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Hindsight 19:20 - Sep 11 with 2995 viewsF1Blue

First post on here so please be kind.

What's your thoughts on the summer cull now? I'm feeling it may have now been too dramatic?

I agree we had got stagnant and lots of players weren't up to standard, but would we have been better to have kept a core and added sensibly?

No doubt some of the signings we've made are fantastic but the defensive issues are probably the worst I've seen in some time.

Thoughts?
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Hindsight on 19:25 - Sep 11 with 2441 viewsgtsb1966

Your last paragraph probably sums it up. If we had a solid defence we would be more than ok but then again if my aunty had balls she would be my uncle.
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Hindsight on 19:27 - Sep 11 with 2430 viewschrismakin

Still needed.

We didnt let players leave who I feel we're 'missing' other than some who wanted to leave.. I,E Downes.

But I feel the balance of the signings is off. We concentrated so highly on the final third, we forgot about what happens off the ball.

The failure to replace Downes has been evident, Morsey will replace this, but we have to wait.

CB's may come good, but they're being left open by their fullbacks who in turn are not being supported by the midfield who in turn aren't being supported by the players on the flanks.

We have a 10 who hadn't been played as a 10, ( Absent today ) so went with a striker as a 10 instead.
we have a fullback playing the inside forward role on the right when our actual FB is doing his best worst impression of a Right footed Kenlock

It's a good squad, full of excellent individuals. Much better than last years players as individuals....... but its not a team.
[Post edited 11 Sep 2021 19:29]

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Hindsight on 19:27 - Sep 11 with 2435 viewsTheBoyBlue

Defensively there is no one we let go that I would've preferred to keep, but that was dire today, an absolute joke. There is no lack of ability, but there is something missing from an attitude perspective. No one really gets stuck in, for all the talk of "Running into adversity", there seem to be lots of running from it today. Simply rolled over.

I do wonder what Holy makes of it all. I didn't think he did too badly and now he's third fiddle to these jokers.

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Hindsight on 19:29 - Sep 11 with 2424 viewsMarshalls_Mullet

Hindsight on 19:27 - Sep 11 by TheBoyBlue

Defensively there is no one we let go that I would've preferred to keep, but that was dire today, an absolute joke. There is no lack of ability, but there is something missing from an attitude perspective. No one really gets stuck in, for all the talk of "Running into adversity", there seem to be lots of running from it today. Simply rolled over.

I do wonder what Holy makes of it all. I didn't think he did too badly and now he's third fiddle to these jokers.


Wilson?

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Hindsight on 19:30 - Sep 11 with 2397 viewsTheBoyBlue

Hindsight on 19:29 - Sep 11 by Marshalls_Mullet

Wilson?


No, fair point, might have kept Wilson. But still wouldn't have put ahead of today's pairing. Might do now.

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Hindsight on 19:33 - Sep 11 with 2362 viewsHighgateBlue

Hindsight on 19:29 - Sep 11 by Marshalls_Mullet

Wilson?


Ab.so.lutely.

Cook decimated our defence with no justification. How much was it costing to keep Wilson with us? He was solid, had a really good season last year, and had experience. Fantasy football was not the way to go in respect of our defence.
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Hindsight on 19:36 - Sep 11 with 2345 viewsGuthrum

Hindsight on 19:29 - Sep 11 by Marshalls_Mullet

Wilson?


Wilson spent a fair bit of last season injured (only made 18 appearances). Plus is now 32, so that injury record may not get better.

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Hindsight on 19:38 - Sep 11 with 2324 viewsgordon

James Wilson was/is miles better than either of those centre-halves (based on today's performance), and Rekeem Harper looked awful, would much rather have Bishop, and Dobra would've done more than Chaplin. Haven't really seen much benefit to our various goalkeeper upgrades, but assuming we couldn't have held on to Downes and Dozzell anyway, who else is there?
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Hindsight on 19:39 - Sep 11 with 2318 viewswkj

It was dramatic, however - what choice did he really have? Our club had been coasting with most of the same players for far too long, and most of those players should have been sold/released and replaced at various points.

The exception to this if Gibbs. I still think that we could have done more to keep hold of the lad. Might not have been a first-teamer this season, but would definitely have deserved a few cameos at least.

Don't be blind to the fact that some of the key issues with Cook from last season have carried through to this season-

We're shat at defending setpieces
His tactical substitutions usually make little sense, and do little to change our fate (in reality, it has lost us leads a few times)

Cook has ability as a manager, but he does not have adaptability - and this is something fans of his other clubs have said too.

Crybaby
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Hindsight on 19:41 - Sep 11 with 2307 viewsHighgateBlue

Hindsight on 19:36 - Sep 11 by Guthrum

Wilson spent a fair bit of last season injured (only made 18 appearances). Plus is now 32, so that injury record may not get better.


He was our player of the year. He is the last person to scratch around for criticisms of. Our ability to injure players is legendary, and Edmundson hasn't exactly looked too clever as regards staying injury free...

In fact, in all competitions, Wilson has played more for Plymouth than Edmundson and Burgess have for Town COMBINED.
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Hindsight on 19:44 - Sep 11 with 2289 viewsgordon

Hindsight on 19:41 - Sep 11 by HighgateBlue

He was our player of the year. He is the last person to scratch around for criticisms of. Our ability to injure players is legendary, and Edmundson hasn't exactly looked too clever as regards staying injury free...

In fact, in all competitions, Wilson has played more for Plymouth than Edmundson and Burgess have for Town COMBINED.


No injury problems for Plymouth, although he did get an early suspension. He was always excellent when I saw him for ITFC. Fair enough Edmundson probably wasn't fit today and shouldn't have played, but Burgess looked absolutely woeful.
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Hindsight on 19:46 - Sep 11 with 2262 viewsChurchman

I’ve no problem binning the lot if he deemed that necessary. However, it’s up to him to replace them with something better and form a competitive team.

A real thrashing at home, beaten with ease and 2 or more goals conceded every game to date says he is miles off creating a competitive team - and that includes a defence. I dread to think what scores the better teams are going to run up against that lot.

Cook under enormous pressure and deserves to be. If I was Ashton and the Chairman he’d be in front of the desk Monday morning to explain what that was and when he sees the team improving. His time is running out fast after a hammering like that.

When all is said and done, it’s a results business.
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Hindsight on 19:49 - Sep 11 with 2238 viewsWicklowBlue

Welcome to the fun forum! Our welcome standards are slipping, favourite cheese?

Only saw the goals but Edmundson looked way off it it was risky putting him from the start. KVY having a mare and having to be subbed after 20 odd mins is not going to help either.

For those who went to the game was it just a backline who haven't played together before and were at sixes and sevens? Or was it the centre 2 midfielders not protecting them?
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Hindsight on 19:51 - Sep 11 with 2232 viewsF1Blue

Hindsight on 19:27 - Sep 11 by chrismakin

Still needed.

We didnt let players leave who I feel we're 'missing' other than some who wanted to leave.. I,E Downes.

But I feel the balance of the signings is off. We concentrated so highly on the final third, we forgot about what happens off the ball.

The failure to replace Downes has been evident, Morsey will replace this, but we have to wait.

CB's may come good, but they're being left open by their fullbacks who in turn are not being supported by the midfield who in turn aren't being supported by the players on the flanks.

We have a 10 who hadn't been played as a 10, ( Absent today ) so went with a striker as a 10 instead.
we have a fullback playing the inside forward role on the right when our actual FB is doing his best worst impression of a Right footed Kenlock

It's a good squad, full of excellent individuals. Much better than last years players as individuals....... but its not a team.
[Post edited 11 Sep 2021 19:29]


I think that's what I'm getting from it all...

We needed the changes.. Badly..

But these players just don't seem to be a team, no one seems to be grabbing an amazing opportunity by the horns.. No one is in control.. We're so far from being a team its untrue.

I hope Morsy is the man for this... Such a shame we will have to wait!
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Hindsight on 19:53 - Sep 11 with 2211 viewsGuthrum

Hindsight on 19:41 - Sep 11 by HighgateBlue

He was our player of the year. He is the last person to scratch around for criticisms of. Our ability to injure players is legendary, and Edmundson hasn't exactly looked too clever as regards staying injury free...

In fact, in all competitions, Wilson has played more for Plymouth than Edmundson and Burgess have for Town COMBINED.


He was player of the season as much by default as anything else, given the CBs were about the only players who did anything positive and Nsiala is a scapegoat to many.

Given Burgess didn't arrive at Town until 15th August, that's a little unfair. Including for Accrington, he's played the same number as Wilson. Also, that's so far only six.

I don't think Wilson was a bad player by any means. He and Toto were our best combination last season. But it remains a fact that he missed two large chunks of the season injured.

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Hindsight on 19:56 - Sep 11 with 2192 viewschrismakin

Hindsight on 19:53 - Sep 11 by Guthrum

He was player of the season as much by default as anything else, given the CBs were about the only players who did anything positive and Nsiala is a scapegoat to many.

Given Burgess didn't arrive at Town until 15th August, that's a little unfair. Including for Accrington, he's played the same number as Wilson. Also, that's so far only six.

I don't think Wilson was a bad player by any means. He and Toto were our best combination last season. But it remains a fact that he missed two large chunks of the season injured.


It's also not to be forgotten that last seasons defence was protected by the 6 in front of them sitting so deep, not scoring, passing sideways and backwards and barely getting out of our own half.

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Hindsight on 19:56 - Sep 11 with 2192 viewsOldboy

Our squad last season was terrible. Defence was our strongest department, but not good enough for L1 top 6. This lot on paper are miles better, but the pitch is where it matters and so far this lot are cr@p. I would sum up that this squad is miles better than last season's, so you have to look at the manager. The blame starts and ends there.
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Hindsight on 23:44 - Sep 11 with 1965 viewsGarv

Hindsight on 19:27 - Sep 11 by chrismakin

Still needed.

We didnt let players leave who I feel we're 'missing' other than some who wanted to leave.. I,E Downes.

But I feel the balance of the signings is off. We concentrated so highly on the final third, we forgot about what happens off the ball.

The failure to replace Downes has been evident, Morsey will replace this, but we have to wait.

CB's may come good, but they're being left open by their fullbacks who in turn are not being supported by the midfield who in turn aren't being supported by the players on the flanks.

We have a 10 who hadn't been played as a 10, ( Absent today ) so went with a striker as a 10 instead.
we have a fullback playing the inside forward role on the right when our actual FB is doing his best worst impression of a Right footed Kenlock

It's a good squad, full of excellent individuals. Much better than last years players as individuals....... but its not a team.
[Post edited 11 Sep 2021 19:29]


Are you saying Burns is a full back??

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Hindsight on 23:58 - Sep 11 with 1908 viewschrismakin

Hindsight on 23:44 - Sep 11 by Garv

Are you saying Burns is a full back??


Was one before he moved up the pitch. I think with the options we do have, i'd pop him back as he may give us more stability than KVY.

Ideally you'd play him as a wingback though.

he played Rightback at BC, and Barton originally preferred him at Fullback when he went to them (Fleetwood)
https://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/sport/football/wes-burns-can-hit-heights-righ
[Post edited 12 Sep 2021 0:01]

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Hindsight on 00:10 - Sep 12 with 1849 views44_not_out

A defensive 7 of:

Holy
KVY - Chambers - Wolf or Wilson - Kenlock
Skuse - Downes

Then add:

Burns - Fraser - Kyle Edwards
Bonne

Would be far higher in this Division at this point

To answer the OP, IMO the ‘cull’ was too much!

No one is telling me the defensive players signed are any better than what we had.

In addition, we have too many players despite what Cook said he intended to do re. A smaller squad
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Hindsight on 01:07 - Sep 12 with 1710 viewspointofblue

It feels like something went very wrong with the defensive recruitment.

When you look at who we brought in in midfield and up front, it's proven players at this level who had superb seasons last time out, players from a higher level who believe in the project or youngsters from higher league sides who want a chance.

I guess at left back you could say Coulson and Penney fall under the youngster category. But we don't bring in a right back, despite KVY's injury record and Donacien being a midtable player at best and then that key centre back role... I'm sorry, I don't accept Burgess was is our top five targets. He did well last year in a different formation with different expectatons and suddenly we put him in a four. He doesn't match the criteria of our other, forward thinking, signings. As for Edmundson, a promising player but has less experience that Woolfenden and, to put it bluntly, it showed today - not withstanding his lack of fitness. Why didn't we bring in the same quality at the back as we did going forward? And I haven't even got to the palaver with the keepers.

Attack had careful selection liked a prized chef picks ingredients with consideration and thoughtfulness. Defence has a complete "this'll do" feel about it.

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Hindsight on 01:32 - Sep 12 with 1672 viewschrismakin

Hindsight on 01:07 - Sep 12 by pointofblue

It feels like something went very wrong with the defensive recruitment.

When you look at who we brought in in midfield and up front, it's proven players at this level who had superb seasons last time out, players from a higher level who believe in the project or youngsters from higher league sides who want a chance.

I guess at left back you could say Coulson and Penney fall under the youngster category. But we don't bring in a right back, despite KVY's injury record and Donacien being a midtable player at best and then that key centre back role... I'm sorry, I don't accept Burgess was is our top five targets. He did well last year in a different formation with different expectatons and suddenly we put him in a four. He doesn't match the criteria of our other, forward thinking, signings. As for Edmundson, a promising player but has less experience that Woolfenden and, to put it bluntly, it showed today - not withstanding his lack of fitness. Why didn't we bring in the same quality at the back as we did going forward? And I haven't even got to the palaver with the keepers.

Attack had careful selection liked a prized chef picks ingredients with consideration and thoughtfulness. Defence has a complete "this'll do" feel about it.


When you've seen that we signed Morsey, Celina, Loaned Bonne, got Fraser, Burns, Edwards etc

Then you see we got Edmundson and Burgess- you are right in thinking where were they exactly on the target list......... I can't imagine they were 2 & 3 after Bradley.

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Hindsight on 02:20 - Sep 12 with 1609 viewsBcarefulwhatUWish4

Hindsight on 19:29 - Sep 11 by Marshalls_Mullet

Wilson?


Could turn out to be Cooks biggest mistake (letting Wilson go). We need strength and experience at the back.
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Hindsight on 07:28 - Sep 12 with 1480 viewsElephantintheRoom

Pointing out the complete idiocy of what has happened isn't hindsight - it's common sense.

The problems go far deeper than a mismatched shedload of players thrown together who may, or may not, be any better than thpse disposed of or sent into purgatory. The manager has been utterly useless since day one - but has been allowed to assemble a huge cast of backroom underperformers who have followed him, or the smarmy man in the open neck shirt around like a bad smell.

Not one of these people was here at the starrt of the year - and its being orchestrated by outsiders who have never been to Ipswich and have not the remotest interest in the club - worse still it is being financed by borrowed money. This insanity has consequences on snd off the pitch.

For supporters of a certain age it is not 'The Ipswich Way'. It's the complete opposite of what should have been done to try and arrest the spiral of decline - and descent into a derided comedy club.

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Hindsight on 07:43 - Sep 12 with 1429 viewsWD19

I suspect lots of people will point to it. My challenge to them is to list the players who were culled who they now think we should have kept.

For me Wilson was sort of useful as a squad option. Nydam I liked but it seems is struggling with his injuries. Downes wanted out…..which leaves….erm……Skuse maybe if he could have proved his fitness and shed about 5 years.

So as far as I can see, when people disagree with the cull it is mostly a “I like Teddy Bishop” post.
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