| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? 13:24 - Jul 10 with 3946 views | Basuco |
This could be the start of quite a few football clubs going into administration. Could be 12 points for admin and 15 for FFP breeches. |  | | |  |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:29 - Jul 10 with 3891 views | Coco |
Hope so, but they will all blame Covid and probably get some kind of special dispensation when the reality is most have been gleefully hemorrhaging cash for years. Derby surely, SURELY i close to the wall! |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:31 - Jul 10 with 3875 views | Radlett_blue |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:29 - Jul 10 by Coco |
Hope so, but they will all blame Covid and probably get some kind of special dispensation when the reality is most have been gleefully hemorrhaging cash for years. Derby surely, SURELY i close to the wall! |
But if Derby get promoted through the play offs, all is forgiven, right? |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:35 - Jul 10 with 3865 views | hampstead_blue |
Someone pass that big burly bloke the punishment stick for FFP.......
It's going to take a club being made an example of for the others to fall in line.
It's not kind to other fans but I hope they get hit with the ugly stick. QPR dodged it but this time..... |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:45 - Jul 10 with 3808 views | Coco |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:35 - Jul 10 by hampstead_blue |
Someone pass that big burly bloke the punishment stick for FFP.......
It's going to take a club being made an example of for the others to fall in line.
It's not kind to other fans but I hope they get hit with the ugly stick. QPR dodged it but this time..... |
QPR somehow posted they pulled in 35m of revenue the year we went down. HOW? | |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:23 - Jul 10 with 3715 views | WD19 |
Given the state of their wage bill its hardly a surprise.................looking through the list a few days ago made me want to weep. |  | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:27 - Jul 10 with 3698 views | loftboy |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:35 - Jul 10 by hampstead_blue |
Someone pass that big burly bloke the punishment stick for FFP.......
It's going to take a club being made an example of for the others to fall in line.
It's not kind to other fans but I hope they get hit with the ugly stick. QPR dodged it but this time..... |
Hi QPR fan here, been reading this board for several years, been posting as loftboy on various sites since 1998, I find a lot of posts on here very informative, I also read one of the Millwall sites to get a polar opposite view! I find that the QPR site is somewhat in the middle but most political threads end up getting g deleted as they end up in slanging matches.
Anyhow I digress, I felt compelled to register so I could ask what part of a £21 million fine was a club the size of Qpr received was getting off lightly?
I fully understand why we are disliked due to a tunnel Visioned chairman (Tony Fernandes) allowing the likes of Mark Hughes and Harry Redknapp to waste literally tens of millions on complete and utter dross without thinking of the huge debt it was racking up.
Fortunately our current CEO Lee Hoos have nearly got things under control and we are now living within the rules ( no dodgy stadium deals like Wednesday or Derby)
It also means we will never compete at the top end again barring a miracle.
Anyhow sorry for intruding on your excellent board, I’ve always had a soft spot for Ipswich going back to the Bobby Robson days and hope you at least get back to the championship soon. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 14:29]
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:29 - Jul 10 with 3676 views | Libero |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:27 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
Hi QPR fan here, been reading this board for several years, been posting as loftboy on various sites since 1998, I find a lot of posts on here very informative, I also read one of the Millwall sites to get a polar opposite view! I find that the QPR site is somewhat in the middle but most political threads end up getting g deleted as they end up in slanging matches.
Anyhow I digress, I felt compelled to register so I could ask what part of a £21 million fine was a club the size of Qpr received was getting off lightly?
I fully understand why we are disliked due to a tunnel Visioned chairman (Tony Fernandes) allowing the likes of Mark Hughes and Harry Redknapp to waste literally tens of millions on complete and utter dross without thinking of the huge debt it was racking up.
Fortunately our current CEO Lee Hoos have nearly got things under control and we are now living within the rules ( no dodgy stadium deals like Wednesday or Derby)
It also means we will never compete at the top end again barring a miracle.
Anyhow sorry for intruding on your excellent board, I’ve always had a soft spot for Ipswich going back to the Bobby Robson days and hope you at least get back to the championship soon. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 14:29]
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Welcome and cheers for your response.
Usually when this subject comes up and people claim that FFP is "toothless" I do highlight that the likes of yourself and Derby have received sizeable fines, I'm not sure why this doesn't register with people but it should. |  | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 15:19 - Jul 10 with 3533 views | hampstead_blue |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:27 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
Hi QPR fan here, been reading this board for several years, been posting as loftboy on various sites since 1998, I find a lot of posts on here very informative, I also read one of the Millwall sites to get a polar opposite view! I find that the QPR site is somewhat in the middle but most political threads end up getting g deleted as they end up in slanging matches.
Anyhow I digress, I felt compelled to register so I could ask what part of a £21 million fine was a club the size of Qpr received was getting off lightly?
I fully understand why we are disliked due to a tunnel Visioned chairman (Tony Fernandes) allowing the likes of Mark Hughes and Harry Redknapp to waste literally tens of millions on complete and utter dross without thinking of the huge debt it was racking up.
Fortunately our current CEO Lee Hoos have nearly got things under control and we are now living within the rules ( no dodgy stadium deals like Wednesday or Derby)
It also means we will never compete at the top end again barring a miracle.
Anyhow sorry for intruding on your excellent board, I’ve always had a soft spot for Ipswich going back to the Bobby Robson days and hope you at least get back to the championship soon. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 14:29]
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Nice to have you.
Glad you're free of those 'grey' dealings.
Good luck with your new model. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 15:32 - Jul 10 with 3498 views | Bent_double |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:29 - Jul 10 by Libero |
Welcome and cheers for your response.
Usually when this subject comes up and people claim that FFP is "toothless" I do highlight that the likes of yourself and Derby have received sizeable fines, I'm not sure why this doesn't register with people but it should. |
Isn't the QPR fine spread over 10 years or something though?
Could be wrong on that and happy to be corrected, but if that's right it's why people feel they have got off lightly.
You can be sure they happily spent more than £20m on buying players and their salaries to get promoted, yet when it comes to paying the fine they plead poverty and only have to pay a couple of million a year, which they can do without having to sell off assets. |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 15:47 - Jul 10 with 3451 views | loftboy |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 15:32 - Jul 10 by Bent_double |
Isn't the QPR fine spread over 10 years or something though?
Could be wrong on that and happy to be corrected, but if that's right it's why people feel they have got off lightly.
You can be sure they happily spent more than £20m on buying players and their salaries to get promoted, yet when it comes to paying the fine they plead poverty and only have to pay a couple of million a year, which they can do without having to sell off assets. |
2 million a year is a helll of a lot out of our budget, yes we were wrong how we spent but the only other club to be punished since is Birmingham who got a nonsense points deduction which meant they finished in a slightly lower mid table position.
Incidentally all that fine goes to charity and QPR have nominated Grenfell as the chosen charity.
Anyhow how can fining any club a huge amount help with their FFP situation, surely the EFL should be working towards getting teams to work within their constraints not making it worse.
As I said previously QPR are now complying fully and will be using this to bring them in young or cheap and sell them off once they’ve become the finished product, something we have always been good at previously ( Paul Parker, Les Ferdinand, Trevor Sinclair Andy Sinton etc) our first crop to come through this way post Redknapp is just bearing fruit , Eze, Bright Samuel and Manning.
The team is great to watch most weeks and going to games is once again enjoyable. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 15:49]
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:54 - Jul 10 with 3133 views | Bent_double |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 15:47 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
2 million a year is a helll of a lot out of our budget, yes we were wrong how we spent but the only other club to be punished since is Birmingham who got a nonsense points deduction which meant they finished in a slightly lower mid table position.
Incidentally all that fine goes to charity and QPR have nominated Grenfell as the chosen charity.
Anyhow how can fining any club a huge amount help with their FFP situation, surely the EFL should be working towards getting teams to work within their constraints not making it worse.
As I said previously QPR are now complying fully and will be using this to bring them in young or cheap and sell them off once they’ve become the finished product, something we have always been good at previously ( Paul Parker, Les Ferdinand, Trevor Sinclair Andy Sinton etc) our first crop to come through this way post Redknapp is just bearing fruit , Eze, Bright Samuel and Manning.
The team is great to watch most weeks and going to games is once again enjoyable. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 15:49]
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The EFL are part of the problem for sure, as they seem unable to apply the rules fairly across clubs with vastly different finances.
I agree a fine doesn't really help - but I also thought that originally any fines would be shared equally between the other clubs in the league, as they are the ones who suffered from a club - like QPR - breaking the rules.
I'm glad you have a young, talented, exciting team to watch, we were forced to sell off all our best players on the cheap when we went into administration, something we have never really recovered from (although there may be other reasons for that!), so sorry, but I will never feel that your 'punishment' was severe or even apt for that matter. | |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:08 - Jul 10 with 3104 views | loftboy |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:54 - Jul 10 by Bent_double |
The EFL are part of the problem for sure, as they seem unable to apply the rules fairly across clubs with vastly different finances.
I agree a fine doesn't really help - but I also thought that originally any fines would be shared equally between the other clubs in the league, as they are the ones who suffered from a club - like QPR - breaking the rules.
I'm glad you have a young, talented, exciting team to watch, we were forced to sell off all our best players on the cheap when we went into administration, something we have never really recovered from (although there may be other reasons for that!), so sorry, but I will never feel that your 'punishment' was severe or even apt for that matter. |
What was your punishment for going into admin? I know the 12 point deduction was brought in after Leicester basically failed to pay all their creditors then got promoted the following season.
On a side note QPR was going to refuse topay any fine for the FFP breach and go through the appeal courts but was basically told that their “golden ticket” would be withdrawn meaning we were effectively kicked out the league, which to me smacked of blackmail. | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:26 - Jul 10 with 3062 views | Libero |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:08 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
What was your punishment for going into admin? I know the 12 point deduction was brought in after Leicester basically failed to pay all their creditors then got promoted the following season.
On a side note QPR was going to refuse topay any fine for the FFP breach and go through the appeal courts but was basically told that their “golden ticket” would be withdrawn meaning we were effectively kicked out the league, which to me smacked of blackmail. |
The last 20 years. | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:40 - Jul 10 with 3024 views | Bent_double |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:08 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
What was your punishment for going into admin? I know the 12 point deduction was brought in after Leicester basically failed to pay all their creditors then got promoted the following season.
On a side note QPR was going to refuse topay any fine for the FFP breach and go through the appeal courts but was basically told that their “golden ticket” would be withdrawn meaning we were effectively kicked out the league, which to me smacked of blackmail. |
Libero beat me to it: 20 years and counting in the Championship, L1 and who knows where next!
Wasn't it well known at the time that if any of the clubs who got promoted by breaching FFP, then got relegated, they would be expelled from the league if they refused to pay the fine?
I guess it was the only realistic threat the EFL had. | |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 22:33 - Jul 10 with 2872 views | loftboy |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 20:40 - Jul 10 by Bent_double |
Libero beat me to it: 20 years and counting in the Championship, L1 and who knows where next!
Wasn't it well known at the time that if any of the clubs who got promoted by breaching FFP, then got relegated, they would be expelled from the league if they refused to pay the fine?
I guess it was the only realistic threat the EFL had. |
But they’ve since changed the rules again, so no one will get the fine we got. It will be a millstone around the clubs neck for ten years, yet Birmingham basically got demoted a couple of places and that’s it. The points deduction is the way forward and it should be a fixed amount for every club that fails FFP no matter by what amount. iMHO of course.
Will be interesting what the EFL do to Villa when they come down as last season they massively breached FFP and have yet to be punished for it. | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 23:04 - Jul 10 with 2806 views | Bent_double |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 22:33 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
But they’ve since changed the rules again, so no one will get the fine we got. It will be a millstone around the clubs neck for ten years, yet Birmingham basically got demoted a couple of places and that’s it. The points deduction is the way forward and it should be a fixed amount for every club that fails FFP no matter by what amount. iMHO of course.
Will be interesting what the EFL do to Villa when they come down as last season they massively breached FFP and have yet to be punished for it. |
Well yes, Villa and Bournemouth too. I agreed that there should be a points deduction, especially as clubs like those would be able to pay a £20-30m fine by selling a single player, if they even had to. | |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 04:46 - Jul 11 with 2674 views | WednesdayJon |
Have Ipswich ever been in Administration?
And what was the resulting points deduction? | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 06:18 - Jul 11 with 2636 views | Mach_foreignBlue |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 04:46 - Jul 11 by WednesdayJon |
Have Ipswich ever been in Administration?
And what was the resulting points deduction? |
You pay astronomical wages to the 'goal machine' Jordan Rhodes so no wonder you've ended up where you are. This Norwich fairy had refused to approach the penalty pending your play-off semi-final to Huddersfield. Says it all.
Does he still have a dream to play in the Premier League? Mind you Carlos once had a dream too. |  | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 07:37 - Jul 11 with 2552 views | WestStanderLaLaLa |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 04:46 - Jul 11 by WednesdayJon |
Have Ipswich ever been in Administration?
And what was the resulting points deduction? |
Yes and none. I can also confirm Ipswich haven’t sold their ground for a massively inflated price and been sponsored by fake companies in an attempt to cheat FFP rules. |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:15 - Jul 12 with 2175 views | WednesdayJon |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 07:37 - Jul 11 by WestStanderLaLaLa |
Yes and none. I can also confirm Ipswich haven’t sold their ground for a massively inflated price and been sponsored by fake companies in an attempt to cheat FFP rules. |
May i respectfully point out that we have not been found guilty of any of the charges you mention .. The ground sale was approved by the EFL at the time it took place.
I don't like the creative accounting or loophole exploiting any more than you do. . . . But, as yet, we haven't been found 'guilty' .
And, don't forget an awful lot of small businesses lost out when your club went into admin, that's the point i was trying to make. You are no more squeaky clean than anyone else.
I hate to see fans of any club suffer through these financial shenanigans, because it IS always the fans and local businesses who suffer. Not the incompetent EFL or the corrupt or incompetent owners.
But, thus far, ITFC has been no more snowy white than any other club i'm afraid. | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:58 - Jul 12 with 2067 views | borge |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:15 - Jul 12 by WednesdayJon |
May i respectfully point out that we have not been found guilty of any of the charges you mention .. The ground sale was approved by the EFL at the time it took place.
I don't like the creative accounting or loophole exploiting any more than you do. . . . But, as yet, we haven't been found 'guilty' .
And, don't forget an awful lot of small businesses lost out when your club went into admin, that's the point i was trying to make. You are no more squeaky clean than anyone else.
I hate to see fans of any club suffer through these financial shenanigans, because it IS always the fans and local businesses who suffer. Not the incompetent EFL or the corrupt or incompetent owners.
But, thus far, ITFC has been no more snowy white than any other club i'm afraid. |
Unfortunately we have. We've stuck rigidly to the rules over the past decade (whether that's in order to do the right thing or to save Marcus Evans a few bob may be debatable), very much to our own detriment given there is no reward for doing so and limited punishment for breaking the rules (although I do accept QPR have been punished).
Where we were lucky is that we went into administration before points deductions came into place (in fact they came in because of our administration). However, that wasn't due to some reckless attempt to buy promotion. We were reckless in so much as we decided to build two new stands and spend not insignificant sums on players, but at the time we'd just come fifth in the Premiership and there was no reason to suspect it would go wrong. Our subsequent demise coincided with the collapse of ITV Digital which meant that what had been within our means no longer was.
Ultimately it's not within the control of the fans what money is or isn't spent, so what the fairest form of punishment is I am not sure. However, the rules have to be applied far more consistently than they have been. | | | |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 21:01 - Jul 12 with 2001 views | bournemouthblue |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 13:31 - Jul 10 by Radlett_blue |
But if Derby get promoted through the play offs, all is forgiven, right? |
That seems to be how it works :( |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 21:10 - Jul 12 with 1984 views | midastouch |
The last time Sheff Wed played well was when I was playing with them on Sensible Soccer! |  |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 21:45 - Jul 12 with 1886 views | bournemouthblue |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 19:58 - Jul 12 by borge |
Unfortunately we have. We've stuck rigidly to the rules over the past decade (whether that's in order to do the right thing or to save Marcus Evans a few bob may be debatable), very much to our own detriment given there is no reward for doing so and limited punishment for breaking the rules (although I do accept QPR have been punished).
Where we were lucky is that we went into administration before points deductions came into place (in fact they came in because of our administration). However, that wasn't due to some reckless attempt to buy promotion. We were reckless in so much as we decided to build two new stands and spend not insignificant sums on players, but at the time we'd just come fifth in the Premiership and there was no reason to suspect it would go wrong. Our subsequent demise coincided with the collapse of ITV Digital which meant that what had been within our means no longer was.
Ultimately it's not within the control of the fans what money is or isn't spent, so what the fairest form of punishment is I am not sure. However, the rules have to be applied far more consistently than they have been. |
This also predated the sizeable parachute payments sides now get
We came down with Leicester and Derby
Derby have managed one season of Premier League football since that time and Leicester until the Thai owners had only got back for a season themselves, the rest there is history but it took all three clubs a long time to recover from
Ironically, it probably resulted in the parachute payment system which then undermined us from then on | |
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| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 08:12 - Jul 13 with 1691 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Sheffield Wednesday close to admin? on 14:27 - Jul 10 by loftboy |
Hi QPR fan here, been reading this board for several years, been posting as loftboy on various sites since 1998, I find a lot of posts on here very informative, I also read one of the Millwall sites to get a polar opposite view! I find that the QPR site is somewhat in the middle but most political threads end up getting g deleted as they end up in slanging matches.
Anyhow I digress, I felt compelled to register so I could ask what part of a £21 million fine was a club the size of Qpr received was getting off lightly?
I fully understand why we are disliked due to a tunnel Visioned chairman (Tony Fernandes) allowing the likes of Mark Hughes and Harry Redknapp to waste literally tens of millions on complete and utter dross without thinking of the huge debt it was racking up.
Fortunately our current CEO Lee Hoos have nearly got things under control and we are now living within the rules ( no dodgy stadium deals like Wednesday or Derby)
It also means we will never compete at the top end again barring a miracle.
Anyhow sorry for intruding on your excellent board, I’ve always had a soft spot for Ipswich going back to the Bobby Robson days and hope you at least get back to the championship soon. [Post edited 10 Jul 2020 14:29]
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It’s probably because £21m doesn’t feel much of a fine when the reward for breaking the rules is £100m+ in TV money and parachute payments |  |
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