| But can we call it Fascism yet? 19:46 - Jul 10 with 2831 views | monytowbray |
It’s a wobbly for sure in relation to the net closing in, but this reply nails it.
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| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:33 - Jul 13 with 567 views | Libero |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:23 - Jul 13 by eireblue |
If it walks pretty damn close to the way a duck walks, and talks in very similar manner, and looks remarkably similar to a ducks that have been observed before.
Then it is just a duck of a type you haven’t seen before.
What I don’t like about some of these articles, is the attitude expressed, i.e. people shouldn’t call Trump a fascist, because it appeals to his base, and he will use that.
That is simply giving in to a bully.
If you think someone is a racist, call them a racist. Ditto fascist. |
Yup, I agree with you, I believe that Trumps team cultivates his public persona and behaviour to generate that potential conflict within people about defining his actions in the hope that it muddies the waters just enough without ever losing their plausible deniability. |  | | |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:33 - Jul 13 with 563 views | DanTheMan |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:23 - Jul 13 by eireblue |
If it walks pretty damn close to the way a duck walks, and talks in very similar manner, and looks remarkably similar to a ducks that have been observed before.
Then it is just a duck of a type you haven’t seen before.
What I don’t like about some of these articles, is the attitude expressed, i.e. people shouldn’t call Trump a fascist, because it appeals to his base, and he will use that.
That is simply giving in to a bully.
If you think someone is a racist, call them a racist. Ditto fascist. |
I don't entirely disagree, I certainly don't think it's really wrong to label him as a fascist, arguments could certainly be made for and against it. And definitely by people who actually study this stuff rather than me!
I do, begrudgingly, see the point of the article though. Calling him a fascist just gets the heckles up, it is basically a swear word. I don't know what the actual way round it is, short of a new word
Populism kind of works but doesn't have the same impact. I remember someone on here saying "what's wrong with doing what's popular?" which sort of misses the point. |  |
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| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:39 - Jul 13 with 554 views | Libero |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:33 - Jul 13 by DanTheMan |
I don't entirely disagree, I certainly don't think it's really wrong to label him as a fascist, arguments could certainly be made for and against it. And definitely by people who actually study this stuff rather than me!
I do, begrudgingly, see the point of the article though. Calling him a fascist just gets the heckles up, it is basically a swear word. I don't know what the actual way round it is, short of a new word
Populism kind of works but doesn't have the same impact. I remember someone on here saying "what's wrong with doing what's popular?" which sort of misses the point. |
I think you're living in the same grey area I am,
it's an area that traps a lot of reasonable people - I do acknowledge though that unfortunately the lack of definition probably only helps the likes of Trump to avoid being held to account.
In my heart I feel he is a fascist, but my head say's similar to what you've posted there, that using the term could possibly be counter productive.
Trump's brand of hypernormalisation/kayfabe like populism and bigotry is new, but there's no doubt that it's routes are in good old fashioned fascism.
I think a more pertinent but less catchy question than "can we call it Fascism yet?" is "how do we go about effectively combating this rhetoric without pouring more fuel on the fire?" [Post edited 13 Jul 2020 10:42]
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| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 11:32 - Jul 13 with 522 views | GlasgowBlue |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 10:39 - Jul 13 by Libero |
I think you're living in the same grey area I am,
it's an area that traps a lot of reasonable people - I do acknowledge though that unfortunately the lack of definition probably only helps the likes of Trump to avoid being held to account.
In my heart I feel he is a fascist, but my head say's similar to what you've posted there, that using the term could possibly be counter productive.
Trump's brand of hypernormalisation/kayfabe like populism and bigotry is new, but there's no doubt that it's routes are in good old fashioned fascism.
I think a more pertinent but less catchy question than "can we call it Fascism yet?" is "how do we go about effectively combating this rhetoric without pouring more fuel on the fire?" [Post edited 13 Jul 2020 10:42]
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Getting the Democrat vote out in huge numbers come November and consigning Trump to the dustbin. |  |
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| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 11:39 - Jul 13 with 508 views | Libero |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 11:32 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue |
Getting the Democrat vote out in huge numbers come November and consigning Trump to the dustbin. |
I just can't see Biden inspiring people who traditionally are non-voters.
I also think there will be plenty of voter suppression and dirty tricks from Trump, long story short, I'll be sincerely surprised if Donald Trump walks away from the job with no fuss.
It's going to get dirty. | | | |
| But can we call it Fascism yet? on 12:39 - Jul 13 with 459 views | Kropotkin123 |
Trump isn't a fascist.
The biggest mistake with labelling him a fascist is not understanding fascist economics - Corporatism, Autarky. The closest Trump gets is crony capitalism and protectionism.
The other key difference is around the notion of the individual vs the state. Trump undermines and devalues the state, whereas fascists promote unity through the state and actively try and strengthen its control through all walks of life.
I read someone saying call a duck a duck. But for me it is like calling a goose a duck. sure they resemble each other. But they are not the same and recognising the differences are important for opposing the unique issues both produce.
The other thing is that Trump gets a huge amount of blame. He is a right-wing extremist, a racist, an authoritarian and more. But America's problems didn't start with him. He is exploiting the wide-ranging institutionalised issues in American politics. Eg, he didn't give himself the power to pardon his mate, that already exists. The Democrats didn't seek to remove it, they used it too.
America's issues should also shine a light on issues in this country. But no one is prepared to document and address them, particularly when it threatens their access to power now or in the future. Corporate clientelism, accountability, systems of voting, the list goes on. |  |
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