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Robson's win percentage when he came in. 09:37 - Jan 6 with 3349 viewsCheltenham_Blue

In each of Sir Bobby's full seasons after being made Ipswich manager -

1969/70 - 24%
1970/71 - 28%
1971/72 - 27%
1972/73 - 41%
1973/74 - 47%

Now I'm not saying Lambert is doing things right, nor am I saying he's the next Bobby Robson, far from it. But what I am saying is that under our current fan base, Robson would have gone sometime around Christmas 1970, and maybe we wouldn't be talking about our 'proud history' now.

Maybe we give Lambert a bit of time to get it right? Me included.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:39 - Jan 6 with 2858 viewsdavblue

Having not been around at that time, could you see what Robson was trying to do though?

That's my big problem with Lambert im no nearer knowing and neither are the team by the looks of things. If you could see what he was trying to do then i would be behind him.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:40 - Jan 6 with 2842 viewsMrTown

Too sensible for this forum.

I do agree entirely though, things are far from rosey right now, but lets stick with it until the end of the season at least.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:41 - Jan 6 with 2844 viewsBlueBadger

Sir Bobby was an inexperienced manager with 36 games under his belt when he started here. Lambert had over 500 to his name when he started here. I don't think it's unfair to be expecting better than he's delivered so far, particularly given the inexplicable level of support he's been afforded by the owner.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:42 - Jan 6 with 2838 viewsthebooks

We were a top-tier team at the time: the opposition was relatively a lot better. Now... we're not.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:43 - Jan 6 with 2821 viewsSwansea_Blue

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:41 - Jan 6 by BlueBadger

Sir Bobby was an inexperienced manager with 36 games under his belt when he started here. Lambert had over 500 to his name when he started here. I don't think it's unfair to be expecting better than he's delivered so far, particularly given the inexplicable level of support he's been afforded by the owner.


Maybe he's a late developer?

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:43 - Jan 6 with 2823 viewsCheltenham_Blue

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:42 - Jan 6 by thebooks

We were a top-tier team at the time: the opposition was relatively a lot better. Now... we're not.


And we were relatively a lot better too....

Poll: Smooth Mash or Mash with Lumps?

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:48 - Jan 6 with 2777 viewsCheltenham_Blue

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:41 - Jan 6 by BlueBadger

Sir Bobby was an inexperienced manager with 36 games under his belt when he started here. Lambert had over 500 to his name when he started here. I don't think it's unfair to be expecting better than he's delivered so far, particularly given the inexplicable level of support he's been afforded by the owner.


Absolutely you're right. But we've just suffered the shock of relegation. This isn't the greatest team in the world, it really isn't.

But if another team sacked its manager at this stage of the season, when in 4th, most fans would be shocked at the decision that team has taken. Lets just get behind him until the end of the season. I am sure that his contract includes a non-promotion clause anyway.

Waiting til the end of the season will save a lot of us an aneurism.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:49 - Jan 6 with 2776 viewsitfcjoe

Without being around to know the exact situation, were we not punching above our weight merely being in the top tier in the early 70s?

As opposed to being basically the biggest club in the league (Sunderland aside) and the favourites to win it?

Do historic bookies odds of those seasons exist? How was Robson doing in comparison to expectation?

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:52 - Jan 6 with 2756 viewsGuthrum

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:41 - Jan 6 by BlueBadger

Sir Bobby was an inexperienced manager with 36 games under his belt when he started here. Lambert had over 500 to his name when he started here. I don't think it's unfair to be expecting better than he's delivered so far, particularly given the inexplicable level of support he's been afforded by the owner.


OTOH, for this season so far (Lambert has yet to have a full one with ITFC), the League win rate stands at 43.5%, even despite the extended poor run.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:54 - Jan 6 with 2738 viewsPJH

I know that you are talking about full seasons but the 16 games that Bobby Robson had when he first arrived in January 1969 resulted in 7 wins, 6 draws and 3 defeats-a win percentage of 43.75%.

If PL had had a similar start on his arrival last season we would not be in the third division now.

It is true that his record in those first three full seasons would have cost him his job at a lot of clubs but if only PL had started like SBR did.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:08 - Jan 6 with 2690 viewsPJH

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:49 - Jan 6 by itfcjoe

Without being around to know the exact situation, were we not punching above our weight merely being in the top tier in the early 70s?

As opposed to being basically the biggest club in the league (Sunderland aside) and the favourites to win it?

Do historic bookies odds of those seasons exist? How was Robson doing in comparison to expectation?


We had returned to the top flight at the end of 1967/68 and Bill McGarry left for Wolves in November 1968. It took until January to appoint Bobby Robson because at least one person (Frank O'F arrell) turned the job down and one more (Billy Bingham) had an interview arranged but chose to stay at Plymouth.
There were others considered before it got as far as interviewing Bobby Robson but it seems unclear as to whether anyone else other than O'Farrell had actually been offered the job.

Although we were a pretty good team we were one of the weaker teams in the top division and that good start when Bobby arrived enabled us to finish 12th(out of 22) in 1968/69.

In 1969/70 and 1970/71 we were in relegation battles and survived by 5pts and 7pts respectively with it being 2pts for a win.

1971/72 was more comfortable finishing 13th and 13pts clear.

Despite the unspectacular win percentage in 1972/73 we finished 4th-so not too bad-and 4th again in 1973/74.

Initially the best that could realistically be hoped for was survival and that was achieved with varying degrees of difficulty.

I would say that we were a club that deserved to be in the top division as opposed to the second division in those early years, but only just.
[Post edited 6 Jan 2020 10:22]
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:19 - Jan 6 with 2661 viewsElephantintheRoom

As someone who was there at the time I offer a few observations.

The 'fan base' back then - ie a small minority who like to make themselves heard did indeed want Robson out.

Robson was an inexperienced manager in the top division with a plan. I and most supporters were delighted with survival and young players coming into the team.... survival in the top division was a big success irrespective of fatuous and meaningless 'win %' ...Lambo is an experienced manager seemingly without a plan at present - has taken Town into the THIRD division and seems at home here.

Robson had the full backing of John Cobbold, who every Town fan admired - and was know throughout football as an outstanding club chairman. I'm not sure anybody anywhere admires Evans - who has shown himself consistently inept at club stewardship

Having said all that I think if you leave any manager in charge for 5 years things will improve by serendipity... and that is probably the sum total of Evans' expectations.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:21 - Jan 6 with 2637 viewsitfcjoe

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:08 - Jan 6 by PJH

We had returned to the top flight at the end of 1967/68 and Bill McGarry left for Wolves in November 1968. It took until January to appoint Bobby Robson because at least one person (Frank O'F arrell) turned the job down and one more (Billy Bingham) had an interview arranged but chose to stay at Plymouth.
There were others considered before it got as far as interviewing Bobby Robson but it seems unclear as to whether anyone else other than O'Farrell had actually been offered the job.

Although we were a pretty good team we were one of the weaker teams in the top division and that good start when Bobby arrived enabled us to finish 12th(out of 22) in 1968/69.

In 1969/70 and 1970/71 we were in relegation battles and survived by 5pts and 7pts respectively with it being 2pts for a win.

1971/72 was more comfortable finishing 13th and 13pts clear.

Despite the unspectacular win percentage in 1972/73 we finished 4th-so not too bad-and 4th again in 1973/74.

Initially the best that could realistically be hoped for was survival and that was achieved with varying degrees of difficulty.

I would say that we were a club that deserved to be in the top division as opposed to the second division in those early years, but only just.
[Post edited 6 Jan 2020 10:22]


So Robson basically exceeded expectations in year 1, and then kept us up relatively comfortably (meeting expectations) in years 2 and 3 before really kicking on

If we were still in the second tier,, and like under Hurst at start of last year, I wouldn't have expected anything more than keeping us up with a little degree of comfort.

But in the 3rd tier, and with the start we had, which has made a rod for his own back in a way, coupled with the total capitulation last season then he needs to do better. And he needs to be looking to build something which I worry he isn't at the moment.

If he heeds his advice from here:
One of them, the then Bayer Leverkusen manager, Roger Schmidt, asked him why he had frequently changed system as Villa slid down the table. “I was just trying to get a result,” Lambert told his friend. “You’ll confuse the players,” Schmidt told him. “I’d been confusing myself with the systems. Back three, four, five, two in the middle, three, couldn’t get the result,” Lambert says. “He was right. I decided I wasn’t going to waver from that advice.”

THen we'll be ok - no excuses, no cups, streamline the squad and get on with it

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:24 - Jan 6 with 2610 viewsElephantintheRoom

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:08 - Jan 6 by PJH

We had returned to the top flight at the end of 1967/68 and Bill McGarry left for Wolves in November 1968. It took until January to appoint Bobby Robson because at least one person (Frank O'F arrell) turned the job down and one more (Billy Bingham) had an interview arranged but chose to stay at Plymouth.
There were others considered before it got as far as interviewing Bobby Robson but it seems unclear as to whether anyone else other than O'Farrell had actually been offered the job.

Although we were a pretty good team we were one of the weaker teams in the top division and that good start when Bobby arrived enabled us to finish 12th(out of 22) in 1968/69.

In 1969/70 and 1970/71 we were in relegation battles and survived by 5pts and 7pts respectively with it being 2pts for a win.

1971/72 was more comfortable finishing 13th and 13pts clear.

Despite the unspectacular win percentage in 1972/73 we finished 4th-so not too bad-and 4th again in 1973/74.

Initially the best that could realistically be hoped for was survival and that was achieved with varying degrees of difficulty.

I would say that we were a club that deserved to be in the top division as opposed to the second division in those early years, but only just.
[Post edited 6 Jan 2020 10:22]


According to John Cobbold, who should know Billy Bingham was offered the job twice - and Cobbold even rang him to get him to change his mind... essentially a third job offer. Robson wasn't wanted by Cobbold - but to his credit he stuck with him, having effectively appointed him as a last resort.

The fact that O'Farrel left Torquay to go to Leicester City - and then Man United - and Bingham was shortly to become Evertob manager shows that both managers were right in their decisions.... as ultimately was Cobbold.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:30 - Jan 6 with 2596 viewspatrickswell

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:21 - Jan 6 by itfcjoe

So Robson basically exceeded expectations in year 1, and then kept us up relatively comfortably (meeting expectations) in years 2 and 3 before really kicking on

If we were still in the second tier,, and like under Hurst at start of last year, I wouldn't have expected anything more than keeping us up with a little degree of comfort.

But in the 3rd tier, and with the start we had, which has made a rod for his own back in a way, coupled with the total capitulation last season then he needs to do better. And he needs to be looking to build something which I worry he isn't at the moment.

If he heeds his advice from here:
One of them, the then Bayer Leverkusen manager, Roger Schmidt, asked him why he had frequently changed system as Villa slid down the table. “I was just trying to get a result,” Lambert told his friend. “You’ll confuse the players,” Schmidt told him. “I’d been confusing myself with the systems. Back three, four, five, two in the middle, three, couldn’t get the result,” Lambert says. “He was right. I decided I wasn’t going to waver from that advice.”

THen we'll be ok - no excuses, no cups, streamline the squad and get on with it


The quotes are interesting. Just how much do managers really learn from their mistakes? I remember Jewell saying he had used the time between Derby and Ipswich to reflect on what he had done wrong. He then proceeded to repeat his mistakes here.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:30 - Jan 6 with 2592 viewsPJH

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 10:24 - Jan 6 by ElephantintheRoom

According to John Cobbold, who should know Billy Bingham was offered the job twice - and Cobbold even rang him to get him to change his mind... essentially a third job offer. Robson wasn't wanted by Cobbold - but to his credit he stuck with him, having effectively appointed him as a last resort.

The fact that O'Farrel left Torquay to go to Leicester City - and then Man United - and Bingham was shortly to become Evertob manager shows that both managers were right in their decisions.... as ultimately was Cobbold.


O'Farrell was ultimately right although Leiceester actually finished bottom in 1968/69 and were losing F.A. Cup Finalist's.

I agree that Bobby Robson got the job by default.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 11:49 - Jan 6 with 2508 viewsOxford_Blue

Difference is Robson was in the top tier, not the third tier.

Also he was given a brief to build a team.

Lambert needs to get us up and do it quick.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 14:12 - Jan 6 with 2375 viewssotd78

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:39 - Jan 6 by davblue

Having not been around at that time, could you see what Robson was trying to do though?

That's my big problem with Lambert im no nearer knowing and neither are the team by the looks of things. If you could see what he was trying to do then i would be behind him.


Robson was subject to a lot of North Stand "Robson Out" chants - same as now really - a vocal few who didn't see the whole picture and weren't informed enough to know the shenagins behind the scenes with Baxter and Caroll.
A wise Chairman did know and gave Robson time. In many ways Evans also gives his managers time. Perhaps there's a bigger picture here - like the top to toe transformation of a club that went very stale. McCarthy himself would say he had no interest in the running of the club - just keeping us in the Championship was his brief. We have festered away under the penny-pinching of various Chief Executives.

In Robson's days of course we had only 12 players on matchday; one substitute only. None of the tactical demands of today; keeping 24 players happy, pleasing the loanee club whilst trying to win matches. Being under 24/7 social media spotlight etc etc.

Robson built several teams - each got better - building on a system. The first one had Best, Hunter, Morris and Belfitt and a brilliant winger in Robertson.
The second had players like Noddy Talbot who we sold and bought two wizard Dutchmen and had some spare change left over.

There's no comparison for PL with SBR. But we do have at present a manager who seems to have invested his soul in us; we at least should do the decent thing and give him the same time we gave Bobby Robson?

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 14:21 - Jan 6 with 2357 viewsOsborneOneNil

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 09:40 - Jan 6 by MrTown

Too sensible for this forum.

I do agree entirely though, things are far from rosey right now, but lets stick with it until the end of the season at least.


Agreed, but, why the new deal now? By all means back the man, but maybe wait a bit before dishing out 5 years.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 16:31 - Jan 6 with 2236 viewsCheltenham_Blue

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 14:21 - Jan 6 by OsborneOneNil

Agreed, but, why the new deal now? By all means back the man, but maybe wait a bit before dishing out 5 years.


As has been said perviously, I think it's safe to assume that there is some kind of non-promotion clause either at the end of this season or next so that PL can be moved on without too much of a financial hit.

Gives the staff and squad a stable platform to work from but protects the club.

Assuming he manages it, it gives PL 3 or 4 years to build a squad capable of competing, with the remit in the first year, to avoid relegation back to L1.

It does make some sense when broken down like that.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 16:51 - Jan 6 with 2201 viewsdavblue

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 14:12 - Jan 6 by sotd78

Robson was subject to a lot of North Stand "Robson Out" chants - same as now really - a vocal few who didn't see the whole picture and weren't informed enough to know the shenagins behind the scenes with Baxter and Caroll.
A wise Chairman did know and gave Robson time. In many ways Evans also gives his managers time. Perhaps there's a bigger picture here - like the top to toe transformation of a club that went very stale. McCarthy himself would say he had no interest in the running of the club - just keeping us in the Championship was his brief. We have festered away under the penny-pinching of various Chief Executives.

In Robson's days of course we had only 12 players on matchday; one substitute only. None of the tactical demands of today; keeping 24 players happy, pleasing the loanee club whilst trying to win matches. Being under 24/7 social media spotlight etc etc.

Robson built several teams - each got better - building on a system. The first one had Best, Hunter, Morris and Belfitt and a brilliant winger in Robertson.
The second had players like Noddy Talbot who we sold and bought two wizard Dutchmen and had some spare change left over.

There's no comparison for PL with SBR. But we do have at present a manager who seems to have invested his soul in us; we at least should do the decent thing and give him the same time we gave Bobby Robson?


Agreed if there was a semblance of a plan on the pitch.

I said in the summer this was never going to be a quick fix, all of our issues sorted out in 1 window it was going to take time, but at the same time the manager had to give you something to hang your hat on and Lambert for me this season despite being top 2 for most of it hasn’t convinced me in the slightest. We haven’t created that many chances all season, we were very clinical in the early stages of the season but since then we haven’t had any kind of real goal threat.

The team is unbalanced and has been for sometime, I hope he proves me really wrong I will take that all day long but he’s failed to convince me at all so far. He’s a manager on the way down without a doubt in my mind.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 17:35 - Jan 6 with 2148 viewspatrickswell

"Under our current fanbase, Robson would have gone by December 1970"

Well, maybe if football in 1970 had the exposure and profile that it did now he might, but if Lambert got us promoted to the Premier League (stop sniggering...) and then left 3 months into the first season back to go to another club claiming that he felt we "lacked sufficient potential" (as Bill McGarry did when he went to Wolves), but his successor kept us up and reached December of his second full season in the bottom half of the top flight but with 2020 equivalents of Mills, Whymark and Woods playing most weeks...then I think we'd have given him the benefit of the doubt.

We need to remember this dark time, because if it does turn around under Lambert or whoever, I for one, will not get blasé about success again. I even took the wins in the early part of this season with an air of "Well, this is nice" rather than "Yes, kneel before us and tremble, football" because I was waiting for the other shoe to drop. It's taking the pee now, surely.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 17:51 - Jan 6 with 2132 viewsTerry_Nutkins

It's so tiring. You make an entirely sensible post with and underlying message of how sometimes good managers need time (so many examples of this by the way with perhaps Alex Ferguson being the best).

This is really nicely balanced but what happens? People aren't prepared to listen to the bigger message here and start talking about specific differences that fit their view.

Of course you can't compare the LambertRobson scenario like for like (or pretty much any other appointments). Always differences but the core message is the same. A little bit of patience in football would make such a difference. Otherwise we are always looking for the quick fix, plaster it up solution.

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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 21:57 - Jan 6 with 2003 viewsbluebudgie

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 14:12 - Jan 6 by sotd78

Robson was subject to a lot of North Stand "Robson Out" chants - same as now really - a vocal few who didn't see the whole picture and weren't informed enough to know the shenagins behind the scenes with Baxter and Caroll.
A wise Chairman did know and gave Robson time. In many ways Evans also gives his managers time. Perhaps there's a bigger picture here - like the top to toe transformation of a club that went very stale. McCarthy himself would say he had no interest in the running of the club - just keeping us in the Championship was his brief. We have festered away under the penny-pinching of various Chief Executives.

In Robson's days of course we had only 12 players on matchday; one substitute only. None of the tactical demands of today; keeping 24 players happy, pleasing the loanee club whilst trying to win matches. Being under 24/7 social media spotlight etc etc.

Robson built several teams - each got better - building on a system. The first one had Best, Hunter, Morris and Belfitt and a brilliant winger in Robertson.
The second had players like Noddy Talbot who we sold and bought two wizard Dutchmen and had some spare change left over.

There's no comparison for PL with SBR. But we do have at present a manager who seems to have invested his soul in us; we at least should do the decent thing and give him the same time we gave Bobby Robson?


"Robson was subject to a lot of North Stand "Robson Out" chants" I was a regular supporter under McGary, then Robson and I only heard the crowd chant for Robson's head once and that was against Man Utd in the League Cup, so I respectfully disagree there was not a "lot" of Robson out chants.
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Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 22:05 - Jan 6 with 1990 viewsPJH

Robson's win percentage when he came in. on 21:57 - Jan 6 by bluebudgie

"Robson was subject to a lot of North Stand "Robson Out" chants" I was a regular supporter under McGary, then Robson and I only heard the crowd chant for Robson's head once and that was against Man Utd in the League Cup, so I respectfully disagree there was not a "lot" of Robson out chants.


That was the only time I recall it as well and as I remember it it was not a huge number involved even then.
The Men Who Made The Town says "a small section of the crowd".
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