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Compulsory Vaccinations 11:20 - Mar 23 with 1377 viewshype313

Thoughts?

Personally I don’t generally agree with mandatory vaccination, it’s counter productive, but I do believe that being anti-vax and working in healthcare is not compatible. Should be a basic part of your job to understand what benefits the people in your care.


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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:23 - Mar 23 with 987 viewsDanTheMan

I don't think mandatory vaccinations from a national point of view is going to be helpful, mainly because it will just further entrench people who are already on the fence.

That said I do know of at least one person who at least flirts with anti-vax stuff who has gone and got it because they want to be able to travel. So restricting certain freedoms does appear to work.

As for certain jobs such as health care, should be mandatory.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:25 - Mar 23 with 975 viewshype313

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:23 - Mar 23 by DanTheMan

I don't think mandatory vaccinations from a national point of view is going to be helpful, mainly because it will just further entrench people who are already on the fence.

That said I do know of at least one person who at least flirts with anti-vax stuff who has gone and got it because they want to be able to travel. So restricting certain freedoms does appear to work.

As for certain jobs such as health care, should be mandatory.


Agreed, equally I know/see a number of people are are rabid anti vaxxers but will get the jab otherwise they won't be able to go on holiday.

Amazing how peoples thought processes change when faced with certain realisations...

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:25 - Mar 23 with 970 viewshomer_123


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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:28 - Mar 23 with 948 viewsThe_Flashing_Smile

Giving any government the mandate to force anything of a medical nature onto people is a very dangerous precedent to set IMO. It may well be fine and make sense for Covid right now, but then what might they force on us in the future? You let them do it once, then anything could happen further down the line.

Far better to restrict what you can do if you don't get it (i.e. needing a vaccine certificate to travel).
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:30 - Mar 23 with 946 viewsurbanblue

I do get frustrated that anyone who has a concern and worry about the Covid Vaccines due to the fact they have been produced in under a year is labeled 'Anti Vax'.

From my experience and conversations that is not the case and these people have no problem with the tried and trusted vaccines. They are not 'Anti Vax' at all.
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:38 - Mar 23 with 908 viewsGuthrum

I think a requirement for vaccination to work in certain jobs is very different to making it compulsory for the wider population.

More a form of qualification than an imposition. People who look after the elderly and vulnerable are required to have criminal background checks in order to protect their charges. Being vaccinated against a virus known to be particularly dangerous to the likes of care home patients is a similar protection.

And not without precedent. I understand airline pilots have a requirement to be vaccinated against Yellow Fever, for example.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:44 - Mar 23 with 885 viewsDanTheMan

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:25 - Mar 23 by hype313

Agreed, equally I know/see a number of people are are rabid anti vaxxers but will get the jab otherwise they won't be able to go on holiday.

Amazing how peoples thought processes change when faced with certain realisations...


It is quite funny to watch their apparently deeply held convictions being beaten by "I can't go on holiday now".

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:46 - Mar 23 with 879 viewslowhouseblue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:38 - Mar 23 by Guthrum

I think a requirement for vaccination to work in certain jobs is very different to making it compulsory for the wider population.

More a form of qualification than an imposition. People who look after the elderly and vulnerable are required to have criminal background checks in order to protect their charges. Being vaccinated against a virus known to be particularly dangerous to the likes of care home patients is a similar protection.

And not without precedent. I understand airline pilots have a requirement to be vaccinated against Yellow Fever, for example.


it will depend on the evidence on how much being vaccinated reduces the likelihood of you passing on the virus. it will then be one person's right's to decide what is injected into their own body versus someone else's right not to have their life put at risk. the second will come down to epidemiology and statistics. if vaccinated or unvaccinated you're just as likely to infect someone else then making it compulsory even in a health care setting would seem disproportionate. equally if everyone who has been vaccinated no longer suffers serious illness, then again that would argue against restricting the freedoms of others. in the end you've got to be able to legally sack someone for not being vaccinated and that is where the test will come.

And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:51 - Mar 23 with 864 viewsGuthrum

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:30 - Mar 23 by urbanblue

I do get frustrated that anyone who has a concern and worry about the Covid Vaccines due to the fact they have been produced in under a year is labeled 'Anti Vax'.

From my experience and conversations that is not the case and these people have no problem with the tried and trusted vaccines. They are not 'Anti Vax' at all.


That is fair.

Tho it's worth emphasising that the vaccines have been through a regulatory and test process (except the Russian Sputnik one, which has nevertheless proven extremely safe and effective so far). It may have been expedited way beyond the usual pace, but that is partly a reflection of the vast resources and government-level backing thrown at the process (in part, removing slow-moving wheels of bureaucracy).

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:58 - Mar 23 with 843 viewsurbanblue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:51 - Mar 23 by Guthrum

That is fair.

Tho it's worth emphasising that the vaccines have been through a regulatory and test process (except the Russian Sputnik one, which has nevertheless proven extremely safe and effective so far). It may have been expedited way beyond the usual pace, but that is partly a reflection of the vast resources and government-level backing thrown at the process (in part, removing slow-moving wheels of bureaucracy).


Of course ... Everything you say is quite true.

My point is that regularly on this forum people who are unsure whether they want this one are labelled 'Anti Vax' which is quite simply not the case.
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:01 - Mar 23 with 838 viewsGuthrum

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:46 - Mar 23 by lowhouseblue

it will depend on the evidence on how much being vaccinated reduces the likelihood of you passing on the virus. it will then be one person's right's to decide what is injected into their own body versus someone else's right not to have their life put at risk. the second will come down to epidemiology and statistics. if vaccinated or unvaccinated you're just as likely to infect someone else then making it compulsory even in a health care setting would seem disproportionate. equally if everyone who has been vaccinated no longer suffers serious illness, then again that would argue against restricting the freedoms of others. in the end you've got to be able to legally sack someone for not being vaccinated and that is where the test will come.


It isn't easy. But take as a parallel someone who drives HGV lorries. If it transpires they have a medical condition which would render them unsafe to be in charge of such a vehicle on the public road, then they will no longer be allowed to continue, with no chance of legal challenge. Especially if it was treatable, but they were unwilling to subject themselves to it.

Obviously, all of this will be subject to statistical analysis of the dangers of unvaccinated people working in medical or care environments. If it isn't a risk, then there's no need to impose such a thing.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:04 - Mar 23 with 819 viewsPinewoodblue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:58 - Mar 23 by urbanblue

Of course ... Everything you say is quite true.

My point is that regularly on this forum people who are unsure whether they want this one are labelled 'Anti Vax' which is quite simply not the case.


So if you think up an excuse you can live with you are not anti-vaccine.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:04 - Mar 23 with 820 viewslowhouseblue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:01 - Mar 23 by Guthrum

It isn't easy. But take as a parallel someone who drives HGV lorries. If it transpires they have a medical condition which would render them unsafe to be in charge of such a vehicle on the public road, then they will no longer be allowed to continue, with no chance of legal challenge. Especially if it was treatable, but they were unwilling to subject themselves to it.

Obviously, all of this will be subject to statistical analysis of the dangers of unvaccinated people working in medical or care environments. If it isn't a risk, then there's no need to impose such a thing.


absolutely. it just strikes me as one of those things which will get debated publicly in terms of morality whereas in reality it is much more a question of statistics.

And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:09 - Mar 23 with 801 viewsGuthrum

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:58 - Mar 23 by urbanblue

Of course ... Everything you say is quite true.

My point is that regularly on this forum people who are unsure whether they want this one are labelled 'Anti Vax' which is quite simply not the case.


In the wider world those with specific concerns about this particular test and regulatory process tend to be drowned out by those espousing more bizarre theories or who oppose all vaccines, thus it is easy for the first to be subsumed into the other two.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:27 - Mar 23 with 766 viewsStokieBlue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 11:30 - Mar 23 by urbanblue

I do get frustrated that anyone who has a concern and worry about the Covid Vaccines due to the fact they have been produced in under a year is labeled 'Anti Vax'.

From my experience and conversations that is not the case and these people have no problem with the tried and trusted vaccines. They are not 'Anti Vax' at all.


Whilst I can understand that people may feel that way to just say they have been developed in under a year isn't really the right way to look at it.

The length of time taken isn't always the most important variable, it's the level of testing that is relevant and the C19 vaccines have actually had larger stage 3 trials than most other vaccines get.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:28 - Mar 23 with 758 viewshype313

Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:27 - Mar 23 by StokieBlue

Whilst I can understand that people may feel that way to just say they have been developed in under a year isn't really the right way to look at it.

The length of time taken isn't always the most important variable, it's the level of testing that is relevant and the C19 vaccines have actually had larger stage 3 trials than most other vaccines get.

SB


Indeed, but just to add for clarification we are still in stage 3 trials and will be until 2023.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:32 - Mar 23 with 740 viewsBasuco

In respect of care home workers I think about when I placed my Mum in a care home, she was 86 and quite frail. I would be asking the question about vaccinations if I was looking for a care home now as I think it is very important that all staff are protected, as well as giving a level of protection for their residents. From my perspective I think in this case compulsory vaccinations would be a good thing.
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:41 - Mar 23 with 710 viewsStokieBlue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:28 - Mar 23 by hype313

Indeed, but just to add for clarification we are still in stage 3 trials and will be until 2023.


The numbers done by December 2020 were already higher than what most vaccine trials would include.

I guess this is mainly due to the urgent need of the vaccine.

SB

“You may not feel outstandingly robust, but if you are an average-sized adult you will contain within your modest frame no less than 7 X 10^18 joules of potential energy—enough to explode with the force of thirty very large hydrogen bombs, assuming you knew how to liberate it and really wished to make a point."

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:45 - Mar 23 with 673 viewsurbanblue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:04 - Mar 23 by Pinewoodblue

So if you think up an excuse you can live with you are not anti-vaccine.


My client Mrs x who is in her 60's has had her Immunisations all her life, has the Flu jab every year and has decided for now she doesn't want the Covid vaccine for whatever reason.

Is she an 'Anti Vaxer'?

I am not debating the rights or wrongs of her decision. That's her business. I would not call her 'Anti Vaccine' though.

That is the only point I'm debating here.
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:52 - Mar 23 with 652 viewsJ2BLUE

I don't think it should be compulsory but I would like to see some sort of internal passport as a requirement to enter pubs, cinemas, restaurants etc. I know some will bitch at me but it's the choice of each person being vaccinated. Society should not have to go along with the minority who are putting them at risk.

I don't know how feasible it would be, but i'd like to see an app where your vaccination status was on there. To be allowed entry you would have to have either had the jab or not yet been offered it (because the young have sacrificed enough). Once you have been offered it and ten working days have passed without you getting it then you should be barred until you've had it.

Just my opinion..

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:58 - Mar 23 with 630 viewsBasuco

Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:52 - Mar 23 by J2BLUE

I don't think it should be compulsory but I would like to see some sort of internal passport as a requirement to enter pubs, cinemas, restaurants etc. I know some will bitch at me but it's the choice of each person being vaccinated. Society should not have to go along with the minority who are putting them at risk.

I don't know how feasible it would be, but i'd like to see an app where your vaccination status was on there. To be allowed entry you would have to have either had the jab or not yet been offered it (because the young have sacrificed enough). Once you have been offered it and ten working days have passed without you getting it then you should be barred until you've had it.

Just my opinion..


I agree with all of that, there was a good report on News Night last week about Israel doing exactly that, they also make it compulsory to have a covid test every two days if you do not have the vaccine as well. They use an app on your mobile to prove being vaccinated. I would like the UK to follow that model, but that is just my opinion.
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Compulsory Vaccinations on 12:58 - Mar 23 with 626 viewsdeliasplums

I’m not in favour of compulsory vaccines but I am in favour of education which will ultimately lead to the vast majority realising this is for their own benefit that of society.

I am at a complete loss however to understand why compulsory testing isn’t being carried out in schools and colleges. It’s an absolute nonsense that some parents can decline the test yet their kids still go to school. The test is harmless and is providing some level of protection to the school community.

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 13:00 - Mar 23 with 624 viewsitfcjoe

I think you end up having to by the back door - i.e. to travel, certain jobs etc - you can't force people to take injections though with force

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 13:04 - Mar 23 with 611 viewsStokieBlue

Compulsory Vaccinations on 13:00 - Mar 23 by itfcjoe

I think you end up having to by the back door - i.e. to travel, certain jobs etc - you can't force people to take injections though with force


As it stands, I am not sure that being vaccinated will be enough to do foreign travel this year. It's going to depend a lot how the EU handles the next few months both internally and externally.

SB

“You may not feel outstandingly robust, but if you are an average-sized adult you will contain within your modest frame no less than 7 X 10^18 joules of potential energy—enough to explode with the force of thirty very large hydrogen bombs, assuming you knew how to liberate it and really wished to make a point."

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Compulsory Vaccinations on 13:07 - Mar 23 with 599 viewsJ2BLUE

Compulsory Vaccinations on 13:04 - Mar 23 by StokieBlue

As it stands, I am not sure that being vaccinated will be enough to do foreign travel this year. It's going to depend a lot how the EU handles the next few months both internally and externally.

SB


I'm hoping it's banned despite the EU hopefully having things improve dramatically. Don't see the point in risking our progress for people to go on holiday abroad. Lots admitted they didn't bother isolating when they got back last summer.

Again some will bitch but why risk it?

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