| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:23 - Apr 3 with 1272 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:19 - Apr 3 by BloomBlue |
But it is the point you criticise the Government for being too slow but not the EU, if the EU had gone out and used it's purchasing power that so many tell us about in January and purchased 1000's of ventilators then people in Italy and Spain possibly would be alive.
It's because you hate the Tories you politically point score selectively.
I accept we should be looking at all options for buying ventilators but the whole world is doing the same and there is no guarantee the EU will find any and therefore looking at the options at home are sensible.
People also need to understand these things aren't made overnight what's the point of a company turning out 1000's for them to fail.
It seems Italy has been getting some (numbers unknown) from China and they're failing what's the point of that. |
I have not once defended the EU though. Plenty of countries have made a hash of this but we had a grace period of delay to not make the same mistakes which we may have blown (or at least caused more damage than needed).
The principle for me is as you say in the second part so I'm glad we agree there. The outright lie Gove told us though before they switched story does suggest a level of incompetence or arrogance we don't have room for right now when it's life and death. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:25 - Apr 3 with 1270 views | BloomBlue |
He didn't say scheme he said ventilators and the EU doesn't have any spare ventilators that's why Italy and Spain are running out.
You're clearly Tony Blair and Trump in one as you didn't read what was written |  | | |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:26 - Apr 3 with 1267 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:25 - Apr 3 by BloomBlue |
He didn't say scheme he said ventilators and the EU doesn't have any spare ventilators that's why Italy and Spain are running out.
You're clearly Tony Blair and Trump in one as you didn't read what was written |
I'm starting to think you haven't read a lot of what was said in this thread and the links provided. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:26 - Apr 3 with 1265 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
The poster quite clearly wasn’t disputing that point
I can’t say I agree with the point that they were making mind, I would have thought sourcing ventilators by any means possible to be essential although clearly the ins and outs of this sort of thing are way above my understanding |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:34 - Apr 3 with 1255 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:09 - Apr 3 by BrixtonBlue |
Bit harsh that Lucan. I think Callis' heart is in the right place. |
I'm still baffled how I've gone from some kind of woke do-gooder who always has to be more righteous than anyone to some kind of monster who takes satisfaction in the death.
I guess whatever the easiest angle to jump on always follows through. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:34 - Apr 3 with 1254 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:19 - Apr 3 by BloomBlue |
But it is the point you criticise the Government for being too slow but not the EU, if the EU had gone out and used it's purchasing power that so many tell us about in January and purchased 1000's of ventilators then people in Italy and Spain possibly would be alive.
It's because you hate the Tories you politically point score selectively.
I accept we should be looking at all options for buying ventilators but the whole world is doing the same and there is no guarantee the EU will find any and therefore looking at the options at home are sensible.
People also need to understand these things aren't made overnight what's the point of a company turning out 1000's for them to fail.
It seems Italy has been getting some (numbers unknown) from China and they're failing what's the point of that. |
If Callis is politically point scoring because he hates the Tories, then you're doing the opposite. No-one said there's a guarantee of the EU finding them, but surely it's better to be in the scheme than not? Also why can't you be "looking at the options at home" AS WELL AS being in the EU ventilator scheme?!
It beggars belief how some of you are bending over backwards to defend the indefensible. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:38 - Apr 3 with 1244 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:34 - Apr 3 by BrixtonBlue |
If Callis is politically point scoring because he hates the Tories, then you're doing the opposite. No-one said there's a guarantee of the EU finding them, but surely it's better to be in the scheme than not? Also why can't you be "looking at the options at home" AS WELL AS being in the EU ventilator scheme?!
It beggars belief how some of you are bending over backwards to defend the indefensible. |
I see it has the same way I pay my bills. if I have one job on that will only cover half my living costs, I take another job on to ensure I can get the rest.
If the EU thing doesn't work out, we've got our own manufacturing to fall back on and vice versa.
The phrase "throwing all your eggs into one basket" comes to mind. Stuff like this needs a plan B at the least, likely C, D and E too. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:41 - Apr 3 with 1237 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:25 - Apr 3 by BloomBlue |
He didn't say scheme he said ventilators and the EU doesn't have any spare ventilators that's why Italy and Spain are running out.
You're clearly Tony Blair and Trump in one as you didn't read what was written |
That's the best you can do, a pedantic point on Callis' wording?
Why is it you defend the Tories so much? is it because you voted for them so they're sort of your team and you support them through thick and thin like your football team? Or is that you don't want to lose face by admitting your mistake at the polling booth?
You'd rather see people die than admit the Tories made an error. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:47 - Apr 3 with 1231 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:38 - Apr 3 by monytowbray |
I see it has the same way I pay my bills. if I have one job on that will only cover half my living costs, I take another job on to ensure I can get the rest.
If the EU thing doesn't work out, we've got our own manufacturing to fall back on and vice versa.
The phrase "throwing all your eggs into one basket" comes to mind. Stuff like this needs a plan B at the least, likely C, D and E too. |
I'm actually on record as saying I think the government had done a decent job managing a difficult situation early on. Herbs even accused me of having a soft spot for Boris!
But it baffles me why people would want to defend such obvious gross incompetence and even duplicitousness. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 11:49 - Apr 3 with 1193 views | NewcyBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:47 - Apr 3 by BrixtonBlue |
I'm actually on record as saying I think the government had done a decent job managing a difficult situation early on. Herbs even accused me of having a soft spot for Boris!
But it baffles me why people would want to defend such obvious gross incompetence and even duplicitousness. |
Therein lies the issue I believe Dollers. You’ve given praise where it is due. You’ve been balanced, especially considering your political views. I think you’ve praised Boris more than I believe he has deserved.
Throughout this whole thing, numerous posts saying the government aren’t acting fast enough with regards to the lockdown, and then posts saying “I said we needed this blah blah blah”.
When you consider Brits as people, a lockdown was never going to work if it was brought in so quickly. Evidenced by the request to avoid pubs, and they were still full.
Sometimes you have to take into account the people you are dealing with.
The Chinese going into a serious lockdown was never going to be an issue, the South Koreans have been preparing for a pandemic such as this for years. The Japanese are just an extremely efficient people, and their hygiene is superb.
Singapore has bans on chewing gum.
These nations are performing well due to the nature of their people.
I imagine there are so many factors beyond the amount of deaths in other countries, that we cannot even comprehend the daily decisions and discussions.
Years of underfunding are coming back to bite us in the @rse with regards to the NHS. The lack of PPE is utterly shocking, heads should roll for that alone.
The first U.K. death of COVID was announced as 5th March, although it is said it was almost a week earlier.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/02/coronavirus-took-hold-in-uk-earlie
Having been in China in January, flown home from Singapore on 31st January, I wouldn’t be surprised if the virus was here as early as January. Lucan will most likely say the same thing. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 12:12 - Apr 3 with 1173 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 11:49 - Apr 3 by NewcyBlue |
Therein lies the issue I believe Dollers. You’ve given praise where it is due. You’ve been balanced, especially considering your political views. I think you’ve praised Boris more than I believe he has deserved.
Throughout this whole thing, numerous posts saying the government aren’t acting fast enough with regards to the lockdown, and then posts saying “I said we needed this blah blah blah”.
When you consider Brits as people, a lockdown was never going to work if it was brought in so quickly. Evidenced by the request to avoid pubs, and they were still full.
Sometimes you have to take into account the people you are dealing with.
The Chinese going into a serious lockdown was never going to be an issue, the South Koreans have been preparing for a pandemic such as this for years. The Japanese are just an extremely efficient people, and their hygiene is superb.
Singapore has bans on chewing gum.
These nations are performing well due to the nature of their people.
I imagine there are so many factors beyond the amount of deaths in other countries, that we cannot even comprehend the daily decisions and discussions.
Years of underfunding are coming back to bite us in the @rse with regards to the NHS. The lack of PPE is utterly shocking, heads should roll for that alone.
The first U.K. death of COVID was announced as 5th March, although it is said it was almost a week earlier.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/02/coronavirus-took-hold-in-uk-earlie
Having been in China in January, flown home from Singapore on 31st January, I wouldn’t be surprised if the virus was here as early as January. Lucan will most likely say the same thing. |
I agree.
I remain staggered by peoples naivety.
There are so many things at play here, not least the mental health of the country.
We've only just begun and to be honest this virus isn't a massive killer in terms of what could follow in a nuclear second wave. I am led to believe by a man in the know that government is anticipating a second wave in August. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 12:14 - Apr 3 with 1173 views | BloomBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:41 - Apr 3 by BrixtonBlue |
That's the best you can do, a pedantic point on Callis' wording?
Why is it you defend the Tories so much? is it because you voted for them so they're sort of your team and you support them through thick and thin like your football team? Or is that you don't want to lose face by admitting your mistake at the polling booth?
You'd rather see people die than admit the Tories made an error. |
Oh the old I was wrong but I've cover myself by using the standard excuse of accusing someone of being pedantic, is that really your best excuse
And where have I said I would rather see people die? more fake news | | | |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 13:20 - Apr 3 with 1151 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 12:12 - Apr 3 by Lord_Lucan |
I agree.
I remain staggered by peoples naivety.
There are so many things at play here, not least the mental health of the country.
We've only just begun and to be honest this virus isn't a massive killer in terms of what could follow in a nuclear second wave. I am led to believe by a man in the know that government is anticipating a second wave in August. |
The second wave could be deadly, it could not be. The Spanish flu is the only real comparison we have for something this size, and that had many factors relating to the impact of war going on.
Either way the main factor is not overwhelming the healthcare system and phasing/delaying outbreak to buy time, which will heavily impact the death count if done wrong. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 13:36 - Apr 3 with 1144 views | NewcyBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 13:20 - Apr 3 by monytowbray |
The second wave could be deadly, it could not be. The Spanish flu is the only real comparison we have for something this size, and that had many factors relating to the impact of war going on.
Either way the main factor is not overwhelming the healthcare system and phasing/delaying outbreak to buy time, which will heavily impact the death count if done wrong. |
In 20 years time it will be interesting to see what issues there are in the U.K. and if a root cause analysis identifies anything to do with this pandemic. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 13:50 - Apr 3 with 1130 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:47 - Apr 3 by BrixtonBlue |
I'm actually on record as saying I think the government had done a decent job managing a difficult situation early on. Herbs even accused me of having a soft spot for Boris!
But it baffles me why people would want to defend such obvious gross incompetence and even duplicitousness. |
Yes. You've been fair and balanced. Absolutely.
Most people have tbh. And there is nothing wrong in criticising the government when you believe they have not acted responsibly. The EU Ventilator scheme being one occasion where they should be rightly criticised. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 14:00 - Apr 3 with 1115 views | hype313 |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 13:20 - Apr 3 by monytowbray |
The second wave could be deadly, it could not be. The Spanish flu is the only real comparison we have for something this size, and that had many factors relating to the impact of war going on.
Either way the main factor is not overwhelming the healthcare system and phasing/delaying outbreak to buy time, which will heavily impact the death count if done wrong. |
Was reading that the second and third wave were far more deadly than the first, however, at that point we did have a huge number of malnourished populus due to the war. |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 21:13 - Apr 3 with 1080 views | Ely_Blue |
We have no choice in the current situation, god you are a complete dumb @ss.
You still keep your loony leftie views and you’ll be fine.
I have no doubt our taxes will go up to pay for these current spending patterns by the govt, and I for one will happily pay more taxes if it stops this country going completely to the wall |  |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 23:48 - Apr 3 with 1044 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 21:13 - Apr 3 by Ely_Blue |
We have no choice in the current situation, god you are a complete dumb @ss.
You still keep your loony leftie views and you’ll be fine.
I have no doubt our taxes will go up to pay for these current spending patterns by the govt, and I for one will happily pay more taxes if it stops this country going completely to the wall |
Your ability to disconnect the obvious dots is quite outstanding. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 00:12 - Apr 4 with 1037 views | pistonbroke |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 23:48 - Apr 3 by monytowbray |
Your ability to disconnect the obvious dots is quite outstanding. |
To be fair call is this is no time for party politics , I hate the tories more than you do and yes the mess we are in is down to the Tory austerity programme which a lot on here have been in favour of , however this is a time for pulling together and getting through this horrible situation , we have chance to vote in 4 and half years , I just hope that because of Tory austerity that has left not only the nhs at crisis point but all of us that the message finally gets through to kick the evil Tory scum out |  | | |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 00:38 - Apr 4 with 1014 views | monytowbray |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 00:12 - Apr 4 by pistonbroke |
To be fair call is this is no time for party politics , I hate the tories more than you do and yes the mess we are in is down to the Tory austerity programme which a lot on here have been in favour of , however this is a time for pulling together and getting through this horrible situation , we have chance to vote in 4 and half years , I just hope that because of Tory austerity that has left not only the nhs at crisis point but all of us that the message finally gets through to kick the evil Tory scum out |
Dunno, Boris’ polls went up. I’m impressed gaslighting works on entire countries. | |
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| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 08:47 - Apr 4 with 953 views | Pecker |
Callis, cold you please stop this ? The Government need opposition and you are normally right to question them on policies. Things like Tax, Savings, Benefits etc. need scrutiny and opposition in normal times, but these are not normal times. No modern day Government has had a crisis like this. No modern day Government has had to try and find solutions to save lives so quickly before. Whilst I get that you do not like the Tories or their backers, this isn't the time to question what they are doing. Nobody can say for any certainty that what the Government are doing is the wrong thing. Nobody can say that a different party would do it better. I do not support any one party, I vote for who I think is best for the majority at the time of an election. At this present moment in time, this is the best we have and we all need too support them and trust that they are doing the right thing to save lives. I do not see what they gain from doing anything but the right thing. Like I say, in normal times, you are right to scrutinise the Government, but these are not normal times. We all need to be in this together. Can you please stop picking faults in the Government, just until we are through these incredibly difficult times for the whole world, not just us. Please Callis, your time will come, this just isn't the time. Stay Safe. |  | | |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 10:07 - Apr 4 with 932 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Flatten the peak whilst boosting the NHS? on 08:47 - Apr 4 by Pecker |
Callis, cold you please stop this ? The Government need opposition and you are normally right to question them on policies. Things like Tax, Savings, Benefits etc. need scrutiny and opposition in normal times, but these are not normal times. No modern day Government has had a crisis like this. No modern day Government has had to try and find solutions to save lives so quickly before. Whilst I get that you do not like the Tories or their backers, this isn't the time to question what they are doing. Nobody can say for any certainty that what the Government are doing is the wrong thing. Nobody can say that a different party would do it better. I do not support any one party, I vote for who I think is best for the majority at the time of an election. At this present moment in time, this is the best we have and we all need too support them and trust that they are doing the right thing to save lives. I do not see what they gain from doing anything but the right thing. Like I say, in normal times, you are right to scrutinise the Government, but these are not normal times. We all need to be in this together. Can you please stop picking faults in the Government, just until we are through these incredibly difficult times for the whole world, not just us. Please Callis, your time will come, this just isn't the time. Stay Safe. |
I have to disagree for two reasons.
1. Just because we're in a pandemic does not absolve the government from any criticism.
2. One man ranting on a football messageboard doesn't really do anything anyway. It's not like Callis is hindering the country's efforts is it? | |
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