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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... 11:06 - Aug 11 with 6537 viewsLibero

If you're the owner of a business that's participating in the "eat out to help out" scheme, what exactly is stopping you from putting through a bunch of fictional meal receipts, dropping the requisite amount of your own money into the till and claiming back the percentage due from the government?

Free money, no?

[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:06]
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:09 - Aug 11 with 4264 viewsKeno

what sort of animal do you get fictional meat from?

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:11 - Aug 11 with 4253 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:09 - Aug 11 by Keno

what sort of animal do you get fictional meat from?


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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:19 - Aug 11 with 4204 viewsfactual_blue

1. Your expenditure won't match your income.
2. When you submit your tax returns HMRC will spot this.
3. They will then turn your life upside down.
4. You'll end up in court as, in effect, a benefit scrounger.
5. You will, however, be allowed to keep your golf club membership (unless you're BAME).

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:22 - Aug 11 with 4191 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:19 - Aug 11 by factual_blue

1. Your expenditure won't match your income.
2. When you submit your tax returns HMRC will spot this.
3. They will then turn your life upside down.
4. You'll end up in court as, in effect, a benefit scrounger.
5. You will, however, be allowed to keep your golf club membership (unless you're BAME).


Surely if you're using cash from your personal account(s) into your business account(s) that's irrelevant? You're essentially investing the cash into the business surreptitiously in order to dishonestly gain the benefit from the "eat out to help out" scheme.

It looks like a bit of an obvious loophole to me, I'm sure someone's exploiting it, somewhere.
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:25]
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:25 - Aug 11 with 4163 viewsfactual_blue

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:22 - Aug 11 by Libero

Surely if you're using cash from your personal account(s) into your business account(s) that's irrelevant? You're essentially investing the cash into the business surreptitiously in order to dishonestly gain the benefit from the "eat out to help out" scheme.

It looks like a bit of an obvious loophole to me, I'm sure someone's exploiting it, somewhere.
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:25]


'Mr Libero, you've taken twice as much money as normal, but your purchases haven't increased. Why is that?'

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:27 - Aug 11 with 4154 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:25 - Aug 11 by factual_blue

'Mr Libero, you've taken twice as much money as normal, but your purchases haven't increased. Why is that?'


"We've had to make cost cutting measures to ensure the business survived Covid-19, a lot of the portion sizes of our meals have significantly shrunk, as a result, this has meant we're purchased less"
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:27]
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:29 - Aug 11 with 4127 viewsgiant_stow

Wasn't the real money in that business loan scheme, where you could borrow up to 50 grand and then shut the business after you'd spent it?

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:32 - Aug 11 with 4100 viewsbluefunk

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:22 - Aug 11 by Libero

Surely if you're using cash from your personal account(s) into your business account(s) that's irrelevant? You're essentially investing the cash into the business surreptitiously in order to dishonestly gain the benefit from the "eat out to help out" scheme.

It looks like a bit of an obvious loophole to me, I'm sure someone's exploiting it, somewhere.
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:25]


Money from your own resources has been taxed before you get it. Putting that money back into the till in the way you describe merely ensures its taxed as business income, then again as income tax to you when you try to take it out of the business (assuming its a limited company). It would take a lot of £10 rebates to make that worthwhile, and thats without noting that the £10 allowance is also taxed as income

so not worth doing
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:32 - Aug 11 with 4097 viewsTIB

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:27 - Aug 11 by Libero

"We've had to make cost cutting measures to ensure the business survived Covid-19, a lot of the portion sizes of our meals have significantly shrunk, as a result, this has meant we're purchased less"
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:27]


Sometimes the meal sizes will be false. Get. Their. Attention.

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:33 - Aug 11 with 4089 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:29 - Aug 11 by giant_stow

Wasn't the real money in that business loan scheme, where you could borrow up to 50 grand and then shut the business after you'd spent it?


Yes, I've made a note of that one too, also, the self employment scheme was quite easily exploited if you did a bit of reading.

I'm just interested in if there are any potential safeguards to stop people committing this kind of fraud? I know a few people who have financially prospered over this period from government schemes, all a bit shady.
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:36 - Aug 11 with 4073 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:32 - Aug 11 by bluefunk

Money from your own resources has been taxed before you get it. Putting that money back into the till in the way you describe merely ensures its taxed as business income, then again as income tax to you when you try to take it out of the business (assuming its a limited company). It would take a lot of £10 rebates to make that worthwhile, and thats without noting that the £10 allowance is also taxed as income

so not worth doing


It's all getting a bit technical for a thicko like me, but I think I just about grasp what you're saying.

Surely even if you're making as little as £1400 a month from this dastardly plot it would be worth doing?
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:41 - Aug 11 with 4047 viewsfactual_blue

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:27 - Aug 11 by Libero

"We've had to make cost cutting measures to ensure the business survived Covid-19, a lot of the portion sizes of our meals have significantly shrunk, as a result, this has meant we're purchased less"
[Post edited 11 Aug 2020 11:27]


'Can you explain why, despite the sign in your premises saying 'contactless payments only due to Covid-19', your cash takings have increased dramatically?'

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:42 - Aug 11 with 4035 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:41 - Aug 11 by factual_blue

'Can you explain why, despite the sign in your premises saying 'contactless payments only due to Covid-19', your cash takings have increased dramatically?'


"Sorry, what sign? We take both cash and card. A lot of our customers are old people, they struggle with technology, it would be discriminatory if we were to stop taking cash and alienate a large portion of our loyal customers"
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:48 - Aug 11 with 4004 viewsbluefunk

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:36 - Aug 11 by Libero

It's all getting a bit technical for a thicko like me, but I think I just about grasp what you're saying.

Surely even if you're making as little as £1400 a month from this dastardly plot it would be worth doing?


well you could make some money, but if you're caught out, it'll cost a lot more in your time while the revenue investigate you. I doubt it's worth it for the £763 maximum a quick calcualtion tells me you'd end up with in your example
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:50 - Aug 11 with 3992 viewsfactual_blue

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:42 - Aug 11 by Libero

"Sorry, what sign? We take both cash and card. A lot of our customers are old people, they struggle with technology, it would be discriminatory if we were to stop taking cash and alienate a large portion of our loyal customers"


You're nicked.

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:55 - Aug 11 with 3963 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:48 - Aug 11 by bluefunk

well you could make some money, but if you're caught out, it'll cost a lot more in your time while the revenue investigate you. I doubt it's worth it for the £763 maximum a quick calcualtion tells me you'd end up with in your example


Interesting, cheers for that.
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:57 - Aug 11 with 3959 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 11:50 - Aug 11 by factual_blue

You're nicked.




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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:04 - Aug 11 with 3930 viewsJ2BLUE

Reminds me of this.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52724062

Truly impaired.
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:11 - Aug 11 with 3892 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:04 - Aug 11 by J2BLUE

Reminds me of this.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52724062


Great link that, fair play to that fella.
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:17 - Aug 11 with 3868 viewsbluelagos

Far more likely is businesses will not ring through for meals paid for Thur to Sunday and then ring them through Mon to Wed.

The idea that Hmrc has the capacity to be checking is essentially nonsense. There will be a number of smaller businesses doing this and their chances of getting caught are very low.

However the consequences if caught will be quite high, plus most people are actually honest(ish).

I think the bigger issue will from people taking the loans and then liquidating. I heard of one bloke who is now in Spain with no intention of repaying the loan he took. Chances of him getting caugnt...well am not holding my breath.

Quick on the hoof policy will always lead to poor legislation. Tbf the govt had little choice but I do think there will be frauds both detected and more often, not.

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:19 - Aug 11 with 3852 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:17 - Aug 11 by bluelagos

Far more likely is businesses will not ring through for meals paid for Thur to Sunday and then ring them through Mon to Wed.

The idea that Hmrc has the capacity to be checking is essentially nonsense. There will be a number of smaller businesses doing this and their chances of getting caught are very low.

However the consequences if caught will be quite high, plus most people are actually honest(ish).

I think the bigger issue will from people taking the loans and then liquidating. I heard of one bloke who is now in Spain with no intention of repaying the loan he took. Chances of him getting caugnt...well am not holding my breath.

Quick on the hoof policy will always lead to poor legislation. Tbf the govt had little choice but I do think there will be frauds both detected and more often, not.


Great shout that, didn't even consider that!

Yes, you're right, exactly what I'm saying really.
I'm just starting to notice a few people doing some rather dodgy things and not particularly trying to hide them...
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:25 - Aug 11 with 3825 viewsbluelagos

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:19 - Aug 11 by Libero

Great shout that, didn't even consider that!

Yes, you're right, exactly what I'm saying really.
I'm just starting to notice a few people doing some rather dodgy things and not particularly trying to hide them...


Spending 8 years investigating Nigerian fruadsters taught me one thing, to catch someone you have to try and think like them first!

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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:27 - Aug 11 with 3806 viewsJ2BLUE

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:25 - Aug 11 by bluelagos

Spending 8 years investigating Nigerian fruadsters taught me one thing, to catch someone you have to try and think like them first!


I'm tempted to reply to them and offer to re-write their proposal in better English with correct spelling for a 10% cut of future scam earnings.

Truly impaired.
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:30 - Aug 11 with 3787 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:25 - Aug 11 by bluelagos

Spending 8 years investigating Nigerian fruadsters taught me one thing, to catch someone you have to try and think like them first!


Sounds really interesting, I'd love to do investigation/detective work like that, I assume you've got to have some kind of police or criminology background.

Either that or solve some kind of super secret off the books puzzle set up by a secret organisation. xoxo
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Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:32 - Aug 11 with 3775 viewsLibero

Here's one for all you business owners/potential fraudsters... on 12:27 - Aug 11 by J2BLUE

I'm tempted to reply to them and offer to re-write their proposal in better English with correct spelling for a 10% cut of future scam earnings.


Here's a better move.

Set up a new hotmail account and email them off of that, claiming that they have been in contact with you.

You then have a risk free way of f*cking with them, I've a mate who's done this few times with much mirth.
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