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That penalty!!!! 08:50 - Nov 21 with 5384 viewsphillev231069

I can only say one sentence, that ref should never ever be allowed to oversee another game again!

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That penalty!!!! on 09:03 - Nov 21 with 3315 viewsWickets

Bit harsh ! mistake yes but the sack ?
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That penalty!!!! on 09:05 - Nov 21 with 3299 viewsitfc_bucks

Watching it live, yes it's been drilled at him from a few yards, but the ruling seems to be that if your hands are out at all and the ball hits you, it's a pen.

It looked a pen to me. Harsh, but them's the rules now it seems.
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That penalty!!!! on 09:06 - Nov 21 with 3293 viewsTractorFrog

It's not the ref's fault, it's the rules. The rule needs to be changed. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

They'd all laugh at me if they knew what I was trying to do. To create a new strain of super-wine in half-an-hour with a fraction of nature's resources and a FOOL for an assistant. 'Bernard Black, he's mad,' they'd say, 'he's insane, he's dangerous.' Well I'll show them! I'll show them all!
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That penalty!!!! on 09:09 - Nov 21 with 3280 viewstimothyeo

It shouldn't ever be a penalty but with the new rules, it is isn't it? In which case how is it the refs fault for correctly applying the rules?

Before you call for someone to be sacked its always worthwhile making sure you know the facts yourself so you don't look COMPLETELY stupid.
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That penalty!!!! on 09:12 - Nov 21 with 3256 viewschrismakin

Watching it again I think it's a bloody good call.

Whilst it's close, it's likely that shot was going on target and at that pace possibly even ending up as a goal.

Ref wouldn't have known that I'm sure.. but it's actually a good call.

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That penalty!!!! on 09:35 - Nov 21 with 3214 viewsZXBlue

That penalty!!!! on 09:05 - Nov 21 by itfc_bucks

Watching it live, yes it's been drilled at him from a few yards, but the ruling seems to be that if your hands are out at all and the ball hits you, it's a pen.

It looked a pen to me. Harsh, but them's the rules now it seems.


Rule says in an unnatural position making the body larger. No unnatural position. Very poor decision. Rule has been ruined for the benefit of idiots who couldn't cope with refs making a judgment.
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That penalty!!!! on 10:10 - Nov 21 with 3122 viewsnorfsufblue

For me the penalty is really irrelevant as it probably doesn't happen if we'd managed the previous 5 mins competently.... there was absolutely no positive response to conceding an undeserved goal.... we had lost already!
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That penalty!!!! on 10:12 - Nov 21 with 3112 viewstractordownsouth

Is there a team who always have refs in their favour as much as Sunderland? Last year's performance was a disgrace and now this. Didn't we get denied a last minute penalty for handball against them back in 05 as well?

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That penalty!!!! on 10:22 - Nov 21 with 3087 viewsnoggin

That penalty!!!! on 09:12 - Nov 21 by chrismakin

Watching it again I think it's a bloody good call.

Whilst it's close, it's likely that shot was going on target and at that pace possibly even ending up as a goal.

Ref wouldn't have known that I'm sure.. but it's actually a good call.


I haven't seen it again, but that was my thought at the time. The shot looked to be on target and Toto's hand changed the direction of the ball. Ref had no choice, even though Toto was completely innocent.
[Post edited 21 Nov 2021 10:23]

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That penalty!!!! on 10:32 - Nov 21 with 3062 viewsDarth_Koont

That penalty!!!! on 10:22 - Nov 21 by noggin

I haven't seen it again, but that was my thought at the time. The shot looked to be on target and Toto's hand changed the direction of the ball. Ref had no choice, even though Toto was completely innocent.
[Post edited 21 Nov 2021 10:23]


Indeed. Toto looked to be turning to get his arm out of the way before the shot was struck but not a lot he could do when it’s hit at pace from such a short distance.

But fact remains his hand is still away from his body so ref has to give a penalty if he sees it.

Pronouns: He/Him

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That penalty!!!! on 10:36 - Nov 21 with 3043 viewsZXBlue

That penalty!!!! on 10:32 - Nov 21 by Darth_Koont

Indeed. Toto looked to be turning to get his arm out of the way before the shot was struck but not a lot he could do when it’s hit at pace from such a short distance.

But fact remains his hand is still away from his body so ref has to give a penalty if he sees it.


Only of its unnaturaL position...
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That penalty!!!! on 10:43 - Nov 21 with 3015 viewsDarth_Koont

That penalty!!!! on 10:36 - Nov 21 by ZXBlue

Only of its unnaturaL position...


Which has been interpreted as away from the body.

I agree that it’s not unnatural (and putting your hands behind your back is) but that’s the way it’s refereed. Hence players putting their hands behind their back in the first place.

Pronouns: He/Him

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That penalty!!!! on 10:47 - Nov 21 with 2994 viewsChrisd

I thought officials had become a little more sensible with their decision making, but clearly not. How a ball which is thundered into someone's arm from a couple of yards away is then deemed a deliberate handball is simply baffling?!
[Post edited 21 Nov 2021 10:47]

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That penalty!!!! on 11:03 - Nov 21 with 2946 viewsTrumptonBlue

That penalty!!!! on 10:12 - Nov 21 by tractordownsouth

Is there a team who always have refs in their favour as much as Sunderland? Last year's performance was a disgrace and now this. Didn't we get denied a last minute penalty for handball against them back in 05 as well?


They got a ridiculous last-minute one against us in ‘87 at Roker Park. I think that was for handball as well, against Romeo Zondervan. Ian Cranson was in goal, they scored, we lost 1-0.
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That penalty!!!! on 11:17 - Nov 21 with 2905 viewsZXBlue

That penalty!!!! on 10:47 - Nov 21 by Chrisd

I thought officials had become a little more sensible with their decision making, but clearly not. How a ball which is thundered into someone's arm from a couple of yards away is then deemed a deliberate handball is simply baffling?!
[Post edited 21 Nov 2021 10:47]


Doesn't have to be deliberate anymore. See my comments about rule being ruined....
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That penalty!!!! on 11:31 - Nov 21 with 2881 viewsWickets

That penalty!!!! on 10:47 - Nov 21 by Chrisd

I thought officials had become a little more sensible with their decision making, but clearly not. How a ball which is thundered into someone's arm from a couple of yards away is then deemed a deliberate handball is simply baffling?!
[Post edited 21 Nov 2021 10:47]


I think this is where the confusion is now if your arm is away from the body its deemed you are trying to make yourself bigger so it is deliberate . But for me yesterday was very harsh . Would we have got it at the other end ?
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That penalty!!!! on 11:32 - Nov 21 with 2875 viewsZXBlue

That penalty!!!! on 11:31 - Nov 21 by Wickets

I think this is where the confusion is now if your arm is away from the body its deemed you are trying to make yourself bigger so it is deliberate . But for me yesterday was very harsh . Would we have got it at the other end ?


It doesn't have to be deliberate. Just an unnatural position. Which is stupid.
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That penalty!!!! on 12:56 - Nov 21 with 2785 viewsChrisd

That penalty!!!! on 11:31 - Nov 21 by Wickets

I think this is where the confusion is now if your arm is away from the body its deemed you are trying to make yourself bigger so it is deliberate . But for me yesterday was very harsh . Would we have got it at the other end ?


I wouldn't have expected it the other end or asked for it. It's ridiculous really, I think it was last season or the season before anything that was hitting anyone's hand/arm intentional or not in the penalty area was a penalty, since then they have realised it was completely brainless and have now subtly changed it again. Never in a month of Sunday's was Nsiala's a penalty and nor should it be.

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That penalty!!!! on 13:03 - Nov 21 with 2762 viewsWickets

That penalty!!!! on 11:32 - Nov 21 by ZXBlue

It doesn't have to be deliberate. Just an unnatural position. Which is stupid.


I agree as its so difficult to decide just what is unnatural !
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That penalty!!!! on 13:04 - Nov 21 with 2759 viewsitfcjoe

It’s a definite penalty, the rules are pretty clear on it

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That penalty!!!! on 13:11 - Nov 21 with 2745 viewsChrisd

That penalty!!!! on 13:04 - Nov 21 by itfcjoe

It’s a definite penalty, the rules are pretty clear on it


If that’s a penalty then the game has gone.

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That penalty!!!! on 13:13 - Nov 21 with 2732 viewsitfcjoe

That penalty!!!! on 13:11 - Nov 21 by Chrisd

If that’s a penalty then the game has gone.


His arm is away from his body and it hits it, it’s literally the rule

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That penalty!!!! on 13:17 - Nov 21 with 2717 viewsChrisd

That penalty!!!! on 13:13 - Nov 21 by itfcjoe

His arm is away from his body and it hits it, it’s literally the rule


The fact is more games this season I have watched when the ball hits the arm they aren’t always given by the official, where the last couple of seasons they have been. If his arm is above his head fair enough, the fact it’s hit with such force and Nsiala is quite close to the Sunderland player he’s not really got that much time to react. If that’s the rule, then it shows you people that are involved in making rules have probably not played the game very much.
[Post edited 22 Nov 2021 13:25]

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That penalty!!!! on 13:53 - Nov 21 with 2643 viewsSwansea_Blue

I had no chance of getting up to S’land, so went down to see the Swans. They had 3-4 shouts, 2 were blatant. Ref was diabolical throughout as well. But it was Keith Stroud. There’s some super crap refs around.

At least with ours you could see why he gave it, even if the rules make that a nonsense decision.

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That penalty!!!! on 14:21 - Nov 21 with 2603 viewsbraveblue

That penalty!!!! on 09:09 - Nov 21 by timothyeo

It shouldn't ever be a penalty but with the new rules, it is isn't it? In which case how is it the refs fault for correctly applying the rules?

Before you call for someone to be sacked its always worthwhile making sure you know the facts yourself so you don't look COMPLETELY stupid.


Why call someone stupid and use capitals? Especially when you are wrong. Must be in an unnatural position. That was not the case so never a penalty.
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