| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:31 - Sep 6 with 3628 views | wkj |
Difficult one really, especially if people see a few pricks being more credible than vaccinations |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:33 - Sep 6 with 3622 views | StokieBlue |
Homeopathy is total nonsense.
It's also not a placebo, the placebo effect isn't caused by anything, it's caused by belief something will work.
Why go through the bother of doing the homeopathy to create water when you can just give them water and say it's had the process applied.
SB |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:33 - Sep 6 with 3618 views | WeWereZombies |
When you say you are going out on a limb please don't cut one off and then place your faith in homeopathy to re-attach it. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:35 - Sep 6 with 3613 views | BrixtonBlue |
I have a catarrh supplement, that my mum recommended, that is the only thing I've found that works. I didn't realise for several years, until recently, that it's a homeopathic remedy. Now I don't know what to do! I know, scientifically, that stuff isn't supposed to work, and yet it does.
The thing I don't understand; if it is just a placebo why hasn't doctor/chemist recommended/prescribed stuff worked via placebo? It's not just down to it being mum-recommended either, as other stuff she's recommended for ailments hasn't worked.
It's all very odd, which makes me wonder if there's something else at work that science-wise we don't understand yet, and thus traditional science-based evidence is the wrong approach. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:39 - Sep 6 with 3591 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:33 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
Homeopathy is total nonsense.
It's also not a placebo, the placebo effect isn't caused by anything, it's caused by belief something will work.
Why go through the bother of doing the homeopathy to create water when you can just give them water and say it's had the process applied.
SB |
How do you explain my little story above? I didn't have any belief it would work (well no more than anything else I've tried).
I don't think it's very open-minded or helpful to just describe something you don't understand as "total nonsense" and then just be done with it. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:41 - Sep 6 with 3589 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:35 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
I have a catarrh supplement, that my mum recommended, that is the only thing I've found that works. I didn't realise for several years, until recently, that it's a homeopathic remedy. Now I don't know what to do! I know, scientifically, that stuff isn't supposed to work, and yet it does.
The thing I don't understand; if it is just a placebo why hasn't doctor/chemist recommended/prescribed stuff worked via placebo? It's not just down to it being mum-recommended either, as other stuff she's recommended for ailments hasn't worked.
It's all very odd, which makes me wonder if there's something else at work that science-wise we don't understand yet, and thus traditional science-based evidence is the wrong approach. |
"Now I don't know what to do! I know, scientifically, that stuff isn't supposed to work"
Homeopathy doesn't work. There is isn't really a debate to he had about that. Once you have diluted whatever it is in the water the number of times you are supposed to then there is nothing left except water.
The homeopathic remedy itself is not what is easing your symptoms.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:42 - Sep 6 with 3578 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:39 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
How do you explain my little story above? I didn't have any belief it would work (well no more than anything else I've tried).
I don't think it's very open-minded or helpful to just describe something you don't understand as "total nonsense" and then just be done with it. |
You didn't know it was a homeopathic remedy for years you said so you had no reason to believe it wouldn't work. I'd also point out that anecdotal evidence isn't evidence at all.
"I don't think it's very open-minded or helpful to just describe something you don't understand as "total nonsense" and then just be done with it."
That's not the way science works. We do understand exactly why homeopathic remedies don't work. The placebo effect in action has nothing to do with the trigger.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:43]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:44 - Sep 6 with 3571 views | DanTheMan |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:35 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
I have a catarrh supplement, that my mum recommended, that is the only thing I've found that works. I didn't realise for several years, until recently, that it's a homeopathic remedy. Now I don't know what to do! I know, scientifically, that stuff isn't supposed to work, and yet it does.
The thing I don't understand; if it is just a placebo why hasn't doctor/chemist recommended/prescribed stuff worked via placebo? It's not just down to it being mum-recommended either, as other stuff she's recommended for ailments hasn't worked.
It's all very odd, which makes me wonder if there's something else at work that science-wise we don't understand yet, and thus traditional science-based evidence is the wrong approach. |
You're literally describing placebo. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:45 - Sep 6 with 3568 views | Ryorry |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:33 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
Homeopathy is total nonsense.
It's also not a placebo, the placebo effect isn't caused by anything, it's caused by belief something will work.
Why go through the bother of doing the homeopathy to create water when you can just give them water and say it's had the process applied.
SB |
Prof Cyril Smith of Salford Uni (now retired) said it's down to no actual chemicals in the water, but the magnetic frequency that the water changes to once a trace of the introduced substance is in it.
I was a total sceptic & said it could never work, but was so desperate when everything else in conventional medicine had been tried & failed that I gave it a go. Worked 66% of the time (I kept records).
Also worked for my old dog's callapso'd back legs, and I don't think he was aware of the concept of the placebo effect.
Anecdotal I know. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:46 - Sep 6 with 3550 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:45 - Sep 6 by Ryorry |
Prof Cyril Smith of Salford Uni (now retired) said it's down to no actual chemicals in the water, but the magnetic frequency that the water changes to once a trace of the introduced substance is in it.
I was a total sceptic & said it could never work, but was so desperate when everything else in conventional medicine had been tried & failed that I gave it a go. Worked 66% of the time (I kept records).
Also worked for my old dog's callapso'd back legs, and I don't think he was aware of the concept of the placebo effect.
Anecdotal I know. |
That's entire first paragraph is pseudo-science of the highest order.
You are once again describing the placebo which has nothing to do with the actual homeopathy.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:48]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:47 - Sep 6 with 3546 views | SpruceMoose |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:45 - Sep 6 by Ryorry |
Prof Cyril Smith of Salford Uni (now retired) said it's down to no actual chemicals in the water, but the magnetic frequency that the water changes to once a trace of the introduced substance is in it.
I was a total sceptic & said it could never work, but was so desperate when everything else in conventional medicine had been tried & failed that I gave it a go. Worked 66% of the time (I kept records).
Also worked for my old dog's callapso'd back legs, and I don't think he was aware of the concept of the placebo effect.
Anecdotal I know. |
I'm glad you're feeling well and that your hound saw an improvement.
And in the words of Forest Gump, that's all I have to say about that. |  |
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"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:48 - Sep 6 with 3537 views | homer_123 |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:42 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
You didn't know it was a homeopathic remedy for years you said so you had no reason to believe it wouldn't work. I'd also point out that anecdotal evidence isn't evidence at all.
"I don't think it's very open-minded or helpful to just describe something you don't understand as "total nonsense" and then just be done with it."
That's not the way science works. We do understand exactly why homeopathic remedies don't work. The placebo effect in action has nothing to do with the trigger.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:43]
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And the placebo effect has been scientifically tried, tested and validated. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:50 - Sep 6 with 3522 views | GeoffSentence |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:33 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
Homeopathy is total nonsense.
It's also not a placebo, the placebo effect isn't caused by anything, it's caused by belief something will work.
Why go through the bother of doing the homeopathy to create water when you can just give them water and say it's had the process applied.
SB |
It is not intended as a placebo by its advocates, but I believe the placebo effect is what accounts for any results it has.
According to the NHS homeopathy is no better than placebo, but the placebo effect has been shown to be quite powerful. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:50 - Sep 6 with 3520 views | sparks |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:46 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
That's entire first paragraph is pseudo-science of the highest order.
You are once again describing the placebo which has nothing to do with the actual homeopathy.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:48]
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Indeed. Its what is sometimes referred to as 'not even wrong' |  |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:53 - Sep 6 with 3508 views | Ryorry |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:46 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
That's entire first paragraph is pseudo-science of the highest order.
You are once again describing the placebo which has nothing to do with the actual homeopathy.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:48]
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You didn't read what I said with an open mind, as I clearly said I thought it a load of mumbo prior to using and was expecting it to fail. In effect, the opposite of the placebo effect. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:54 - Sep 6 with 3497 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:50 - Sep 6 by GeoffSentence |
It is not intended as a placebo by its advocates, but I believe the placebo effect is what accounts for any results it has.
According to the NHS homeopathy is no better than placebo, but the placebo effect has been shown to be quite powerful. |
The two things are different. I don't see why you are melding them together.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:56 - Sep 6 with 3490 views | Ryorry |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:47 - Sep 6 by SpruceMoose |
I'm glad you're feeling well and that your hound saw an improvement.
And in the words of Forest Gump, that's all I have to say about that. |
Unfortunately I'm not feeling well actually. But different ailments now. Shows how some people read into the posts of others what was never there. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:57 - Sep 6 with 3486 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:53 - Sep 6 by Ryorry |
You didn't read what I said with an open mind, as I clearly said I thought it a load of mumbo prior to using and was expecting it to fail. In effect, the opposite of the placebo effect. |
It's scientifically incorrect. If I say the sky was pink would you approach it with an open mind? It's a weird argument - you said it was anecdotal then get upset when it's dismissed as such.
It can work even if you believe it won't:
https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/placebo-can-work-even-know-placebo-201607079
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:02 - Sep 6 with 3455 views | footers |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:45 - Sep 6 by Ryorry |
Prof Cyril Smith of Salford Uni (now retired) said it's down to no actual chemicals in the water, but the magnetic frequency that the water changes to once a trace of the introduced substance is in it.
I was a total sceptic & said it could never work, but was so desperate when everything else in conventional medicine had been tried & failed that I gave it a go. Worked 66% of the time (I kept records).
Also worked for my old dog's callapso'd back legs, and I don't think he was aware of the concept of the placebo effect.
Anecdotal I know. |
Magnets are an attractive alternative but are poles apart from proven medicine. |  |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:03 - Sep 6 with 3446 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:41 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
"Now I don't know what to do! I know, scientifically, that stuff isn't supposed to work"
Homeopathy doesn't work. There is isn't really a debate to he had about that. Once you have diluted whatever it is in the water the number of times you are supposed to then there is nothing left except water.
The homeopathic remedy itself is not what is easing your symptoms.
SB |
So why are they only eased directly after I use this remedy? And this after having tried lots of other remedies.
You seem to have completely glossed over the point about maybe this is something science doesn't understand yet, and science-based evidence might be the wrong way. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:07 - Sep 6 with 3431 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:42 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
You didn't know it was a homeopathic remedy for years you said so you had no reason to believe it wouldn't work. I'd also point out that anecdotal evidence isn't evidence at all.
"I don't think it's very open-minded or helpful to just describe something you don't understand as "total nonsense" and then just be done with it."
That's not the way science works. We do understand exactly why homeopathic remedies don't work. The placebo effect in action has nothing to do with the trigger.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:43]
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Might as well leave it there. You don't believe me. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:07 - Sep 6 with 3424 views | WeWereZombies |
And, as everyone knows, the sky is black... | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:08 - Sep 6 with 3417 views | wkj |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:07 - Sep 6 by WeWereZombies |
And, as everyone knows, the sky is black... |
So is Rick Astley | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:08 - Sep 6 with 3414 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 14:44 - Sep 6 by DanTheMan |
You're literally describing placebo. |
You've totally ignored the middle portion of my post.
"if it is just a placebo why hasn't doctor/chemist recommended/prescribed stuff worked via placebo? It's not just down to it being mum-recommended either, as other stuff she's recommended for ailments hasn't worked."
Feel free to explain it rather than just say it's placebo and sweep this bit under the carpet. | |
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| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:09 - Sep 6 with 3407 views | StokieBlue |
| Dangerous mumbo jumbo or powerful placebo? on 15:03 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
So why are they only eased directly after I use this remedy? And this after having tried lots of other remedies.
You seem to have completely glossed over the point about maybe this is something science doesn't understand yet, and science-based evidence might be the wrong way. |
I glossed over it because I don't know what you expect me to say?
You've given an unfalisifable position and thus nobody can argue against it.
I'll say this - what other type of medicine is their other than "science-based"? I can't think of anything - you are essentially saying "magic".
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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