| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night 09:52 - Jan 29 with 4347 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
or am I missing something. The ball was headed in to the ground from about 6 yards out, not sure what he could've done tbh. I actually think he was our best player along with Flynn (again).
What the defence were doing I am not sure. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 09:54 - Jan 29 with 2930 views | Herbivore |
He could have done better, certainly not a howler though like the Lincoln and Wycombe ones were. That aside he had a decent enough game, though I don't get this idea that his distribution is meant to be good. His kicking is atrocious. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 09:55 - Jan 29 with 2919 views | ChateauWines |
Weak goalkeeping. He was flapping all night and seemed scared. Holy has much more presence and would have been in my team last night |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 09:58 - Jan 29 with 2902 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 09:54 - Jan 29 by Herbivore |
He could have done better, certainly not a howler though like the Lincoln and Wycombe ones were. That aside he had a decent enough game, though I don't get this idea that his distribution is meant to be good. His kicking is atrocious. |
His kicking has definitely got worse which is typical of our goalkeepers. It was good at Rochdale I remember. I blame goalkeepers trying to do that side foot slice thing when they kick out of hands. Just put your foot through it ffs. Matteo Sereni used to do that, leaves such a small margin for error. | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:25 - Jan 29 with 2852 views | ITFC_Forever |
Why was he kneeling on the floor?
Holy would have claimed the cross in the first place. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:28 - Jan 29 with 2844 views | portmanking |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:25 - Jan 29 by ITFC_Forever |
Why was he kneeling on the floor?
Holy would have claimed the cross in the first place. |
Exactly right.
Someone said last night that Norris was at fault because someone was standing on his toes FFS. Keepers need to be imposing and prepared to stand up to physical threats. Holy would have been perfect for last night's onslaught.
Also agree with other posters that Norris' distribution is poor. His technique is similar to Gerken's, which means that he very rarely gets the distance required. | | | |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:31 - Jan 29 with 2830 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:25 - Jan 29 by ITFC_Forever |
Why was he kneeling on the floor?
Holy would have claimed the cross in the first place. |
I do think that Holy is a keeper who has got better without playing. He is a decent league one keeper, was harsh for him to be dropped. But he has his faults.
However, we were in the land of the giants last night, Holy would have been useful for corners. | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:32 - Jan 29 with 2823 views | clive_baker |
I think it's the bit before that, it appeared to pop up off Norris into the air. Maybe he could've batted it away? I think on balance he was one of about 2 players to actually do alright last night, made 2 or 3 tidy saves, handling was good and came off his line smartly in the 1st half to prevent a very good opportunity for them. I felt a bit sorry for him at times as he had nobody showing for the ball short, the back 3 didn't appear to want it off him because they knew how quickly Rotherham were pressing, which left him with no choice but to punt long to Keane, who I don't recall winning anything in the air. In his defence that's really not his game, but it just meant the ball kept coming back. In hindsight we might've been better off having Skuse on there, at least he's not afraid to have the ball. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:34 - Jan 29 with 2819 views | JakeITFC |
This thread is so weird.
Norris was probably the only player who barely put a foot wrong last night and yet he still gets stick and Holy continues to gain almost mythical status. |  | | |
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| Norris was the least of our problems last night..... on 10:36 - Jan 29 with 2810 views | Bloots |
....but it's far easier for the "Football manager" generation to pin the blame on an individual incident rather than look at the wider tactical and coaching inadequacies. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:38 - Jan 29 with 2795 views | clive_baker |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:34 - Jan 29 by JakeITFC |
This thread is so weird.
Norris was probably the only player who barely put a foot wrong last night and yet he still gets stick and Holy continues to gain almost mythical status. |
I find the criticism of his kicking particularly weird. He had 1 out ball for pretty much the whole game yesterday, and with the exception of a kick at the start of the 2nd half that went into touch he found Keane on pretty much every occasion. The fact Keane couldn't win a single header somehow reflects on Norris now. You couldn't make it up.
I think people like Holy, he seemed excited to be here in an interview once or something.
The bloke's conceded 4 in 6 games since the turn of the year (should really have been 3 had it not been for Wilson's cheap penalty against Accrington) and kept us in it at times last night. Seems like he's been added to the scape goat list. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 10:42]
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:41 - Jan 29 with 2759 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:34 - Jan 29 by JakeITFC |
This thread is so weird.
Norris was probably the only player who barely put a foot wrong last night and yet he still gets stick and Holy continues to gain almost mythical status. |
100% agree | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:42 - Jan 29 with 2754 views | portmanking |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:38 - Jan 29 by clive_baker |
I find the criticism of his kicking particularly weird. He had 1 out ball for pretty much the whole game yesterday, and with the exception of a kick at the start of the 2nd half that went into touch he found Keane on pretty much every occasion. The fact Keane couldn't win a single header somehow reflects on Norris now. You couldn't make it up.
I think people like Holy, he seemed excited to be here in an interview once or something.
The bloke's conceded 4 in 6 games since the turn of the year (should really have been 3 had it not been for Wilson's cheap penalty against Accrington) and kept us in it at times last night. Seems like he's been added to the scape goat list. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 10:42]
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His kicking IS bang average. You can't deny that. For someone who lacks height, physicality and general presence, I think most expected him to be very impressive with his feet and he's no better than Holy for my money. | | | |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:44 - Jan 29 with 2746 views | Herbivore |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:38 - Jan 29 by clive_baker |
I find the criticism of his kicking particularly weird. He had 1 out ball for pretty much the whole game yesterday, and with the exception of a kick at the start of the 2nd half that went into touch he found Keane on pretty much every occasion. The fact Keane couldn't win a single header somehow reflects on Norris now. You couldn't make it up.
I think people like Holy, he seemed excited to be here in an interview once or something.
The bloke's conceded 4 in 6 games since the turn of the year (should really have been 3 had it not been for Wilson's cheap penalty against Accrington) and kept us in it at times last night. Seems like he's been added to the scape goat list. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 10:42]
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I think people like Holy because we won more games and conceded fewer goals with him in the side. I'm not sure interviews have anything to do with it. | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:50 - Jan 29 with 2723 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:38 - Jan 29 by clive_baker |
I find the criticism of his kicking particularly weird. He had 1 out ball for pretty much the whole game yesterday, and with the exception of a kick at the start of the 2nd half that went into touch he found Keane on pretty much every occasion. The fact Keane couldn't win a single header somehow reflects on Norris now. You couldn't make it up.
I think people like Holy, he seemed excited to be here in an interview once or something.
The bloke's conceded 4 in 6 games since the turn of the year (should really have been 3 had it not been for Wilson's cheap penalty against Accrington) and kept us in it at times last night. Seems like he's been added to the scape goat list. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 10:42]
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This isn't a recent scapegoat list mate. This has been since he got in. Holy seems like a nice bloke and all and people like him. But I think they are much of a muchness, and you are right to highlight Norris' stats because people seem to have forgotten them. Much like people ignored his save against Lincoln that was very good. | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:50 - Jan 29 with 2719 views | clive_baker |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:42 - Jan 29 by portmanking |
His kicking IS bang average. You can't deny that. For someone who lacks height, physicality and general presence, I think most expected him to be very impressive with his feet and he's no better than Holy for my money. |
What about his kicking wasn't good? I genuinely don't see it. He found Keane 9 / 10 times and had nothing else on. Genuine question, I'm not sure what was wrong with his kicking (aside from one right at the start of the 2nd half that went straight into touch). | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:56 - Jan 29 with 2703 views | LankHenners |
The whole thing was a mess - Garbutt gives the ball away needlessly, the corner is defended poorly and Norris should do better when it comes at him.
Can count himself a bit unfortunate as it might have bounced up to a Town head and been cleared and it's not on the level of a couple of the howlers he's had in the past few weeks.
On the overall goalkeeping argument re: him or Holy, I think there is some (justifiable) bemusement over Holy being dropped in the first place and it seems to be a case of him being unlucky that Lambert put the handbrake on rotation whilst he was rotated out. He's performed better than Norris and should be in there on merit but regardless, if you're playing a team with lots of height who want to pump the ball into the box a lot and you have a giant 'keeper on your books who can command his area it's a poor tactical decision not to play him. |  |
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| Norris was the least of our problems last night..... on 10:57 - Jan 29 with 2690 views | BlueBadger |
| Norris was the least of our problems last night..... on 10:36 - Jan 29 by Bloots |
....but it's far easier for the "Football manager" generation to pin the blame on an individual incident rather than look at the wider tactical and coaching inadequacies. |
For what it's worth, we will probably get promoted this season in spite of the management team rather than because of it due to the utter lack of quality in the division, we don't have a brilliant squad but it's still better than 90% of the rest. I worry that next season will be like all those times that Rangers and Celtic used to play in the Champions League and get routinely outclassed because they weren't used to playing against decent opposition as opposed to pub teams. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:10 - Jan 29 with 2624 views | BiGDonnie |
I'd blame him. He let it hit his effing knee and drop right into the 6 yard box. Why didn't he put his foot through it?
I prefer Holy. |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:10 - Jan 29 with 2616 views | Herbivore |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:50 - Jan 29 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
This isn't a recent scapegoat list mate. This has been since he got in. Holy seems like a nice bloke and all and people like him. But I think they are much of a muchness, and you are right to highlight Norris' stats because people seem to have forgotten them. Much like people ignored his save against Lincoln that was very good. |
He's not highlighting Norris' stats, he's cherry picking a run of games that makes Norris look good as he's decided Norris is the better keeper and wants to justify that view. I get quite frustrated that those who rate Norris more highly seem to think it's those who prefer Holy that are biased. Below is why I personally prefer Holy to Norris:
Holy - 15 league appearances, 1.87 points per game, 0.73 goals conceded per game.
Norris - 13 league appearances, 1.54 points per game, 1.08 goals conceded per game.
So over a 44 game season, Holy is worth an extra 14 points and Norris would concede an additional 15 goals. That's without taking into account some of Norris' individual errors that have led to goals, notably at Wycombe and Lincoln, and him generally looking more error prone.
The reason Holy is preferred by many of us is because he looks a better keeper and because we do better with him in goal. And he's actually our player as well. It has nothing to do with personalities. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 11:27]
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:22 - Jan 29 with 2561 views | Chrisd |
When you watch the goal again, there are bodies in front of him , which might have distracted his view of the ball. As a keeper you're taught to have a 'set position' which invariably is low and stationary prior to the striker hitting the ball or in this case heading it. Norris is low, but with the Rotherham and Ipswich players in front of him I would say that has caused him to lose sight and flight of the ball, he's done the next best thing and reacted to get the block in with his body. I would question what our defenders are doing just standing and watching the Rotherham player bundle the ball in the net? | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:26 - Jan 29 with 2542 views | clive_baker |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:10 - Jan 29 by Herbivore |
He's not highlighting Norris' stats, he's cherry picking a run of games that makes Norris look good as he's decided Norris is the better keeper and wants to justify that view. I get quite frustrated that those who rate Norris more highly seem to think it's those who prefer Holy that are biased. Below is why I personally prefer Holy to Norris:
Holy - 15 league appearances, 1.87 points per game, 0.73 goals conceded per game.
Norris - 13 league appearances, 1.54 points per game, 1.08 goals conceded per game.
So over a 44 game season, Holy is worth an extra 14 points and Norris would concede an additional 15 goals. That's without taking into account some of Norris' individual errors that have led to goals, notably at Wycombe and Lincoln, and him generally looking more error prone.
The reason Holy is preferred by many of us is because he looks a better keeper and because we do better with him in goal. And he's actually our player as well. It has nothing to do with personalities. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 11:27]
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I'm sorry but that is such meaningless BS, it's actually laughable. With no context of opposition, the team in front of them, form, system, morale, shape, home vs. away etc. You simply cannot present that as proof that Holy is better, it's such a limited analysis. For starters, Norris coming into the side coincided with KVY's injury, and we've not looked anything close to the same side without him. | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:26 - Jan 29 with 2540 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:10 - Jan 29 by Herbivore |
He's not highlighting Norris' stats, he's cherry picking a run of games that makes Norris look good as he's decided Norris is the better keeper and wants to justify that view. I get quite frustrated that those who rate Norris more highly seem to think it's those who prefer Holy that are biased. Below is why I personally prefer Holy to Norris:
Holy - 15 league appearances, 1.87 points per game, 0.73 goals conceded per game.
Norris - 13 league appearances, 1.54 points per game, 1.08 goals conceded per game.
So over a 44 game season, Holy is worth an extra 14 points and Norris would concede an additional 15 goals. That's without taking into account some of Norris' individual errors that have led to goals, notably at Wycombe and Lincoln, and him generally looking more error prone.
The reason Holy is preferred by many of us is because he looks a better keeper and because we do better with him in goal. And he's actually our player as well. It has nothing to do with personalities. [Post edited 29 Jan 2020 11:27]
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If you are going to compare goalkeeper stats surely you would need to be looking at saves to shots, kicking statistics, crosses claimed etc. Whilst I take your point and as I said I don't have a preference. Surely you would need to look at these stats as oppose to just goals conceded? Holy may well be better in these I don't know, but that would give a better indication? | |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:27 - Jan 29 with 2528 views | Sharkey |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 10:25 - Jan 29 by ITFC_Forever |
Why was he kneeling on the floor?
Holy would have claimed the cross in the first place. |
I'm trying to work out if this is analysis or a pun-fest? (Could be both, I suppose.) |  | | |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:28 - Jan 29 with 2525 views | itfcjoe |
He could have done a bit better with it, but no one reacts to it.
He had a good game I thought, brave when he needed to be and I would makr him out as one of our better performers |  |
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| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:28 - Jan 29 with 2521 views | Herbivore |
| Was Norris actually at fault for that goal last night on 11:26 - Jan 29 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
If you are going to compare goalkeeper stats surely you would need to be looking at saves to shots, kicking statistics, crosses claimed etc. Whilst I take your point and as I said I don't have a preference. Surely you would need to look at these stats as oppose to just goals conceded? Holy may well be better in these I don't know, but that would give a better indication? |
I think goals conceded is a pretty good indicator, mate. | |
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