| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? 17:40 - Jun 8 with 4660 views | MattinLondon |
Or should religion in general, be given special protection from criticism or art etc?
How many of those protesters, or those who signed the petition, have actually seen the film?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61729392 |  | | |  |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 23:36 - Jun 8 with 1548 views | ZXBlue |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 21:58 - Jun 8 by Swansea_Blue |
A good piece that was. And what stands out from that (and other discussions on religious tolerance) is that the actual priests often have a good sense of humour over any challenge. It’s the swivel eyed nutters they attract that are the most fanatical and least tolerant. Thin skins, thin faith and thin intellects probably. |
Some certainly do. Though they provide the environment that the loons take comfort in.
Plenty don't. |  | | |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 00:06 - Jun 9 with 1525 views | Kievthegreat |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 21:58 - Jun 8 by Swansea_Blue |
A good piece that was. And what stands out from that (and other discussions on religious tolerance) is that the actual priests often have a good sense of humour over any challenge. It’s the swivel eyed nutters they attract that are the most fanatical and least tolerant. Thin skins, thin faith and thin intellects probably. |
I'll have to watch the piece, but was just interested about the "actual priests often have a good sense of humour over any challenge." I remember watching a documentary about Life of Brian, particularly focusing on the debate with Palin and Clease versus some Clergy and theologian. Christianity too has had it's past issues around censorship and sensitivity. My belief is that greater exposure to secular society will dilute* the "swivel eyed nutters" to the point these things will become far more trivial.
*it's important to remember we're dealing with a group of people WITHIN the religion, not all people of that faith, so they are already diluted. |  | | |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 06:47 - Jun 9 with 1460 views | fab_lover |
I just find it amazing - and disappointing - that in 2022, people can worship deities who are sensitive enough to care about what foods people eat and what clothes they can and can't wear.
I mean, there you are, creator of the Universe, and you get your knickers in a twist about your followers needing to wear special clothing, or not eat certain things. Doesn't say much for you as a deity, does it ?
What is desperately sad is that we are told we should have respect for these crackpot ideas, which are often deeply sexist and homophobic. We shouldn't. We shouldn't persecute people following these beliefs, people are free to believe in what ever they want, FFS most of us on here believe that ITFC should be in the Premiership...but "respect" for creeds which don't let boys and girls swim together ? No, that's just nonsense. If you want to live in a theocracy, there are plenty to choose from. If you don't, then don't expect or demand "respect" for your backdated ideas. |  | | |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:25 - Jun 9 with 1420 views | unbelievablue |
Je suis Charlie. |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:38 - Jun 9 with 1404 views | unbelievablue |
People are usually terrified of offending religions, for various reasons.
Of course, sensitivity to others' beliefs and broad tolerance is fundamental to a functioning society. But so is challenging inherent intolerances. It is blinkered to ignore deep rooted issues within most organised religions - we should, rightly, point out their intolerances wherever possible.
Please don't take this the wrong way (he says, knowing some will): I also think it is justified to point out differences *between* religions in terms of sensitivity. There are fundamentalist nutters among all religions, and those who appropriate holy texts for their own political ends, (Christianity is certainly guilty of this), but it would be remiss not to point out that, based on objective truth, Islam is the leader in the pack. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 09:34 - Jun 9 with 1341 views | wkj |
IMHO There is a very fine line between conspiracy theories and religions. Both are very important to the people that believe in them, and often creates a feeling of self governance when being challenged by opposing opinions.
On the other side of the coin - religion brings a lot of security and meaning to people's lives, many of whom are good people with good intentions. It's just a shame that the people doing bad things in the name of religion are so damned destructive and end up making a mockery of the spirituality they claim. |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 13:12 - Jun 9 with 1274 views | J2BLUE |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:38 - Jun 9 by unbelievablue |
People are usually terrified of offending religions, for various reasons.
Of course, sensitivity to others' beliefs and broad tolerance is fundamental to a functioning society. But so is challenging inherent intolerances. It is blinkered to ignore deep rooted issues within most organised religions - we should, rightly, point out their intolerances wherever possible.
Please don't take this the wrong way (he says, knowing some will): I also think it is justified to point out differences *between* religions in terms of sensitivity. There are fundamentalist nutters among all religions, and those who appropriate holy texts for their own political ends, (Christianity is certainly guilty of this), but it would be remiss not to point out that, based on objective truth, Islam is the leader in the pack. |
Your last paragraph is spot on. It's ok saying they shouldn't have pulled it but violent retaliation is a legit concern. |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 18:12 - Jun 9 with 1193 views | Ryorry |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:38 - Jun 9 by unbelievablue |
People are usually terrified of offending religions, for various reasons.
Of course, sensitivity to others' beliefs and broad tolerance is fundamental to a functioning society. But so is challenging inherent intolerances. It is blinkered to ignore deep rooted issues within most organised religions - we should, rightly, point out their intolerances wherever possible.
Please don't take this the wrong way (he says, knowing some will): I also think it is justified to point out differences *between* religions in terms of sensitivity. There are fundamentalist nutters among all religions, and those who appropriate holy texts for their own political ends, (Christianity is certainly guilty of this), but it would be remiss not to point out that, based on objective truth, Islam is the leader in the pack. |
Really, really tricky issue, particularly if you count Judaism - which people are born into - as a "religion" (I think that debate's still not settled? ie whether it's a religion, race, cultural identity, or some mix of all those).
I'm an atheist by choice & against censorship generally speaking, but as someone whose parents were both refugees to the UK from Hitler's Germany & whose aunt died in a concentration camp there, I was very uncomfortable with a joke around that on another thread this morning, so can see the p.o.v. of the guy who was spokesman on BBC TV news last for the Muslim group in question.
And playing devil's advocate for a mo, I thought people on here were mostly in agreement that it should be the minority group themselves who decide what's OK & what's not when it comes to protests? (eg BLM, taking the knee etc.) |  |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 07:32 - Jun 10 with 1093 views | unbelievablue |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 18:12 - Jun 9 by Ryorry |
Really, really tricky issue, particularly if you count Judaism - which people are born into - as a "religion" (I think that debate's still not settled? ie whether it's a religion, race, cultural identity, or some mix of all those).
I'm an atheist by choice & against censorship generally speaking, but as someone whose parents were both refugees to the UK from Hitler's Germany & whose aunt died in a concentration camp there, I was very uncomfortable with a joke around that on another thread this morning, so can see the p.o.v. of the guy who was spokesman on BBC TV news last for the Muslim group in question.
And playing devil's advocate for a mo, I thought people on here were mostly in agreement that it should be the minority group themselves who decide what's OK & what's not when it comes to protests? (eg BLM, taking the knee etc.) |
Each and every religion is different. As you say, Judaism is a tricky one - there are cultural Jews who profess no religious adherence whatsoever (e.g. David Baddiel who is a proper atheist), but who can still be, and often are, victims of anti-Semitism. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:56 - Jun 10 with 1054 views | fab_lover |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:38 - Jun 9 by unbelievablue |
People are usually terrified of offending religions, for various reasons.
Of course, sensitivity to others' beliefs and broad tolerance is fundamental to a functioning society. But so is challenging inherent intolerances. It is blinkered to ignore deep rooted issues within most organised religions - we should, rightly, point out their intolerances wherever possible.
Please don't take this the wrong way (he says, knowing some will): I also think it is justified to point out differences *between* religions in terms of sensitivity. There are fundamentalist nutters among all religions, and those who appropriate holy texts for their own political ends, (Christianity is certainly guilty of this), but it would be remiss not to point out that, based on objective truth, Islam is the leader in the pack. |
Yes, you're correct (sadly) about Islam. However - it was not always thus.
35 years ago, I lived for a year (when I was a student) in a part of Birmingham that was very Muslim, i.e. over 70%.
The interesting fact is that back then, if you saw a Burqa, you would do a double-take.
What has happened, sadly, and it's a global thing, is the rise of the type of Islam faith celebrated by the House of Saud: Wahhabism. Now although more recently, it appears that the Saudis are trying to roll this back, the ideas have already been sown, and have spread far beyond Saudi Arabia. However the expansion of this brand of Islam coincided, unfortunately, in the West with the desire to accept multi-culturalism, to try and accommodate both modern strains of thought around the rights of women and non-hetrosexuals, and "respect" belief systems that were totally at odds with liberal / enlightened thought.
As a result, we are where we are. I am far, far, far, far from "send the b'gers back". No way. However, if we as a society want to respect and support the changes we have made to try and bring equality for all, we can't do that and give respect to faiths - of any hue - which oppose those viewpoints. If you live here, you respect the rules, just as if I moved somewhere else, I would respect their rules, and obey them, whatever I might think about them, and not insist that my rules were incorporated or even considered. | | | |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 09:44 - Jun 10 with 1019 views | unbelievablue |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 08:56 - Jun 10 by fab_lover |
Yes, you're correct (sadly) about Islam. However - it was not always thus.
35 years ago, I lived for a year (when I was a student) in a part of Birmingham that was very Muslim, i.e. over 70%.
The interesting fact is that back then, if you saw a Burqa, you would do a double-take.
What has happened, sadly, and it's a global thing, is the rise of the type of Islam faith celebrated by the House of Saud: Wahhabism. Now although more recently, it appears that the Saudis are trying to roll this back, the ideas have already been sown, and have spread far beyond Saudi Arabia. However the expansion of this brand of Islam coincided, unfortunately, in the West with the desire to accept multi-culturalism, to try and accommodate both modern strains of thought around the rights of women and non-hetrosexuals, and "respect" belief systems that were totally at odds with liberal / enlightened thought.
As a result, we are where we are. I am far, far, far, far from "send the b'gers back". No way. However, if we as a society want to respect and support the changes we have made to try and bring equality for all, we can't do that and give respect to faiths - of any hue - which oppose those viewpoints. If you live here, you respect the rules, just as if I moved somewhere else, I would respect their rules, and obey them, whatever I might think about them, and not insist that my rules were incorporated or even considered. |
If you lived in Birmingham you might be interested in the Trojan Horse Affair podcast, which is tangentially related. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 10:48 - Jun 10 with 1004 views | Ryorry |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 18:52 - Jun 8 by textbackup |
It’s absolutely criminal they’ve pulled the film IMO.
But doesn’t surprise me in the slightest that people bend over to give others what they want, the absolute mayhem it would have caused otherwise wouldn’t have made it worthwhile.
An angry mob, of about 50/70 men outside a cinema ffs, not a single policeman in sight either.
But give them some credit, theres a cost of living crisis at the moment and all these hard working individuals took time off work, missed out on money, to protest… 🤡
If there was a film about my god, David Johnson, and I didn’t agree with it, I just wouldn’t watch it [Post edited 8 Jun 2022 20:37]
|
How would you know you disagreed with it unless you watched it? | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 11:12 - Jun 10 with 978 views | Naim1995 |
Are you a Muslim? Unlikely.
Do you have knowledge of the Shi'a sect? Unlikely.
The screenwriter is an extremist Shi'a - they are proven liars who have no accurate or reliable sources for what they say, and have zero respect for the Prophet or any of his followers, wives etc.
Why should knowledgeable and honest Muslims have to stand for that man spreading his lies and deceit about figures they so love and revere, especially to an audience of non-Muslims who already have an embarrassingly ignorant view of Islam and Muslims in general? It's the same reason people like Tommy Robinson have any authority lmao. | | | |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 11:17 - Jun 10 with 961 views | itfcjoe |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 11:12 - Jun 10 by Naim1995 |
Are you a Muslim? Unlikely.
Do you have knowledge of the Shi'a sect? Unlikely.
The screenwriter is an extremist Shi'a - they are proven liars who have no accurate or reliable sources for what they say, and have zero respect for the Prophet or any of his followers, wives etc.
Why should knowledgeable and honest Muslims have to stand for that man spreading his lies and deceit about figures they so love and revere, especially to an audience of non-Muslims who already have an embarrassingly ignorant view of Islam and Muslims in general? It's the same reason people like Tommy Robinson have any authority lmao. |
There are about 150 million Shi'a Muslims in the world - are they all proven liars? |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:01 - Jun 10 with 901 views | Darth_Koont |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 11:17 - Jun 10 by itfcjoe |
There are about 150 million Shi'a Muslims in the world - are they all proven liars? |
I’d give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he was talking about extremist Shi’a. All religious extremists are proven liars – unwitting or not. |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:04 - Jun 10 with 882 views | itfcjoe |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:01 - Jun 10 by Darth_Koont |
I’d give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he was talking about extremist Shi’a. All religious extremists are proven liars – unwitting or not. |
It's total smear for me, is this guy really a religious extremist? Or is he someone who will now get painted as one by his enemies as he has produced a film? | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:05 - Jun 10 with 882 views | Darth_Koont |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 09:44 - Jun 10 by unbelievablue |
If you lived in Birmingham you might be interested in the Trojan Horse Affair podcast, which is tangentially related. |
Indeed. Very good.
The issues raised seem to have been largely ignored by the rest of our media. Which comes as absolutely no surprise. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:09 - Jun 10 with 874 views | Darth_Koont |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:04 - Jun 10 by itfcjoe |
It's total smear for me, is this guy really a religious extremist? Or is he someone who will now get painted as one by his enemies as he has produced a film? |
I’m very comfortable with religious extremists being labeled as liars. We shouldn’t drop those humanist and rational standards because of faith.
I haven’t seen the film. But, if it’s as religious and sectarian as advertised, I bet it’s extremist shyte. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:21 - Jun 10 with 858 views | DanTheMan |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:04 - Jun 10 by itfcjoe |
It's total smear for me, is this guy really a religious extremist? Or is he someone who will now get painted as one by his enemies as he has produced a film? |
I did find this review which seems to be written from a Shia perspective that does paint a picture that the film might be unnecessarily antagonistic.
https://themuslimvibe.com/faith-islam/in-history/the-lady-of-heaven-a-deliberate
Obviously doesn't mean it shouldn't be allowed to be shown but I don't think this is a simple as some of the comments in the thread have made it out to be. |  |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:24 - Jun 10 with 842 views | unbelievablue |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:21 - Jun 10 by DanTheMan |
I did find this review which seems to be written from a Shia perspective that does paint a picture that the film might be unnecessarily antagonistic.
https://themuslimvibe.com/faith-islam/in-history/the-lady-of-heaven-a-deliberate
Obviously doesn't mean it shouldn't be allowed to be shown but I don't think this is a simple as some of the comments in the thread have made it out to be. |
From what I've read, even the contention "written from a Shia perspective" isn't a fair reflection. Most Shias seem to distance themselves from him very strongly. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:26 - Jun 10 with 825 views | DanTheMan |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:24 - Jun 10 by unbelievablue |
From what I've read, even the contention "written from a Shia perspective" isn't a fair reflection. Most Shias seem to distance themselves from him very strongly. |
Should be more clear, I meant the review was written from a Shia perspective, not the film. Basically was trying to make the point that it's not just a Sunni Muslim saying the film is bad. | |
| |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:30 - Jun 10 with 800 views | unbelievablue |
| Are some Muslims and other religions just too sensitive? on 14:26 - Jun 10 by DanTheMan |
Should be more clear, I meant the review was written from a Shia perspective, not the film. Basically was trying to make the point that it's not just a Sunni Muslim saying the film is bad. |
My bad. | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
