| Players released 15:04 - Apr 21 with 45056 views | greyhound |
Hearing rumours that the next stage of the clear out is awaiting announcement.
Jack lankaster among those names that I've been given as well as a large portion of under 23s
With all of the noise about improving academy when the takeover happened this seems surprising, I wonder if that u23 contingent includes more players that are in or around the first team than anything else.
I know we're seriously lacking quality but I hope in this clear out we don't make some hasty regrettable decisions on some of the younger talent we may have.
These are horrible horrible times as a town fan, where those you pinned your hopes on are falling so far short |  | | |  |
| Players released on 08:07 - Apr 22 with 3120 views | You_Bloo_Right |
| Players released on 22:05 - Apr 21 by itfcjoe |
We are talking about what he is doing now, with this group of players. I’m not saying he’s a bad manager, just that whatever he has done man management wise with these players clearly hasn’t worked. |
Football manager fails to motivate unfit and uninterested players shock. |  |
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| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 with 3067 views | itfcjoe |
| Players released on 22:47 - Apr 21 by Churchman |
So what would have worked? Tell what the potential is of this sorry lot and why he’s failed. How could he make the goalie a better keeper? Should he have chased Norwood out of KFC and round the training ground with a cattle prod? These players are adults. They should have some responsibility for their own careers. They should see the writing on the wall and burst every sinew to show what they can do. People wang on about formations, but ultimately no formation in the world can make a team out of people who are unwilling or incapable or both.
I hear phrases like get a tune out of them, best squad in the division, words like motivate them. They’ve had every chance and have shown nothing. They are what they are. Which of our players would get near one of the top 6 teams. Downes maybe, when he’s fit? Norwood? Doesn’t every team need an unfit forward that needs a lot of chances to take one. Hardly. Sears because he was good 6 years ago? Chambers and Skuse? Think not. What about KVY? 13 games in nearly two seasons. Bishop? no longer young, career ravaged by injury. Dozzell might make Blackpool’s squad but he’d need to improve a lot to make the first team.
Why can’t people be patient and let the people who now own the club and Cook do their job? Many clearly think Cook’s time is up. So fire him after 12 games without any chance of changing the rabble he inherited. Who on that basis would you want to replace him? How about Lambert? Better than Cook according to some on here. |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |  |
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| Players released on 08:35 - Apr 22 with 3021 views | DanTheMan |
| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 by itfcjoe |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |
I'm fairly sure he already has said he's not done a good job.
"What we’ve offered under me, I’m not talking about anyone else, hasn’t been good enough"
I'd agree with him, it's not been good enough. |  |
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| Players released on 08:39 - Apr 22 with 2995 views | Ely_Blue |
| Players released on 16:43 - Apr 21 by longtimefan |
I think the lack of high level loans for U23 players has been one of many failings over the years. Even as a Championship club we managed to get few young players out on loan to L1 or L2 clubs where they would have real opportunities to test them andprove themselves. Our young players have generally ended up at National League or National League North/South level with few exceptions (Woolf and El Miz). It’s another thing those up the road have done well recently with lots of their youngsters getting L1 experience (Godfrey for instance). Or actually it might just indicate that we view our youngsters very much with blue tinted glasses and over estimate their quality compared to the unbiased opinions of other club’s recruiters. [Post edited 21 Apr 2021 16:51]
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The only ones recently who got good loans were Downes to Luton and Woolf at Swindon, other than that it’s been pants national league rubbish at best |  |
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| Players released on 08:39 - Apr 22 with 2994 views | Vic |
| Players released on 21:53 - Apr 21 by BryanPlug |
[content removed at owner's request] |
Lambert did! He left them on the very edge of the PO’s and generally improving.
Would that trend have continued? Who knows! The reality is that a new manager came in and the results and performances have tailed off completely.
I’m not in anyway wanting Cook to go - but I absolutely didn’t expect things to go so seriously downhill after he was appointed. The simple fact is that he hasn’t done as well with the same group of players as Lambert did. I don’t expect it to be the same with a new team - but questions have been raised in my mind that we’re not there before! |  |
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| Players released on 08:49 - Apr 22 with 2962 views | N2_Blue |
| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 by itfcjoe |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |
Yes fair enough fans are disappointed with his start.
But it's not helping the situation with fans continually going on about how they think he has failed so far and that his man management is all wrong.
You are pretty much banging a drum about this Joe which is a bit disappointing for you and that's why some posters are taking issue with it.
We need to support the manager in everyway at this stage. No one is immune to criticism but at this stage and not knowing exactly what is going on behind the scenes i think it is unfair. His reaction to our squad after recent losses is really telling. I think he is in shock and what this group is doing.
What bugs me is how scot free these players are getting off. Because they have not had any fan interaction due to COVID they have been protected, and its scandalous really because I'd say the performance level of this group of players is probably the worst of any professional football squad I have been aware of. I know its impossible to say that with really knowing but is shameful what has happened here and the vitriol some of these players would have received if playing in front of fans would have been something else, and fully deserved.
The players are the issue, not PC and not his man management. Yes his man management may have not worked, but that again is because the players have refused to respond. They knew they were off once the takeover happened, performances were always going to end because they don't care. The takeover basically ended many players futures at this club. The type of character these players are...its been evident for some time they don't have any respect for the club and fans, and have downed tools. Coupled with being short of confidence which is more understandable due to the past managerial regime, lack of fitness (again unacceptable of players part), its a recipe for the shockingly low performance we are seeing.
I feel sorry for PC that usually well-balanced fans like you are currently so damning of PC's failure to get anything out of the squad. (note i know that doesn't mean you are not asking for him to go or still don't support him)
I remember many fans saying they were worried that players wouldn't perform after the takeover irrespective of manager. They are being proven right. I think this has had more impact that some realise, more than the manager/staffing changes. |  |
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| Players released on 08:58 - Apr 22 with 2911 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 by itfcjoe |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |
With such a big squad of players, and not wanting to miss any hidden gems, it must have been difficult for PC to identify the nucleus of players he needed to concentrate on.
One of the problems too many of our youngsters have is they try to fit in with the players around them. Perhaps they aren’t big headed enough to make a full impact.
Given a fresh start elsewhere there are sure to be some released that, with hindsight, we should have kept.
You are right To be disappointed with the impact PC has had and I’m sure he is too. Up too now he has been looking for a quick fix to make the play offs. Hopefully we will see signs , those difficult to find green shoots, of how things will develop over the last four games. |  |
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| Players released on 08:59 - Apr 22 with 2909 views | Radlett_blue |
| Players released on 08:49 - Apr 22 by N2_Blue |
Yes fair enough fans are disappointed with his start.
But it's not helping the situation with fans continually going on about how they think he has failed so far and that his man management is all wrong.
You are pretty much banging a drum about this Joe which is a bit disappointing for you and that's why some posters are taking issue with it.
We need to support the manager in everyway at this stage. No one is immune to criticism but at this stage and not knowing exactly what is going on behind the scenes i think it is unfair. His reaction to our squad after recent losses is really telling. I think he is in shock and what this group is doing.
What bugs me is how scot free these players are getting off. Because they have not had any fan interaction due to COVID they have been protected, and its scandalous really because I'd say the performance level of this group of players is probably the worst of any professional football squad I have been aware of. I know its impossible to say that with really knowing but is shameful what has happened here and the vitriol some of these players would have received if playing in front of fans would have been something else, and fully deserved.
The players are the issue, not PC and not his man management. Yes his man management may have not worked, but that again is because the players have refused to respond. They knew they were off once the takeover happened, performances were always going to end because they don't care. The takeover basically ended many players futures at this club. The type of character these players are...its been evident for some time they don't have any respect for the club and fans, and have downed tools. Coupled with being short of confidence which is more understandable due to the past managerial regime, lack of fitness (again unacceptable of players part), its a recipe for the shockingly low performance we are seeing.
I feel sorry for PC that usually well-balanced fans like you are currently so damning of PC's failure to get anything out of the squad. (note i know that doesn't mean you are not asking for him to go or still don't support him)
I remember many fans saying they were worried that players wouldn't perform after the takeover irrespective of manager. They are being proven right. I think this has had more impact that some realise, more than the manager/staffing changes. |
We're naturally disappointed because when Cook came in, we were on the edge of the play-offs & naturally assumed a new and supposedly better manager would get a positive reaction from a squad which we felt was underperforming anyway & would breeze into the play-offs, with a reasonable chance of success. The result was the opposite - Town have been consistently poor under Cook, with the odd 30 minute glimpses of what might be. Whether that's the fault of Cook or the players - probably a bit of both - doesn't matter any more & the only thing that matters is Cook being able to work with the new owners & their hired suits & assemble a potential promotion challenging team for next season. With the huge disruption this will involve, it won't be an easy task. Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. The last 4 games will again be painful viewing, but are pretty much irrelevant unless we see some promise from some of the younger players. However, I do hope Cook stops picking players who won't be here next season. He must have made up his mind on most of them by now. |  |
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| Players released on 08:59 - Apr 22 with 2901 views | Ely_Blue |
| Players released on 23:10 - Apr 21 by Garv |
But he adds so much more than Jackson. Anyone that can't see that isn't watching.
For starters, he can play up front on his own. |
Which means they are different types of players, just take a look at where most of the assists for those Norwood goals came from! | |
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| Players released on 09:00 - Apr 22 with 2900 views | Churchman |
| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 by itfcjoe |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |
Show me any post that says he’s done a good job. Nobody has said that. He hasn’t said that. The point is he hasn’t had a chance to do a job at all. The EADT stats though slanted, do indicate a long term problem. Your own post re 7 defeats in 9 at the end of last season says a lot. Inertia and decay is in the club from top to bottom for years yet people expect Cook to amble in here and ‘motivate’ 40+ unfit players, many of whom aspire to be journeymen, into Real Madrid. It was never going to happen. Hope all you want. The players can’t do it.
I’m disappointed he’s not done better but the only mistake I think he’s made is not keeping to the formula he wants to play. The results would still have been poor because the players can’t play, but that’s secondary to getting structure in place.
This notion that under Lambert we’d have been in the play offs is dubious too. They scraped 3 wins, but nobody can tell me they wouldn’t have got a hiding at Gillingham with the windbag in charge. They’d have lost at Wimbledon and Northampton probably too.
The point is that the players have taken no responsibility whatsoever in my view. It’s mostly down to them. |  | | |
| Players released on 09:01 - Apr 22 with 2888 views | DanTheMan |
| Players released on 08:59 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
We're naturally disappointed because when Cook came in, we were on the edge of the play-offs & naturally assumed a new and supposedly better manager would get a positive reaction from a squad which we felt was underperforming anyway & would breeze into the play-offs, with a reasonable chance of success. The result was the opposite - Town have been consistently poor under Cook, with the odd 30 minute glimpses of what might be. Whether that's the fault of Cook or the players - probably a bit of both - doesn't matter any more & the only thing that matters is Cook being able to work with the new owners & their hired suits & assemble a potential promotion challenging team for next season. With the huge disruption this will involve, it won't be an easy task. Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. The last 4 games will again be painful viewing, but are pretty much irrelevant unless we see some promise from some of the younger players. However, I do hope Cook stops picking players who won't be here next season. He must have made up his mind on most of them by now. |
"I do hope Cook stops picking players who won't be here next season. He must have made up his mind on most of them by now."
Given what Phil has said we wouldn't even be able to field a team if we did this. Not an exaggeration. | |
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| Players released on 09:14 - Apr 22 with 2799 views | Parky |
| Players released on 08:59 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
We're naturally disappointed because when Cook came in, we were on the edge of the play-offs & naturally assumed a new and supposedly better manager would get a positive reaction from a squad which we felt was underperforming anyway & would breeze into the play-offs, with a reasonable chance of success. The result was the opposite - Town have been consistently poor under Cook, with the odd 30 minute glimpses of what might be. Whether that's the fault of Cook or the players - probably a bit of both - doesn't matter any more & the only thing that matters is Cook being able to work with the new owners & their hired suits & assemble a potential promotion challenging team for next season. With the huge disruption this will involve, it won't be an easy task. Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. The last 4 games will again be painful viewing, but are pretty much irrelevant unless we see some promise from some of the younger players. However, I do hope Cook stops picking players who won't be here next season. He must have made up his mind on most of them by now. |
Just throwing my two pence in:
“ Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. “ - This has already happened despite Cook only being here for 12 games and having no transfer window.
I remember when the takeover was in the pipelines and some of our fans were worried about becoming a club that churns through managers each season and now people are seriously questioning somebody after 12 games, despite inheriting our worst team in playing history.
For the record, each to their own and I fully agree that we probably hoped and expected better results when Cook arrived, but doubting a proven experienced manager after 12 games is just ridiculous. I remember people on here laughing at Norwich fans wanting Farke to leave after a short period, now look.
The bloke has my full support and will continue to do so. Our fans gave Lambert a free pass after relegating us and then finishing 11th. We now have a proven successful manager, new owners and a proper footballing structure, if you can’t be excited and supportive about that after what we’ve had to endure, what’s the point? [Post edited 22 Apr 2021 9:16]
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| Players released on 09:14 - Apr 22 with 2805 views | N2_Blue |
| Players released on 09:00 - Apr 22 by Churchman |
Show me any post that says he’s done a good job. Nobody has said that. He hasn’t said that. The point is he hasn’t had a chance to do a job at all. The EADT stats though slanted, do indicate a long term problem. Your own post re 7 defeats in 9 at the end of last season says a lot. Inertia and decay is in the club from top to bottom for years yet people expect Cook to amble in here and ‘motivate’ 40+ unfit players, many of whom aspire to be journeymen, into Real Madrid. It was never going to happen. Hope all you want. The players can’t do it.
I’m disappointed he’s not done better but the only mistake I think he’s made is not keeping to the formula he wants to play. The results would still have been poor because the players can’t play, but that’s secondary to getting structure in place.
This notion that under Lambert we’d have been in the play offs is dubious too. They scraped 3 wins, but nobody can tell me they wouldn’t have got a hiding at Gillingham with the windbag in charge. They’d have lost at Wimbledon and Northampton probably too.
The point is that the players have taken no responsibility whatsoever in my view. It’s mostly down to them. |
Absolutely agree....and yes to add to my reply to Joe....no one has said PC has done a good job....but i think the criticism is too much personally, i think the players need to take more responsibility for not making the play-offs...not PC. | |
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| Players released on 09:15 - Apr 22 with 2795 views | clive_baker |
| Players released on 23:30 - Apr 21 by chrismakin |
The basics
There was a point under Lambert where we failed to score in 4 out of 5 games. Same squad funnily enough
Coming in you would expect any manager to have ambitions of finishing in the playoffs. However that's before you have even seen or had more than 1 training session with out lot. Who once again need to be remembered for being unable to train to an acceptable standard.
" by what ever means" that's great if you have a transfer window. If all managers could finish in the play offs by " what ever means" then the top 6 would be doable by all the league clubs.
I'd happily accept someone pointing out what PC has actually done wrong. Not just saying hasnt won.. but what he specifically hasnt done as a manager.
If you cant.. then the blame lies solely at the players. The same players 99% of the fans want gone. |
The reality is nobody knows how he’s been managing this squad, effectively, ineffectively or otherwise, because who knows what the alternative would’ve looked like. What we can see with our own eyes is that Cook’s overseen some of our worst performances that I’ve ever witnessed. Now I think everyone recognises there are lots of variables at play, namely commitment and the contract issue, uncertainty, changing of ownership, experimenting with different styles and personnel etc.
I think it’s all a bit of a moot point. We owe Cook the chance to hit reset over the summer which promises to see a massive amount of change on and off the pitch. I think most sensible town fans agree on that. Forget this season, it’s finished. Let’s just get behind him and reserve any judgement until 15 games into next season. |  |
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| Players released on 09:22 - Apr 22 with 2735 views | NthQldITFC |
| Players released on 09:15 - Apr 22 by clive_baker |
The reality is nobody knows how he’s been managing this squad, effectively, ineffectively or otherwise, because who knows what the alternative would’ve looked like. What we can see with our own eyes is that Cook’s overseen some of our worst performances that I’ve ever witnessed. Now I think everyone recognises there are lots of variables at play, namely commitment and the contract issue, uncertainty, changing of ownership, experimenting with different styles and personnel etc.
I think it’s all a bit of a moot point. We owe Cook the chance to hit reset over the summer which promises to see a massive amount of change on and off the pitch. I think most sensible town fans agree on that. Forget this season, it’s finished. Let’s just get behind him and reserve any judgement until 15 games into next season. |
Totally agree, but what is everybody going to post about?  For the first time I'm getting sick of reading the endless angst about the (in this case just-arrived) manager on this forum, and I am going to turn off Football posts for a bit! |  |
| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| Players released on 09:23 - Apr 22 with 2726 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Players released on 08:25 - Apr 22 by itfcjoe |
WHy just the constant need to try and reframe the debate, as far as I can see people aren't saying Cook should go, even though some are disappointed with his start.
We finished last season with 7 defeats out of 9 games, the period of 12 games in our nearly 2 seasons in this division that includes that run is the only time we have picked up so few points in a 12 game stretch as Cook's run here. We've scored 6 goals, we've never been as blunt going forwards over a consistent period in this league.
We are worse than we have been at any point this season. The manager's first job was to get us into the play offs. He has totally failed at this.
You can talk about player x, player y and player z - but we are getting less out of all of them now than we were before Cook came in.
I can't see anyone saying he shouldn't get the summer, and he shouldn't get next season after a window - but it's a massive concern at just how badly he has done here so far for me, at quite how much worse we are than what we were before with the same players.
It's been a failure of man management, he'll get another chance with a fresh set of players next year - but there's no need to dance around and try to make excuses and claim he's doing a good job currently - he simply isn't, he'd admit that even if some fans won't. |
A new manager comes in and the results get worse - it makes absolute sense to think that's down to the manager, so I do see where you're coming from. However, what also happened around the same time is this takeover. The team have got far worse since the takeover happened... could it be this disruption and uncertainty for many of them has actually had the greater affect? Might things have been different if Cook had come in ages ago... or at the end of the season?
We'll never know now, but please consider it might not be that Cook's doing anything wrong. It might be that the takeover is playing a huge part and this downturn would've happened whoever the boss was. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Players released on 09:25 - Apr 22 with 2709 views | Radlett_blue |
| Players released on 09:14 - Apr 22 by Parky |
Just throwing my two pence in:
“ Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. “ - This has already happened despite Cook only being here for 12 games and having no transfer window.
I remember when the takeover was in the pipelines and some of our fans were worried about becoming a club that churns through managers each season and now people are seriously questioning somebody after 12 games, despite inheriting our worst team in playing history.
For the record, each to their own and I fully agree that we probably hoped and expected better results when Cook arrived, but doubting a proven experienced manager after 12 games is just ridiculous. I remember people on here laughing at Norwich fans wanting Farke to leave after a short period, now look.
The bloke has my full support and will continue to do so. Our fans gave Lambert a free pass after relegating us and then finishing 11th. We now have a proven successful manager, new owners and a proper footballing structure, if you can’t be excited and supportive about that after what we’ve had to endure, what’s the point? [Post edited 22 Apr 2021 9:16]
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Fair points, although I want the record to show that I said Lambert was a poor appointment at the time & nothing he did in his time at PR changed that opinion. | |
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| Players released on 09:28 - Apr 22 with 2686 views | N2_Blue |
| Players released on 09:23 - Apr 22 by The_Flashing_Smile |
A new manager comes in and the results get worse - it makes absolute sense to think that's down to the manager, so I do see where you're coming from. However, what also happened around the same time is this takeover. The team have got far worse since the takeover happened... could it be this disruption and uncertainty for many of them has actually had the greater affect? Might things have been different if Cook had come in ages ago... or at the end of the season?
We'll never know now, but please consider it might not be that Cook's doing anything wrong. It might be that the takeover is playing a huge part and this downturn would've happened whoever the boss was. |
Spot on! You make this point but better than i did in my ramble. I think the takeover had way more impact on how we are playing than anything else unfortunately. It's another reason why i was led to believe it wouldn't go through until the season was over. I wish it hadn't as I think with PC as manger we would probably have squeezed a playoff spot.
Unfortunately the timing of the takeover announcement was actually pretty terrible....and evidently disastrous in terms of how the season has panned out.
Oh well we just have to hope the upside is it helps with having some pieces in place a bit earlier for the summer break and pre-season | |
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| Players released on 09:36 - Apr 22 with 2645 views | hype313 |
| Players released on 09:00 - Apr 22 by Churchman |
Show me any post that says he’s done a good job. Nobody has said that. He hasn’t said that. The point is he hasn’t had a chance to do a job at all. The EADT stats though slanted, do indicate a long term problem. Your own post re 7 defeats in 9 at the end of last season says a lot. Inertia and decay is in the club from top to bottom for years yet people expect Cook to amble in here and ‘motivate’ 40+ unfit players, many of whom aspire to be journeymen, into Real Madrid. It was never going to happen. Hope all you want. The players can’t do it.
I’m disappointed he’s not done better but the only mistake I think he’s made is not keeping to the formula he wants to play. The results would still have been poor because the players can’t play, but that’s secondary to getting structure in place.
This notion that under Lambert we’d have been in the play offs is dubious too. They scraped 3 wins, but nobody can tell me they wouldn’t have got a hiding at Gillingham with the windbag in charge. They’d have lost at Wimbledon and Northampton probably too.
The point is that the players have taken no responsibility whatsoever in my view. It’s mostly down to them. |
Personally, I just think we have all collectivity over estimated the standard of our squad/players.
If we take each in isolation what have any of them achieved? Nolan, Nsiala and Norwood all done well in League Two but haven't really cut the mustard in this league, Downes, Dozzell and Bishop have shown flashes, but nothing to suggest they should be ripping this league to shreds (like everyone thought)
I just think our demise has been long winded for a while, mismangement from the top, add in managers that just weren't fit for the job and recruitment which has been throw enough Sh!t and hope something sticks.
Watson said on a pod recently, we have amalgamated a Frankenstein team over the past few years and we're seeing the pitfalls of that.
I thought Cook would come in and improve things, and that clearly hasn't happened, but equally I think we have to take a step back and realize that this mis match of a confidence and mentally shot team with constant injuries, poor form and questionable attitudes that have lead to this position. |  |
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| Players released on 09:39 - Apr 22 with 2621 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Players released on 22:05 - Apr 21 by itfcjoe |
We are talking about what he is doing now, with this group of players. I’m not saying he’s a bad manager, just that whatever he has done man management wise with these players clearly hasn’t worked. |
It hasn't worked, but who you hold responsible for it not working is a choice, not a fact.
Some have chosen to blame him for not having the ability to instruct these players sufficiently.
Some have chosen to blame the players for not giving it their all or not being good enough to follow instructions.
I'm in the latter camp and will reserve judgement on PC until after the summer. |  |
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| Players released on 09:39 - Apr 22 with 2618 views | portmanking |
| Players released on 09:36 - Apr 22 by hype313 |
Personally, I just think we have all collectivity over estimated the standard of our squad/players.
If we take each in isolation what have any of them achieved? Nolan, Nsiala and Norwood all done well in League Two but haven't really cut the mustard in this league, Downes, Dozzell and Bishop have shown flashes, but nothing to suggest they should be ripping this league to shreds (like everyone thought)
I just think our demise has been long winded for a while, mismangement from the top, add in managers that just weren't fit for the job and recruitment which has been throw enough Sh!t and hope something sticks.
Watson said on a pod recently, we have amalgamated a Frankenstein team over the past few years and we're seeing the pitfalls of that.
I thought Cook would come in and improve things, and that clearly hasn't happened, but equally I think we have to take a step back and realize that this mis match of a confidence and mentally shot team with constant injuries, poor form and questionable attitudes that have lead to this position. |
This is the nail on the head. I think it's time to accept that people like Joe (and many others, myself included) have simply overrated the majority of this squad. It wouldn't be the first squad to be overrated on paper would it?
Too many of these players have stunk out the training ground and dressing room with a lack of ambition and underachievement and the only way to rid that is a significant cull. Cook knows what's needed. He's the most qualified manager at this level to undertake such a challenge too. Give him time. [Post edited 22 Apr 2021 9:40]
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| Players released on 09:40 - Apr 22 with 2611 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Players released on 09:14 - Apr 22 by Parky |
Just throwing my two pence in:
“ Naturally, if Town's performances don't improve, fans will question Cook's ability & decisions & also wonder if he won't be as effective as he was at his previous clubs without Richardson. “ - This has already happened despite Cook only being here for 12 games and having no transfer window.
I remember when the takeover was in the pipelines and some of our fans were worried about becoming a club that churns through managers each season and now people are seriously questioning somebody after 12 games, despite inheriting our worst team in playing history.
For the record, each to their own and I fully agree that we probably hoped and expected better results when Cook arrived, but doubting a proven experienced manager after 12 games is just ridiculous. I remember people on here laughing at Norwich fans wanting Farke to leave after a short period, now look.
The bloke has my full support and will continue to do so. Our fans gave Lambert a free pass after relegating us and then finishing 11th. We now have a proven successful manager, new owners and a proper footballing structure, if you can’t be excited and supportive about that after what we’ve had to endure, what’s the point? [Post edited 22 Apr 2021 9:16]
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Well said. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Players released on 09:45 - Apr 22 with 2584 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Players released on 09:28 - Apr 22 by N2_Blue |
Spot on! You make this point but better than i did in my ramble. I think the takeover had way more impact on how we are playing than anything else unfortunately. It's another reason why i was led to believe it wouldn't go through until the season was over. I wish it hadn't as I think with PC as manger we would probably have squeezed a playoff spot.
Unfortunately the timing of the takeover announcement was actually pretty terrible....and evidently disastrous in terms of how the season has panned out.
Oh well we just have to hope the upside is it helps with having some pieces in place a bit earlier for the summer break and pre-season |
I've just seen from that damning stats list that we haven't even scored a goal since the takeover happened!
When will ITFC fans stop blaming the manager and start looking at the bigger picture? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Players released on 09:45 - Apr 22 with 2580 views | hype313 |
| Players released on 09:39 - Apr 22 by portmanking |
This is the nail on the head. I think it's time to accept that people like Joe (and many others, myself included) have simply overrated the majority of this squad. It wouldn't be the first squad to be overrated on paper would it?
Too many of these players have stunk out the training ground and dressing room with a lack of ambition and underachievement and the only way to rid that is a significant cull. Cook knows what's needed. He's the most qualified manager at this level to undertake such a challenge too. Give him time. [Post edited 22 Apr 2021 9:40]
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Just to add, to be fair to Joe, I was singing from the same hymn sheet regarding the standard. | |
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| Players released on 09:47 - Apr 22 with 2567 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Players released on 09:36 - Apr 22 by hype313 |
Personally, I just think we have all collectivity over estimated the standard of our squad/players.
If we take each in isolation what have any of them achieved? Nolan, Nsiala and Norwood all done well in League Two but haven't really cut the mustard in this league, Downes, Dozzell and Bishop have shown flashes, but nothing to suggest they should be ripping this league to shreds (like everyone thought)
I just think our demise has been long winded for a while, mismangement from the top, add in managers that just weren't fit for the job and recruitment which has been throw enough Sh!t and hope something sticks.
Watson said on a pod recently, we have amalgamated a Frankenstein team over the past few years and we're seeing the pitfalls of that.
I thought Cook would come in and improve things, and that clearly hasn't happened, but equally I think we have to take a step back and realize that this mis match of a confidence and mentally shot team with constant injuries, poor form and questionable attitudes that have lead to this position. |
Indeed, it's been death by a thousand cuts, not death over 12 games.
This takeover couldn't have come too soon because we now have a chance to re-ignite the beast | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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