| There is the usual excitement around spending money 08:31 - Apr 8 with 3162 views | Bluefish |
For so many years now football has been judged on how much money you spend but it will be very interesting to see the GC20 limitations of that. When Marcus came in we went big in terms of spending but he was an rich idiot in a football sense, he was happy to blow it for the win. The new blokes have to return a profit so there has to be limitations to that. How much would it take to get out of league 1 and how much to get out of the Championship? We've seen the likes of Derby throw 200 million at just the Champjonship part and get nowhere, same for Sheffield Weds, Forest etc
It is OK the say the Premier League makes it worthwhile but does it? Going up comes with massively increased costs or you come straight back down and back to where you were. We are also seeing requests to overhaul the stadium, presumably that comes fron the budget too?
Marcus was a useful idiot in many ways because he could throw the money early on for fun and then he didn't really really to return anything let alone a profit. The new guys have to return a profit and they will not get away with a limitless fund to do so
I am happy because it is something new but it is also a big risk |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:35 - Apr 8 with 2178 views | hype313 |
I think with the new owners it will be more a calculated risk, rather than the Evans throw enough s**t and hope some of it sticks approach we have seen.
We also have a structure, one where there is accountability, something we haven't had since Evans took over, and that will be huge as the whole mentality will hopefully change from being a nice place to retire without any pressure, to being somewhere where people want results from top to bottom. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 8:36]
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:35 - Apr 8 with 2173 views | tractorboy1978 |
We don't really know what ££ they have to invest but with a pension fund it is potentially seriously vast. It'll be far smarter investment than we ever saw under Evans. Getting the infrastructure right is so, so important and it is something that in 13 years Evans never seemed to understand. And we've been a club focused on reducing costs rather than one looking to generate revenue.
Recruitment and player trading is going to be crucial at the end of the day. That's the key cog for me. If you can recruit the right players, develop them and sell them for a tidy profit that is a Game Changer. We did it with Webster (although BC and the potential new man Ashton pulled our pants down) and got fortunate with Mings/Waghorn. But we've not done it anywhere near enough. And when it came to it, Evans was scared to invest the sort of fees needed to secure the best young talent - the types that with the right push and coaching could go on to become £10m-£20m players rather than £5m-£6m players. |  | | |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:36 - Apr 8 with 2168 views | jayessess |
Getting us out League 1 requires more competence rather than more investment. We're a massive long shot for promotion this season, so the investment required to compete in the Championship isn't really a question until 2022-23 at the earliest. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:38 - Apr 8 with 2136 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
Agree with a lot of this.
I think the stadium needs to be refurbished in terms of bringing it upto date, and there's no way around that for the new owners, it can't be ignored.
I think the healthiest football model is that of Norwich, accept the role of a yo-yo club and anything above that is a bonus.
Norwich probably make more money as a yo-yo club than some small clubs that spend to stay in the Prem. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:38 - Apr 8 with 2134 views | Bluefish |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:36 - Apr 8 by jayessess |
Getting us out League 1 requires more competence rather than more investment. We're a massive long shot for promotion this season, so the investment required to compete in the Championship isn't really a question until 2022-23 at the earliest. |
But why does that make a difference apart from tying their investment up even longer? | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:39 - Apr 8 with 2125 views | Bluefish |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:35 - Apr 8 by hype313 |
I think with the new owners it will be more a calculated risk, rather than the Evans throw enough s**t and hope some of it sticks approach we have seen.
We also have a structure, one where there is accountability, something we haven't had since Evans took over, and that will be huge as the whole mentality will hopefully change from being a nice place to retire without any pressure, to being somewhere where people want results from top to bottom. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 8:36]
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Good point but football is a different world, changes and mistakes just make it even more of a money pit | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:46 - Apr 8 with 2064 views | hype313 |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:39 - Apr 8 by Bluefish |
Good point but football is a different world, changes and mistakes just make it even more of a money pit |
Agreed, but you would hope that changes would be made before the s##t hits the fan with the new owners rather than clapping relegation. | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:48 - Apr 8 with 2048 views | Basuco |
Derby have shown how just spending big (for the championship) money is not the magic bullet to promotion, so the recruitment changes will be interesting to see. |  | | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:50 - Apr 8 with 2030 views | jayessess |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:38 - Apr 8 by Bluefish |
But why does that make a difference apart from tying their investment up even longer? |
Just that the club isn't instantaneously a money pit, particularly.
I've no idea what GC20's time frame is, but I don't especially see why it should be any more short term than their ownership of Phoenix Rising, which is 7 years and counting. | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:53 - Apr 8 with 2019 views | Coastalblue |
I'm hoping they are looking to develop the entire club, not just the team on the pitch because unless you are very smart, or very lucky that can be a gamble almost regardless of budget.
It would be nice if they did look at developing around the club, both physically and metaphorically to try and bring in additional revenue streams. Yes we are lil old Ipswich, but we can also get 30k+ crowds if things are going well.
The big fear is that they have come in with a plan to make it all happen in a 5 year period or similar. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:54 - Apr 8 with 2007 views | hype313 |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:48 - Apr 8 by Basuco |
Derby have shown how just spending big (for the championship) money is not the magic bullet to promotion, so the recruitment changes will be interesting to see. |
Derby are quite rightly used as the poster boys for spending big and not making it up, but plenty of other clubs have spent big in the Championship over the years and have made a success, Bournemouth, Brighton, Leicester and Southampton to name a few, even Newcastle were paying people 80k a week in the Championship.
It's quite right to look at Derby as the model on how not to operate, but I do feel they are used as a reason why clubs shouldn't spend, forgetting plenty of others who do. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 8:55]
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:27 - Apr 8 with 1915 views | ArnieM |
Changing owners is a bit like the current Oxford Vaccine isn't it …… What's the bigger risk ? Staying with the underfunding Evans, and guaranteed continued steady ( not even slow ), decline, or jump ship to a bigger, financial backer who you don't know anything about, but has clear history of major reinvestment and "Club building" In the USA ?...a nation where football isn't its first sport. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:42 - Apr 8 with 1843 views | Churchman |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:54 - Apr 8 by hype313 |
Derby are quite rightly used as the poster boys for spending big and not making it up, but plenty of other clubs have spent big in the Championship over the years and have made a success, Bournemouth, Brighton, Leicester and Southampton to name a few, even Newcastle were paying people 80k a week in the Championship.
It's quite right to look at Derby as the model on how not to operate, but I do feel they are used as a reason why clubs shouldn't spend, forgetting plenty of others who do. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 8:55]
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The key is the right people in the right structure. If you look at Leicester and Southampton in particular, they had a modern stadium with a good fan base. They got the right people in and built progressively. Leicester didn’t throw huge sums at promotion, but they had a good manager in a settled structure. The first thing the Leicester people did was find out all about the club and the community. A step by step approach.
Derby appear to have gone a different way literally thrown money at it, but it’s been a bit castles on sand. People in, people out. Lampard and Rooney wheeled in because of their names. Top players with no idea what the Championship demanded or the job itself. Instant success sought. It rarely works out. It was pretty much Evans’ undoing in his early days.
If I was the new owner, the first thing I’d do if I truly wanted Cook here would be to improve his contract and spend time with him finding out what he needs and using some of that experience he has. I’d want to spend time with people like Burley Butcher Dyer, even Sheepshanks, to find out what made the club what it was. An aim surely has to be to give it back its identity. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 9:48]
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:52 - Apr 8 with 1785 views | haynes_toe1 |
You're right that I don't think being in the Premier League is a money-maker anymore - ask any of the current Prem club owners and they'll tell you much the obvious. The only way to make money is to do a Norwich and literally don't spend anything and take a relegation on the chin. To even vaguely compete your wage budget will utilise 90% of the prem money. | | | |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:54 - Apr 8 with 1776 views | Kieran_Knows |
There's certainly no excitement about spending money in the side for me. I'm more interested in to how they play things off the field, which'll hopefully in turn help us on it. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:55 - Apr 8 with 1763 views | Bluefish |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:54 - Apr 8 by Kieran_Knows |
There's certainly no excitement about spending money in the side for me. I'm more interested in to how they play things off the field, which'll hopefully in turn help us on it. |
Cant see the ownership having any impact there is the short and medium term | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:59 - Apr 8 with 1748 views | clive_baker |
I wouldn’t say football is judged on how much money you spend. I think it’s judged on results and performances, and people are perhaps less forgiving when huge sums are involved.
I think it’s possible to run ITFC with a break even P&L or even a small profit but it would require a much skinnier cost base, massive reliance on the academy and we would probably find ourselves somewhere in mid table. We’ve got a big fan base though, and there would be 8-10k inside PR regardless so it’s possible. Owning a modestly profitable league 1 club isn’t going to give these guys any sort of return on their investment though. Looking at it crudely, they’re PE and want a return, the only way they’ll get that is by popping us up at least 1 league, ideally 2.
I imagine the approach they’ll take is a fairly sensible one in the short term, backing the manager on and off the pitch with what they deem appropriate investment to get us up, but if anyone thinks we’ll be sniffing around Aguero this summer then they need to wake up. I wouldn’t think Cook’s targets will be any different to the ones under Evans. Getting into the Championship is priority #1. If / when that point comes then they can take stock and decide if it’s worth turning on the taps and pushing to get to the top of the Championship. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:07 - Apr 8 with 1714 views | Pinewoodblue |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 08:54 - Apr 8 by hype313 |
Derby are quite rightly used as the poster boys for spending big and not making it up, but plenty of other clubs have spent big in the Championship over the years and have made a success, Bournemouth, Brighton, Leicester and Southampton to name a few, even Newcastle were paying people 80k a week in the Championship.
It's quite right to look at Derby as the model on how not to operate, but I do feel they are used as a reason why clubs shouldn't spend, forgetting plenty of others who do. [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 8:55]
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Leeds made a loss of over £60m the season they gained promotion and, it seems, without any penalty from EFL. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:08 - Apr 8 with 1697 views | nodge_blue |
I think a few on here need to reflect a little on the generosity of what Evans has done given the context of how much abuse they gave him.
Evans has written off multi millions in a way that the pension fund won't want to do. I suspect that we will have a year or two of funding where progress is expected. If we continue to wallow then the question will be what happens next. Pension funds are not likely to want to continue to throw money at it.
But Im sure the American owners know all this.
At least its a change. It feels like we needed one. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:13 - Apr 8 with 1675 views | ElderGrizzly |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 09:52 - Apr 8 by haynes_toe1 |
You're right that I don't think being in the Premier League is a money-maker anymore - ask any of the current Prem club owners and they'll tell you much the obvious. The only way to make money is to do a Norwich and literally don't spend anything and take a relegation on the chin. To even vaguely compete your wage budget will utilise 90% of the prem money. |
I think it was Sunderland who actually lost over £200m while in the PL, so agree on that point.
However, we see with clubs with a similar fan base to us (like Burnley), their valuation was £170m when sold recently.
If Gamechanger can get us in the PL, they could expect similar returns potentially and that would be job done for their investors. £40m + new spending turning into £170m would be hell of a return.
They HAVE to make money and they've been quite open about that. But to do that you are going to have to spend/lose money in the short-term to achieve that objective [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 10:15]
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:19 - Apr 8 with 1645 views | haynes_toe1 |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:13 - Apr 8 by ElderGrizzly |
I think it was Sunderland who actually lost over £200m while in the PL, so agree on that point.
However, we see with clubs with a similar fan base to us (like Burnley), their valuation was £170m when sold recently.
If Gamechanger can get us in the PL, they could expect similar returns potentially and that would be job done for their investors. £40m + new spending turning into £170m would be hell of a return.
They HAVE to make money and they've been quite open about that. But to do that you are going to have to spend/lose money in the short-term to achieve that objective [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 10:15]
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Yeah, I guess the only fear involved is they'll have zero care about who it's sold to as long as they get the return they're after but to be honest, we can worry about that if we get to it as like you'd say, we'd likely be in the prem for that to happen! | | | |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:22 - Apr 8 with 1637 views | J2BLUE |
This is true but only to an extent. The money is always going to be welcomed but really the full time CEO and chairman (two days a week he said, long term) are even more meaningful. The club is going to get the attention it needs. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:22 - Apr 8 with 1630 views | jayessess |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:13 - Apr 8 by ElderGrizzly |
I think it was Sunderland who actually lost over £200m while in the PL, so agree on that point.
However, we see with clubs with a similar fan base to us (like Burnley), their valuation was £170m when sold recently.
If Gamechanger can get us in the PL, they could expect similar returns potentially and that would be job done for their investors. £40m + new spending turning into £170m would be hell of a return.
They HAVE to make money and they've been quite open about that. But to do that you are going to have to spend/lose money in the short-term to achieve that objective [Post edited 8 Apr 2021 10:15]
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I think there's also some broad feeling that the Premier League's TV rights are undervalued, relative to US sports. | |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:23 - Apr 8 with 1610 views | chrismakin |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:22 - Apr 8 by J2BLUE |
This is true but only to an extent. The money is always going to be welcomed but really the full time CEO and chairman (two days a week he said, long term) are even more meaningful. The club is going to get the attention it needs. |
Need the ceo in asap so when they are doing the internal department audit. You've got someone who knows what's not right and what needs urgently changing. I.e sports science dept. |  |
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| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:24 - Apr 8 with 1621 views | footers |
| There is the usual excitement around spending money on 10:22 - Apr 8 by J2BLUE |
This is true but only to an extent. The money is always going to be welcomed but really the full time CEO and chairman (two days a week he said, long term) are even more meaningful. The club is going to get the attention it needs. |
That and we always have Drogba waiting in the wings if we need a goal-scorer. |  |
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