| Looks like we have a "suicide government" 10:20 - Sep 2 with 2587 views | Guthrum |
with no long term ambition beyond the one task of getting No Deal Brexit through by default. Destroying their majority, their (notional) party or the foundations of British constitutional procedure are not an issue as long as they can crash over the line.
If any of them genuinely believe they can hoodwink the EU into unreasonable concessions by a show of stymieing Parliament and witholding damaging reports (see this morning's Guardian), they're fools. It has to be a deliberate ploy for the negotiations to "fail" as a blame-pinning excercise.
The willingness to sacrifice a Commons majority by removing the whip from MPs suggests they don't expect to need to get legislation through the House in the aftermath. It's a one-shot weapon, then cast aside (along with Boris Johnson).
If they are relying upon grateful Brexit Party voters to get them back in power with a majority afterwards, then there's a nasty shock coming. Labour may be hamstrung by their (perceived) hard left position and the LibDems by lingering memeories of the Coalition, but many moderate and swing voters will be repelled by both the effects of austerity and the way the present government has handled this crisis. There's a dozen seats in Scotland likely to go, plus a number in the South West.That's assuming some of the removed Tories don't stand as independents or as part of a new grouping. |  |
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| "... deliberate ploy for the negotiations to "fail" as a blame-pinning exercise" on 10:22 - Sep 2 with 2036 views | Dyland |
That's it. Full stop.
Dreadful, shameful, arrogant, ignorant. I hope karma kicks in sooner rather than later. |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:24 - Sep 2 with 2009 views | artsbossbeard |
Can you provide a synopsis of the Gaurdian story, please? |  |
| Please note: prior to hitting the post button, I've double checked for anything that could be construed as "Anti Semitic" and to the best of my knowledge it isn't. Anything deemed to be of a Xenophobic nature is therefore purely accidental or down to your own misconstruing. | | Poll: | Raining in IP8 - shall I get the washing in? |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:26 - Sep 2 with 2002 views | itfcjoe |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:24 - Sep 2 by artsbossbeard |
Can you provide a synopsis of the Gaurdian story, please? |
DOVER AND OUT: Sky News has got its hands on the department for transport’s latest assessment of the impact of no deal on the port of Dover. And – guess what! – it ain’t pretty, with worst-case scenarios of a two-day delay for freight and vehicles. Even if everything goes as smoothly as it can, the DFT report says, vehicles will be waiting for two to three hours, with 50 percent of vehicles waiting for at least eight.
And there’s more: Another leaked document, this time to the Guardian’s Kate Proctor, shows all the so-called the alternative arrangement options for the Irish border explored by government working groups are “fraught with difficulty and would leave smaller businesses struggling to cope.” It looks bleak for those still hoping the backstop can be replaced with a better plan.
Brexit magic money tree: Somewhat ironically given the looming disasters detailed above, the government’s own £100 million Brexit PR blitz is now up and running, with full-page “Get Ready” adverts in all the national papers this morning. No word yet on where we can buy the promised “Get Ready” mugs.
(This is all from the excellent daily Politico e-mail which is well worth signing up to) |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:27 - Sep 2 with 1980 views | footers |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:26 - Sep 2 by itfcjoe |
DOVER AND OUT: Sky News has got its hands on the department for transport’s latest assessment of the impact of no deal on the port of Dover. And – guess what! – it ain’t pretty, with worst-case scenarios of a two-day delay for freight and vehicles. Even if everything goes as smoothly as it can, the DFT report says, vehicles will be waiting for two to three hours, with 50 percent of vehicles waiting for at least eight.
And there’s more: Another leaked document, this time to the Guardian’s Kate Proctor, shows all the so-called the alternative arrangement options for the Irish border explored by government working groups are “fraught with difficulty and would leave smaller businesses struggling to cope.” It looks bleak for those still hoping the backstop can be replaced with a better plan.
Brexit magic money tree: Somewhat ironically given the looming disasters detailed above, the government’s own £100 million Brexit PR blitz is now up and running, with full-page “Get Ready” adverts in all the national papers this morning. No word yet on where we can buy the promised “Get Ready” mugs.
(This is all from the excellent daily Politico e-mail which is well worth signing up to) |
Brexit mugs. That's a nice little double entendre. |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:29 - Sep 2 with 1971 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:24 - Sep 2 by artsbossbeard |
Can you provide a synopsis of the Gaurdian story, please? |
Better than that, here is a link: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/02/irish-border-after-brexit-all-i
Basically, government analysis of proposed border solutions says all are more or less unworkable in their current forms. This report suppressed by DExEU and No. 10, but now leaked. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:32 - Sep 2 with 1954 views | Guthrum |
It's even upset some unlikely people:
This is what Charles Walker, a Brexiter Tory and acting co-chair of the Conservative 1922 Committee, told the Daily Telegraph about Johnson’s strategy. Walker said: 'I say, as a committed Brexiteer and acting co-chair of the 1922, that talk of purging good Conservatives, who were serving in government up until late July, from our ranks is extremely unpleasant and the idea is one that must be resisted.'
As quoted in the Guardian. | |
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| Looks like we have a on 11:01 - Sep 2 with 1880 views | Swansea_Blue |
Damn. I saw the words "suicide" and "government" and for a second thought this was going to be good news  |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:03 - Sep 2 with 1873 views | homer_123 |
Feel like Boris wants an election and then to be in power having purged the Tory party. |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:04 - Sep 2 with 1866 views | footers |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:03 - Sep 2 by homer_123 |
Feel like Boris wants an election and then to be in power having purged the Tory party. |
Great idea after May's snap GE. That worked out well. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:04 - Sep 2 with 1863 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:32 - Sep 2 by Guthrum |
It's even upset some unlikely people:
This is what Charles Walker, a Brexiter Tory and acting co-chair of the Conservative 1922 Committee, told the Daily Telegraph about Johnson’s strategy. Walker said: 'I say, as a committed Brexiteer and acting co-chair of the 1922, that talk of purging good Conservatives, who were serving in government up until late July, from our ranks is extremely unpleasant and the idea is one that must be resisted.'
As quoted in the Guardian. |
They're publically falling apart. Several of the less swivel-eyed MPs are pushing back both professionally via letter to the PM and publically on social media. This week isn't going to be pretty. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:12 - Sep 2 with 1838 views | homer_123 |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:04 - Sep 2 by footers |
Great idea after May's snap GE. That worked out well. |
I didn't say it was well thought out. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:16 - Sep 2 with 1824 views | footers |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:12 - Sep 2 by homer_123 |
I didn't say it was well thought out. |
Didn't say you did.
Just pointing out the hubris of BoJo. Not that anyone really needs to. | |
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| Looks like we have a on 11:23 - Sep 2 with 1794 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 10:26 - Sep 2 by itfcjoe |
DOVER AND OUT: Sky News has got its hands on the department for transport’s latest assessment of the impact of no deal on the port of Dover. And – guess what! – it ain’t pretty, with worst-case scenarios of a two-day delay for freight and vehicles. Even if everything goes as smoothly as it can, the DFT report says, vehicles will be waiting for two to three hours, with 50 percent of vehicles waiting for at least eight.
And there’s more: Another leaked document, this time to the Guardian’s Kate Proctor, shows all the so-called the alternative arrangement options for the Irish border explored by government working groups are “fraught with difficulty and would leave smaller businesses struggling to cope.” It looks bleak for those still hoping the backstop can be replaced with a better plan.
Brexit magic money tree: Somewhat ironically given the looming disasters detailed above, the government’s own £100 million Brexit PR blitz is now up and running, with full-page “Get Ready” adverts in all the national papers this morning. No word yet on where we can buy the promised “Get Ready” mugs.
(This is all from the excellent daily Politico e-mail which is well worth signing up to) |
I don't commute to work anymore but can remember dreading roadworks, with contraflow,on the A12 causing chaos. The roadworks might go on for 10 weeks or more but you always knew that traffic conditions would ease after a couple of days as people changed work patterns, leaving earlier or later etc.
Problems at Dover will be exactly the same as this, they will be hell for a short time and then will improve. [Post edited 2 Sep 2019 11:26]
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:27 - Sep 2 with 1781 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:04 - Sep 2 by footers |
Great idea after May's snap GE. That worked out well. |
Judging by the "heat map" of UKIP support in 2015 (probably the best analogy to the Brexit Party now) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32624405 , their support base was concentrated in the Fens, along the Thames estuary, the Kent coast, South Yorkshire and a sprinkling of places in the North East, Manchester Region and Stoke. In the current HoC, those first three areas are already Conservative and the rest are all big Labour strongholds with little chance of falling to the Tories.
So a mass defection from BP to Cons is unlikely to win them that many extra seats.
Dislike of Corbyn may well be more effective. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:27 - Sep 2 with 1775 views | homer_123 |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:16 - Sep 2 by footers |
Didn't say you did.
Just pointing out the hubris of BoJo. Not that anyone really needs to. |
touche! ;) | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:33 - Sep 2 with 1736 views | saxon |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:03 - Sep 2 by homer_123 |
Feel like Boris wants an election and then to be in power having purged the Tory party. |
Not to mention that they've already floated the ideas that if he lost a no confidence vote he could just not resign. Or that even if an alternative interim government could be formed, it would still be incumbent on him to recommend it to the Queen, and he could just choose not do that. Or that the date of any election as the result of a non confidence vote would be of his choosing - so he could just set a date after 31st October. Or that they could just not ask for royal assent on any legislation passed which they didn't like.
He's gambling on no deal by hell or high water, and that once the raison d'etre of the Brexit Party was removed there'd be enough of those voters who'd return to the tories for him to get away with it in an election before the full realities of Brexit hit home. |  | | |
| Looks like we have a on 11:34 - Sep 2 with 1733 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like we have a on 11:23 - Sep 2 by Pinewoodblue |
I don't commute to work anymore but can remember dreading roadworks, with contraflow,on the A12 causing chaos. The roadworks might go on for 10 weeks or more but you always knew that traffic conditions would ease after a couple of days as people changed work patterns, leaving earlier or later etc.
Problems at Dover will be exactly the same as this, they will be hell for a short time and then will improve. [Post edited 2 Sep 2019 11:26]
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Unfortunately, unlike roadworks, there are an extremely limited number of options for alternative routes to get heavy goods to and from the Continent. Plus all of them take considerably longer than Dover (Felixtowe to the Hook is 6.5 hours, Dover to Calais 1.5) and many do not have the same transport connectivity. Nor do they have facilities to cope with a sudden increase in traffic. | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:34 - Sep 2 with 1731 views | gordon |
Indeed. This week's constitutional question the TWTD panel will be focusing in is what do you do when a Government decides to commit hara-kiri. |  | | |
| Looks like we have a on 11:50 - Sep 2 with 1688 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Looks like we have a on 11:34 - Sep 2 by Guthrum |
Unfortunately, unlike roadworks, there are an extremely limited number of options for alternative routes to get heavy goods to and from the Continent. Plus all of them take considerably longer than Dover (Felixtowe to the Hook is 6.5 hours, Dover to Calais 1.5) and many do not have the same transport connectivity. Nor do they have facilities to cope with a sudden increase in traffic. |
We live in a society where it is the norm to overstate risks only time will tell. Schools closing because it might snow is a good example.
Would be very surprised if the Irish government don't already have plans in place to avoid their exports passing through the UK. Risk assessment by many businesses will have unearthed ways in which journey savings can be made. Recently purchased Lasagna from a supermarket. Emblazoned across the packaging was a banner "100% British Beef" In small print on the reverse "Produced in France" Beef exported to France to be used in the production of Lasagna for the UK market.
Not trying to say there wouldn't be a problem as clearly there would be.
The biggest problem I have with the current situation is in reality it isn't about stopping a no deal Brexit but stopping any sort of Brexit. How many Labour MPs, with constituencies that overwhelmingly voted to leave, are comfortable about being used to help the Likes of John Major george Osborne et al? [Post edited 2 Sep 2019 11:51]
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| Looks like we have a on 11:54 - Sep 2 with 1670 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like we have a on 11:50 - Sep 2 by Pinewoodblue |
We live in a society where it is the norm to overstate risks only time will tell. Schools closing because it might snow is a good example.
Would be very surprised if the Irish government don't already have plans in place to avoid their exports passing through the UK. Risk assessment by many businesses will have unearthed ways in which journey savings can be made. Recently purchased Lasagna from a supermarket. Emblazoned across the packaging was a banner "100% British Beef" In small print on the reverse "Produced in France" Beef exported to France to be used in the production of Lasagna for the UK market.
Not trying to say there wouldn't be a problem as clearly there would be.
The biggest problem I have with the current situation is in reality it isn't about stopping a no deal Brexit but stopping any sort of Brexit. How many Labour MPs, with constituencies that overwhelmingly voted to leave, are comfortable about being used to help the Likes of John Major george Osborne et al? [Post edited 2 Sep 2019 11:51]
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Except that Labour are not an anti-Brexit party. Not by manifesto nor by leadership inclination. | |
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| Looks like we have a on 12:08 - Sep 2 with 1630 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Looks like we have a on 11:54 - Sep 2 by Guthrum |
Except that Labour are not an anti-Brexit party. Not by manifesto nor by leadership inclination. |
Not sure anyone knows exactly what the Labour party wants anymore, apart from power.
Cannot foresee any circumstances where Labour could form a government without the support of SNP. The price to be paid will be a second referendum on Scottish independence. The consequences of which could prove catastrophic for the Union.
Tony Blair has already warned against forcing a General Election.
If the Labour party is still genuinely pro Brexit they are not doing a very good job of getting the message over. Nor are they, by holding a shadow cabinet meeting to agree an action plan with regards to parliamentary action without involving some representation from other parties looking for a unified opposition.
A plague on all their houses. | |
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| Looks like we have a on 12:16 - Sep 2 with 1600 views | gordon |
| Looks like we have a on 12:08 - Sep 2 by Pinewoodblue |
Not sure anyone knows exactly what the Labour party wants anymore, apart from power.
Cannot foresee any circumstances where Labour could form a government without the support of SNP. The price to be paid will be a second referendum on Scottish independence. The consequences of which could prove catastrophic for the Union.
Tony Blair has already warned against forcing a General Election.
If the Labour party is still genuinely pro Brexit they are not doing a very good job of getting the message over. Nor are they, by holding a shadow cabinet meeting to agree an action plan with regards to parliamentary action without involving some representation from other parties looking for a unified opposition.
A plague on all their houses. |
I don't follow the second paragraph - if the majority of Scots support independence, as you insinuate, then in a democracy shouldn't they be given the chance to express that position? | | | |
| Looks like we have a on 12:20 - Sep 2 with 1579 views | Guthrum |
| Looks like we have a on 12:08 - Sep 2 by Pinewoodblue |
Not sure anyone knows exactly what the Labour party wants anymore, apart from power.
Cannot foresee any circumstances where Labour could form a government without the support of SNP. The price to be paid will be a second referendum on Scottish independence. The consequences of which could prove catastrophic for the Union.
Tony Blair has already warned against forcing a General Election.
If the Labour party is still genuinely pro Brexit they are not doing a very good job of getting the message over. Nor are they, by holding a shadow cabinet meeting to agree an action plan with regards to parliamentary action without involving some representation from other parties looking for a unified opposition.
A plague on all their houses. |
Mostly can't disagree with that.
Altho I'm not sure a second Scottish Referendum would go much differently to the first. The hard realities about national viability have not gone away and the chances of instant re-entry into the EU for Scotland are still slim (due to opposition from secession-sensitive nations such as Spain and France). | |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 12:22 - Sep 2 with 1564 views | BlueBadger |
| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 11:03 - Sep 2 by homer_123 |
Feel like Boris wants an election and then to be in power having purged the Tory party. |
Ah yes, the Corbyn Gambit. |  |
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| Looks like we have a "suicide government" on 12:26 - Sep 2 with 1545 views | Ryorry |
I'm hoping he/they've shot himself/themselves in the foot by making it so obvious. Blackmail's never gone down well with the Great British Public's sense of fair play, esp where it's a question of individuals' integrity being placed on one side of the seesaw, & their job on the other. |  |
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