| NI only backstop 18:21 - Oct 15 with 4370 views | itfcjoe |
Does this not make NI the beat of both worlds, in the EU and in the UK?
A good place to do business and invest? |  |
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| NI only backstop on 19:51 - Oct 15 with 1424 views | Darth_Koont |
| NI only backstop on 19:32 - Oct 15 by xrayspecs |
DUP are in daily talks with No10 so will know what is on the table. Boris would not be agreeing to this option without knowing he has DUP support. DUP will have either warmed to the idea or have secured a settlement with No10 for their co-operation. |
You'd think so. But then again if the maneuvering around the blame game continues then perhaps this is Boris hanging the DUP out to dry and blaming them for the lack of a deal.
But, yes, it would be a massive about face by the DUP if they're now going along with it. Not to mention the vast majority of Conservatives who backed May when she said it was totally unacceptable. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 19:52 - Oct 15 with 1426 views | Guthrum |
| NI only backstop on 18:46 - Oct 15 by Swansea_Blue |
Is there any evidence the DUP have gone for it? My understanding is that whatever is agreed (if anything) in the talks with the EU today still has to be run by parliament. i.e. Boris is doing exactly the same thing May did and wil have the same problems getting it through Parliament - it won't be Brexity enough for the headbangers and the DUP will be against divergence from the UK. [Post edited 15 Oct 2019 18:48]
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I think quite a lot of MPs have been scared by the vision of hardline No Deal which loomed menacingly over proceedings in the last few months. Moreover, with the strong possibility of an imminent election, they are looking to the feelings of their constituents (particularly those in very Brexity areas).
The DUP and ERG could easily find themselves outflanked by a sizeable Labour rebellion (assuming Corbyn whips against - he may not). There's only about 40 or 50 of those first two combined, with several leading members now having ministerial briefs and thus compelled to vote with the Government. Assuming the Tory exiles also do, might only need a couple of dozen others to get through. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 21:38 - Oct 15 with 1364 views | vilanovablue |
Won't this essentially create a.hard border formed by the sea.potentially? Meaning checks will need to be carried out serving ports in Ireland? |  | | |
| NI only backstop on 23:08 - Oct 15 with 1332 views | The_Last_Baron |
| NI only backstop on 18:40 - Oct 15 by Darth_Koont |
Agreed. But getting the rump end of Brexit - not that Northern Ireland should have got it either - will no doubt push many waverers and perhaps even some soft unionist Remainers further towards independence. |
No chance. Unionists are unionists for a reason. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 09:08 - Oct 16 with 1276 views | Swansea_Blue |
| NI only backstop on 19:52 - Oct 15 by Guthrum |
I think quite a lot of MPs have been scared by the vision of hardline No Deal which loomed menacingly over proceedings in the last few months. Moreover, with the strong possibility of an imminent election, they are looking to the feelings of their constituents (particularly those in very Brexity areas).
The DUP and ERG could easily find themselves outflanked by a sizeable Labour rebellion (assuming Corbyn whips against - he may not). There's only about 40 or 50 of those first two combined, with several leading members now having ministerial briefs and thus compelled to vote with the Government. Assuming the Tory exiles also do, might only need a couple of dozen others to get through. |
I was wondering if some had possibly been jolted into reconsidering previous position, but it looks like people are continuing to hold their ground. DUP say 'no', headbangers in the Tories also not happy it seems. Of course, we'll have to see what that looks like in Westminster, but for now it looks like this 'new' deal is a non-starter.
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| NI only backstop on 09:42 - Oct 16 with 1260 views | Herbivore |
| NI only backstop on 23:08 - Oct 15 by The_Last_Baron |
No chance. Unionists are unionists for a reason. |
Although a majority of members of the Conservative and Unionist Party would be happy to see Scotland and Northern Ireland leave the Union if it meant getting Brexit done. So I don't think your point is all that valid. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 10:12 - Oct 16 with 1256 views | clive_baker |
All very well until ROI takes back control of those 6 counties, strengthens it's already long standing ties with USA and we're left rudderless. Not impossible that Scotland will gain independence and rejoin the EU. Meanwhile you've got England & Wales sat here pretending we're still relevant. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 10:17 - Oct 16 with 1250 views | chicoazul |
| NI only backstop on 10:12 - Oct 16 by clive_baker |
All very well until ROI takes back control of those 6 counties, strengthens it's already long standing ties with USA and we're left rudderless. Not impossible that Scotland will gain independence and rejoin the EU. Meanwhile you've got England & Wales sat here pretending we're still relevant. |
If that's what the majority of the population of those countries want, thats what they should do. and England is still relevant, very much so, especially to the people who live here. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 10:23 - Oct 16 with 1241 views | clive_baker |
| NI only backstop on 10:17 - Oct 16 by chicoazul |
If that's what the majority of the population of those countries want, thats what they should do. and England is still relevant, very much so, especially to the people who live here. |
I don't have an issue with Scotland / NI having a choice on independence or becoming a united Ireland, as you say if that's what the people want more power to them. I'm English, but of Scottish heritage and my wife is fully Irish, I'm often exposed to opinions on both sides of the fence and have sympathy for them. However as a somewhat selfish and proud Englishman, anything that might encourage foreign investment to NI is going to be less beneficial to me and my children as they grow up. | |
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| NI only backstop on 10:51 - Oct 16 with 1226 views | noggin |
| NI only backstop on 10:12 - Oct 16 by clive_baker |
All very well until ROI takes back control of those 6 counties, strengthens it's already long standing ties with USA and we're left rudderless. Not impossible that Scotland will gain independence and rejoin the EU. Meanwhile you've got England & Wales sat here pretending we're still relevant. |
I’m not sure the ROI wants the 6 counties. They’re more trouble than they’re worth. |  |
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| NI only backstop on 10:53 - Oct 16 with 1222 views | Darth_Koont |
| NI only backstop on 09:42 - Oct 16 by Herbivore |
Although a majority of members of the Conservative and Unionist Party would be happy to see Scotland and Northern Ireland leave the Union if it meant getting Brexit done. So I don't think your point is all that valid. |
Indeed.
Any anyway I did say "soft unionists" - even I fall into that category as someone who would like the Union to stay together. But not enough if it's punishing regions and its citizens if they're outside of the sphere of what's considered politically, socially and economically important.
And I think the EU Remain/Leave division will make it easier for a lot of Remainers to cross the divide they wouldn't cross back in 2014. Putting aside how Brexit has laid bare the inadequacy of our Westminster politics and media over the past few years, if independence is the only way for people to stay in the EU and retain its benefits and opportunities then that's a big draw for committed Remainers. | |
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| NI only backstop on 11:07 - Oct 16 with 1207 views | WeWereZombies |
| NI only backstop on 10:51 - Oct 16 by noggin |
I’m not sure the ROI wants the 6 counties. They’re more trouble than they’re worth. |
Ever been to Northern Ireland? |  |
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| NI only backstop on 13:18 - Oct 16 with 1171 views | noggin |
| NI only backstop on 11:07 - Oct 16 by WeWereZombies |
Ever been to Northern Ireland? |
Born there. Why? | |
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| NI only backstop on 13:22 - Oct 16 with 1160 views | WeWereZombies |
| NI only backstop on 13:18 - Oct 16 by noggin |
Born there. Why? |
It surprises me that you are so dismissive about a beautiful part of the World and 1.8 million people, that's all. | |
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| NI only backstop on 13:51 - Oct 16 with 1131 views | sparks |
| NI only backstop on 13:22 - Oct 16 by WeWereZombies |
It surprises me that you are so dismissive about a beautiful part of the World and 1.8 million people, that's all. |
He wasnt.
NI would clearly be a drain on the Republic and brings with it all manner of problems. |  |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| NI only backstop on 15:01 - Oct 16 with 1105 views | noggin |
| NI only backstop on 13:22 - Oct 16 by WeWereZombies |
It surprises me that you are so dismissive about a beautiful part of the World and 1.8 million people, that's all. |
The people of the ROI and the catholics of NI, of course,would love a united Ireland. However, if Ireland were united tomorrow, there would be bloodshed on a huge scale and I'm not sure the Irish people are really ready for that. | |
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| NI only backstop on 20:00 - Oct 16 with 1068 views | WeWereZombies |
| NI only backstop on 15:01 - Oct 16 by noggin |
The people of the ROI and the catholics of NI, of course,would love a united Ireland. However, if Ireland were united tomorrow, there would be bloodshed on a huge scale and I'm not sure the Irish people are really ready for that. |
Thanks for the answer (much more useful than someone answering on your behalf). And concerns about the demographic changes in the population of the six counties is probably underneath some of the unrest that has crept back into Northern Ireland. IF the Good Friday Agreement was a difficult balancing act then unification of the twenty six and the six counties would require a number of angels to dance in unison on the smallest of pin heads.
But unification is not the only thing on the table, there are Catholics who are keen on Northern Ireland remaining a country in it's own right. And Protestants learning Gaelic enthusiastically as w way of connecting with history and culture before the Battle of the Boyne. The violence and recent history is nerve wracking in the extreme and there are very deep social problems that stem from uneven distribution of wealth and entitlement. On the other hand it is refreshing to get treated in A&E and discover that health and social services are integrated, something that the rest of the United Kingdom has promised to do and never delivered. | |
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