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The Euros format 12:13 - May 24 with 2073 viewsclive_baker

With 4 of the 6 3rd place teams going through is so sh1t isn't it?

I thought Group F looked interesting with one of Germany, France, Portugal going out but I can't see anything other than them all qualifying, despite one of them likely only beating Hungary.

Horrible format.

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The Euros format on 12:17 - May 24 with 2033 viewstractordownsouth

Yeah I really dislike it. 16 was a really good number - it maintained a high quality while also allowing room for a few of the mid-sized footballing nations to qualify every year and preserved the drama of the group stages. I'd almost prefer 32 to qualify - in the current format, 36 games are played to knock out just 8 teams.

Could be worse though, the Copa America this year has 2 groups of 5 with the top 4 qualifying from each one!

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The Euros format on 12:22 - May 24 with 2003 viewsStokieBlue

In the end result, it's not much different to the ESL which they were so against. It's entirely constructed to ensure the teams they want to be at the later stage of the tournament all get there so they get more viewers and sales.

The implementation is different but the results are essentially the same as having a tournament with no relegation.

I'm sure nobody is that shocked by some hypocrisy from UEFA though.

SB

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The Euros format on 12:24 - May 24 with 1992 viewswkj

The Euros format on 12:17 - May 24 by tractordownsouth

Yeah I really dislike it. 16 was a really good number - it maintained a high quality while also allowing room for a few of the mid-sized footballing nations to qualify every year and preserved the drama of the group stages. I'd almost prefer 32 to qualify - in the current format, 36 games are played to knock out just 8 teams.

Could be worse though, the Copa America this year has 2 groups of 5 with the top 4 qualifying from each one!


I would rather see 2 seed pools and more teams, but pure knockout format. I always hate the group stages of international competitions. No second chances, get as many teams in as possible to make up the deficit in games and those who turn up for every game gets the gold.

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The Euros format on 12:24 - May 24 with 1993 viewstractordownsouth

The Euros format on 12:17 - May 24 by tractordownsouth

Yeah I really dislike it. 16 was a really good number - it maintained a high quality while also allowing room for a few of the mid-sized footballing nations to qualify every year and preserved the drama of the group stages. I'd almost prefer 32 to qualify - in the current format, 36 games are played to knock out just 8 teams.

Could be worse though, the Copa America this year has 2 groups of 5 with the top 4 qualifying from each one!


I've been thinking about the 32 team idea. Of course 16 is better and 32 would make qualifying a waste of time, but would the standard of the tournament be much worse than it is currently if we chucked in Iceland, Bosnia, Romania, Northern Ireland, Republic of Ireland, Norway, Serbia and Greece? At least then we'd have entertainment for all 3 group games rather than teams getting 4 points from their first two matches and playing a second string in the last one because it doesn't matter if they finish third.

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The Euros format on 12:26 - May 24 with 1979 viewsclive_baker

The Euros format on 12:17 - May 24 by tractordownsouth

Yeah I really dislike it. 16 was a really good number - it maintained a high quality while also allowing room for a few of the mid-sized footballing nations to qualify every year and preserved the drama of the group stages. I'd almost prefer 32 to qualify - in the current format, 36 games are played to knock out just 8 teams.

Could be worse though, the Copa America this year has 2 groups of 5 with the top 4 qualifying from each one!


Yeah I agree, it waters down the group stages when it's essentially the bottom placed and only 2 of the 3rd place going out. I liked 16, but I could see the merit in 32, to get more sides qualified and have 8 groups, with the top 2 going through from each.

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The Euros format on 12:27 - May 24 with 1968 viewsSouperJim

I must admit I'd not paid much attention, but a quick peek suggests if England have a good tournament they will be playing at Wembley for every game other than the quarter final.

That's quite a leg up.

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The Euros format on 12:30 - May 24 with 1905 viewsStewart27

I like it. We get more games and one extra knock out round.
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The Euros format on 12:36 - May 24 with 1865 viewsJimmyJazz

The Euros format on 12:22 - May 24 by StokieBlue

In the end result, it's not much different to the ESL which they were so against. It's entirely constructed to ensure the teams they want to be at the later stage of the tournament all get there so they get more viewers and sales.

The implementation is different but the results are essentially the same as having a tournament with no relegation.

I'm sure nobody is that shocked by some hypocrisy from UEFA though.

SB


There is some hypocrisy here, but who profits from a 'successful' tournament? The problem, for me, with the ESL was that it was the big clubs that would profit which i'm not sure is so much of a concern here - happy to be educated as to why this is not the case.

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The Euros format on 12:45 - May 24 with 1819 viewsStokieBlue

The Euros format on 12:36 - May 24 by JimmyJazz

There is some hypocrisy here, but who profits from a 'successful' tournament? The problem, for me, with the ESL was that it was the big clubs that would profit which i'm not sure is so much of a concern here - happy to be educated as to why this is not the case.


I meant more in the way that the tournament is setup to ensure that the "best" teams make it through to the later stages which is pretty similar to having a closed league with no promotion or relegation which UEFA said was an awful thing to do.

As for who profits, I've not really considered it but I suspect that viewing figures in the US and the Far East would be higher for later tournament match France vs Germany than they would be for something like Bulgaria vs Romania which would be more likely with a different qualifying mechanism.

The tournament setup virtually ensures a closed shop of the best teams in the later stages unless they performance horrendously.

SB

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The Euros format on 13:04 - May 24 with 1767 viewsclive_baker

The Euros format on 12:30 - May 24 by Stewart27

I like it. We get more games and one extra knock out round.


We do, the extra knock out round is good. But I can't help but feel that could be achieved with 32 teams, while maintaining the integrity and excitement of the group stage.

As tractordownsouth says, the likes of NI, ROI, Bulgaria, Serbia, Norway, Iceland etc could've joined in a larger format without any compromise to the quality. That would've been cool I think, 32 teams, 8 groups of 4. Meaning more nations involved, more games, more host cities, the extra knockout round, and only 2 going through to the last 16 from each group.

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The Euros format on 13:04 - May 24 with 1765 viewsgordon

Yeah completely agree with this, hate the way these tournaments get ruined - if they wanted to expand the competition (which is always the way), the way I'd do it would be to go up to 20 teams and have 4 groups of 5 with 2 from each group going through to QF.
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The Euros format on 13:37 - May 24 with 1658 viewsJ2BLUE

It makes the group stage a waste of time but as someone said, it provides more games. I actually like the group stages because of all the different fans, the different colours etc. It's always a little sad after the group stages when some teams go home.

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The Euros format on 13:45 - May 24 with 1626 viewsMerseyBlue

Ridiculous format that screams greed.

16 teams was perfect, 32 would be acceptable, 24 is just making hard work of it and attempting to guarantee the old guard always make it through to the latter stages.

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The Euros format on 13:54 - May 24 with 1577 viewsStewart27

The Euros format on 13:04 - May 24 by gordon

Yeah completely agree with this, hate the way these tournaments get ruined - if they wanted to expand the competition (which is always the way), the way I'd do it would be to go up to 20 teams and have 4 groups of 5 with 2 from each group going through to QF.


I like this.

As somebody else has already mentioned the group stages are great. Really get the tournament feel with all teams present. If this stage can be drawn out longer then I’d really like that. Also 2 from 5 makes sense.
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The Euros format on 14:12 - May 24 with 1541 viewsClapham_Junction

Personally I kind of like it. Having the best third-placed teams go through means the results in every group matter and there's a bit of excitement in watching other groups' results to see how it affects you. While I agree it can make groups with three big teams a bit less exciting, it means a group with two big teams in it has a bit more meaning for the two smaller teams. Plus even in groups with three big teams, the smaller team can potentially go through with one win or even three draws.

Having said that, I wouldn't mind a 32-team tournament. 16 for me was too small and didn't allow many of the smaller countries to qualify.

[edit] Forgot one advantage of third-placed teams going through - it means groups can't be done and dusted after two matches and there are very few dead rubbers.
[Post edited 24 May 2021 14:15]
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The Euros format on 15:27 - May 24 with 1465 viewsclive_baker

The Euros format on 14:12 - May 24 by Clapham_Junction

Personally I kind of like it. Having the best third-placed teams go through means the results in every group matter and there's a bit of excitement in watching other groups' results to see how it affects you. While I agree it can make groups with three big teams a bit less exciting, it means a group with two big teams in it has a bit more meaning for the two smaller teams. Plus even in groups with three big teams, the smaller team can potentially go through with one win or even three draws.

Having said that, I wouldn't mind a 32-team tournament. 16 for me was too small and didn't allow many of the smaller countries to qualify.

[edit] Forgot one advantage of third-placed teams going through - it means groups can't be done and dusted after two matches and there are very few dead rubbers.
[Post edited 24 May 2021 14:15]


Hmm, I can see the logic. I guess if you've lost 2/2 you still might have something to play for in game 3, where a win might give you a shot of being one of the top 4 3rd places.

Although maybe you could argue there will be more dead rubbers in those final group games. It's rare in a group game with only 2 going through that nothing rides on the outcome, maybe 1 or 2 of the final round games where it's 3rd v 4th and neither can pip 2nd. Under this format, if a side picks up 4 or 6 points from their first 2 games, they might as well rest players for the last group game, safe in the knowledge that there are already 6 guaranteed teams worse off across the tournament.

Ultimately it just makes it so much harder for a France or Germany (or England, to be fair) to get dumped out in the group, that's what I'm not keen on.

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The Euros format on 17:25 - May 24 with 1390 viewsClapham_Junction

The Euros format on 15:27 - May 24 by clive_baker

Hmm, I can see the logic. I guess if you've lost 2/2 you still might have something to play for in game 3, where a win might give you a shot of being one of the top 4 3rd places.

Although maybe you could argue there will be more dead rubbers in those final group games. It's rare in a group game with only 2 going through that nothing rides on the outcome, maybe 1 or 2 of the final round games where it's 3rd v 4th and neither can pip 2nd. Under this format, if a side picks up 4 or 6 points from their first 2 games, they might as well rest players for the last group game, safe in the knowledge that there are already 6 guaranteed teams worse off across the tournament.

Ultimately it just makes it so much harder for a France or Germany (or England, to be fair) to get dumped out in the group, that's what I'm not keen on.


I'm not sure the top two are really playing dead rubbers as they'll be playing for top spot to avoid meeting a strong team in the next round.

I had a quick look at the results from the last Euros and had completely forgotten that Portugal got through in third place in their group in 2016.
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The Euros format on 17:41 - May 24 with 1356 viewsChrisd

I agree. How long before we have the qualifiers for the Euros and then all countries have the capacity to qualify for the finals by finishing bottom or second from bottom in their group?!

On a serious note, I appreciate it gives lesser countries the opportunity to experience the finals, but to what point are they diluting the quality of the competition? Just seems the bigger countries are going to get even more opportunity to go deeper into the competition. Would've been nice seeing one of Germany, France or Portugal going out early using the old format, that's what makes it interesting.

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The Euros format on 17:51 - May 24 with 1348 viewspointofblue

The Euros format on 13:04 - May 24 by clive_baker

We do, the extra knock out round is good. But I can't help but feel that could be achieved with 32 teams, while maintaining the integrity and excitement of the group stage.

As tractordownsouth says, the likes of NI, ROI, Bulgaria, Serbia, Norway, Iceland etc could've joined in a larger format without any compromise to the quality. That would've been cool I think, 32 teams, 8 groups of 4. Meaning more nations involved, more games, more host cities, the extra knockout round, and only 2 going through to the last 16 from each group.


I agree, they should have stuck with 16 or increased to 32 - not this half-baked midway house which doesn’t really achieve anything.

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The Euros format on 17:54 - May 24 with 1334 viewsbluelagos

The Euros format on 12:22 - May 24 by StokieBlue

In the end result, it's not much different to the ESL which they were so against. It's entirely constructed to ensure the teams they want to be at the later stage of the tournament all get there so they get more viewers and sales.

The implementation is different but the results are essentially the same as having a tournament with no relegation.

I'm sure nobody is that shocked by some hypocrisy from UEFA though.

SB


The only way they could find to help get Scotland to qualify I reckon.

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The Euros format on 17:55 - May 24 with 1331 viewsbluelagos

Agree, but if England come 3rd I reserve the right to reconsider...

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The Euros format on 17:57 - May 24 with 1320 viewsClapham_Junction

The Euros format on 17:41 - May 24 by Chrisd

I agree. How long before we have the qualifiers for the Euros and then all countries have the capacity to qualify for the finals by finishing bottom or second from bottom in their group?!

On a serious note, I appreciate it gives lesser countries the opportunity to experience the finals, but to what point are they diluting the quality of the competition? Just seems the bigger countries are going to get even more opportunity to go deeper into the competition. Would've been nice seeing one of Germany, France or Portugal going out early using the old format, that's what makes it interesting.


On the other hand, the first expanded tournament was won by a country that had never won a major tournament before, saw Wales get to the semi-finals and Iceland (by far the smallest country in terms of population) get to the quarter finals.
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