labour have been hamstrung by all of this even though Corbyn himself takes a lot of the blame for the Brexit impasse. Should have gone all out as a Remain party a while back and certainly when May was tying herself in knots in the HoP with her deal.

On pure policy they're a good and arguably necessary alternative.
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Is it just me? on 12:01 - Jun 11 with 410 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 11:32 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Corbyn and his cronies take positions on foreign affairs that I couldn't vote for - they are just anti-West in all reality and regardless of policies those things are a massive turn off to a lot of voters.

Whilst he is the leader of the party, and surrounds himself with the people with the views that he consistently does their policies will take a back seat - in the same way that whatever Johnson's policies are will do so because I don't trust the man and who he surrounds himself with (Steve Bannon etc)


When you say "anti-West" do you mean like the Swedish government is anti-West? They're cut from the same cloth as Corbyn politically. A Labour government would be arguably more in step with European governments than our current lot are.

Anti-Imperialist is probably a more accurate description.
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Is it just me? on 12:16 - Jun 11 with 360 viewsWeWereZombies

Is it just me? on 11:37 - Jun 11 by BlueBadger

I like how you mentioned 'populist chancers' and the SNP as if the two things were completely different, there.


I am highly unlikely to ever vote SNP but I think you have to accept that Sturgeon's tenure as First Minister for almost five years now is more than 'chancing'. She and the SNP are ploughing through some tough times (and there is a lot tougher ahead) and have faded a little but certainly not gone away. And when you see her standing next to Prince Charles (as she did at the centenary commemoration for the HMY Iolaire disaster on New Year's Day) or chatting informally to the Queen you have to wonder whether the best hope of statesmanship in Britain is a long way away from Westminster.

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Is it just me? on 12:16 - Jun 11 with 363 viewsBlueBadger

Is it just me? on 11:52 - Jun 11 by Darth_Koont

I'll forgive you for not following Scottish politics very closely.


Yeah, one party is lead by a blonde chancer who is still trying to sell their country a vision of 'independence' that bears no resemblance to what'll happen in reality and the other is likely to be led by Boris Johnson.
[Post edited 11 Jun 12:28]

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Is it just me? on 12:17 - Jun 11 with 358 viewsitfcjoe

Is it just me? on 11:42 - Jun 11 by BrixtonBlue

It's nonsense that they're "anti-West", but the fact that you describe them right at the start as cronies shows I'm never going to change your mind regardless of the truth, so I'll leave it there.


Of course it isn't, they take the anti-US/UK view on every major conflict or disagreement - Milne is clearly a Stalinist which is pro-Russia and the East.

These facts might be inconvenient but look into the likes of Milne and their views

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Is it just me? on 12:19 - Jun 11 with 353 viewswkj

I see the terms fact and opinion are being used interchangeably again.

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Is it just me? on 12:19 - Jun 11 with 352 viewsitfcjoe

Is it just me? on 12:01 - Jun 11 by Darth_Koont

When you say "anti-West" do you mean like the Swedish government is anti-West? They're cut from the same cloth as Corbyn politically. A Labour government would be arguably more in step with European governments than our current lot are.

Anti-Imperialist is probably a more accurate description.


Anti-US/UK, which in many ways is anti-imperialist but it's much more Stalinist than Socialist for me.

They care too much about people in far flung lands than the problems on our doorstep which get neglected.

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Is it just me? on 12:20 - Jun 11 with 339 viewsfooters

Is it just me? on 12:19 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Anti-US/UK, which in many ways is anti-imperialist but it's much more Stalinist than Socialist for me.

They care too much about people in far flung lands than the problems on our doorstep which get neglected.


'Stalinist' - please check what that means.

And your second point is bllocks, frankly.

"Man up you floppy armed fig. Footers is actually talking a lot of sense here."

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Is it just me? on 12:21 - Jun 11 with 336 viewsSpruceMoose

Is it just me? on 12:19 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Anti-US/UK, which in many ways is anti-imperialist but it's much more Stalinist than Socialist for me.

They care too much about people in far flung lands than the problems on our doorstep which get neglected.


I've literally never seen any evidence of that, so wouldn't mind you providing some that I could add to my 'reasons to not vote for Labour ' list.

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Is it just me? on 12:26 - Jun 11 with 317 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 12:16 - Jun 11 by BlueBadger

Yeah, one party is lead by a blonde chancer who is still trying to sell their country a vision of 'independence' that bears no resemblance to what'll happen in reality and the other is likely to be led by Boris Johnson.
[Post edited 11 Jun 12:28]


Then you're being a bit too reductive.

The case for Independence is that Scotland is a poor relation in the UK and also compared to similarly sized Northern European nations that don't even have the same assets. Self-determination offers a way out of that. There will be costs and issues but it's legitimate for people in Scotland to expect more than they've been getting and better prospects in the long term.

The Brexit lie is based on pretending that we have it bad within the EU and it can be better outside even when none of this adds up.

If I was going to reduce it, Scottish independence is about getting away from Brexiteers, even before the Brexiteers showed themselves for who they really are.
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Is it just me? on 12:27 - Jun 11 with 312 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 12:19 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Anti-US/UK, which in many ways is anti-imperialist but it's much more Stalinist than Socialist for me.

They care too much about people in far flung lands than the problems on our doorstep which get neglected.


That's a bit silly, Joe.
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Is it just me? on 12:31 - Jun 11 with 291 viewsWeWereZombies

Is it just me? on 12:26 - Jun 11 by Darth_Koont

Then you're being a bit too reductive.

The case for Independence is that Scotland is a poor relation in the UK and also compared to similarly sized Northern European nations that don't even have the same assets. Self-determination offers a way out of that. There will be costs and issues but it's legitimate for people in Scotland to expect more than they've been getting and better prospects in the long term.

The Brexit lie is based on pretending that we have it bad within the EU and it can be better outside even when none of this adds up.

If I was going to reduce it, Scottish independence is about getting away from Brexiteers, even before the Brexiteers showed themselves for who they really are.


That wasn't really the case in 2014, was it?

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Is it just me? on 12:37 - Jun 11 with 271 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 12:31 - Jun 11 by WeWereZombies

That wasn't really the case in 2014, was it?


I think so. These neo-Liberal Brexiteers have been around and influencing policy even before Brexit became an issue.

Scottish independence isn't really a nationalist battle. At heart it's a battle between the advocates of a more social democratic politics and the free-market capitalism that has seen communities and regions marginalised and not being invested in.
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Is it just me? on 12:37 - Jun 11 with 268 viewsPragmaticBlue

Is it just me? on 12:17 - Jun 11 by itfcjoe

Of course it isn't, they take the anti-US/UK view on every major conflict or disagreement - Milne is clearly a Stalinist which is pro-Russia and the East.

These facts might be inconvenient but look into the likes of Milne and their views


Russia has not been communist for nearly 30 years! Why do you mix the modern Russia with Stalin et al? Similarly what is "the East"? If you think the old communist bloc is socialist then you need to do some research!
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Is it just me? on 12:49 - Jun 11 with 243 viewsWeWereZombies

Is it just me? on 12:37 - Jun 11 by Darth_Koont

I think so. These neo-Liberal Brexiteers have been around and influencing policy even before Brexit became an issue.

Scottish independence isn't really a nationalist battle. At heart it's a battle between the advocates of a more social democratic politics and the free-market capitalism that has seen communities and regions marginalised and not being invested in.


Well there are plenty around my way who see independence referendums as some type of revival of the '45. It would be better if some of the SNP enthusiasts I meet could see it as more than putting a saltire on everything, if only to give Scottish Labour the kick up the backside it needs (although after debacles like Falkirk and the treatment of Johann Lamont I wonder if Labour can ever recover). I did the University of Edinburgh MOOC on the 2014 referendum before I voted to see if I could be swayed to 'Aye' and I cannot remember EU membership ever being discussed in the online debates.

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Is it just me? on 12:56 - Jun 11 with 226 viewsDarth_Koont

Is it just me? on 12:49 - Jun 11 by WeWereZombies

Well there are plenty around my way who see independence referendums as some type of revival of the '45. It would be better if some of the SNP enthusiasts I meet could see it as more than putting a saltire on everything, if only to give Scottish Labour the kick up the backside it needs (although after debacles like Falkirk and the treatment of Johann Lamont I wonder if Labour can ever recover). I did the University of Edinburgh MOOC on the 2014 referendum before I voted to see if I could be swayed to 'Aye' and I cannot remember EU membership ever being discussed in the online debates.


I don't think anyone seriously thought that EU membership would be an issue.

If the choice becomes between an independent Scotland in the EU vs. Scotland in a post-Brexit UK then I expect a closer result than 45-55.

It will be very interesting to read about the "vision" of Scotland's future in that sort of UK. Replace sunny uplands with misty highlands.
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