| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... 08:34 - Apr 17 with 4985 views | ITFC_Forever |
....as they have no idea who has / hasn't got / has had the virus, and won't have for weeks, if not months. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:39 - Apr 17 with 1638 views | TractorWood |
They are losing credibility every day. Totally reactive and unhelpfully defensive. Every tough question is met with 'we are being led by the science' although there can't be any proven science as we haven't tested properly, it's a new virus, no idea if it's seasonal, what the additional death rate is, true mortality rate etc etc.
PS this isn't specifically about lifting lockdown. More their actions in the past. [Post edited 17 Apr 2020 8:56]
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:41 - Apr 17 with 1634 views | Steve_M |
The lack of testing and the lack of checks at airports make it difficult to see that the government has got an exit strategy. Sit tight and wait for a vaccine just might not cut it.
As ever with this government though, this seems to a be a news management crisis than a public health one. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 with 1612 views | Lord_Lucan |
There are things you can criticise the government for but this isn't one of them.
To come out and state a time when the lockdown will end would be idiotic. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 with 1596 views | monytowbray |
They're banking it all on the antibody test from the sounds of it. Which is well and good when we have one but for now ramping up live testing would be a good start.
I do wonder what data exactly they're using at this point to inform stuff as we're not making many reliable sets of our own. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 with 1605 views | sparks |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:39 - Apr 17 by TractorWood |
They are losing credibility every day. Totally reactive and unhelpfully defensive. Every tough question is met with 'we are being led by the science' although there can't be any proven science as we haven't tested properly, it's a new virus, no idea if it's seasonal, what the additional death rate is, true mortality rate etc etc.
PS this isn't specifically about lifting lockdown. More their actions in the past. [Post edited 17 Apr 2020 8:56]
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I think that is nonsense.
Sometimes the correct answer is 'we dont know'. To refuse to be pressed into things when the information is incomplete is intellectually and morally creditable. |  |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:50 - Apr 17 with 1584 views | monytowbray |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 by sparks |
I think that is nonsense.
Sometimes the correct answer is 'we dont know'. To refuse to be pressed into things when the information is incomplete is intellectually and morally creditable. |
Or "we don't know as we actually have no idea about the severity of the spread because we've failed to hit testing targets". That'd be the correct one. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:53 - Apr 17 with 1574 views | TractorWood |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 by sparks |
I think that is nonsense.
Sometimes the correct answer is 'we dont know'. To refuse to be pressed into things when the information is incomplete is intellectually and morally creditable. |
So you think the herd immunity stage, the lack of PPE, the shambolic approach to testing were all successes? | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:56 - Apr 17 with 1561 views | ITFC_Forever |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 by Lord_Lucan |
There are things you can criticise the government for but this isn't one of them.
To come out and state a time when the lockdown will end would be idiotic. |
They have no idea how widespread or not the virus is.
The only people getting tested are those going in to hospital as they are so ill, and key workers.
But as key workers are a relatively low percentage of the population, and are also more likely to contract it, they're not a fair sample.
People who may have it and only have no, low or moderate symptons are not being tested - they're just told to self-isolate. And those systems may or not be COVID-19, they could be just a general virus / bug / flu etc.
The Government are as clueless as ever. And that's before you start on the completely inadequate PPE the key workers have available. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:00 - Apr 17 with 1527 views | homer_123 |
Ask yourself:
What has changed since the outbreak started in China?
The answer is fundamentally nothing - the UKs strategy has been to flatten the curve so we can cope with this from a healthcare perspective - that's it. No more and no less.
There isn't a cure, there isn't a vaccine and there is no natural immunity. Therefore, the exit strategy is reasonably clear for us to see. Once we get to the point that the evidence suggests we can manage from a healthcare perspective - we'll ease the current situation but it will be a managed easing of them.
For example, social distancing is going to be in place for a very long time - most likely until vaccine arrives, which is probably a year away still, possibly shorter, possibly longer but around that time frame. You'll see the easing through age brackets (i.e. those that are younger having their restrictions eased) and by geography.
So don't, for one minute, think that when the current measures are stopped it will be back to normal because it won't.
Remember one thing and it is very, very important. Everyone can catch this and no one has immunity. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 with 1513 views | ElephantintheRoom |
You could have shortened your post considerably to 'The government have no idea'
The main problem is that a lockdown never started. A complete U-turn from a deranged herd immunity 'strategy' to the current voluntary, stay at home please but do go out whenever you feel like a bit of shopping or a jog whilst we continue to run public transport and fly in 15,000 people a day to disperse amongst you freely semi-holiday only occured because someone did some maths on the back of a fag packet and 1 million people lost their jobs on a monday of government dithering.
Having totally failed to prepare for a pandemic despite having the advantage of an island location several weeks behind that of mainland europe, it is hardly surprising that the government has no plan of what to do next.... simply because there is nothing they can do until everyone is comfortable with 'the plateau of 700 people dying every day (but only if we hold back 50% until later and dont count anyone in the community)' Their hope is three weeks.... but as no effort has been made to contain the spread of the virus which is still merrily bubbling along - then its probably best to copy what those nasty foreigners are doing - and pretend we have the testing and isloation facilities to make it work. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 with 1517 views | hampstead_blue |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 by monytowbray |
They're banking it all on the antibody test from the sounds of it. Which is well and good when we have one but for now ramping up live testing would be a good start.
I do wonder what data exactly they're using at this point to inform stuff as we're not making many reliable sets of our own. |
Not sure about that in the short term.
I do feel they are following the data and being very cautious.
Last nights presser was clear on that and tbh, I'd rather a cautious line was taken rather than risking massive spikes by taking unnecessary risks with our health. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 with 1516 views | homer_123 |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:48 - Apr 17 by sparks |
I think that is nonsense.
Sometimes the correct answer is 'we dont know'. To refuse to be pressed into things when the information is incomplete is intellectually and morally creditable. |
I'd rather 'we don't know' that some trite soundbite.
I'd rather 'we don't know' than a load of bull. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:02 - Apr 17 with 1511 views | homer_123 |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 by ElephantintheRoom |
You could have shortened your post considerably to 'The government have no idea'
The main problem is that a lockdown never started. A complete U-turn from a deranged herd immunity 'strategy' to the current voluntary, stay at home please but do go out whenever you feel like a bit of shopping or a jog whilst we continue to run public transport and fly in 15,000 people a day to disperse amongst you freely semi-holiday only occured because someone did some maths on the back of a fag packet and 1 million people lost their jobs on a monday of government dithering.
Having totally failed to prepare for a pandemic despite having the advantage of an island location several weeks behind that of mainland europe, it is hardly surprising that the government has no plan of what to do next.... simply because there is nothing they can do until everyone is comfortable with 'the plateau of 700 people dying every day (but only if we hold back 50% until later and dont count anyone in the community)' Their hope is three weeks.... but as no effort has been made to contain the spread of the virus which is still merrily bubbling along - then its probably best to copy what those nasty foreigners are doing - and pretend we have the testing and isloation facilities to make it work. |
Which government has an idea on this? | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:02 - Apr 17 with 1504 views | lowhouseblue |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:53 - Apr 17 by TractorWood |
So you think the herd immunity stage, the lack of PPE, the shambolic approach to testing were all successes? |
what was the herd immunity stage? |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:04 - Apr 17 with 1498 views | BlueNomad |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 by ElephantintheRoom |
You could have shortened your post considerably to 'The government have no idea'
The main problem is that a lockdown never started. A complete U-turn from a deranged herd immunity 'strategy' to the current voluntary, stay at home please but do go out whenever you feel like a bit of shopping or a jog whilst we continue to run public transport and fly in 15,000 people a day to disperse amongst you freely semi-holiday only occured because someone did some maths on the back of a fag packet and 1 million people lost their jobs on a monday of government dithering.
Having totally failed to prepare for a pandemic despite having the advantage of an island location several weeks behind that of mainland europe, it is hardly surprising that the government has no plan of what to do next.... simply because there is nothing they can do until everyone is comfortable with 'the plateau of 700 people dying every day (but only if we hold back 50% until later and dont count anyone in the community)' Their hope is three weeks.... but as no effort has been made to contain the spread of the virus which is still merrily bubbling along - then its probably best to copy what those nasty foreigners are doing - and pretend we have the testing and isloation facilities to make it work. |
Spot on! You have saved me a lot of typing, thank you. |  | | |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:10 - Apr 17 with 1484 views | lowhouseblue |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 by ElephantintheRoom |
You could have shortened your post considerably to 'The government have no idea'
The main problem is that a lockdown never started. A complete U-turn from a deranged herd immunity 'strategy' to the current voluntary, stay at home please but do go out whenever you feel like a bit of shopping or a jog whilst we continue to run public transport and fly in 15,000 people a day to disperse amongst you freely semi-holiday only occured because someone did some maths on the back of a fag packet and 1 million people lost their jobs on a monday of government dithering.
Having totally failed to prepare for a pandemic despite having the advantage of an island location several weeks behind that of mainland europe, it is hardly surprising that the government has no plan of what to do next.... simply because there is nothing they can do until everyone is comfortable with 'the plateau of 700 people dying every day (but only if we hold back 50% until later and dont count anyone in the community)' Their hope is three weeks.... but as no effort has been made to contain the spread of the virus which is still merrily bubbling along - then its probably best to copy what those nasty foreigners are doing - and pretend we have the testing and isloation facilities to make it work. |
the mistrust of science and experts continues unabated i see.
i can't think of another example in uk government when politics and politicians have been so completely secondary to expert scientific advice. and yet twtd still knows better. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:12 - Apr 17 with 1486 views | sparks |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 08:53 - Apr 17 by TractorWood |
So you think the herd immunity stage, the lack of PPE, the shambolic approach to testing were all successes? |
Do you understand what a fallacy is?
I have not commented on any of those things. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:14 - Apr 17 with 1472 views | Lord_Lucan |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:01 - Apr 17 by ElephantintheRoom |
You could have shortened your post considerably to 'The government have no idea'
The main problem is that a lockdown never started. A complete U-turn from a deranged herd immunity 'strategy' to the current voluntary, stay at home please but do go out whenever you feel like a bit of shopping or a jog whilst we continue to run public transport and fly in 15,000 people a day to disperse amongst you freely semi-holiday only occured because someone did some maths on the back of a fag packet and 1 million people lost their jobs on a monday of government dithering.
Having totally failed to prepare for a pandemic despite having the advantage of an island location several weeks behind that of mainland europe, it is hardly surprising that the government has no plan of what to do next.... simply because there is nothing they can do until everyone is comfortable with 'the plateau of 700 people dying every day (but only if we hold back 50% until later and dont count anyone in the community)' Their hope is three weeks.... but as no effort has been made to contain the spread of the virus which is still merrily bubbling along - then its probably best to copy what those nasty foreigners are doing - and pretend we have the testing and isloation facilities to make it work. |
Couple of things, a vaccine may well be a very long way away so herd immunity may get there first and an island location isn't as great as you think when London is such a massive international hub and thousands upon thousands of students come here from the far east, notably China
We've touched on this before but I'm not sure what sort of lockdown you want, there are people out there with severe mental health problems who are not dealing well with this and the domestic murder rate has doubled since lockdown.
I repeat, there are things the government has done wrong and there will be more errors along the way and it is right to question some things but sitting behind a keyboard and acting like Wolfie Smith is the actions of a sad case. Grow up man. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:20 - Apr 17 with 1433 views | gordon |
Devi Sridhar from Edinburgh Uni is really worth following on Twitter btw for those genuinely interested in an unvarnished, critical view of where we are and what we are doing and what we should be doing.
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:21 - Apr 17 with 1423 views | sparks |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:04 - Apr 17 by BlueNomad |
Spot on! You have saved me a lot of typing, thank you. |
When you are agreeing with a persistent budgie troll, it might be worth re-evaluating! | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:25 - Apr 17 with 1398 views | ITFC_Forever |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:21 - Apr 17 by sparks |
When you are agreeing with a persistent budgie troll, it might be worth re-evaluating! |
Well, when Piers Morgan is getting it right most of the time, we know these are indeed strange and unknown times. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:26 - Apr 17 with 1390 views | GlasgowBlue |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:10 - Apr 17 by lowhouseblue |
the mistrust of science and experts continues unabated i see.
i can't think of another example in uk government when politics and politicians have been so completely secondary to expert scientific advice. and yet twtd still knows better. |
Armchair epidemiologists and doctors with a PhD from the university of Wikipedia. |  |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:29 - Apr 17 with 1380 views | sparks |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:25 - Apr 17 by ITFC_Forever |
Well, when Piers Morgan is getting it right most of the time, we know these are indeed strange and unknown times. |
Piers morgan is looking for cheap shots as usual.
The nonsense about challenging a politican to take a pay cut being a classic example. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:32 - Apr 17 with 1362 views | ITFC_Forever |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:29 - Apr 17 by sparks |
Piers morgan is looking for cheap shots as usual.
The nonsense about challenging a politican to take a pay cut being a classic example. |
There is slightly more wheat amongst his usual chaff than usual.
From an extremely low base, admittedly. | |
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| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:32 - Apr 17 with 1351 views | monytowbray |
| The Government have no idea when the lockdown will finish.... on 09:02 - Apr 17 by lowhouseblue |
what was the herd immunity stage? |
It was the stage that everyone who Shouted TRUST THE SCIENCE and POLITICAL POINT SCORING for an entire weekend in March now claim never happened.
Despite it being something that LITERALLY happened. | |
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