| All these teenage stabbings in london 08:41 - Oct 11 with 15557 views | fergalsharkey |
Drug gang tit for tat killings obviously but how do you deal with it?
I think the government should look at changing certain laws to loosen the restraints on what legally can be used as evidence against these vile little rodents.
2 more killed last night, and there is a school of thought which makes you think that if we back away then eventually they will all kill each other.
With the reduction in police numbers in the met maybe that is the grand plan.
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:41 - Oct 11 with 3587 views | Deano69 |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 09:09 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
The answer is legalise drugs. Which plenty of people on here have said over and over. Some won't listen though.
Heard some horror stories about how higher up gang folk rope these kids in very young (usually from less privileged backgrounds) with the promise of easy money and once they're on the street they'll hire one of their own to rob them of their drugs/cash, take it back to the gang and then tell the poor kid they now owe debt with interest so there is no way out from them.
Plus many of these kids pushing drugs are normal lads without a dangerous bone in their body pushing a bit of 'armless 'erb. Sweeping generalisations like the OP are part of the reason nothing's getting done. [Post edited 11 Oct 2019 9:10]
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Was talking to a careers adviser from Manchester. He always asks the lads he is advising (school age) what they want to do when they leave school. a large number of the answers are either 'play for United/City' or be 'a drug dealer'. It is said without joking, and when challenged they reply with things like 'well they both drive Range Rovers' or ' minted aint they' etc
Depressing. |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:43 - Oct 11 with 3575 views | wkj |
The should stop vlogging and getting beef with each other, get a real job. |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:43 - Oct 11 with 3577 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:39 - Oct 11 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
I think you’ve missed the point
If drugs were legalised and able to be bought via legal sources, your average recreational user would almost certainly do so, assuming no real dropoff in quality or significant increase in price. Dealers would probably try and compete and still sell at a cheaper price but appeal would be less as people would worry about what they were buying
However, your average hard substance addict who is scrambling together every last £ is more likely to be susceptible - and so think the black market would rage on
The gang issue is very much tied to the latter
I could be wrong - and of course very difficult to predict exactly given what a huge shift it would be if it did by some miracle happen |
You could be right, but at this point what we've been doing for decades hasn't worked. People still buy drugs. Crime around drugs rages on. I'd be open to trying something different and then tackling any issues as they arise. |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:44 - Oct 11 with 3573 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:39 - Oct 11 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
I think you’ve missed the point
If drugs were legalised and able to be bought via legal sources, your average recreational user would almost certainly do so, assuming no real dropoff in quality or significant increase in price. Dealers would probably try and compete and still sell at a cheaper price but appeal would be less as people would worry about what they were buying
However, your average hard substance addict who is scrambling together every last £ is more likely to be susceptible - and so think the black market would rage on
The gang issue is very much tied to the latter
I could be wrong - and of course very difficult to predict exactly given what a huge shift it would be if it did by some miracle happen |
Here is something you may find interesting;
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/17/canada-cannabis-stores-sales-black |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:45 - Oct 11 with 3569 views | StokieBlue |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:30 - Oct 11 by Herbivore |
I don't really see the issue. Those things are already available to those that want to take them, though they are supplied by criminals and sometimes cut with toxic substances. They also vary in strength because production is far from standardised, increasing the risk of overdose. If you care about people's wellbeing then a sensible drugs policy is the only way, and a sensible drug policy should focus on legalisation and regulation with very tough policing of anyone operating outside the agreed legal and regulatory framework. [Post edited 11 Oct 2019 12:24]
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I guess the only thing to consider is whether legalised cannabis would be easier to obtain for the younger members of society. I suspect as you've pointed out that if they want it then they can already get it so maybe not an issue but the effects on a developing brain are allegedly quite different to those on an adult brain.
For instance:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-pot-really-does-to-the-teen-brai
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:48 - Oct 11 with 3558 views | DanTheMan |
This mainly reads like a supply problem. You could avoid this by doing the work upfront, allowing manufacturers to produce before legalising sales.
At least that's how it reads anyway. |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:52 - Oct 11 with 3544 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:45 - Oct 11 by StokieBlue |
I guess the only thing to consider is whether legalised cannabis would be easier to obtain for the younger members of society. I suspect as you've pointed out that if they want it then they can already get it so maybe not an issue but the effects on a developing brain are allegedly quite different to those on an adult brain.
For instance:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-pot-really-does-to-the-teen-brai
SB |
I'm getting more worried at how young dealers are getting. I knew no one in school who was selling regularly other than a couple of kids who would pick up for mates when they saw their dealer. Now it seems from speaking to people and seeing the news kids often have multiple full time dealers in school, many not even past GCSE age.
I believe in part it's because London is all taken so smaller dealers are venturing out the capital to find local kids to run their business there, and using the reputation of the big city to scare those already running out of city patches away (or getting them to buy in).
FWIW, I knew where I could buy weed when I was 13 (and I did). Most kids in school will know that I'd imagine these days (and did back then). I'd sooner the kids are smoking safer stuff and not risking getting sucked into the seedy underbelly of a plant the government decided it didn't want to tax decades ago. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:52 - Oct 11 with 3541 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:48 - Oct 11 by DanTheMan |
This mainly reads like a supply problem. You could avoid this by doing the work upfront, allowing manufacturers to produce before legalising sales.
At least that's how it reads anyway. |
Indeed. We'll have to see how it develops, once the supply chain is fully in the hands of super-massive pharma and food companies with huge advertising budgets rather than criminals. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:53 - Oct 11 with 3541 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:52 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
I'm getting more worried at how young dealers are getting. I knew no one in school who was selling regularly other than a couple of kids who would pick up for mates when they saw their dealer. Now it seems from speaking to people and seeing the news kids often have multiple full time dealers in school, many not even past GCSE age.
I believe in part it's because London is all taken so smaller dealers are venturing out the capital to find local kids to run their business there, and using the reputation of the big city to scare those already running out of city patches away (or getting them to buy in).
FWIW, I knew where I could buy weed when I was 13 (and I did). Most kids in school will know that I'd imagine these days (and did back then). I'd sooner the kids are smoking safer stuff and not risking getting sucked into the seedy underbelly of a plant the government decided it didn't want to tax decades ago. |
Sounds like your parents did a terrible job bringing you up. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:54 - Oct 11 with 3534 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:52 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
Indeed. We'll have to see how it develops, once the supply chain is fully in the hands of super-massive pharma and food companies with huge advertising budgets rather than criminals. |
I recommend watching Murder Mountain on Netflix if you want to see how Big Pharma is affecting current illegal growers and those trying to move into legit business in the face of big pharma. Interesting watch. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:55 - Oct 11 with 3528 views | footers |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:43 - Oct 11 by wkj |
The should stop vlogging and getting beef with each other, get a real job. |
Getting 'high' and spinning Logan Paul fidget spinners agen. We have failed our children. |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:56 - Oct 11 with 3531 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:53 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
Sounds like your parents did a terrible job bringing you up. |
Thanks for your fantastic contribution to an otherwise sensible thread. I remember why I div-listed you now.
What a vile f*cking thing to say. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:57 - Oct 11 with 3522 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:56 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
Thanks for your fantastic contribution to an otherwise sensible thread. I remember why I div-listed you now.
What a vile f*cking thing to say. |
If you were out seeing criminals buying weed and smoking it regularly, at 13 when your brain chemistry is very much developing, then it seems to me to be very uncontroversial to say your parents failed you at a time when you really needed them. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:58 - Oct 11 with 3514 views | StokieBlue |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:52 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
I'm getting more worried at how young dealers are getting. I knew no one in school who was selling regularly other than a couple of kids who would pick up for mates when they saw their dealer. Now it seems from speaking to people and seeing the news kids often have multiple full time dealers in school, many not even past GCSE age.
I believe in part it's because London is all taken so smaller dealers are venturing out the capital to find local kids to run their business there, and using the reputation of the big city to scare those already running out of city patches away (or getting them to buy in).
FWIW, I knew where I could buy weed when I was 13 (and I did). Most kids in school will know that I'd imagine these days (and did back then). I'd sooner the kids are smoking safer stuff and not risking getting sucked into the seedy underbelly of a plant the government decided it didn't want to tax decades ago. |
The last paragraph is certainly a good point, as I said in my post, they likely can get it anyway and you've given an anecdotal case of where this is true. Having regulated and clean sources would be far better. Hopefully they are aware of the possible damage to non-adults but I guess none of us really think about these things as kids.
I will say it's not a world I've been involved in so you're knowledge is far better than mine and happy to bow to your knowledge on dealers and suchlike.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:59 - Oct 11 with 3510 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Mildly but just confirms what I suspected - if the legal sources can’t offer a similar price, quality or fulfill the demand then they won’t work, which is why I noted an assumption that they could |  |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:02 - Oct 11 with 3498 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:57 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
If you were out seeing criminals buying weed and smoking it regularly, at 13 when your brain chemistry is very much developing, then it seems to me to be very uncontroversial to say your parents failed you at a time when you really needed them. |
I find it more offensive that someone who doesn't know the first thing about drugs, let alone my upbringing, would have a pop at my parents.
It's not your place to say. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:02 - Oct 11 with 3496 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:43 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
You could be right, but at this point what we've been doing for decades hasn't worked. People still buy drugs. Crime around drugs rages on. I'd be open to trying something different and then tackling any issues as they arise. |
No I agree, very much pro-legalisation pretty much for the reasons you listed (although Herbivore does make a reasonable point about the wider supply chain), I just don’t think it would solve the specific problem highlighted in the OP, unfortunately | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:03 - Oct 11 with 3488 views | wkj |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 11:55 - Oct 11 by footers |
Getting 'high' and spinning Logan Paul fidget spinners agen. We have failed our children. |
Tbf in a world full of broken homes and abandoned kids, Logan Paul and the sort is probably the only shot some kids have of having a role model. [Post edited 11 Oct 2019 12:03]
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:06 - Oct 11 with 3476 views | footers |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:03 - Oct 11 by wkj |
Tbf in a world full of broken homes and abandoned kids, Logan Paul and the sort is probably the only shot some kids have of having a role model. [Post edited 11 Oct 2019 12:03]
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Broken homes? Good time to get into the trades. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:08 - Oct 11 with 3467 views | wkj |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:06 - Oct 11 by footers |
Broken homes? Good time to get into the trades. |
You are right, you should see the state of my Kitchen right now. Half empty cups of tea, daily sports, broken bits of cupboard and dust sheets everywhere. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:10 - Oct 11 with 3463 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:02 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
I find it more offensive that someone who doesn't know the first thing about drugs, let alone my upbringing, would have a pop at my parents.
It's not your place to say. |
You use the benefit of your own experience to seek to impose your views on this topic on everyone else. I'll comment on what I want how I want. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:12 - Oct 11 with 3454 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:10 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
You use the benefit of your own experience to seek to impose your views on this topic on everyone else. I'll comment on what I want how I want. |
I do because it's something I have experience in. Whereas you're just making baseless assumptions based on what I've told you that add nothing to discussion.
Keep digging that hole though, you're coming across well. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:14 - Oct 11 with 3444 views | chicoazul |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:12 - Oct 11 by monytowbray |
I do because it's something I have experience in. Whereas you're just making baseless assumptions based on what I've told you that add nothing to discussion.
Keep digging that hole though, you're coming across well. |
If you were hanging out with drug dealers buying & smoking at 13 your parents failed you. This is not a terrible opinion. You were a child at 13. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:16 - Oct 11 with 3438 views | monytowbray |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:14 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
If you were hanging out with drug dealers buying & smoking at 13 your parents failed you. This is not a terrible opinion. You were a child at 13. |
There were more factors in play. I suggest you be more careful with your words.
You're being a d1ckhead frankly. | |
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| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:17 - Oct 11 with 3434 views | wkj |
| All these teenage stabbings in london on 12:14 - Oct 11 by chicoazul |
If you were hanging out with drug dealers buying & smoking at 13 your parents failed you. This is not a terrible opinion. You were a child at 13. |
I spent most of my life wishing my dad was around when I was 13, I guess I should be thankful really if a scenario like this was a possibility. | |
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