| "Remembrance Period" 14:08 - Nov 6 with 2742 views | Zx1988 |
What's this whole 'remembrance period' thing about? I thought that you had a minute's silence if you were at home on remembrance weekend, not if you played at any time in the first fortnight of November? |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 14:10 - Nov 6 with 2700 views | J2BLUE |
Really doesn't matter when it is really. People usually wear poppies from start of November. It's not something new. |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 14:12 - Nov 6 with 2684 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
It has become rather protracted. I like that football clubs promote remembrance and I like the traditional Remembrance at 11.00 on the 11th and on the nearest Sunday. I guess no harm is done by having extra moments to pause and remember but it is different from what is traditional. |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 14:15 - Nov 6 with 2634 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 14:10 - Nov 6 by J2BLUE |
Really doesn't matter when it is really. People usually wear poppies from start of November. It's not something new. |
Maybe I am wrong but I feel it used to be people would wear them on the 11th and maybe a few days before. Gradually the media (news presenters etc) started wearing them for a longer and longer period of time until it seems like it is still October and people have started wearing them. No harm in it but it does seem more protracted (as do "Back to School", Christmas, Easter, Halloween, November 5th, etc.). | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 14:17 - Nov 6 with 2620 views | Zx1988 |
| "Remembrance Period" on 14:10 - Nov 6 by J2BLUE |
Really doesn't matter when it is really. People usually wear poppies from start of November. It's not something new. |
At least with two silences ITFC will be remembering harder than most of the rest of the Football League.
Perhaps we'll go for the hat-trick of remembrance on Tuesday against Colchester? | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 14:19 - Nov 6 with 2592 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 14:17 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
At least with two silences ITFC will be remembering harder than most of the rest of the Football League.
Perhaps we'll go for the hat-trick of remembrance on Tuesday against Colchester? |
Lest we forget, here is last season's team! | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 16:19 - Nov 6 with 2437 views | BlueBadger |
| "Remembrance Period" on 14:15 - Nov 6 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Maybe I am wrong but I feel it used to be people would wear them on the 11th and maybe a few days before. Gradually the media (news presenters etc) started wearing them for a longer and longer period of time until it seems like it is still October and people have started wearing them. No harm in it but it does seem more protracted (as do "Back to School", Christmas, Easter, Halloween, November 5th, etc.). |
It is increasingly morphing into Gammon Christmas in recent years, depressingly. With the ever-diminishing numbers of of the Greatest Generation the dignity, solemnity and overriding message of 'never again' is devolving into a weird display of jingoism, tacky decorations and (ironically, given the professed hatred of it from the worst offenders) virtue signalling.
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| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 with 2300 views | Zx1988 |
| "Remembrance Period" on 16:19 - Nov 6 by BlueBadger |
It is increasingly morphing into Gammon Christmas in recent years, depressingly. With the ever-diminishing numbers of of the Greatest Generation the dignity, solemnity and overriding message of 'never again' is devolving into a weird display of jingoism, tacky decorations and (ironically, given the professed hatred of it from the worst offenders) virtue signalling.
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Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 15:01 - Nov 7 with 2066 views | eastangliaisblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 16:19 - Nov 6 by BlueBadger |
It is increasingly morphing into Gammon Christmas in recent years, depressingly. With the ever-diminishing numbers of of the Greatest Generation the dignity, solemnity and overriding message of 'never again' is devolving into a weird display of jingoism, tacky decorations and (ironically, given the professed hatred of it from the worst offenders) virtue signalling.
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F#*k me that is tacky in the extreme. I had to laugh at the comment "That guys seen some sh1t." |  | | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 20:35 - Nov 7 with 1929 views | Durovigutum |
| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. |
I had a conversation with someone recently who said that with the decline in observance of remembrance Sunday in the early noughties that the British Legion had planned to get to the 100th anniversary of the end of the first world war and then "retire" the poppy. Thing is, popularity increased as people realise it's important to mark that war = death and destruction and loss and now it is where it is. I don't think it's a bad thing myself, saves glorification for sure. |  | | |
| "Remembrance Period" on 20:50 - Nov 7 with 1901 views | textbackup |
these brave men and women arent celebrated/remembered enough IMO.
its a small gesture from the footballing world who also celebrate a range of other aspects, such as taking the knee, the rainbow flag day etc. |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 21:01 - Nov 7 with 1846 views | Ryorry |
| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. |
I thought the poppy appeal was as much for currently injured/ill service personnel who need ongoing support due to having to take early medical retirement because of what they've incurred in 'line of duty'?
As much as for Remembrance of those fallen or injured by both WWs.
That's what's been in the British Legion's annual Poppy Appeal message in previous years anyway.
Lest we forget.
I wouldn't be here if it weren't for those real heroes of WW2 (and I don't mean just those who served in the armed forces), so I always take this very seriously, however it's described or commemorated. |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 23:09 - Nov 7 with 1712 views | wkj |
| "Remembrance Period" on 20:50 - Nov 7 by textbackup |
these brave men and women arent celebrated/remembered enough IMO.
its a small gesture from the footballing world who also celebrate a range of other aspects, such as taking the knee, the rainbow flag day etc. |
Plenty one can do to help more - you should checkout this link. https://www.britishlegion.org.uk/get-involved/things-to-do/volunteer/volunteerin
MAybe you can do a change collection at FPR. [Post edited 7 Nov 2021 23:12]
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| "Remembrance Period" on 00:17 - Nov 8 with 1630 views | Bugs |
| "Remembrance Period" on 20:35 - Nov 7 by Durovigutum |
I had a conversation with someone recently who said that with the decline in observance of remembrance Sunday in the early noughties that the British Legion had planned to get to the 100th anniversary of the end of the first world war and then "retire" the poppy. Thing is, popularity increased as people realise it's important to mark that war = death and destruction and loss and now it is where it is. I don't think it's a bad thing myself, saves glorification for sure. |
I have paid my few quid into the British legion coffers for a poppy, but I will never wear it.
More due to the poppy Nazis (irony isn't their strong point) and a vocal amount of people that don't appreciate that war = death, destruction and loss. They see it glorifying the war dead via the poppy.
Also as the years go by its become embarrassingly mawkish to watch our leaders at the cenotaph one second and the next sending someone else's child into Iraq/Libya/Syria..ect |  | | |
| "Remembrance Period" on 07:20 - Nov 8 with 1512 views | Plums |
| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. |
It’s become a competitive festival of remembrance which bears no relation to the solemn reflection that I recall when there were thousands of those who served parading on November 11th in the 80’s.
If the Legion got a fraction of the cash that’s spent on plastic tat and (bizarrely) wool that now festoons the streets, the service men and women and their families who need support would be in a much better place.
I buy a poppy, I wear a poppy but I despair at what it’s become. [Post edited 8 Nov 2021 7:28]
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| "Remembrance Period" on 08:58 - Nov 8 with 1424 views | Leaky |
| "Remembrance Period" on 16:19 - Nov 6 by BlueBadger |
It is increasingly morphing into Gammon Christmas in recent years, depressingly. With the ever-diminishing numbers of of the Greatest Generation the dignity, solemnity and overriding message of 'never again' is devolving into a weird display of jingoism, tacky decorations and (ironically, given the professed hatred of it from the worst offenders) virtue signalling.
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What ia a Gammon Christmas? I'm not a great lover of gammon, to salty usually, also not a lover of what Christmas has become. |  | | |
| "Remembrance Period" on 09:11 - Nov 8 with 1402 views | Pinewoodblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. |
While remembrance originated from two world wars people forget that lives have been lost since. A former school chum lost his Father in Korea; a cousin served in Malaysia and still carries the scars; a friends Father was injured in Northern Ireland; there have been so many conflicts, Kenya, Bosnia, Falklands, Iraq, Afghanistan and others.
Lives are lost every year and many more suffer injuries that are life changing. There will never be a moment, in any of our lifetimes that the British Legion doesn’t need financial support to look after unsung heroes. |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 09:24 - Nov 8 with 1365 views | Keno |
| "Remembrance Period" on 09:11 - Nov 8 by Pinewoodblue |
While remembrance originated from two world wars people forget that lives have been lost since. A former school chum lost his Father in Korea; a cousin served in Malaysia and still carries the scars; a friends Father was injured in Northern Ireland; there have been so many conflicts, Kenya, Bosnia, Falklands, Iraq, Afghanistan and others.
Lives are lost every year and many more suffer injuries that are life changing. There will never be a moment, in any of our lifetimes that the British Legion doesn’t need financial support to look after unsung heroes. |
I really dont see the issue with taking a minute or two a year out to remember those who fought for our freedoms in the past.
I mean its not like as a society we have learnt the lessons from the past is it?? |  |
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| What difference does it make..... on 09:32 - Nov 8 with 1353 views | Bloots |
....to you?
It's not exactly difficult to pause and reflect.
Doing it a couple of times extra won't do any harm, particularly given the state the world is in at the moment. |  |
| TWTD Leadership Group/Elite Level Supporter/Anti-Bullying Crusader |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 09:44 - Nov 8 with 1312 views | bournemouthblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 15:01 - Nov 7 by eastangliaisblue |
F#*k me that is tacky in the extreme. I had to laugh at the comment "That guys seen some sh1t." |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 09:48 - Nov 8 with 1296 views | bournemouthblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 08:58 - Nov 8 by Leaky |
What ia a Gammon Christmas? I'm not a great lover of gammon, to salty usually, also not a lover of what Christmas has become. |
Interestingly in somewhere like Korea or Japan they celebrate Christmas a bit like Black Friday
Which is a strangely accurate representation of the Capitalist mega spending fest it has become sadly
Jesus would be spinning in his grave as they say | |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 10:34 - Nov 8 with 1236 views | GunnsAirkick |
I think it's right to have a minutes silence and reflection at a couple of games, I don't really see the big deal there. I also wear a poppy and give a few quid to the RBL.
What I can't get behind though is this tacky glorification of war (see Twitter posts above), which is the complete opposite of what remembrance is supposed to be about (it's not supposed to look like Halloween FFS). It has got completely out of hand to the point of being disrespectful in itself and has been hijacked by some pretty unpleasant people. |  | | |
| "Remembrance Period" on 10:45 - Nov 8 with 1193 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| "Remembrance Period" on 15:01 - Nov 7 by eastangliaisblue |
F#*k me that is tacky in the extreme. I had to laugh at the comment "That guys seen some sh1t." |
That's a genuine thousand yard stare... |  |
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| "Remembrance Period" on 12:54 - Nov 8 with 1070 views | The_Major |
| "Remembrance Period" on 18:31 - Nov 6 by Zx1988 |
Precisely this.
As we move ever further away from WW2, and as we end up with fewer and fewer who served in that particular conflict, I think there's an argument for, at some point, drawing a line under it all.
Whilst I truly believe we should honour those who served in the World Wars (with little/no choice in the matter), I think that remembrance has moved away from what it should be, and has become more associated with the glorification/fetishisation of war/the military, and I dare say that those who it was originally meant to honour would be somewhat aghast at what it has become. |
Eventually, that is what will happen just due to the passage of time. To have served in WW2, you would now be at least 94. To remember it with any clarity, you'd be over 80. For WW1, anyone who could legitimately have memories would be about 106 - and considering the oldest person in the UK is 109, you're probably looking at no more than about twenty or so people.
Yes, there have been conflicts since 1945, and hundreds have died, but the whole iconography surrounding this time of year is based around the two world wars. There's no "we all had to pull together" sort of narrative surrounding say, the Falklands or Afghanistan - and the reason for that is that despite being involved in conflict, the security of the UK was never in peril in those ones. The Argentinians for example were never going to try and storm Brighton beach in 1982.
This isn't going to happen for a while though - if I had to put dates on it, I suspect you'd be looking at 2045, with it being the centenary of VE Day, otherwise it'll be when there's nobody left with any direct connection or memory of talking to anyone who remembers the conflicts themselves, in which case, possibly 2080 or so. At that point, it will have much relevance to people as say the Napoleonic wars have for us - it'll just be another page in the history books. Otherwise, how far do you go back? When remembering, do people think of the men who died in the Crimean War, the Spanish Armada, the Hundred Years War, the Battle of Hastings? Generally, no, of course not. They're just part of history.
In recent years however, you can't deny that it seems to have got a bit more tacky, with more and more people trying to outdo each other with displays of supposed genuine remembrance. I say supposed as a lot of it is, I'm afraid, one upmanship - I know of one person who always made a great thing of being a staunch supporter, but never gave a penny to the RBL - their poppy was bought in about 1993, and removed each year on Nov 12, and placed into a draw until the following year. Sometimes the hypocrisy is off the scale - GB News the other day held a debate on whether or not we should go to war with France(!!), with all participants in the debate wearing the poppy.
For these people, you have to look at the reason John Cleese said he wrote the Germans episode of Fawlty Towers - that there is a certain type of British person who can not let WW2 go - because it was the last time that this country truly had a lasting effect on global events - that episode was broadcast in 1974, and here we are 47 years later, and that attitude he referred to is probably more prevalent than ever.
In the meantime, I'm always reminded of what my late grandfather, who served in the Far East, said nearly forty years ago. This was following the Michael Foot donkey jacket incident, when people bleated about the then Labour leader not showing respect by what he was wearing at the Cenotaph. Bearing in mind he was a staunch Conservative, my grandfather had considerable sympathy for Foot, saying "I don't know why they're having a go at him - at least he's remembering" - going on to explain that most veterans couldn't care less whether anyone was dressed appropriately, or even wearing a poppy. All that they asked is that now and again, we should take pause to think about what sacrifices were made, and what people went through.
And in 2021, so we should. |  | | |
| "Remembrance Period" on 14:19 - Nov 8 with 989 views | Timefliesbyintheblue |
| "Remembrance Period" on 12:54 - Nov 8 by The_Major |
Eventually, that is what will happen just due to the passage of time. To have served in WW2, you would now be at least 94. To remember it with any clarity, you'd be over 80. For WW1, anyone who could legitimately have memories would be about 106 - and considering the oldest person in the UK is 109, you're probably looking at no more than about twenty or so people.
Yes, there have been conflicts since 1945, and hundreds have died, but the whole iconography surrounding this time of year is based around the two world wars. There's no "we all had to pull together" sort of narrative surrounding say, the Falklands or Afghanistan - and the reason for that is that despite being involved in conflict, the security of the UK was never in peril in those ones. The Argentinians for example were never going to try and storm Brighton beach in 1982.
This isn't going to happen for a while though - if I had to put dates on it, I suspect you'd be looking at 2045, with it being the centenary of VE Day, otherwise it'll be when there's nobody left with any direct connection or memory of talking to anyone who remembers the conflicts themselves, in which case, possibly 2080 or so. At that point, it will have much relevance to people as say the Napoleonic wars have for us - it'll just be another page in the history books. Otherwise, how far do you go back? When remembering, do people think of the men who died in the Crimean War, the Spanish Armada, the Hundred Years War, the Battle of Hastings? Generally, no, of course not. They're just part of history.
In recent years however, you can't deny that it seems to have got a bit more tacky, with more and more people trying to outdo each other with displays of supposed genuine remembrance. I say supposed as a lot of it is, I'm afraid, one upmanship - I know of one person who always made a great thing of being a staunch supporter, but never gave a penny to the RBL - their poppy was bought in about 1993, and removed each year on Nov 12, and placed into a draw until the following year. Sometimes the hypocrisy is off the scale - GB News the other day held a debate on whether or not we should go to war with France(!!), with all participants in the debate wearing the poppy.
For these people, you have to look at the reason John Cleese said he wrote the Germans episode of Fawlty Towers - that there is a certain type of British person who can not let WW2 go - because it was the last time that this country truly had a lasting effect on global events - that episode was broadcast in 1974, and here we are 47 years later, and that attitude he referred to is probably more prevalent than ever.
In the meantime, I'm always reminded of what my late grandfather, who served in the Far East, said nearly forty years ago. This was following the Michael Foot donkey jacket incident, when people bleated about the then Labour leader not showing respect by what he was wearing at the Cenotaph. Bearing in mind he was a staunch Conservative, my grandfather had considerable sympathy for Foot, saying "I don't know why they're having a go at him - at least he's remembering" - going on to explain that most veterans couldn't care less whether anyone was dressed appropriately, or even wearing a poppy. All that they asked is that now and again, we should take pause to think about what sacrifices were made, and what people went through.
And in 2021, so we should. |
Thank Major for your excellent post. It exemplifies my thoughts in every way. I remember the Michael Foot (his brother of course was Dingle MP, for Ipswich) incident and yes he was unfairly pilloried in the media for what he was wearing. | | | |
| What difference does it make..... on 14:48 - Nov 8 with 914 views | J2BLUE |
| What difference does it make..... on 09:32 - Nov 8 by Bloots |
....to you?
It's not exactly difficult to pause and reflect.
Doing it a couple of times extra won't do any harm, particularly given the state the world is in at the moment. |
Agree.
The competitive side of it is annoying but the individual can maintain the real meaning. | |
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