| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... 07:25 - Jun 22 with 8547 views | Libero |
Should we engage or ignore?
Interesting experiences shared and points made in this article from the BBC website this morning that reflects various things I’ve seen on TWTD in recent weeks.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-53000622 [Post edited 22 Jun 2020 7:36]
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:42 - Jun 22 with 2153 views | 26_Paz |
Genuinely racist post need calling out. I do think this board, perhaps more accurately certain individuals that frequent this board, need to be careful about throwing accusations of racism around willy nilly. Apparently the OP in the thread yesterday had a more than suspect posting history, fine call him, grouping others who have agreed with some of his other posts goes a bit far. Just my thoughts. |  |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:42 - Jun 22 with 2144 views | Herbivore |
Interesting article. I think everyone has to make their own decisions and I think when you've directly been on the receiving end of abuse I can see why you might just want to unfriend people posting racist stuff. I've unfriended people for expressing dodgy views myself.
More recently I've been inclined to engage and point out the issues with what they are saying. It might make a difference, it probably won't, but I feel by staying silent I'm complicit and I'm tacitly condoning their bigotry if I don't challenge.
It's clear from some posters on here that being challenged makes them feel uncomfortable but then it probably should, being confronted with your implicit racism or your condoning of those expressing racist views isn't comfortable. I don't really see, though, why we should have to offer safe spaces for racists and those who condone or fail to challenge them. |  |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:43 - Jun 22 with 2138 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:42 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
Genuinely racist post need calling out. I do think this board, perhaps more accurately certain individuals that frequent this board, need to be careful about throwing accusations of racism around willy nilly. Apparently the OP in the thread yesterday had a more than suspect posting history, fine call him, grouping others who have agreed with some of his other posts goes a bit far. Just my thoughts. |
...any thoughts on the article? | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:45 - Jun 22 with 2130 views | 26_Paz |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:43 - Jun 22 by Libero |
...any thoughts on the article? |
Having never been racially abused myself I don’t really feel qualified to comment on what the best way of dealing with it is ... | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:48 - Jun 22 with 2120 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:42 - Jun 22 by Herbivore |
Interesting article. I think everyone has to make their own decisions and I think when you've directly been on the receiving end of abuse I can see why you might just want to unfriend people posting racist stuff. I've unfriended people for expressing dodgy views myself.
More recently I've been inclined to engage and point out the issues with what they are saying. It might make a difference, it probably won't, but I feel by staying silent I'm complicit and I'm tacitly condoning their bigotry if I don't challenge.
It's clear from some posters on here that being challenged makes them feel uncomfortable but then it probably should, being confronted with your implicit racism or your condoning of those expressing racist views isn't comfortable. I don't really see, though, why we should have to offer safe spaces for racists and those who condone or fail to challenge them. |
Quite, your final paragraph echoes my own thoughts.
I’ve never been a fan of sticking people on ignore, I prefer to engage with people or at least to have the option of engaging with people at my own discretion.
Of course if I was a BAME person and was having to digest a lot of the bigotry that’s on offer at the moment I don’t know if I’d hold the same philosophy... | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:49 - Jun 22 with 2114 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:45 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
Having never been racially abused myself I don’t really feel qualified to comment on what the best way of dealing with it is ... |
So that’s a no then... | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:49 - Jun 22 with 2109 views | WeWereZombies |
Always engage, always reason
But there are far better places to do that than FaceBook. |  |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:50 - Jun 22 with 2105 views | Herbivore |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:45 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
Having never been racially abused myself I don’t really feel qualified to comment on what the best way of dealing with it is ... |
Although you felt qualified to say yesterday that the BLM protests were an overreaction, so clearly you do have a view on how Black people should and shouldn't deal with racism. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:50 - Jun 22 with 2105 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:49 - Jun 22 by WeWereZombies |
Always engage, always reason
But there are far better places to do that than FaceBook. |
I can’t imagine the level of sh1t posting happening on Facebook atm, thankfully I removed myself from it 4/5 years ago and don’t have to witness it apart from when the missus shows me something. | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:58 - Jun 22 with 2066 views | Herbivore |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:48 - Jun 22 by Libero |
Quite, your final paragraph echoes my own thoughts.
I’ve never been a fan of sticking people on ignore, I prefer to engage with people or at least to have the option of engaging with people at my own discretion.
Of course if I was a BAME person and was having to digest a lot of the bigotry that’s on offer at the moment I don’t know if I’d hold the same philosophy... |
Absolutely on that last bit. I imagine most people of colour feel quite sick and tired of fighting racism. White people need to step up and start challenging racism and getting our house in order. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:00 - Jun 22 with 2057 views | 26_Paz |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 07:50 - Jun 22 by Herbivore |
Although you felt qualified to say yesterday that the BLM protests were an overreaction, so clearly you do have a view on how Black people should and shouldn't deal with racism. |
I don’t think it should be dealt with by breaching corona restrictions and committing criminal damage. Whether to ignore someone on social media or not is a more difficult one to answer! I.e the answer is not obvious! | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:00 - Jun 22 with 2051 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:00 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
I don’t think it should be dealt with by breaching corona restrictions and committing criminal damage. Whether to ignore someone on social media or not is a more difficult one to answer! I.e the answer is not obvious! |
Still not commenting on anything that’s referenced in the article...
I posted the article for people to read, digest and percolate on, not so that you could just repeat the same stuff you said yesterday and completely ignore the subject of the thread. [Post edited 22 Jun 2020 8:02]
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:02 - Jun 22 with 2041 views | 26_Paz |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:00 - Jun 22 by Libero |
Still not commenting on anything that’s referenced in the article...
I posted the article for people to read, digest and percolate on, not so that you could just repeat the same stuff you said yesterday and completely ignore the subject of the thread. [Post edited 22 Jun 2020 8:02]
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I’ve told you I don’t have anything to say about that. Apologies if you feel I’ve dragged your thread in a direction you didn’t want it to go in. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 with 2040 views | DanTheMan |
My experience has been poor when tried to engage so I no longer really do.
I will sometimes on here, but honestly most of the time I find that people's views won't budge.
It's more likely that I'm not eloquent or persuasive enough to convince them to look inward a bit.
It tends to go a bit better when it's in person though. |  |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 with 2037 views | Herbivore |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:00 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
I don’t think it should be dealt with by breaching corona restrictions and committing criminal damage. Whether to ignore someone on social media or not is a more difficult one to answer! I.e the answer is not obvious! |
So you are able to express a view on how Black people should or shouldn't respond to racism, you're just choosing not to in this particular instance. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 with 2037 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:02 - Jun 22 by 26_Paz |
I’ve told you I don’t have anything to say about that. Apologies if you feel I’ve dragged your thread in a direction you didn’t want it to go in. |
It’s clear you haven’t even read it mate, I’d kindly ask that if all you want to do is rehash the same material you used yesterday then please start or own thread or do so elsewhere. | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:07 - Jun 22 with 2017 views | Herbivore |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 by Libero |
It’s clear you haven’t even read it mate, I’d kindly ask that if all you want to do is rehash the same material you used yesterday then please start or own thread or do so elsewhere. |
We're in phase two of the Paz cycle and we've been here before. He pops up and posts some fairly abhorrent views in phase one. In phase two he tries to feign reasonableness and pretends he either didn't really say or didn't really mean the abhorrent things he said and that he really doesn't mean to upset anyone. In phase three he reverts back to phase one, before then disappearing for a number of months when pulled up on his behaviour. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:08 - Jun 22 with 2015 views | 26_Paz |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 by Libero |
It’s clear you haven’t even read it mate, I’d kindly ask that if all you want to do is rehash the same material you used yesterday then please start or own thread or do so elsewhere. |
I have read it, you did reference yesterday’s thread which was why I gave my views in relation to that. I have already apologised if you thought that inappropriate. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:12 - Jun 22 with 2007 views | itfcjoe |
This board is OTT, those threads do nothing for a more well rounded or balanced approaches on the board.
Some take more satisfaction in telling people they are racist than trying to talk them round a little bit and work out why they hold certain positions. I wouldn't say it's virtue signalling, but more just pious and it puts people off using the board. |  |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:12 - Jun 22 with 1993 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 by DanTheMan |
My experience has been poor when tried to engage so I no longer really do.
I will sometimes on here, but honestly most of the time I find that people's views won't budge.
It's more likely that I'm not eloquent or persuasive enough to convince them to look inward a bit.
It tends to go a bit better when it's in person though. |
I’ve just been brought up to not stand for people being d1cks, be that online or in person.
I also really enjoy creating awkward silences and have no problem with playing the role of social assassin if it’s going to stop a bigot in his tracks.
I don’t remember what year it was but when all that nonsense kicked off between Suarez and Evra I went to the pub to watch United Vs Liverpool, as the camera ran across the line of players a chap I am aware of locally shouted “stupid f*cking n*gger!” when the camera stopped on Evra.
I challenged him on it and his defence was “I can’t be racist, I’m half Maltese”
Not one other person in the pub said anything and when I pulled him up on it you could literally see people shrinking into their seats. I’d like to think if that were to happen in the current climate that people wouldn’t be so reserved. | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:12 - Jun 22 with 1992 views | 26_Paz |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:07 - Jun 22 by Herbivore |
We're in phase two of the Paz cycle and we've been here before. He pops up and posts some fairly abhorrent views in phase one. In phase two he tries to feign reasonableness and pretends he either didn't really say or didn't really mean the abhorrent things he said and that he really doesn't mean to upset anyone. In phase three he reverts back to phase one, before then disappearing for a number of months when pulled up on his behaviour. |
I’m not pretending I didn’t say or mean anything I’ve said, I’ve simply offered apologies if the way I said it offended anyone. When I disappear it’s because I’ve had enough of you lot! | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:15 - Jun 22 with 1983 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:12 - Jun 22 by itfcjoe |
This board is OTT, those threads do nothing for a more well rounded or balanced approaches on the board.
Some take more satisfaction in telling people they are racist than trying to talk them round a little bit and work out why they hold certain positions. I wouldn't say it's virtue signalling, but more just pious and it puts people off using the board. |
I think you’re right, I’m not a fan of that kind of pointless dogma and think it serves to undermine any pertinent point the individual has. | | | |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:15 - Jun 22 with 1978 views | WeWereZombies |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:03 - Jun 22 by DanTheMan |
My experience has been poor when tried to engage so I no longer really do.
I will sometimes on here, but honestly most of the time I find that people's views won't budge.
It's more likely that I'm not eloquent or persuasive enough to convince them to look inward a bit.
It tends to go a bit better when it's in person though. |
Communicating in person rather than on social media is a far more vital discussion (more vital than TWTD I hear you say - yes, even more vital than TWTD), you notice body language and all the non-verbal signs that indicate whether an opinion is strongly held or merely someone playing devil's advocate. This helps you adjust your own arguments more sympathetically (or in the worst of circumstances, more antagonistically) towards the other person(s) with more hope of resolution and understanding.
One of the most regrettable things about lock down has been the de-socialisation of many people and wonder whether coming out of it we will improve our social skills or allow then to just become formulated reduced instruction sets. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:17 - Jun 22 with 1975 views | Herbivore |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:12 - Jun 22 by itfcjoe |
This board is OTT, those threads do nothing for a more well rounded or balanced approaches on the board.
Some take more satisfaction in telling people they are racist than trying to talk them round a little bit and work out why they hold certain positions. I wouldn't say it's virtue signalling, but more just pious and it puts people off using the board. |
It's odd that the focus of your ire is more on those challenging racism than those expressing racist views. I don't really get that to be honest. | |
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| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:19 - Jun 22 with 1968 views | Libero |
| Food for thought after yesterday’s lengthy discussion... on 08:17 - Jun 22 by Herbivore |
It's odd that the focus of your ire is more on those challenging racism than those expressing racist views. I don't really get that to be honest. |
I think Joe makes a fair point, there are posters who only serve to undermine their own point by the manner in which it’s communicated. | | | |
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