| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him 10:23 - Nov 8 with 3537 views | ElderGrizzly |
Admitted he was fired and the others weren’t because they still had financial value to Derby
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:34 - Nov 8 with 3455 views | Oldsmoker |
I think Derby were always prepared to pay up Keoghs contract.
If you've been compensated in full according to the employment laws then no matter how unfair the dismissal you're not getting any more money and you're not getting your old job back either.
Those laws were brought in by the Tories under Thatcher and despite 13 years of a Labour government under Blair/Brown they weren't changed. |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:53 - Nov 8 with 3388 views | pointofblue |
I’m trying to think what my reaction would be if this was, say, Chambers, Downes and Norwood with the captain in the Keogh role. I would feel very uncomfortable if he was sacked and the other two kept on even though he was the only one who hadn’t broken the law by drink-driving.
We have held drink-drivers to contract before, wasn’t that why Gary Croft has his tag? Indeed I think the clubs have sacked drink-drivers is when there has been a fatality because of it. But the whole Keogh situation just smacks of putting money above everything else. |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:55 - Nov 8 with 3367 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:34 - Nov 8 by Oldsmoker |
I think Derby were always prepared to pay up Keoghs contract.
If you've been compensated in full according to the employment laws then no matter how unfair the dismissal you're not getting any more money and you're not getting your old job back either.
Those laws were brought in by the Tories under Thatcher and despite 13 years of a Labour government under Blair/Brown they weren't changed. |
They offered him 10% of his contract apparently | | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:03 - Nov 8 with 3326 views | Oldsmoker |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:55 - Nov 8 by ElderGrizzly |
They offered him 10% of his contract apparently |
That won't do if that's the offer.
If you want it to be settled then pay the whole contract up.
You cannot single out one person especially if their role was minor compared to the others - that is discrimination.
Derby need to settle in full because they won't win this and it will drag on, making the club look foolish only for them to pay up in the end. | |
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| The difference is that.... on 11:08 - Nov 8 with 3288 views | Bloots |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 10:53 - Nov 8 by pointofblue |
I’m trying to think what my reaction would be if this was, say, Chambers, Downes and Norwood with the captain in the Keogh role. I would feel very uncomfortable if he was sacked and the other two kept on even though he was the only one who hadn’t broken the law by drink-driving.
We have held drink-drivers to contract before, wasn’t that why Gary Croft has his tag? Indeed I think the clubs have sacked drink-drivers is when there has been a fatality because of it. But the whole Keogh situation just smacks of putting money above everything else. |
....Keogh is a massive turd and everyone hates him. |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 with 3298 views | Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |  | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:18 - Nov 8 with 3251 views | itfc48 |
A few people on Twitter reckon it's an FFP ploy as legal costs don't count towards FFP.
Regarding the point he made about players potentially getting sacked deliberately then moving on a free, surely he could sack them but keep hold of their registration for the period of the original contract? I think I recall a case like this in the past. | | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:32 - Nov 8 with 3176 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:18 - Nov 8 by itfc48 |
A few people on Twitter reckon it's an FFP ploy as legal costs don't count towards FFP.
Regarding the point he made about players potentially getting sacked deliberately then moving on a free, surely he could sack them but keep hold of their registration for the period of the original contract? I think I recall a case like this in the past. |
Mel Morris finding ways round FFP? Surely not..
Can’t see Keoghs contract being a deciding factor in any FFP issues they have. They’ll be overspent more than Keogh’s contract value | | | |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:33 - Nov 8 with 3168 views | pointofblue |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:32 - Nov 8 by ElderGrizzly |
Mel Morris finding ways round FFP? Surely not..
Can’t see Keoghs contract being a deciding factor in any FFP issues they have. They’ll be overspent more than Keogh’s contract value |
It’s the Tescos approach - every little helps. | |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:42 - Nov 8 with 3131 views | poppiesman |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 by Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |
Very good point. It irrelevant about the other two. Keogh's actions deserved the sack.
Plus the other two players actions didn't get them injured and not fit for work for 12 months, where as Keogh's did.
If I had a drunken night out and it meant I was off work sick for 12 months, I would expect the sack too. | | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:46 - Nov 8 with 3110 views | pointofblue |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:42 - Nov 8 by poppiesman |
Very good point. It irrelevant about the other two. Keogh's actions deserved the sack.
Plus the other two players actions didn't get them injured and not fit for work for 12 months, where as Keogh's did.
If I had a drunken night out and it meant I was off work sick for 12 months, I would expect the sack too. |
Though the other two players broke the law, which Keogh didn’t. | |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:34 - Nov 8 with 2927 views | itfcjoe |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:33 - Nov 8 by pointofblue |
It’s the Tescos approach - every little helps. |
It could easily be £1.5m saved against FFP if this is what is happening - that's not small change |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:45 - Nov 8 with 2877 views | poppiesman |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:46 - Nov 8 by pointofblue |
Though the other two players broke the law, which Keogh didn’t. |
But it didn't affect them playing and working for their employer.
Doesn't make what they did ok, but from an employers point of view, why sack them? | | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:47 - Nov 8 with 2876 views | Eireannach_gorm |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 by Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |
I think you will find that as his treatment was different to the two others involved it will be quite easy to prove in court that it was an unfair dismissal. It is quite obvious that Keogh is not an asset while the other two are and that is the reason for his sacking. [Post edited 8 Nov 2019 13:27]
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:56 - Nov 8 with 2827 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 by Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |
Even if all three were sacked, Keogh's would be the most 'unfair' of the lot. | | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 13:06 - Nov 8 with 2787 views | SWGF |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:03 - Nov 8 by Oldsmoker |
That won't do if that's the offer.
If you want it to be settled then pay the whole contract up.
You cannot single out one person especially if their role was minor compared to the others - that is discrimination.
Derby need to settle in full because they won't win this and it will drag on, making the club look foolish only for them to pay up in the end. |
Depends how it's all worded in his contract. Would imagine there's a very strong case of "bringing the club into disrepute" etc, and he was club captain whereas the others weren't. |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 13:24 - Nov 8 with 2693 views | monty_radio |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:34 - Nov 8 by itfcjoe |
It could easily be £1.5m saved against FFP if this is what is happening - that's not small change |
Agreed - though this is Derby's pockets we're talking about, not Town's. | |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 14:27 - Nov 8 with 2548 views | factual_blue |
So it's because they could sign for a rival club in January and profit from it.
The simple answer would be for the FA to revoke registrations of players sacked for gross misconduct for a period, preventing them from playing for any club. |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 15:06 - Nov 8 with 2441 views | Churchman |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 by Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |
You are right, but there is still something disgusting about it for me. If I was a Derby fan I wouldn’t be comfortable with it and indeed some of them aren’t. But most are which tells us what we already know about the game. Money 1st 2nd 3rd. |  | | |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 18:19 - Nov 8 with 2224 views | Oldsmoker |
| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 11:08 - Nov 8 by Roberds |
Think they were well within their rights to sack Keogh, his actions amounted to gross misconduct.
They were also within their rights to sack Lawrence and Bennett, but chose not to. That's their prerogative and the reasons were obvious even without Morris spelling it out here.
Just because they chose not to sack the other two doesn't make Keogh's sacking unfair. |
Lets refer to the most famous Club v Player disagreement.
Jean-Marc Bosman v RFC Liege.
The ruling now known as the Bosman Ruling was made by the European Court of Justice.
It overruled the laws of the Belgian FA.
It overruled the contract between the player and RFC Liege.
It completely ignored the opinions of a lower league football club forum based in the East of England.
It's all about english and european law - not opinions. | |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 08:53 - Nov 9 with 1905 views | backinbeige |
There has been a lot of talk about how certain players broke the law, certain players should be dropped and certain players have been sacked. What have been their legal consequences for breaking the law? That hasn’t been discussed as much? |  |
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| Mel Morris just won Richard Keogh’s unfair dismissal case for him on 12:37 - Nov 9 with 1753 views | backinbeige |
Its Nottm Forest v Derby on Sky at the moment, the current chant going round the ground:
He should be in jail
He should be in jail
Tom Lawrence
He should be in jail
I don't necessarily agree with that - he should receive the correct punishment for his offence, not an unnecessarily increased one. But I can't help but think we're focusing a lot on the football side of this (who should/shouldn't be sacked, when someone should be allowed to return to their national team) and not the human side. | |
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