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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 09:32 - Apr 19 by Guthrum
A construction worker risks a career-ending injury every working day.
The age of 30 doesn't seem too late for cricket and rugby players to get qualifications or learn a trade and go on to second careers. Same with footballers in the past. Reign in the lifestyle a bit and they could afford to put themselves through university debt-free.
And it opens up the prospect of , say, Harry Kane fitting your kitchen in a few years time. Which is the sort of thing footy fans love.
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 09:56 - Apr 19 by giant_stow
The Guardian blog on this is reporting that the new comp's lawyers have already started proceedings against UEFA etc to stop them from being sanctionned.
On a base level, surely if one group doesn't want to play with another, they can decide to do that?
Students of Kerry Packer will be getting a twinge of nostalgia.
Packer's mob won their case on restraint of trade - add in a dose of human rights and it's difficult to see FIFA/ UEFA/ FA getting much joy in banning the players from any other ventures.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 12:02 - Apr 19 with 1397 views
This proposal, whether it is a negotiating position or for real, has given rise to much heated comment. It is perhaps worth reflecting on the nature of football both historically and what it has become.
Basically football supporters come with an assortment of motivations. A love of sport and football in particular. An appreciation of amazing levels of athleticism and skill such that watching two good teams playing well is a delight even if my team is not involved. Being identified as a supporter of a particular team and investing time and emotions in the tribalism of being a dedicated supporter.
In truth the game at the top level long ago transitioned from the simple tribalism of supporting your local club. A wealthier more mobile society means that an individual can support almost any team of their choosing and travel halfway across the country to see live games, or far easier watch the games on TV. Indeed some individuals will travel from another country to experience the tribalism factor. Investors buying clubs and buying success by buying talent have contributed to the breakdown of the old structures. We have all contributed to this through our sport TV subscriptions that by definition channel funds to the big clubs at the expense of the small. I guess most of us have these subscriptions. Similarly how many town fans have abused Evans over recent years demanding that he get out his cheque book or get out of their club! It amounts to the same thing - buying success to put your club above others.
It seems to me to be at least twenty years too late to be pulling up the drawbridge to stop faceless investors ruining the game.
Similarly complaining about players earnings is pointless. They provide entertainment. What they can earn depends on what we are prepared to pay, either for tickets, TV or associated merchandise. Ultimately if we are not entertained and don’t pay then they won’t earn.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 12:05 - Apr 19 with 1385 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 08:57 - Apr 19 by noggin
Let's not forget, if the big 6 are kicked out of the Premier League, it would open up the possibility of Norwich being champions of England.
Good!
A proper club. Like it or not (doesn't bother me in the slightest) but a Norwich or a Burnley winning the top league would be like a breath of fresh air.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 12:23 - Apr 19 with 1371 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 12:02 - Apr 19 by Crawfordsboot
This proposal, whether it is a negotiating position or for real, has given rise to much heated comment. It is perhaps worth reflecting on the nature of football both historically and what it has become.
Basically football supporters come with an assortment of motivations. A love of sport and football in particular. An appreciation of amazing levels of athleticism and skill such that watching two good teams playing well is a delight even if my team is not involved. Being identified as a supporter of a particular team and investing time and emotions in the tribalism of being a dedicated supporter.
In truth the game at the top level long ago transitioned from the simple tribalism of supporting your local club. A wealthier more mobile society means that an individual can support almost any team of their choosing and travel halfway across the country to see live games, or far easier watch the games on TV. Indeed some individuals will travel from another country to experience the tribalism factor. Investors buying clubs and buying success by buying talent have contributed to the breakdown of the old structures. We have all contributed to this through our sport TV subscriptions that by definition channel funds to the big clubs at the expense of the small. I guess most of us have these subscriptions. Similarly how many town fans have abused Evans over recent years demanding that he get out his cheque book or get out of their club! It amounts to the same thing - buying success to put your club above others.
It seems to me to be at least twenty years too late to be pulling up the drawbridge to stop faceless investors ruining the game.
Similarly complaining about players earnings is pointless. They provide entertainment. What they can earn depends on what we are prepared to pay, either for tickets, TV or associated merchandise. Ultimately if we are not entertained and don’t pay then they won’t earn.
I think they really are going for it. My initial reaction was that they might be doing this to get all the CL changes they wanted but seems I was probably wrong.
Few of them have left the ECA as well now.
Even if they backtrack now, the fall out from this will be big. And I hope the federations and leagues have some balls and punish them for it.
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 12:05 - Apr 19 by BlueBlueBluex2
Good!
A proper club. Like it or not (doesn't bother me in the slightest) but a Norwich or a Burnley winning the top league would be like a breath of fresh air.
It wouldn't really be the "TOP" league anymore though
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 10:45 - Apr 19 by Radlett_blue
If one group starts trying to ban players from playing in certain competitions, this could amount to an illegal restraint of trade. Sounds a bit like the doomed attempt by the TCCB to ban players who signed up with Kerry Packer years ago, although the laws may have changed since then.
But surely to take part in a FIFA or UEFA competition you need to play in a FIFA or UEFA endorsed league? If they do carry out their threat to expel them from the domestic leagues then they no longer will do so.
This is just more evidence of the big clubs wanting their cake and eating it.
One thing I would love to see if it goes ahead is the creation of a subscription channel dedicated to the united 92 clubs. Let's not allow Sky or BT to show the super league and buy the rights to the rest of it so fans of clubs who have been screwed over have no choice but to subsidise the super league to watch the leagues they are interested in.
If this takes off I doubt it will be too long until we see super league two and the likes of Celtic, Rangers, Everton, West Ham, Newcastle join along with some of the bigger European sides who were yet to cement a place.
I think it will be a disaster for clubs left behind but at what point do we stop throwing incentives at them to stay. They are going to threaten this every few years. Maybe this is the time to make a stand.
The problem is... if this is a big success, then it will be more commercially viable than the Premier League is, possibly even the Champions League. If the money follows the heretics - then the cash filtering into grass roots and the EFL will dry up.
"One may think of this as - well, so players get cheaper and cost less to employ - win win!"
In the long term that may be true - but in the transition years some clubs will get royally screwed over.
See ITFC Digital as an example of what happens when the projected financial outlay suddenly shifts.
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 08:50 - Apr 19 by davblue
Clubs will cease to be English, Spanish, Italian they will be European.
The cost to fans will also be prohibitive also I suspect with 18 group games. Games will become like going to a theatre. It will be to watch a spectacle rather than supporting your team.
It’s garbage but not a surprise this has been talked about since the mid nineties.
Our clubs are not English now , all the 6 already have foreign owners , foreign managers and mostly foreign players .
Agree , games will pretty soon become boring with no relegation , just playing the same teams and assuming all games will be televised , you're right , it will become an armchair spectacle
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:10 - Apr 19 with 1255 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 10:17 - Apr 19 by MrTown
I would be delighted for them to form their own footballing community.
For the rest of the domestic scene it would certainly level the pack once again, and the prospect of being and competing in the Premier League will be a much more achievable ambition.
Will open the doors for many other teams to compete in the Champions League and the Europa League.
The real ones who lose are the hard core fan bases of these 'super' clubs.
They don’t care about fans in Europe anymore. This is all about reaching new fans in India China Indonesia and Mexico.
In the spirit of reconciliation and happiness at the end of the Banter Era (RIP) and as a result of promotion I have cleared out my ignore list. Look forwards to reading your posts!
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:10 - Apr 19 by chicoazul
They don’t care about fans in Europe anymore. This is all about reaching new fans in India China Indonesia and Mexico.
£700-£800 per season ticket is a drop in the ocean to them. They'd rather play to an empty stadium if it means £300m a year in income from the ESL.
Irrelevant as fans will still go though - football in this country is a drug and they know it. They will get 60,000 turn up for their fix every week whatever they do.
[Post edited 19 Apr 2021 14:54]
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:27 - Apr 19 with 1216 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:17 - Apr 19 by tractorboy1978
£700-£800 per season ticket is a drop in the ocean to them. They'd rather play to an empty stadium if it means £300m a year in income from the ESL.
Irrelevant as fans will still go though - football in this country is a drug and they know it. They will get 60,000 turn up for their fix every week whatever they do.
[Post edited 19 Apr 2021 14:54]
Investments are only answerable to the shareholders. This is all quite pertinent given our new situation. Ultimately, the history of the club means nothing.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:34 - Apr 19 with 1202 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 09:21 - Apr 19 by XYZ
In how many jobs are your most productive years <30 and where you risk a career-ending injury every week?
If you'd said £5k a week, I'd agree.
This argument that players need to be paid loads is weird. Yeah, they could have a career ending injury every week (but very few do), and they have to find a new job in their mid 30s, but so what?
Ultimately, their wages should be relatable to what they bring in to their business. Not in a direct sense of 'this many tickets were bought because Ronaldo is here', but what other industry in the world routinely pays its staff so much money that the company makes a loss, year on year? How on earth would any of those business owners say, 'yeah, we only earned a million this year but I'm going to pay the staff £1.5m'...?
That ANY club in the richest league in the world is making a loss is a joke, but numerous PL clubs do it just to keep up with their rivals. And it gets even worse down the leagues.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 14:03 - Apr 19 with 1161 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 13:34 - Apr 19 by glasso
This argument that players need to be paid loads is weird. Yeah, they could have a career ending injury every week (but very few do), and they have to find a new job in their mid 30s, but so what?
Ultimately, their wages should be relatable to what they bring in to their business. Not in a direct sense of 'this many tickets were bought because Ronaldo is here', but what other industry in the world routinely pays its staff so much money that the company makes a loss, year on year? How on earth would any of those business owners say, 'yeah, we only earned a million this year but I'm going to pay the staff £1.5m'...?
That ANY club in the richest league in the world is making a loss is a joke, but numerous PL clubs do it just to keep up with their rivals. And it gets even worse down the leagues.
Ummm.. I shudder to think of the consequences of this EFL proposal.
Whether the proposal suceeds or fails, will be massive implication for clubs like ours, as both scenario's ultimately seems to result in the EPL becoming much less viable concern
Even if the proposal fails, the fall-out and concessions to Europes elites teams will mean the current CL becomes dominant, thus the EPL less attractive. It may instigate UEFA's Euro league sooner rather than later.
If it succeeds the ESL ties will become more important than any EPL ties. (No or hardly any promotion/ relegation to from ECL)
So any buyer looking to 'flip' any Chumps/league one club etc will now have to factor in the reduced possible returns. (which is where we are)
Apart from this, the carnage that is going to be wrought upon any non ECL/CL club in England who is harbouring any sizable debt is going to be fatal. Any others will die a slow death due to overpaid contract bleed.
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 07:33 - Apr 19 by Bluefish
Yes I think fook them but I don't believe it. The Champions League was started when Milan stopped winning the league so they got together with some other clubs and talked about a European super league. Uefa reacted and made the CL so they all got in on the greed. They just want the CL extended to more teams, there aren't enough places now for the old school big 4 in England to qualify each year
The super league has been talked about since the 90's. I worked for a law firm who represents the PL and documents suggesting exactly this were floating around then.
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Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 14:55 - Apr 19 with 1117 views
Am I the only one who thinks we should let the big six go.... on 14:03 - Apr 19 by BlueNode
Ummm.. I shudder to think of the consequences of this EFL proposal.
Whether the proposal suceeds or fails, will be massive implication for clubs like ours, as both scenario's ultimately seems to result in the EPL becoming much less viable concern
Even if the proposal fails, the fall-out and concessions to Europes elites teams will mean the current CL becomes dominant, thus the EPL less attractive. It may instigate UEFA's Euro league sooner rather than later.
If it succeeds the ESL ties will become more important than any EPL ties. (No or hardly any promotion/ relegation to from ECL)
So any buyer looking to 'flip' any Chumps/league one club etc will now have to factor in the reduced possible returns. (which is where we are)
Apart from this, the carnage that is going to be wrought upon any non ECL/CL club in England who is harbouring any sizable debt is going to be fatal. Any others will die a slow death due to overpaid contract bleed.
Not sure that leaves many clubs left..
The futures bright, the futures Blancmange...
This stuff reminds me of the Mark Curtis quote, "it is easier to imagine an end to the world than an end to capitalism”.
Football exists beyond its current financial arrangements. So long as people want to watch football and want to watch their local football team, there'll be a viable professional league in England. If every club in the EFL went bust tomorrow and the league collapsed, it is within our power as supporters to go out and re-found it all.
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