| Toto move confirmed on 14:12 - Jan 14 with 1404 views | wkj |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:10 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Nowhere near as loudly as Nsiala.
The Barrow game is a one of the examples too how badly treated he was. The whole team was awful on that day. Burgess was even worse than Nsiala but people did scapegoat the latter after the game. Again, why him being singled out when the whole team was terrible. [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 14:10]
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I couldn't see anything beyond skewering Cook that night. Toto has been under the microscope a lot, but he's made a hell of a lot of point-dropping errors too. He was never fit to be a Championship defender, as he was signed on to be. Fleetwood is about his level. |  |
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| Toto move confirmed on 14:18 - Jan 14 with 1365 views | Churchman |
Toto was somebody who always gave 100%. Appears to be a decent bloke too. I hope he has a good next few years in the NW.
Times are changing and it doesn’t look like he was going to be anything other than back up under McK so it’s right that at 29 he gets regular football elsewhere. Shame he couldn’t take Nolan with him on a ‘buy one get one free’ basis, but there we are. |  | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:29 - Jan 14 with 1342 views | Mach_foreignBlue |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:12 - Jan 14 by wkj |
I couldn't see anything beyond skewering Cook that night. Toto has been under the microscope a lot, but he's made a hell of a lot of point-dropping errors too. He was never fit to be a Championship defender, as he was signed on to be. Fleetwood is about his level. |
Hell a lot of point-dropping errors? People keep yapping about penalties and red cards. When was the last time he gave away stupid penalty? More than year ago.
To underline how people treated him the Colchester pre-season game back in 2020 is a fine example too. Not only Barrow. The game without the crowd and people slated him for couple of mistakes whereas it wasn't even him who did those mistakes. It was Vincent-Young.
Agree, Championship wasn't his level but he is a good, committed central back in League One. He kept Woolfenden out of the team and that was annoying for some people. But he kept him out for the reason as Woolfenden was cack in the last couple of years. Seems to be improving under McKenna and long may it continue. |  | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:33 - Jan 14 with 1327 views | Strimmer |
The level of vitriol aimed at toto not to mention the sour stuff on social media now he’s gone is ridiculous. He’s not beyond criticism far from it but it strikes me as people being c@ntish for the sake of it |  |
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| Toto move confirmed on 14:35 - Jan 14 with 1319 views | wkj |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:29 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Hell a lot of point-dropping errors? People keep yapping about penalties and red cards. When was the last time he gave away stupid penalty? More than year ago.
To underline how people treated him the Colchester pre-season game back in 2020 is a fine example too. Not only Barrow. The game without the crowd and people slated him for couple of mistakes whereas it wasn't even him who did those mistakes. It was Vincent-Young.
Agree, Championship wasn't his level but he is a good, committed central back in League One. He kept Woolfenden out of the team and that was annoying for some people. But he kept him out for the reason as Woolfenden was cack in the last couple of years. Seems to be improving under McKenna and long may it continue. |
I can't see how you have such searing hatred for Chambers, yet view Toto as a bit of a loss. I don't agree with any of Toto's abuse, such as Charlton - though to be uneasy about him wasn't treating him badly. He did Okay at best, but his errors of the seasons prior were painful and costly- when he came back he was Okay, but not at the standard we need. | |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:04 - Jan 14 with 1264 views | jayessess |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:35 - Jan 14 by wkj |
I can't see how you have such searing hatred for Chambers, yet view Toto as a bit of a loss. I don't agree with any of Toto's abuse, such as Charlton - though to be uneasy about him wasn't treating him badly. He did Okay at best, but his errors of the seasons prior were painful and costly- when he came back he was Okay, but not at the standard we need. |
There's a lot of exaggeration about Nsiala's error-proneness.
He was supposedly a red card machine, but only got 1 (very unfair) red card for us in 4 seasons.
He was supposedly a liability in the penalty area but gave 2 (one very unfair, one in a game we lost 4-1 anyway) penalties in his last 2 seasons with us.
What were these very costly errors he was supposedly responsible for? [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 15:05]
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:15 - Jan 14 with 1248 views | itfcjoe |
| Toto move confirmed on 13:30 - Jan 14 by Swansea_Blue |
Ah, I didn't see any of the social media stuff. He wasn't treated very well when on the pitch though. It leaves a bit of a bad taste for me. I don't understand why anyone gets on their backs while they're actually playing. If people want to moan, that's what this place is for! |
I don't really feel he got much stick on the pitch from what I've seen - the Charlton incident aside which was a silly position for him to find himself in and tarnishes our fanbase |  |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:17 - Jan 14 with 1242 views | Mach_foreignBlue |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:35 - Jan 14 by wkj |
I can't see how you have such searing hatred for Chambers, yet view Toto as a bit of a loss. I don't agree with any of Toto's abuse, such as Charlton - though to be uneasy about him wasn't treating him badly. He did Okay at best, but his errors of the seasons prior were painful and costly- when he came back he was Okay, but not at the standard we need. |
Searing hatred for Chambers? He took us down without a fight alongside others, the team wasn't performing under his guidance. Cook was bad for him, so was Lambert, so was Hurst....poor Luke ! All these awful managers while he was an angel wasn't he?
Nice and easy life, repeating the same cliches and soundbites in the interviews while it was plainly hollow words. I could carry on and on.
And he was one of those nowhere near as badly judged for his mistakes as Toto was.
Yes I view Totos departure as a bit of a loss. The defence was mostly sound and solid when he played. I liked his bravery and putting body on the line when required. I liked his commitment. You disagree, fine, your opinion. | | | |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:17 - Jan 14 with 1240 views | itfcjoe |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:29 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Hell a lot of point-dropping errors? People keep yapping about penalties and red cards. When was the last time he gave away stupid penalty? More than year ago.
To underline how people treated him the Colchester pre-season game back in 2020 is a fine example too. Not only Barrow. The game without the crowd and people slated him for couple of mistakes whereas it wasn't even him who did those mistakes. It was Vincent-Young.
Agree, Championship wasn't his level but he is a good, committed central back in League One. He kept Woolfenden out of the team and that was annoying for some people. But he kept him out for the reason as Woolfenden was cack in the last couple of years. Seems to be improving under McKenna and long may it continue. |
Woolfenden doesn't 'seem to be improving' he's just a better footballer than Nsiala ever has been | |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:21 - Jan 14 with 1237 views | itfcjoe |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:04 - Jan 14 by jayessess |
There's a lot of exaggeration about Nsiala's error-proneness.
He was supposedly a red card machine, but only got 1 (very unfair) red card for us in 4 seasons.
He was supposedly a liability in the penalty area but gave 2 (one very unfair, one in a game we lost 4-1 anyway) penalties in his last 2 seasons with us.
What were these very costly errors he was supposedly responsible for? [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 15:05]
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It's at least 3 penalties isn't it? Sunderland away this year as well.
When he came into the team after signing he seemed to be punished for every error - stupid foul on byline at Rotherham in 90th minute and we go 1-0 down from free kick.
Too many avoidable errors that led to goals, more than any defender I've known here - too many times he was 'unlucky' but because he gave the ref a decision to make.
At times, when it was a game when bodies needed to be put on line he did well, he had a decent season last year - but I won't be sad to see a player of that ilk go, I like footballers who can play. Every team recently have just let him have the ball and waited for him to make the error, it's a team failing but bearing in mind he was bought for the Championship it's been a failure of a signing - good luck to him at Fleetwood | |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:32 - Jan 14 with 1198 views | abracaDOBRA_ |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:15 - Jan 14 by itfcjoe |
I don't really feel he got much stick on the pitch from what I've seen - the Charlton incident aside which was a silly position for him to find himself in and tarnishes our fanbase |
I agree with the first bit, but don't really think it was Toto tarnishing the fan base, more the guy who ran on the pitch trying to fight Walton.
Players and fans clash, its happened before and will happen again. Running on the pitch to attack players is the thing tarnishing the fan base |  | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:33 - Jan 14 with 1190 views | Mach_foreignBlue |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:17 - Jan 14 by itfcjoe |
Woolfenden doesn't 'seem to be improving' he's just a better footballer than Nsiala ever has been |
Never been the case in the last couple of years. Nsiala was a much better footballer for us than Woolfenden. | | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:51 - Jan 14 with 1164 views | itfcjoe |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:32 - Jan 14 by abracaDOBRA_ |
I agree with the first bit, but don't really think it was Toto tarnishing the fan base, more the guy who ran on the pitch trying to fight Walton.
Players and fans clash, its happened before and will happen again. Running on the pitch to attack players is the thing tarnishing the fan base |
Between my writing and your comprehension, probably more my writing(!)< you've got wrong end of stick there so apologies - didn't mean to imply Toto tarnished the fan base as simply not the case.
He shouldn't have gone over as was going to end badly, but no way does it excuse the fans behaviour who was 100% in the wrong | |
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| There is no way anyone could describe.... on 15:54 - Jan 14 with 1139 views | Bloots |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:33 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Never been the case in the last couple of years. Nsiala was a much better footballer for us than Woolfenden. |
....Nsiala as a much better footballer than Woolfenden, no matter how mentally deranged you are.
Stop being a silly boy. |  |
| TWTD Leadership Group/Elite Level Supporter/Anti-Bullying Crusader |
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| Toto move confirmed on 15:55 - Jan 14 with 1134 views | abracaDOBRA_ |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:51 - Jan 14 by itfcjoe |
Between my writing and your comprehension, probably more my writing(!)< you've got wrong end of stick there so apologies - didn't mean to imply Toto tarnished the fan base as simply not the case.
He shouldn't have gone over as was going to end badly, but no way does it excuse the fans behaviour who was 100% in the wrong |
Fair enough, no need to apologies. He should've left it in fairness, doesn't seem like the type of player than can keep a cool head (see Walton) so best for him to walk away. Although I was there and some of the abuse was awful quite frankly.
That being said, im pleased he's gone (in the nicest way). Just cannot imagine him playing in a McKenna team!! | | | |
| Good question.... on 15:59 - Jan 14 with 1102 views | AlanG296 |
| Good question.... on 13:41 - Jan 14 by SitfcB |
Legends. |
Myths | | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:06 - Jan 14 with 1087 views | gtsb1966 |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:17 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Searing hatred for Chambers? He took us down without a fight alongside others, the team wasn't performing under his guidance. Cook was bad for him, so was Lambert, so was Hurst....poor Luke ! All these awful managers while he was an angel wasn't he?
Nice and easy life, repeating the same cliches and soundbites in the interviews while it was plainly hollow words. I could carry on and on.
And he was one of those nowhere near as badly judged for his mistakes as Toto was.
Yes I view Totos departure as a bit of a loss. The defence was mostly sound and solid when he played. I liked his bravery and putting body on the line when required. I liked his commitment. You disagree, fine, your opinion. |
If you view Toto's departure as a bit of a loss you obviously can't see the ambitions of our new owners and management. Nice bloke, not good enough. It's as simple as that. Onwards and upwards. |  | | |
| There is no way anyone could describe.... on 16:08 - Jan 14 with 1083 views | Mach_foreignBlue |
| There is no way anyone could describe.... on 15:54 - Jan 14 by Bloots |
....Nsiala as a much better footballer than Woolfenden, no matter how mentally deranged you are.
Stop being a silly boy. |
Says the person who claims that Chambers is a legend.
As mostly is the case you turn into personal comments when seeing totally different view to yours. Bullying and insulting from behind your screen, you make me laugh you rank fairy.
The forum is about opinions. If you can't handle it ask the admins to teach you a bit. | | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:17 - Jan 14 with 1059 views | Parky |
| Toto move confirmed on 14:09 - Jan 14 by JakeITFC |
Nope, Evans and Morsy put in a stinker for the ages, however Charlton (like Rotherham and maybe somebody else before) pressed everyone in the team except Nsiala, and so all of our moves ended with him having to play a risky ball or a long punt. That obviously isn't his fault exclusively - we should be able to play a way that counteracts that, but it is a big problem that we had an easily exploitable weakness at the heart of our defence.
I also don't think he was particularly good defender the majority of the time either, but realise that's a more polarising view. For balance, I think we have the exact same problem now with Burgess (but obviously harder to shift him given the fee we've just paid and his contract).
EDIT: Obviously none of the above justifies the actions at the end of the game from some at the Valley. [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 14:09]
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Evans, Morsy and everyone else [except Toto] clapped the fans and walked down the tunnel. Toto didn’t like being boo’d and walked the length of the pitch to confront the away fans.
The idiot that ran on the pitch is inexcusable and is clearly a tw@t, but there is a reason why Toto apologised. | | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:25 - Jan 14 with 1037 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Toto move confirmed on 11:59 - Jan 14 by Cheltenham_Blue |
"Toto is really dominant in both boxes and he can also play comfortably with the ball at his feet.".........."And when the ball is at our opponents feet, you can expect Toto to slide in and invariably give away penalties and get sent off" |
He got sent off once for us, against Sheffield Wednesday, where he won the ball and the decision was appealled. It's a myth he is prone to red cards. |  |
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| Toto move confirmed on 16:25 - Jan 14 with 1038 views | JakeITFC |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:17 - Jan 14 by Parky |
Evans, Morsy and everyone else [except Toto] clapped the fans and walked down the tunnel. Toto didn’t like being boo’d and walked the length of the pitch to confront the away fans.
The idiot that ran on the pitch is inexcusable and is clearly a tw@t, but there is a reason why Toto apologised. |
I think confront is probably a strong word there (but I had left before the final whistle so may be wrong). |  | | |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:27 - Jan 14 with 1032 views | jayessess |
| Toto move confirmed on 15:21 - Jan 14 by itfcjoe |
It's at least 3 penalties isn't it? Sunderland away this year as well.
When he came into the team after signing he seemed to be punished for every error - stupid foul on byline at Rotherham in 90th minute and we go 1-0 down from free kick.
Too many avoidable errors that led to goals, more than any defender I've known here - too many times he was 'unlucky' but because he gave the ref a decision to make.
At times, when it was a game when bodies needed to be put on line he did well, he had a decent season last year - but I won't be sad to see a player of that ilk go, I like footballers who can play. Every team recently have just let him have the ball and waited for him to make the error, it's a team failing but bearing in mind he was bought for the Championship it's been a failure of a signing - good luck to him at Fleetwood |
Had blotted Sunderland from my memory! Posh missed a penalty last season of his last season too (unlike Sunderland that was his fault), now I come to think of it. But "gave away a free kick we defended badly" strikes me as one of those fairly classic complaints that scapegoats get, like Woolfenden against MK Dons this season.
Still think his reputation as a liability has been pretty wildly exaggerated. [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 16:28]
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| "Rank fairy".....Roflcopter. (n/t) on 16:29 - Jan 14 with 1029 views | Bloots |
| There is no way anyone could describe.... on 16:08 - Jan 14 by Mach_foreignBlue |
Says the person who claims that Chambers is a legend.
As mostly is the case you turn into personal comments when seeing totally different view to yours. Bullying and insulting from behind your screen, you make me laugh you rank fairy.
The forum is about opinions. If you can't handle it ask the admins to teach you a bit. |
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| TWTD Leadership Group/Elite Level Supporter/Anti-Bullying Crusader |
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| Toto move confirmed on 16:48 - Jan 14 with 978 views | Steve_M |
| Toto move confirmed on 16:27 - Jan 14 by jayessess |
Had blotted Sunderland from my memory! Posh missed a penalty last season of his last season too (unlike Sunderland that was his fault), now I come to think of it. But "gave away a free kick we defended badly" strikes me as one of those fairly classic complaints that scapegoats get, like Woolfenden against MK Dons this season.
Still think his reputation as a liability has been pretty wildly exaggerated. [Post edited 14 Jan 2022 16:28]
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I think it was more that Toto dived into a challenge he hadn't needed to make in that Rotherham match. He had had a really impressive debut up until that point.
There were a few more instances of diving into challenges before the very harsh red card at Hillsborough which wasn't that many games later.
He got better at that over time but was still prone to lose it once things went a bit wrong, see the Doncaster 4-1 defeat for example. |  |
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| Toto move confirmed on 16:59 - Jan 14 with 957 views | patrickswell |
| Toto move confirmed on 13:55 - Jan 14 by Zx1988 |
I don't blame the chap. The inference I get from his comments (or coyness around commenting) is that he'd had enough and wanted a fresh start elsewhere. After what happened at Charlton, I wouldn't blame him in the slightest. |
It’s been a pretty joyless four years for him, Nolan and Jackson. People used to talk about Chambers and Skuse being representative of a decline, but at least they were part of a decent team and have some good memories from McCarthy’s imperial phase. What good memories/achievements will Nsiala have to look back on from his time here?
Good luck to him but don’t let the door hit you on the way out, either. |  | | |
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