| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... 12:56 - Dec 3 with 5444 views | monytowbray |
I beg you to watch this and tell me why you’re still going to do so.
https://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/on-demand/68553-001
This is a serious request.
Watch it and tell me why you still feel justified in your actions. I am genuinely curious. I want to know what makes 1 in 3 children living that way okay with you. Tell me what makes you happy about the fact the current regime believes the people in this documentary are lazy and have no one to blame but themselves. Tell me these people have the same opportunities everyone in this country have and they’re simply not taking advantage of them because they want the moon on a stick.
Thank you. [Post edited 3 Dec 2019 12:57]
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:08 - Dec 3 with 835 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 19:34 - Dec 3 by Nthsuffolkblue |
As much dread as the idea that the Islamophobic, racist Johnson and his mates can continue their austerity agenda against the poor? |
I’m not voting Tory either. |  |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:09 - Dec 3 with 821 views | jaykay |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 18:01 - Dec 3 by jeera |
Explain why.
500 words:
Go! |
because some bloke down the pub said he a commie or something like that.
oh dear thats not 500 words. |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:17 - Dec 3 with 813 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 19:36 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
Why do you keep asking people who list their issues with Labour to watch the video? If the video does not address their issues with Labour, how will it make any difference?, it will just waste their time. |
“I didn’t watch the video but...”
You’ve pulled a blinder with that ‘context’ post by the way. Probably best to log off and go do something else for a bit. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:28 - Dec 3 with 797 views | J2BLUE |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:17 - Dec 3 by monytowbray |
“I didn’t watch the video but...”
You’ve pulled a blinder with that ‘context’ post by the way. Probably best to log off and go do something else for a bit. |
I hate this new way of debating where people ask a question and then demand the answer is based on exactly what they want; any other stuff mentioned is dismissed because it isn't in that narrow area and perfectly acceptable answers of how people can vote Tory are ignored because people are refusing to play your game. You know that people can't watch that video and justify it which to you is conclusive proof that voting Tory is wrong but this is much more complex than the GCSE style question you are asking. People are giving you answers based on the bigger picture and you're dismissing them because you don't like the content.
Labout fans on here have spent weeks telling people to vote Labour because the Tories are worse. For most people it is a balancing act between the two parties and people consider issues much wider than the single issue you present. People could easily find a similar point about Labour and ask a similar question but they would be laughed off the board.
*waits to be mocked by people posting 'there are good people on both sides' and similar* |  |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:31 - Dec 3 with 788 views | Trequartista |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:17 - Dec 3 by monytowbray |
“I didn’t watch the video but...”
You’ve pulled a blinder with that ‘context’ post by the way. Probably best to log off and go do something else for a bit. |
So you have no argument at all against what i said and just reverted to “I didn’t watch the video but...” as some kind of trump card, before reverting to an ad hominem attack. And you wonder why people get frustrated with you! [Post edited 3 Dec 2019 20:32]
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:31 - Dec 3 with 785 views | footers |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:28 - Dec 3 by J2BLUE |
I hate this new way of debating where people ask a question and then demand the answer is based on exactly what they want; any other stuff mentioned is dismissed because it isn't in that narrow area and perfectly acceptable answers of how people can vote Tory are ignored because people are refusing to play your game. You know that people can't watch that video and justify it which to you is conclusive proof that voting Tory is wrong but this is much more complex than the GCSE style question you are asking. People are giving you answers based on the bigger picture and you're dismissing them because you don't like the content.
Labout fans on here have spent weeks telling people to vote Labour because the Tories are worse. For most people it is a balancing act between the two parties and people consider issues much wider than the single issue you present. People could easily find a similar point about Labour and ask a similar question but they would be laughed off the board.
*waits to be mocked by people posting 'there are good people on both sides' and similar* |
Who are you and what have you done with the real J2?
Very good post, buh. |  |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:32 - Dec 3 with 780 views | BlueForYou |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 19:30 - Dec 3 by GlasgowBlue |
I'm a lifelong right of centre Tory voter but even I concede that the pendulum has swung too far to the right and this current incarnation of the Tory government is completely morally bankrupt and not deserving of votes from decent people.
The country needs a complete change of direction and if somebody like Kier Starmer or Hillary Benn was the leader of the opposition they would even have my vote.
But regardless of some of the aims of Corbyn to create a fairer society, his support of all manner of vile terror groups, his associations with antisemites, blood libelers and holocaust deniers, his lack of will to tackle the antisemtism crisis in the Labour party and his record of backing all things "anti west" precludes me from voting Labour.
The idea of people like John McDonnell, Jeremy Corbyn, Andy Murray, Seumus Milne, Diane Abbott, Len McCluskey and those lesser-known trots working with them getting anywhere near to grabbing control of Ten Downing Street, the Treasury, the Home Office, the Ministry of Defence, of Culture, of the Environment, MI6, MI5 and every other part of government and administration that you care to think about fills me with absolute dread. |
Very well said! |  | | |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:34 - Dec 3 with 777 views | footers |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:02 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
Is he Islamophobic and racist though? He used racist and islamophobic language that is clear. The context of the watermelon smiles/piccaninny comments has certainly been ignored by those that shout 'context' the most. |
Is there a particular reason you're always so keen to jump to the defence of bigots?
Place your bets now. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:37 - Dec 3 with 766 views | Warkystache |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:17 - Dec 3 by monytowbray |
“I didn’t watch the video but...”
You’ve pulled a blinder with that ‘context’ post by the way. Probably best to log off and go do something else for a bit. |
I hate the way that people are somehow made to feel stupid, or insensitive, or morally wrong by voting how they wish. I appreciate it's probably not your intention to do this.
I vote for who is best placed to serve me. Call me selfish, and I appreciate there are people out there who have it extremely hard in this country, often through no fault of their own, but I'm not one of them. I haven't chosen to have kids; I've always worked despite long-term health issues that would perfectly entitle me to a life on UC/ESA/PIP. I don't see myself as unwell.
I'm nothing special. There are far, far worse off people than me out there. There are also people in power who I wish would just b*gger off gracefully. I voted to remain in the EU, but I understand why people wanted out. I just think this continual baiting of folk for some personal political moral high ground is getting a bit dull, tbh. Not all of those who are long-term unemployed and in so-called 'poverty' are entirely blameless for their situation. But then neither are they to blame. It needs someone prepared to offer support and help those who want to help themselves. Not some victim culture. |  |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 with 760 views | Herbivore |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:34 - Dec 3 by footers |
Is there a particular reason you're always so keen to jump to the defence of bigots?
Place your bets now. |
Look, he just doesn't like the idea that just because you repeatedly say racist things it means you're a racist, alright? |  |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 with 756 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:34 - Dec 3 by footers |
Is there a particular reason you're always so keen to jump to the defence of bigots?
Place your bets now. |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 with 756 views | Trequartista |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:34 - Dec 3 by footers |
Is there a particular reason you're always so keen to jump to the defence of bigots?
Place your bets now. |
I'm very interested in the truth. On occasion that may not align with those who have ultra-pc principles but i'm not afraid to offend them. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:40 - Dec 3 with 753 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:28 - Dec 3 by J2BLUE |
I hate this new way of debating where people ask a question and then demand the answer is based on exactly what they want; any other stuff mentioned is dismissed because it isn't in that narrow area and perfectly acceptable answers of how people can vote Tory are ignored because people are refusing to play your game. You know that people can't watch that video and justify it which to you is conclusive proof that voting Tory is wrong but this is much more complex than the GCSE style question you are asking. People are giving you answers based on the bigger picture and you're dismissing them because you don't like the content.
Labout fans on here have spent weeks telling people to vote Labour because the Tories are worse. For most people it is a balancing act between the two parties and people consider issues much wider than the single issue you present. People could easily find a similar point about Labour and ask a similar question but they would be laughed off the board.
*waits to be mocked by people posting 'there are good people on both sides' and similar* |
I think “look at this evidence and tell me why you disagree” is a perfectly valid point to make. What’s weirder and more unhealthy is people who refuse to base their opinions on evidence. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:41 - Dec 3 with 746 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:31 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
So you have no argument at all against what i said and just reverted to “I didn’t watch the video but...” as some kind of trump card, before reverting to an ad hominem attack. And you wonder why people get frustrated with you! [Post edited 3 Dec 2019 20:32]
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Me: can you do this and then validate your views please?
You: No but here’s my opinion without doing so.
See where the real issue is?
What’s more Trump-like is dismissing actual racism and homophobia as “context”. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:43 - Dec 3 with 741 views | footers |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 by GlasgowBlue |
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Hey, remember when you were standing and voting for a party infected by racism and pro-apartheid sentiment but couldn't see it for more than two decades? That's my favourite Friends episode :) | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:44 - Dec 3 with 741 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:37 - Dec 3 by Warkystache |
I hate the way that people are somehow made to feel stupid, or insensitive, or morally wrong by voting how they wish. I appreciate it's probably not your intention to do this.
I vote for who is best placed to serve me. Call me selfish, and I appreciate there are people out there who have it extremely hard in this country, often through no fault of their own, but I'm not one of them. I haven't chosen to have kids; I've always worked despite long-term health issues that would perfectly entitle me to a life on UC/ESA/PIP. I don't see myself as unwell.
I'm nothing special. There are far, far worse off people than me out there. There are also people in power who I wish would just b*gger off gracefully. I voted to remain in the EU, but I understand why people wanted out. I just think this continual baiting of folk for some personal political moral high ground is getting a bit dull, tbh. Not all of those who are long-term unemployed and in so-called 'poverty' are entirely blameless for their situation. But then neither are they to blame. It needs someone prepared to offer support and help those who want to help themselves. Not some victim culture. |
I’m baffled to see how the post is unreasonable to be honest. I’ve justified and explained why I posted it on page 2.
I think you’ve been more honest here than a lot of the deflective answers though. There’s no right or wrong answer, despite a few people thinking IT’S A TRAP or something. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:45 - Dec 3 with 739 views | Trequartista |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 by Herbivore |
Look, he just doesn't like the idea that just because you repeatedly say racist things it means you're a racist, alright? |
I wouldn't say repeatedly. The same 3 phrases have been repeatedly trotted out, is more accurate. If you read more carefully i don't defend the use of the language, nor do i say Mr Johnson is not a racist. I merely pose the question is he racist, just because he has used that language in that context. I'm sure i used what would be deemed racist language when i was younger but i wasn't and will never be racist, in my humble opinion. I don't see why we should shut down the debate. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:45 - Dec 3 with 737 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
I'm very interested in the truth. On occasion that may not align with those who have ultra-pc principles but i'm not afraid to offend them. |
And what is the truth behind Johnson calling PoC “Piccaninnies with watermelon smiles” exactly? BANTZ?
Furthermore, what’s the context behind him refusing to apologise for it?
Am I missing something here? [Post edited 3 Dec 2019 20:47]
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:46 - Dec 3 with 737 views | footers |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:39 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
I'm very interested in the truth. On occasion that may not align with those who have ultra-pc principles but i'm not afraid to offend them. |
Why not come to London some weekend soon and test these ultra-PC principles by calling some young black lads 'picanninies with watermelon smiles' - see if they reckon it's racist :) | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:50 - Dec 3 with 722 views | monytowbray |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:46 - Dec 3 by footers |
Why not come to London some weekend soon and test these ultra-PC principles by calling some young black lads 'picanninies with watermelon smiles' - see if they reckon it's racist :) |
Iggy Pop once used the term “P*ki shop” in a Reading Fest interview in regards to how he was enjoying his time in the UK. He assumed it was just localised stuff amongst words like “crumpet” and “dog and bone”. That’s when context matters.
The fact Johnson’s best reply to the matter is “well I’ve said loads of offensive stuff before so I’m not apologising” is all the context you need there. YOU ULTRA LEFTY PC C0CKWOMBLE. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:51 - Dec 3 with 716 views | Herbivore |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:45 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
I wouldn't say repeatedly. The same 3 phrases have been repeatedly trotted out, is more accurate. If you read more carefully i don't defend the use of the language, nor do i say Mr Johnson is not a racist. I merely pose the question is he racist, just because he has used that language in that context. I'm sure i used what would be deemed racist language when i was younger but i wasn't and will never be racist, in my humble opinion. I don't see why we should shut down the debate. |
It's not the same three phrases, there are several examples of racist and Islamaphobic language being used by him. And not when he was a teenager messing about on twitter either. You can question whether that makes him racist/Islamaphobic if you like, to me it seems fairly clear cut. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:57 - Dec 3 with 697 views | Trequartista |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:41 - Dec 3 by monytowbray |
Me: can you do this and then validate your views please?
You: No but here’s my opinion without doing so.
See where the real issue is?
What’s more Trump-like is dismissing actual racism and homophobia as “context”. |
I didn't give any opinion, i was questioning your responses to others, and you have thus far not addressed this. It's all there in black and white.
The context of those terms in an written article, was how, in Johnson's opinion, Tony Blair saw these people. Before the cavalry come charging back in with their arrows, I am not defending Johnson, or the language used, I am making a point of an example where context can be ignored or claimed depending on whether it is convenient for the argument being made. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:59 - Dec 3 with 690 views | J2BLUE |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:40 - Dec 3 by monytowbray |
I think “look at this evidence and tell me why you disagree” is a perfectly valid point to make. What’s weirder and more unhealthy is people who refuse to base their opinions on evidence. |
On one issue where you know the only answer decent people will have is to agree with you? As I said, this isn't a question on an exam paper. It's one issue within a much wider debate. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 21:01 - Dec 3 with 686 views | Trequartista |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 20:46 - Dec 3 by footers |
Why not come to London some weekend soon and test these ultra-PC principles by calling some young black lads 'picanninies with watermelon smiles' - see if they reckon it's racist :) |
So you have deduced from me saying "I don't defend the use of that language" that i would be someone who would go around using that language. Hmmmm. | |
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| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 21:08 - Dec 3 with 661 views | wkj |
| Tories of TWTD or those refusing to tactically vote this election.... on 21:01 - Dec 3 by Trequartista |
So you have deduced from me saying "I don't defend the use of that language" that i would be someone who would go around using that language. Hmmmm. |
Is defending those who use it really all that different? I don't think it really is. |  |
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