| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? 12:29 - Aug 30 with 8258 views | Herbivore |
Last season when Cook came in I remember him being pretty vocal about the size of the squad and it being too bloated, especially in certain areas, and us having too many loan players. He wanted a small, quality squad that he could work hard with and get playing his way.
Fast forward to the end of the transfer window and it looks very much like we're going to have a massive squad again and, if Walton and Celina join, we'll be up at five players on loan. The start has been poor and based on Hladky's displays so far I see the need for a new keeper. But another attacking player when we already have at least 2 players for every position? Morsy looks the type of midfielder we need as our current options don't look solid enough defensively, but when we already have Carroll, Evans, and Harper signed as well as El Miz and Nolan in the first team squad you have to ask whether the first three signings were made with any great thought? Did we not foresee that we might need some steel when signing three neat and tidy players to complement the two neat and tidy players already on our books?
I'm sure this will upset some as it's become unacceptable to ask questions of the new regime, but I do find the late flurry to bolster an already very large first team squad a little unsettling. It feels very much like how the old regime operated, throw new (often temporary) additions at it if it's not working rather than showing a bit more planning and nous. I hope for all our sakes it works this time. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 12:33]
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:34 - Aug 30 with 3686 views | Bluefish |
Both came in and spoke nonsense about the previous squads in regards to numbers and loans. It shows a lack of vision and strategy and smacks desperation |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:36 - Aug 30 with 3660 views | chrismakin |
Celina is a signing for the 2nd half of the season, nothing more, it's actually quite something that we see town being proactive about a situation, we've signed him, no one else can and when it comes to the 2nd half of the season, we go into it with alot more legs than other sides will have. The complete opposite to our previous few seasons.
Late flurry in a transfer window is normal for sides that can actually make use of a window to it's full purpose. Players become available who you targetted at the beginning - Walton.
There is nothing similar to this transfer window to previous years. We've actually signed a squad.
There will still be players leaving, the squad is still not as big as last seasons either.
Loans are fine, as long as there is a reason behind him. Last season we had 6 loans, NOT 1 of them was better than what we had. Apart from Barry, we haven't had a loan as yet which us not a compliment to the squad. Bonne - beutiful use of the loan system.
If we go up, we will need to recruit again, to do so, its no suprise to see some loan signings and 1 year deals thrown in as it gives us the option if/when that time comes. etc |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:38 - Aug 30 with 3655 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:36 - Aug 30 by chrismakin |
Celina is a signing for the 2nd half of the season, nothing more, it's actually quite something that we see town being proactive about a situation, we've signed him, no one else can and when it comes to the 2nd half of the season, we go into it with alot more legs than other sides will have. The complete opposite to our previous few seasons.
Late flurry in a transfer window is normal for sides that can actually make use of a window to it's full purpose. Players become available who you targetted at the beginning - Walton.
There is nothing similar to this transfer window to previous years. We've actually signed a squad.
There will still be players leaving, the squad is still not as big as last seasons either.
Loans are fine, as long as there is a reason behind him. Last season we had 6 loans, NOT 1 of them was better than what we had. Apart from Barry, we haven't had a loan as yet which us not a compliment to the squad. Bonne - beutiful use of the loan system.
If we go up, we will need to recruit again, to do so, its no suprise to see some loan signings and 1 year deals thrown in as it gives us the option if/when that time comes. etc |
Keep telling yourself that, mate. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:40 - Aug 30 with 3610 views | chrismakin |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:38 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
Keep telling yourself that, mate. |
sorry, did I just pi s on your fire.
Don't worry, i'll keep out now, let you have you rant. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:41 - Aug 30 with 3617 views | FPL_Tractor |
I think the loan of Barry looked strange at the time and could be a total waste. The others I can broadly get behind. But I hope once we have a proper recruitment team we can be more strategic. |  |
| For more ITFC chat and some fantasy football mutterings follow me on twitter @fpl_tractor. |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:44 - Aug 30 with 3599 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:41 - Aug 30 by FPL_Tractor |
I think the loan of Barry looked strange at the time and could be a total waste. The others I can broadly get behind. But I hope once we have a proper recruitment team we can be more strategic. |
Barry has a lot of potential it seems but at this point is he really a huge upgrade on Dobra? Probably not. And why on earth did we sign Aluko? We've got so many options in the attacking areas now it's going to be a big challenge to keep them all happy. Same will go for the midfield if Morsy signs, we'll have four CMs for two spots all of whom won't expect to be bench warmers in League 1. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:47 - Aug 30 with 3562 views | StochesStotasBlewe |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:36 - Aug 30 by chrismakin |
Celina is a signing for the 2nd half of the season, nothing more, it's actually quite something that we see town being proactive about a situation, we've signed him, no one else can and when it comes to the 2nd half of the season, we go into it with alot more legs than other sides will have. The complete opposite to our previous few seasons.
Late flurry in a transfer window is normal for sides that can actually make use of a window to it's full purpose. Players become available who you targetted at the beginning - Walton.
There is nothing similar to this transfer window to previous years. We've actually signed a squad.
There will still be players leaving, the squad is still not as big as last seasons either.
Loans are fine, as long as there is a reason behind him. Last season we had 6 loans, NOT 1 of them was better than what we had. Apart from Barry, we haven't had a loan as yet which us not a compliment to the squad. Bonne - beutiful use of the loan system.
If we go up, we will need to recruit again, to do so, its no suprise to see some loan signings and 1 year deals thrown in as it gives us the option if/when that time comes. etc |
We need another goalkeeper. He is fit, better than we currently have. Good business.
We need a defensive midfielder, you know, someone experienced who does the ugly stuff, rolls their sleeves up, gets stuck in. That would be good business.
We don't need a footballer who won't be fit to play until the second half of the season, no matter the previous stint said player had here. Poor business. |  |
| We have no village green, or a shop.
It's very, very quiet.
I can walk to the pub. |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:51 - Aug 30 with 3536 views | chicoazul |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:44 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
Barry has a lot of potential it seems but at this point is he really a huge upgrade on Dobra? Probably not. And why on earth did we sign Aluko? We've got so many options in the attacking areas now it's going to be a big challenge to keep them all happy. Same will go for the midfield if Morsy signs, we'll have four CMs for two spots all of whom won't expect to be bench warmers in League 1. |
I think he got Aluko as he was free, experienced and versatile. He’ll get us a few this season.
Take your point about the squad size in general but it’ll be 22 plus keepers according to Phil. Don’t imagine Cook will have much of anything to do with the U23 squad and will focus on training the firsts. So it’ll be a tight knit group, sadly the likes of El Miz and Dobs and maybe even Woolf will miss out. |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:58 - Aug 30 with 3493 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:51 - Aug 30 by chicoazul |
I think he got Aluko as he was free, experienced and versatile. He’ll get us a few this season.
Take your point about the squad size in general but it’ll be 22 plus keepers according to Phil. Don’t imagine Cook will have much of anything to do with the U23 squad and will focus on training the firsts. So it’ll be a tight knit group, sadly the likes of El Miz and Dobs and maybe even Woolf will miss out. |
Not sure it's that straightforward, Chico. Even if he keeps it down to a core squad of 22 plus the keepers, there'll be 22 outfield players all expecting to be regulars at this level when we can only pick ten of them. Keeping them happy won't be easy. He's kind of basically created the same problem he identified when he came into the club, albeit with better players (on paper at least). | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:04 - Aug 30 with 3447 views | chicoazul |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 12:58 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
Not sure it's that straightforward, Chico. Even if he keeps it down to a core squad of 22 plus the keepers, there'll be 22 outfield players all expecting to be regulars at this level when we can only pick ten of them. Keeping them happy won't be easy. He's kind of basically created the same problem he identified when he came into the club, albeit with better players (on paper at least). |
Surely you’re not advocating for a smaller squad than 22 though (plus keepers)? It sounds about right to me. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:12 - Aug 30 with 3397 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:04 - Aug 30 by chicoazul |
Surely you’re not advocating for a smaller squad than 22 though (plus keepers)? It sounds about right to me. |
It's not so much the number it's how many of them have been brought to the club with an expectation of playing regularly. You can't keep a squad of 22 outfield players happy when 6 of them won't even make the bench, let alone start.
Excluding goalies we now have:
Defenders - KVY, Donacien, Nsiala, Edmundson, Woolf, Burgess, Penney, Coulson
Midfield - Evans, Harper, Carroll, Nolan, El Miz (strong possibility of adding Morsy)
Attacking midfielders - Fraser, Dobra, Burns, Chaplin, Barry, Aluko, Edwards (likely to add Celina)
Forwards - Bonne, Pigott, Norwood, Jackson
That's not including Kenlock, who hasn't featured at all for us. That's 24 outfield players if we don't include Celina and Morsy, 26 if we do. Even if we assume Jackson goes and Dobra and El Miz go out on loan that's still a huge squad, chock full of players who aren't likely to be chuffed that they aren't even making the bench every week.
Competition is good to a point but it has to be balanced against squad management and Cook himself said when he came in this year that our first team squad was too big to manage. It looks the same again to me. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:16 - Aug 30 with 3356 views | _sanctimoanious_ |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:12 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
It's not so much the number it's how many of them have been brought to the club with an expectation of playing regularly. You can't keep a squad of 22 outfield players happy when 6 of them won't even make the bench, let alone start.
Excluding goalies we now have:
Defenders - KVY, Donacien, Nsiala, Edmundson, Woolf, Burgess, Penney, Coulson
Midfield - Evans, Harper, Carroll, Nolan, El Miz (strong possibility of adding Morsy)
Attacking midfielders - Fraser, Dobra, Burns, Chaplin, Barry, Aluko, Edwards (likely to add Celina)
Forwards - Bonne, Pigott, Norwood, Jackson
That's not including Kenlock, who hasn't featured at all for us. That's 24 outfield players if we don't include Celina and Morsy, 26 if we do. Even if we assume Jackson goes and Dobra and El Miz go out on loan that's still a huge squad, chock full of players who aren't likely to be chuffed that they aren't even making the bench every week.
Competition is good to a point but it has to be balanced against squad management and Cook himself said when he came in this year that our first team squad was too big to manage. It looks the same again to me. |
Every player should have expectations of playing regularly? |  | | |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:17 - Aug 30 with 3331 views | chrismakin |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:16 - Aug 30 by _sanctimoanious_ |
Every player should have expectations of playing regularly? |
lol, he's literally digging a hole, leave him to it.
Why would you want a squad of players who don't want to play. lol | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:19 - Aug 30 with 3320 views | itfcjoe |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:12 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
It's not so much the number it's how many of them have been brought to the club with an expectation of playing regularly. You can't keep a squad of 22 outfield players happy when 6 of them won't even make the bench, let alone start.
Excluding goalies we now have:
Defenders - KVY, Donacien, Nsiala, Edmundson, Woolf, Burgess, Penney, Coulson
Midfield - Evans, Harper, Carroll, Nolan, El Miz (strong possibility of adding Morsy)
Attacking midfielders - Fraser, Dobra, Burns, Chaplin, Barry, Aluko, Edwards (likely to add Celina)
Forwards - Bonne, Pigott, Norwood, Jackson
That's not including Kenlock, who hasn't featured at all for us. That's 24 outfield players if we don't include Celina and Morsy, 26 if we do. Even if we assume Jackson goes and Dobra and El Miz go out on loan that's still a huge squad, chock full of players who aren't likely to be chuffed that they aren't even making the bench every week.
Competition is good to a point but it has to be balanced against squad management and Cook himself said when he came in this year that our first team squad was too big to manage. It looks the same again to me. |
There’s going to be so many not even getting in the match day 18 |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:20 - Aug 30 with 3315 views | pointofblue |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:12 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
It's not so much the number it's how many of them have been brought to the club with an expectation of playing regularly. You can't keep a squad of 22 outfield players happy when 6 of them won't even make the bench, let alone start.
Excluding goalies we now have:
Defenders - KVY, Donacien, Nsiala, Edmundson, Woolf, Burgess, Penney, Coulson
Midfield - Evans, Harper, Carroll, Nolan, El Miz (strong possibility of adding Morsy)
Attacking midfielders - Fraser, Dobra, Burns, Chaplin, Barry, Aluko, Edwards (likely to add Celina)
Forwards - Bonne, Pigott, Norwood, Jackson
That's not including Kenlock, who hasn't featured at all for us. That's 24 outfield players if we don't include Celina and Morsy, 26 if we do. Even if we assume Jackson goes and Dobra and El Miz go out on loan that's still a huge squad, chock full of players who aren't likely to be chuffed that they aren't even making the bench every week.
Competition is good to a point but it has to be balanced against squad management and Cook himself said when he came in this year that our first team squad was too big to manage. It looks the same again to me. |
Eight defenders is fine and evenly split - four full backs, four centre backs. We also have Kenlock but Cook clearly has no interest in him.
El Mizouni will surely be loaned out. Morsy's introduction might result in questions being asked of Nolan's future; I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves.
Splitting the attacking midfileders into right wing, left wing and number tens:
Right - Burns and Celina
Centre - Chaplin and Fraser
Left - Barry and Edwards
That's fine, two for every position. I agree, the Aluko signing seems a bit odd but I don't think he expects to be playing all that much. Dobra will be told to accept a loan or be left to play for the Under 23s - I think Cook wants him to go out for experience.
Stiker wise I'd be amazed if we haven't be trying to sell Jackson all summer though we might regret taking up the year's option if so. Otherwise three players for that position is fine, indeed losing Bonne, Chaplin and Norwood resulted in us looking short up top.
So I don't think the squad is over-burdened at this stage considering there are still players who we're looking to move on. |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:20 - Aug 30 with 3304 views | chrismakin |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:19 - Aug 30 by itfcjoe |
There’s going to be so many not even getting in the match day 18 |
Oh no, how on earth do all the other clubs cope with squads of 22 + with players all wanting to be involved. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:23 - Aug 30 with 3286 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:19 - Aug 30 by itfcjoe |
There’s going to be so many not even getting in the match day 18 |
Indeed, and this was something Cook himself identified as being a problem at the club when he arrived. But try telling that to those who have been necking the Kool Aid all summer. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:25 - Aug 30 with 3269 views | Reuser_is_God |
Hopefully we see some outgoings between now & the window shutting tomorrow too.
However I doubt many clubs are falling over themselves to sign Jackson & Kenlock. |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:26 - Aug 30 with 3259 views | Herbivore |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:20 - Aug 30 by pointofblue |
Eight defenders is fine and evenly split - four full backs, four centre backs. We also have Kenlock but Cook clearly has no interest in him.
El Mizouni will surely be loaned out. Morsy's introduction might result in questions being asked of Nolan's future; I wouldn't be surprised if he leaves.
Splitting the attacking midfileders into right wing, left wing and number tens:
Right - Burns and Celina
Centre - Chaplin and Fraser
Left - Barry and Edwards
That's fine, two for every position. I agree, the Aluko signing seems a bit odd but I don't think he expects to be playing all that much. Dobra will be told to accept a loan or be left to play for the Under 23s - I think Cook wants him to go out for experience.
Stiker wise I'd be amazed if we haven't be trying to sell Jackson all summer though we might regret taking up the year's option if so. Otherwise three players for that position is fine, indeed losing Bonne, Chaplin and Norwood resulted in us looking short up top.
So I don't think the squad is over-burdened at this stage considering there are still players who we're looking to move on. |
Sadly we can only play one player in each position though, and with your breakdown we still have spares who for now at least are at the club with no guarantee of being able to be moved on. As I said in my OP, I hope it works out but I have some reservations about the approach. We look bloated in some areas of the squad, much as we did when Cook came in and he identified that as one of our main problems. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:26 - Aug 30 with 3247 views | _sanctimoanious_ |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:23 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
Indeed, and this was something Cook himself identified as being a problem at the club when he arrived. But try telling that to those who have been necking the Kool Aid all summer. |
But that’s the deal with a squad. Because you feel Bonne, Pigott et al were signed as guaranteed starters doesn’t mean Cook does. All the signings have joined with excitement at the squad that is being compiled. The challenge is on them. People ate moaning at crazy things right now. Next you will be saying we should have kept Chambo. | | | |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:27 - Aug 30 with 3244 views | Keaneish |
Your point is based on this squad being bigger than last season, it isn’t so what’s your point? I’d like a loan or two less in truth but I’m not going to sacrifice the additional quality we’ve brought in over that.
Let’s remind ourselves that Celina and Walton have been long term targets, this isn’t a whim; there’s no desperation to this.
I’d like to see a few moved on now as was said back in April / May. Let’s see what the next 24 hours brings. |  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:27 - Aug 30 with 3223 views | chrismakin |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:26 - Aug 30 by _sanctimoanious_ |
But that’s the deal with a squad. Because you feel Bonne, Pigott et al were signed as guaranteed starters doesn’t mean Cook does. All the signings have joined with excitement at the squad that is being compiled. The challenge is on them. People ate moaning at crazy things right now. Next you will be saying we should have kept Chambo. |
Also, it was at the time impossible to put on proper training sessions
We had to many in the first time
to many in the u23s and even the u18s was full
It's not just the first team squad thats been trimmed. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:34 - Aug 30 with 3182 views | chicoazul |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:19 - Aug 30 by itfcjoe |
There’s going to be so many not even getting in the match day 18 |
So many..? 3 or 4 and it’s Ipswich so there will always be a couple injured. | |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:34 - Aug 30 with 3181 views | ArnieM |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:27 - Aug 30 by Keaneish |
Your point is based on this squad being bigger than last season, it isn’t so what’s your point? I’d like a loan or two less in truth but I’m not going to sacrifice the additional quality we’ve brought in over that.
Let’s remind ourselves that Celina and Walton have been long term targets, this isn’t a whim; there’s no desperation to this.
I’d like to see a few moved on now as was said back in April / May. Let’s see what the next 24 hours brings. |
Ah, a sensible post. Like it 👠|  |
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| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:35 - Aug 30 with 3171 views | pointofblue |
| Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? on 13:26 - Aug 30 by Herbivore |
Sadly we can only play one player in each position though, and with your breakdown we still have spares who for now at least are at the club with no guarantee of being able to be moved on. As I said in my OP, I hope it works out but I have some reservations about the approach. We look bloated in some areas of the squad, much as we did when Cook came in and he identified that as one of our main problems. |
I just attempted to do a first eleven and subs bench based on your previously post which maybe exposes the issue you raise better.
Walton; Vincent-Young, Coulson, Edmundson, Burgess; Morsy, Evans; Burns, Celina, Edwards; Bonne
Subs: Hladky, Penney, Woolfenden, Harper, Fraser, Chaplin, Pigott
Missing out: Dobra, Donacien, El Mizouni, Nsiala, Nolan, Carroll, Aluko, Barry, Jackson, Norwood
In fairness the majority of them may not be surprised at this turn of events (the first five plus Aluko and Jackson). Norwood could well be told to like it or lump it too.
With the rest I think it'll be a case of rotation though. Maybe picking certain players to exploit the weaknesses in different sides. Burns clearly is unable to play more than a match a week for now, if that, possibly the same with KVY and Coulson at the moment. Celina will probably be used sparingly for a bit due to a lack of pre-season. The signing of Barry is probably the one which doesn't sit right with me at the moment - Villa surely expect him to get game time but when? Other than in the Trophy. | |
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