| They're at it again on 19:20 - Aug 20 with 1977 views | thebooks |
| They're at it again on 14:18 - Aug 20 by giant_stow |
That's a reasonable point, but doesn't excuse the behavior of train driving unions whose actions regularly push the cost of living up for less well off Londoners. I've no idea why they're heroes of the left when all they do is suck money out of the pockets of nurses, teachers, cleaners, policemen, firefighters etc... |
Hmm, I can think of a few things pushing up the cost of living more in London than tube drivers’ salaries.
All power to the RMT for being a strong union (although not as much as it was, unfortunately). The economy needs more of them as they represent the only way for the “less well off” you seem so concerned about to actually become better off. |  | |  |
| They're at it again on 19:26 - Aug 20 with 1970 views | GeoffSentence |
The big surprise to me, is that the tube till has drivers. |  |
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| They're at it again on 20:57 - Aug 20 with 1925 views | Clapham_Junction |
| They're at it again on 19:20 - Aug 20 by thebooks |
Hmm, I can think of a few things pushing up the cost of living more in London than tube drivers’ salaries.
All power to the RMT for being a strong union (although not as much as it was, unfortunately). The economy needs more of them as they represent the only way for the “less well off” you seem so concerned about to actually become better off. |
The amount of fare dodging on the tube must be a massive drain on TfL's finances. It's hugely annoying that station staff make no attempt to stop or even challenge people pushing through gates. People aren't even subtle about it anymore.
My local DLR station has no gates and I'd say at least a third of people travelling do not tap in/out. I'd imagine the losses must be in the millions every year. |  | | |
| They're at it again on 21:26 - Aug 20 with 1909 views | JDB23 |
| They're at it again on 18:39 - Aug 20 by Timefliesbyintheblue |
To so many poorly paid folk, those on minimum wage for example, the tube drivers ARE among the elite few. It has nothing to do with the press or brainwashing.
A working man in most peoples opinion is anyone that has to work to provide for their family - that is most of us (except me of course, I am retired after working 49 years!)
Please let us not have a throwback to the 1970's when unions held us all to ransom!
Oh and before you get too left wing with me, I accept the fact that without trade unions we would still be sending little boys up chimneys. I am not biased sufficiently though to think that this action is necessary. |
Not actually sure what point you’re trying to make here? Are you saying tube drivers aren’t working class? That if they lost their jobs tomorrow they would be fine and dandy? Also earning 50k living in London is a bit different to earning 50k in most other places in the country. |  | | |
| They're at it again on 22:09 - Aug 20 with 1886 views | Herbivore |
| They're at it again on 21:26 - Aug 20 by JDB23 |
Not actually sure what point you’re trying to make here? Are you saying tube drivers aren’t working class? That if they lost their jobs tomorrow they would be fine and dandy? Also earning 50k living in London is a bit different to earning 50k in most other places in the country. |
It's just his usual obfuscating shtick. He's best ignored. |  |
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| They're at it again on 22:20 - Aug 20 with 1870 views | Juggsy |
| They're at it again on 21:26 - Aug 20 by JDB23 |
Not actually sure what point you’re trying to make here? Are you saying tube drivers aren’t working class? That if they lost their jobs tomorrow they would be fine and dandy? Also earning 50k living in London is a bit different to earning 50k in most other places in the country. |
I left the RAF after 30 years and became a train driver on the Tyne & Wear metro. Having never been unionised before in the military I initially found the concept bemusing, but have now seen first hand the power of unions to uphold procedures and standards as well as holding companies accountable for their treatment of drivers (any problem automatically gets blamed on the driver!)
On the subject of train driving, it is a ridiculously hard and brutal career path to get into and once there you have to know everything about your system, the trains, and how to deal with any situation that passengers frequently create. The shift times are awful, can do a 9 hour shift with one 40 minute break and a 4.5 hour drive needs 100% concentration as there are stops every 2 minutes. I’ll admit it’s a well paid job but it’s open to anyone who can make it through the application, interview, psychometric testing, medical and subsequent training (8 months intensive on my system)
Stating Train drivers aren’t working class is a ridiculous statement. |  | | |
| They're at it again on 22:21 - Aug 20 with 1866 views | factual_blue |
They're simply being good capitalists. |  |
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| They're at it again on 23:07 - Aug 20 with 1837 views | Timefliesbyintheblue |
| They're at it again on 21:26 - Aug 20 by JDB23 |
Not actually sure what point you’re trying to make here? Are you saying tube drivers aren’t working class? That if they lost their jobs tomorrow they would be fine and dandy? Also earning 50k living in London is a bit different to earning 50k in most other places in the country. |
Not sure what part of my post suggested to you that tube drivers are not working class. It is just a pity that trade unions do not work hard enough to make lives better for those earning much less than tube drivers. Most minimum wage folk are not given the backing/help they deserve by their respective unions. | | | |
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| They're at it again on 23:14 - Aug 20 with 1829 views | Timefliesbyintheblue |
| They're at it again on 22:09 - Aug 20 by Herbivore |
It's just his usual obfuscating shtick. He's best ignored. |
Anyone with differing views to you own Mr H seem to get the same response. I just happen to think that so many working people in the UK have a more deserving case for assistance from their union than the tube drivers. I thought my views were clear and certainly not obfuscating. | | | |
| They're at it again on 00:15 - Aug 21 with 1802 views | MattinLondon |
| They're at it again on 19:26 - Aug 20 by GeoffSentence |
The big surprise to me, is that the tube till has drivers. |
I’m pretty sure the newer trains don’t need drivers. |  | | |
| They're at it again on 08:56 - Aug 21 with 1747 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 00:15 - Aug 21 by MattinLondon |
I’m pretty sure the newer trains don’t need drivers. |
I think the jubilee line doesn't and that's not really even new anymore. They just make that option more attractive.
The balance of opinion seems to be against what I'm saying, so I'll shut it after clarifying a couple of things
I think I'm speaking out against self-interest basically and a lack of acknowledgement from drivers that they have a good thing going, or a willingness to help out. Against a backdrop of pandemic, joblessness and financial bailouts to keep their trade running, I find it sad that they dig in rather than chip in.
It all seems ironically indicative of Thatcher's society-less world, which seems strange coming from what calls itself the left.
Real 'community' or care for others would see them accept their privilege and pipe down for the greater good.
J2 asked what I do. I knock up websites and keep them running as a freelancer and surprisingly often perhaps, that means practising what I preach above, so please be assured, I'm not asking them to do anything other than what I demand of myself.
Anyway, just wanted to explain that this isn't some hatred of the left. It's actually a complaint that they seem free of any sense of solidairy with the many less well off londoners who would be screwed over by their strike. [Post edited 21 Aug 2021 8:58]
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| They're at it again on 09:08 - Aug 21 with 1727 views | Herbivore |
| They're at it again on 08:56 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
I think the jubilee line doesn't and that's not really even new anymore. They just make that option more attractive.
The balance of opinion seems to be against what I'm saying, so I'll shut it after clarifying a couple of things
I think I'm speaking out against self-interest basically and a lack of acknowledgement from drivers that they have a good thing going, or a willingness to help out. Against a backdrop of pandemic, joblessness and financial bailouts to keep their trade running, I find it sad that they dig in rather than chip in.
It all seems ironically indicative of Thatcher's society-less world, which seems strange coming from what calls itself the left.
Real 'community' or care for others would see them accept their privilege and pipe down for the greater good.
J2 asked what I do. I knock up websites and keep them running as a freelancer and surprisingly often perhaps, that means practising what I preach above, so please be assured, I'm not asking them to do anything other than what I demand of myself.
Anyway, just wanted to explain that this isn't some hatred of the left. It's actually a complaint that they seem free of any sense of solidairy with the many less well off londoners who would be screwed over by their strike. [Post edited 21 Aug 2021 8:58]
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We get it, you're annoyed that you won't be able to get the tube for a day. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:10 - Aug 21 with 1723 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 09:08 - Aug 21 by Herbivore |
We get it, you're annoyed that you won't be able to get the tube for a day. |
Very glib fella, ignores what I just typed and answers what you think you read.
As it happens I'm not using the tube and working from home - I'm thinking of others. [Post edited 21 Aug 2021 9:11]
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| They're at it again on 09:14 - Aug 21 with 1711 views | Darth_Koont |
| They're at it again on 08:56 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
I think the jubilee line doesn't and that's not really even new anymore. They just make that option more attractive.
The balance of opinion seems to be against what I'm saying, so I'll shut it after clarifying a couple of things
I think I'm speaking out against self-interest basically and a lack of acknowledgement from drivers that they have a good thing going, or a willingness to help out. Against a backdrop of pandemic, joblessness and financial bailouts to keep their trade running, I find it sad that they dig in rather than chip in.
It all seems ironically indicative of Thatcher's society-less world, which seems strange coming from what calls itself the left.
Real 'community' or care for others would see them accept their privilege and pipe down for the greater good.
J2 asked what I do. I knock up websites and keep them running as a freelancer and surprisingly often perhaps, that means practising what I preach above, so please be assured, I'm not asking them to do anything other than what I demand of myself.
Anyway, just wanted to explain that this isn't some hatred of the left. It's actually a complaint that they seem free of any sense of solidairy with the many less well off londoners who would be screwed over by their strike. [Post edited 21 Aug 2021 8:58]
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You’re saying that this is about society’s good and limiting self-interest ... and it’s the train drivers you’re upset about!!??
Putting aside whether the train drivers should be any form of target at all (Juggsy’s excellent insight into the job was very revealing), if you really believe that why do you read the papers you do and vote for the politicians you do?
You should be punching up, you silly billy. |  |
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| They're at it again on 09:16 - Aug 21 with 1708 views | Darth_Koont |
| They're at it again on 09:08 - Aug 21 by Herbivore |
We get it, you're annoyed that you won't be able to get the tube for a day. |
That was the vibe I got too. Plus a sprinkle of “bloody unions dragging this country down!” | |
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| They're at it again on 09:16 - Aug 21 with 1700 views | Herbivore |
| They're at it again on 09:10 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Very glib fella, ignores what I just typed and answers what you think you read.
As it happens I'm not using the tube and working from home - I'm thinking of others. [Post edited 21 Aug 2021 9:11]
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I stand by it. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:18 - Aug 21 with 1692 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 09:16 - Aug 21 by Herbivore |
I stand by it. |
When I don't use the tube?! Or you don't believe I don't use the tube? | |
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| They're at it again on 09:23 - Aug 21 with 1681 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 09:14 - Aug 21 by Darth_Koont |
You’re saying that this is about society’s good and limiting self-interest ... and it’s the train drivers you’re upset about!!??
Putting aside whether the train drivers should be any form of target at all (Juggsy’s excellent insight into the job was very revealing), if you really believe that why do you read the papers you do and vote for the politicians you do?
You should be punching up, you silly billy. |
Don't you see!? I am punching up! At a small self-interested group which holds millions of other often less-well off people to ransom. regularly.
And that's despite their industry being bailed out... in principal, it reminds me of another group we all moaned about.
Have you read the papers lately? They don't complain about a lack of solidarity. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:28 - Aug 21 with 1659 views | Herbivore |
| They're at it again on 09:23 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Don't you see!? I am punching up! At a small self-interested group which holds millions of other often less-well off people to ransom. regularly.
And that's despite their industry being bailed out... in principal, it reminds me of another group we all moaned about.
Have you read the papers lately? They don't complain about a lack of solidarity. |
Weird. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:32 - Aug 21 with 1649 views | Darth_Koont |
| They're at it again on 09:23 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Don't you see!? I am punching up! At a small self-interested group which holds millions of other often less-well off people to ransom. regularly.
And that's despite their industry being bailed out... in principal, it reminds me of another group we all moaned about.
Have you read the papers lately? They don't complain about a lack of solidarity. |
They hold politicians to ransom for pay and working conditions. The politicians then decide if they’re going to pass that on to the public.
I suggest you read Juggsy’s description of the job again.
You’re coming across as a big C. Content to see decades of systemic inequality in the UK if you think your interests and beliefs are being served, but heaven help that someone else gets uppity and demands more where it doesn’t help you. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:33 - Aug 21 with 1645 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 09:28 - Aug 21 by Herbivore |
Weird. |
Either you're too indoctrinated to think outside your box, or you're having trouble comprehending what I'm writing.
I'll leave you with one last point. If this strike goes ahead, who will be the ones who have no choice but to struggle in? Who's usually in the best position to work at home, or work flexi-time and come in another day instead? It's not the shop workers, cleaners or service people on london living wage (if they're lucky). | |
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| They're at it again on 09:37 - Aug 21 with 1634 views | giant_stow |
| They're at it again on 09:32 - Aug 21 by Darth_Koont |
They hold politicians to ransom for pay and working conditions. The politicians then decide if they’re going to pass that on to the public.
I suggest you read Juggsy’s description of the job again.
You’re coming across as a big C. Content to see decades of systemic inequality in the UK if you think your interests and beliefs are being served, but heaven help that someone else gets uppity and demands more where it doesn’t help you. |
I know you think I'm a c@nt Darth, but at least reply to what I've written: I don't use the tube. I'm thinking of others who do. I have no horse in this race.
Maybe its hard for you to comprehend someone giving a sh1t about something that doesn't effect them. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:39 - Aug 21 with 1631 views | Darth_Koont |
| They're at it again on 09:33 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Either you're too indoctrinated to think outside your box, or you're having trouble comprehending what I'm writing.
I'll leave you with one last point. If this strike goes ahead, who will be the ones who have no choice but to struggle in? Who's usually in the best position to work at home, or work flexi-time and come in another day instead? It's not the shop workers, cleaners or service people on london living wage (if they're lucky). |
Your conditional support for low-paid workers is very touching.
But you don’t seem to care much about them the other 364 days a year, just when you can wring your hands and have a go at unionised workers.
You’ve been indoctrinated by the right-wing media and particularly their style of rhetoric. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:41 - Aug 21 with 1624 views | Herbivore |
| They're at it again on 09:33 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Either you're too indoctrinated to think outside your box, or you're having trouble comprehending what I'm writing.
I'll leave you with one last point. If this strike goes ahead, who will be the ones who have no choice but to struggle in? Who's usually in the best position to work at home, or work flexi-time and come in another day instead? It's not the shop workers, cleaners or service people on london living wage (if they're lucky). |
Then maybe you should be campaigning for better pay and conditions for service industry workers rather than pissing and moaning that another group of working people are standing up for their rights? Just a thought. | |
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| They're at it again on 09:42 - Aug 21 with 1620 views | lowhouseblue |
| They're at it again on 09:33 - Aug 21 by giant_stow |
Either you're too indoctrinated to think outside your box, or you're having trouble comprehending what I'm writing.
I'll leave you with one last point. If this strike goes ahead, who will be the ones who have no choice but to struggle in? Who's usually in the best position to work at home, or work flexi-time and come in another day instead? It's not the shop workers, cleaners or service people on london living wage (if they're lucky). |
the computer says all strikes are good.
your faith that you can reason with people is very touching but i'd give up if i were you. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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