| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa 20:02 - Aug 6 with 7321 views | reusersfreekicks |
These are key states. I just don't understand what is the matter with people?
Wilful ignorance? Stupidity? Nasty human beings? How can so many people support such a dangerous idiot? |  | | |  |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:16 - Aug 7 with 3036 views | tractordownsouth |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 07:43 - Aug 7 by Guthrum |
I think Trump himself will fade into the background fairly rapidly. The danger is that the next figurehead his backers find might be less of a loose canon.
Tho it's equally possible it may be a series of more orthodox hard-right characters, but lower profile, less media-cunning, weaker and more divisive within the group. Much like happened with the BNP and with UKIP after the departure of Griffin and Farage respectively. |
Will be interesting to see who runs for the Republicans in 2024. I imagine Marco Rubio will have another go but he seems too moderate to follow on from Trump. Ted Cruz will also probably try again as his senate seat will probably flip blue in 2024 and he may be seen as a slightly less crazy version of Trump whilst keeping the hard right on side - shows how far we’ve come when Ted Cruz is seen as a more sensible choice than the incumbent.
Of the Trump kids, only Ivanka seems reasonably intelligent, whereas the two sons are both thick as mince and riding off their father’s coattails, rather ironically considering the Republicans’ fascination with personal responsibility. Wouldn’t rule them out though as the current incumbent has proven you don’t need to be clever to lead a successful campaign.
Wouldn’t rule out Paul Ryan either. I think it may have been a tactical decision for him to duck out in 2018 and disassociate himself from Trump - he’s still only 50 so I’d be surprised if he doesn’t have ambitions |  |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:20 - Aug 7 with 3029 views | pointofblue |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 21:38 - Aug 6 by SpruceMoose |
No need to apologise! The American electoral system is...um... a mess! |
Clinton and May pulled in more votes than Trump and Johnson (in the following election) yet they lost/had a minority Government whilst the men in question won outright.
Democracy in action. |  |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:23 - Aug 7 with 3025 views | Guthrum |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:16 - Aug 7 by tractordownsouth |
Will be interesting to see who runs for the Republicans in 2024. I imagine Marco Rubio will have another go but he seems too moderate to follow on from Trump. Ted Cruz will also probably try again as his senate seat will probably flip blue in 2024 and he may be seen as a slightly less crazy version of Trump whilst keeping the hard right on side - shows how far we’ve come when Ted Cruz is seen as a more sensible choice than the incumbent.
Of the Trump kids, only Ivanka seems reasonably intelligent, whereas the two sons are both thick as mince and riding off their father’s coattails, rather ironically considering the Republicans’ fascination with personal responsibility. Wouldn’t rule them out though as the current incumbent has proven you don’t need to be clever to lead a successful campaign.
Wouldn’t rule out Paul Ryan either. I think it may have been a tactical decision for him to duck out in 2018 and disassociate himself from Trump - he’s still only 50 so I’d be surprised if he doesn’t have ambitions |
There could well be a swing back the other way, towards a more traditional and moderate Republican candidate. Especially so if Trump loses heavily in November, that will go a long way towards discrediting the alt-right elements of the Party and strengthening their opponents. |  |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:40 - Aug 7 with 3004 views | Libero |
It's irrelevant where he is or isn't ahead, he's not leaving the white house. [Post edited 7 Aug 2020 9:49]
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 09:17 - Aug 7 with 2990 views | Guthrum |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 20:55 - Aug 6 by SpruceMoose |
Texan cities are generally pretty liberal though, I think it's a rural thing. Even in New York state the upstate super white areas lean heavily to Trump. Maybe it's harder to demonise people when they are your neighbours and colleagues and you know first hand that they largely face all the same struggles as you do.
It's easy to get people to turn on the people they don't mix with, especially when they've been deliberately kept poor and uneducated. [Post edited 6 Aug 2020 21:09]
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Indeed. One thing which really struck me about the rural US (in areas like Wyoming, Idaho and Oregon) is how far apart places are. In England you can often see the church tower of one village from another, rarely are they much more than an hour's walk apart. In the US it might be an hour's drive or more between small towns. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 09:39 - Aug 7 with 2974 views | tractordownsouth |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:23 - Aug 7 by Guthrum |
There could well be a swing back the other way, towards a more traditional and moderate Republican candidate. Especially so if Trump loses heavily in November, that will go a long way towards discrediting the alt-right elements of the Party and strengthening their opponents. |
Which is why I think Paul Ryan is in with a shot. He still holds all the hard-right economic views and is pro-life, which will appeal to the solid Republican base (who make up about 30% of the electorate) but isn't implicated in all of Trump's scandals and has tactically distanced himself from the carnage, although has stopped short of speaking out against it.
It may be similar to how Starmer won the Labour leadership contest, by distancing himself from the decisions of Corbyn but not speaking out too strongly against the previous leadership as he realised he needed to win votes their supporters. Although of course that election happened only a few months after a defeat, whereas the Republican 2024 race won't begin for another 2.5 years after the election. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 10:21 - Aug 7 with 2947 views | Darth_Koont |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 20:37 - Aug 6 by Guthrum |
That and fear. Fear of the "other", of change, of the upsetting of the social order. As if Texas would instantly become a vision of liberal, cosmopolitan New York. |
Agreed. I think that's more accurate.
There's a lot who hate/fear Muslims because they don't know any. Who think Mexicans are simultaneously lazy and are going to steal their job. Who think "Socialism" is about taking away everyone's happiness and their guns, and turning their kids gay. |  |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 10:24 - Aug 7 with 2934 views | Keno |
Yeah but Texas is like a large version of Norfolk so what do you expect? |  |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 10:29 - Aug 7 with 2928 views | Darth_Koont |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 09:39 - Aug 7 by tractordownsouth |
Which is why I think Paul Ryan is in with a shot. He still holds all the hard-right economic views and is pro-life, which will appeal to the solid Republican base (who make up about 30% of the electorate) but isn't implicated in all of Trump's scandals and has tactically distanced himself from the carnage, although has stopped short of speaking out against it.
It may be similar to how Starmer won the Labour leadership contest, by distancing himself from the decisions of Corbyn but not speaking out too strongly against the previous leadership as he realised he needed to win votes their supporters. Although of course that election happened only a few months after a defeat, whereas the Republican 2024 race won't begin for another 2.5 years after the election. |
But Starmer didn't distance himself from the "decisions of Corbyn" during the leadership contest. His Ten Pledges were a continuation of those policies and he doubled down on his own Brexit position. None of which were bad IMO.
He's distanced himself AFTER the leadership contest and increasingly looks to be something else entirely as leader. Which shows a worrying lack of principles and genuine direction. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 12:09 - Aug 7 with 2865 views | SpruceMoose |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:16 - Aug 7 by tractordownsouth |
Will be interesting to see who runs for the Republicans in 2024. I imagine Marco Rubio will have another go but he seems too moderate to follow on from Trump. Ted Cruz will also probably try again as his senate seat will probably flip blue in 2024 and he may be seen as a slightly less crazy version of Trump whilst keeping the hard right on side - shows how far we’ve come when Ted Cruz is seen as a more sensible choice than the incumbent.
Of the Trump kids, only Ivanka seems reasonably intelligent, whereas the two sons are both thick as mince and riding off their father’s coattails, rather ironically considering the Republicans’ fascination with personal responsibility. Wouldn’t rule them out though as the current incumbent has proven you don’t need to be clever to lead a successful campaign.
Wouldn’t rule out Paul Ryan either. I think it may have been a tactical decision for him to duck out in 2018 and disassociate himself from Trump - he’s still only 50 so I’d be surprised if he doesn’t have ambitions |
I think Nikki Haley will be keeping an eye on the situation.
Paul Ryan is dead and buried. Ivanka is every bit as thick as the other Trumps, she just knows enough to keep quiet.
I think the Republicans will be looking for another Trump, but a smooth, intelligent one. Someone who can push their agenda with charm and without all the extra poo flinging noise of the last four years. Someone incredibly dangerous.
That ain't Ted Cruz. [Post edited 8 Aug 2020 4:18]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 12:23 - Aug 7 with 2855 views | ElephantintheRoom |
You do realise Boris Johnson is still supported by the same % of people who voted him in?
It's easy to sneer at people who feel ignored for decades from distance - but if you take a trip through what used to be small town america anywhere almost anywhere in 'the flyover states' you can understand it.... especially when there was such a dramatic upturn in the economy, jobs and prosperity in these areas pre 'the chinese virus'... of course all that would have happened anyway in a global upturn - but hey... who needs reality?
And the death rates in the USA are stilll way down on the UK... whch brungs me back to point one. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:26 - Aug 7 with 2821 views | tractordownsouth |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 10:29 - Aug 7 by Darth_Koont |
But Starmer didn't distance himself from the "decisions of Corbyn" during the leadership contest. His Ten Pledges were a continuation of those policies and he doubled down on his own Brexit position. None of which were bad IMO.
He's distanced himself AFTER the leadership contest and increasingly looks to be something else entirely as leader. Which shows a worrying lack of principles and genuine direction. |
He didn’t double down on his Brexit position, he said the argument was over.
As for the 10 pledges, a lot of the stuff will be in the manifesto but some of it won’t as the post-covid economic situation is a different kettle of fish. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:33 - Aug 7 with 2815 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 12:23 - Aug 7 by ElephantintheRoom |
You do realise Boris Johnson is still supported by the same % of people who voted him in?
It's easy to sneer at people who feel ignored for decades from distance - but if you take a trip through what used to be small town america anywhere almost anywhere in 'the flyover states' you can understand it.... especially when there was such a dramatic upturn in the economy, jobs and prosperity in these areas pre 'the chinese virus'... of course all that would have happened anyway in a global upturn - but hey... who needs reality?
And the death rates in the USA are stilll way down on the UK... whch brungs me back to point one. |
"And the death rates in the USA are stilll way down on the UK... whch brungs me back to point one."
By what measure? I assume you mean per capita? It's not really valid to look at that whilst one country has a huge upward slope and one doesn't.
Do you want to revisit your previous posts on the trajectory/gradient and shape of the graphs or just yell and say I am an idiot and modelling is stupid?
SB [Post edited 7 Aug 2020 16:36]
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:35 - Aug 7 with 2811 views | StokieBlue |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:20 - Aug 7 by pointofblue |
Clinton and May pulled in more votes than Trump and Johnson (in the following election) yet they lost/had a minority Government whilst the men in question won outright.
Democracy in action. |
May didn't get as many votes as Johnson and Johnson was further aided by the opposition losing nearly 3m votes so it's not quite as simple as your sentence suggests.
You are entirely right that both the US and UK voting systems are not really fit for purpose though.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:55 - Aug 7 with 2792 views | Darth_Koont |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:26 - Aug 7 by tractordownsouth |
He didn’t double down on his Brexit position, he said the argument was over.
As for the 10 pledges, a lot of the stuff will be in the manifesto but some of it won’t as the post-covid economic situation is a different kettle of fish. |
Sorry, but that's not true. We were talking about his leadership campaign weren't we?
I agree that he's shifted away from these things since then. That's my point.
And why on earth has Covid-19 meant progressive politics are now less likely??!! The notion that progressive politics goes against sound economics is an entirely fallacious mantra.
Let's put climate change on hold too while we're at it. Oh ... | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 15:10 - Aug 7 with 2757 views | tractordownsouth |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 13:55 - Aug 7 by Darth_Koont |
Sorry, but that's not true. We were talking about his leadership campaign weren't we?
I agree that he's shifted away from these things since then. That's my point.
And why on earth has Covid-19 meant progressive politics are now less likely??!! The notion that progressive politics goes against sound economics is an entirely fallacious mantra.
Let's put climate change on hold too while we're at it. Oh ... |
I'm not saying that would be my view but that may be a reason for doing it. Besides, I'm not entirely sure which pledges he has rowed back on.
The climate target story came from a statement from one of Starmer's team saying that the entirety of the previous manifesto was under review, and a few journalists jumped on it to get a dramatic headline. Ed Miliband (who I believe is partly responsible for that policy, along with Luke Pollard) has since said it's staying in place. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 16:27 - Aug 7 with 2726 views | Darth_Koont |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 15:10 - Aug 7 by tractordownsouth |
I'm not saying that would be my view but that may be a reason for doing it. Besides, I'm not entirely sure which pledges he has rowed back on.
The climate target story came from a statement from one of Starmer's team saying that the entirety of the previous manifesto was under review, and a few journalists jumped on it to get a dramatic headline. Ed Miliband (who I believe is partly responsible for that policy, along with Luke Pollard) has since said it's staying in place. |
He hasn't pushed his pledges either. And I think there are a number of relevant questions raised here that need addressing (along with some that are a little semantic I'll admit).
https://actionnetwork.org/petitions/10-broken-pledges
On top of that he's been utterly useless as a unity figure and only deepened the factionalism.
So I hope he seriously picks up his game in terms of much-needed policy and leadership. Winning over a few Guardian columnists and the self-serving Labour politicos doesn't give me any real hope of a positive future for the UK. In fact, quite the opposite. | |
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| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 04:11 - Aug 8 with 2644 views | SpruceMoose |
| Trump still ahead in Texas, Georgia and Iowa on 08:40 - Aug 7 by Libero |
It's irrelevant where he is or isn't ahead, he's not leaving the white house. [Post edited 7 Aug 2020 9:49]
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I usually like your posts Libby, but you've swung and missed on a few Trump related ones lately.
The idea that if Trump loses the election he can just refuse to leave the WH and over half the country, the federal and state governments, the army, the secret service and the courts will just shrug their shoulders and say 'well shucks, he's out thunks us here! Guess there's nothing we can do about this!' is a bit silly.
As soon as he knows he's lost he is more likely to be on a plane to whatever country doesn't have an extradition treaty with the US, where he will spend the rest of his days flinging shït on Twitter.
Saying that, play on, no harm in your opinion. But it is a bit of a daft one. Unless I've misunderstood what you meant somehow? [Post edited 8 Aug 2020 4:15]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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