| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 06:57 - Jul 2 with 1613 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 06:51 - Jul 2 by GlasgowBlue |
“ Adedeji contributed 11 out of the chat’s 345 messages. One saw him pass on the postcode of one of Soyoye’s killers. ”
So in a group chat where people conspired do carry out a violent revenge attack, this ‘innocent’ person provided the postcode of one of the potential victims? That makes him complicit in a conspiracy.
A misleading headline by you banksy and a very unbalanced article by the Guardian. |
Their friend had just been brutally murdered....nothing happened....is it that some people are just less human than others?
Roxy Legane, the director of Kids of Colour, said the case was the latest in a series of trials which had seen large groups of often black boys imprisoned for who they know.
“This is a case of guilty by association because, once again, the harms of a small minority have drawn in a much wider net for prosecution,” she said.
“For these 10 boys, it is their knowing each other, whether through school or church, that has been manipulated to draw them closer together, and draw broader conclusions about what their knowing each other amounts to.
“Their associations become evidence of guilt. Shared schools, social media friendships, music interests, messaging groups and, of course, sharing being black has been used to frame them as a criminal gang.”
She said the private messages used to bolster a gang narrative were in fact “thoughtless, immature, emotional messages” which “became criminal, became intent: it feels like thought policing”.
Hence the thought police angle. |  |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 07:10 - Jul 2 with 1578 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 06:57 - Jul 2 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Their friend had just been brutally murdered....nothing happened....is it that some people are just less human than others?
Roxy Legane, the director of Kids of Colour, said the case was the latest in a series of trials which had seen large groups of often black boys imprisoned for who they know.
“This is a case of guilty by association because, once again, the harms of a small minority have drawn in a much wider net for prosecution,” she said.
“For these 10 boys, it is their knowing each other, whether through school or church, that has been manipulated to draw them closer together, and draw broader conclusions about what their knowing each other amounts to.
“Their associations become evidence of guilt. Shared schools, social media friendships, music interests, messaging groups and, of course, sharing being black has been used to frame them as a criminal gang.”
She said the private messages used to bolster a gang narrative were in fact “thoughtless, immature, emotional messages” which “became criminal, became intent: it feels like thought policing”.
Hence the thought police angle. |
They took part in a group chat where they conspired to carry out a violent revenge attack. Whether that attack took place of not is irrelevant.
As the article reports, at least two violent attacks were committed by other defendants.
If I take part of a group plotting a violent attack, produce details of where one of the potential victims lives but do not actually take part in any attack, I am still guilty of conspiring to carry out a violent attack and I would expect to feel the long arm of the law.
People are often convicted of conspiring to carry out criminal acts that did not end up taking place. Whether that be terror attacks, murder, drug supply or violence. This case seems no different.
It’s tragic that some of those involved had very promising careers ahead of them but the court found them guilty. [Post edited 2 Jul 2022 7:17]
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 07:22 - Jul 2 with 1567 views | noggin |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 23:11 - Jul 1 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Ask an American woman. |
Nothing to see here. [Post edited 2 Jul 2022 7:26]
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 08:06 - Jul 2 with 1532 views | You_Bloo_Right |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 07:10 - Jul 2 by GlasgowBlue |
They took part in a group chat where they conspired to carry out a violent revenge attack. Whether that attack took place of not is irrelevant.
As the article reports, at least two violent attacks were committed by other defendants.
If I take part of a group plotting a violent attack, produce details of where one of the potential victims lives but do not actually take part in any attack, I am still guilty of conspiring to carry out a violent attack and I would expect to feel the long arm of the law.
People are often convicted of conspiring to carry out criminal acts that did not end up taking place. Whether that be terror attacks, murder, drug supply or violence. This case seems no different.
It’s tragic that some of those involved had very promising careers ahead of them but the court found them guilty. [Post edited 2 Jul 2022 7:17]
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Something just doesn't seem right and perhaps that is due to my lack of knowledge about the evidence presented to the jury and/or the news sources I have read.
For a conspiracy allegation to stand I do expect a little more rigour from the judicial system than the quoting of song lyrics and "misinterpretations" of text messages and photos as proof of a plot.
As I said, perhaps such evidence was given and the sources I have read have conveniently omitted this. But perhaps not. |  |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 11:55 - Jul 2 with 1472 views | Kievthegreat |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 06:51 - Jul 2 by GlasgowBlue |
“ Adedeji contributed 11 out of the chat’s 345 messages. One saw him pass on the postcode of one of Soyoye’s killers. ”
So in a group chat where people conspired do carry out a violent revenge attack, this ‘innocent’ person provided the postcode of one of the potential victims? That makes him complicit in a conspiracy.
A misleading headline by you banksy and a very unbalanced article by the Guardian. |
See, I'm pretty much in agreement about whether they committed a crime based on the content of the article (bearing in mind a jury had more). The defendants may have played a seemingly smaller or less direct role than those who attacked people, but sharing someones address and saying they should kidnap them or their family members is serious. If there is any serious intent or malice in the threats, which the jury must have believed existed, then I agree it is likely a crime.
However I feel the article is being a bit maligned here. It's almost as if people are stamping BDS's headline on the article. I'd ask you the same thing I asked LowHouse, which bits of the article you object to or would omit? |  | | |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 12:28 - Jul 2 with 1441 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 11:55 - Jul 2 by Kievthegreat |
See, I'm pretty much in agreement about whether they committed a crime based on the content of the article (bearing in mind a jury had more). The defendants may have played a seemingly smaller or less direct role than those who attacked people, but sharing someones address and saying they should kidnap them or their family members is serious. If there is any serious intent or malice in the threats, which the jury must have believed existed, then I agree it is likely a crime.
However I feel the article is being a bit maligned here. It's almost as if people are stamping BDS's headline on the article. I'd ask you the same thing I asked LowHouse, which bits of the article you object to or would omit? |
I think the article suffers from the build up banksy gave it. So perhaps I'm being a little unfair.
That said, it's written very much from the perspective of the people who were convicted and lacks balance imo. | |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 21:24 - Jul 2 with 1388 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 22:50 - Jul 1 by lowhouseblue |
i think that's pretty disgusting reporting by the guardian to be honest. it's the decision of a court - if you don't respect that then where are we? |
Why is it disgusting? Have you read the trial transcript? |  |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 21:28 - Jul 2 with 1386 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 12:28 - Jul 2 by GlasgowBlue |
I think the article suffers from the build up banksy gave it. So perhaps I'm being a little unfair.
That said, it's written very much from the perspective of the people who were convicted and lacks balance imo. |
If you take that approach that there can never be any articles sympathetic to people found guilty of crimes then the Guildford 4 and Birmingham 6 would still be in jail.... | |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 21:34 - Jul 2 with 1382 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 00:28 - Jul 2 by lowhouseblue |
and your evidence for a miscarriage of justice in this case? and your alternative to a judge and jury?
birmingham 6 v. today's guardian agenda. hmmmm. |
Your right-wing agenda is showing through Lowers.... | |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 21:42 - Jul 2 with 1380 views | jeera |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 22:34 - Jul 1 by Swansea_Blue |
What? You mean you’ve never attacked anyone with machetes or tried to run them over? Pah! I thought you were supposed to be well hard innit.
(There’ll be a lot more to this than the headline. Machete attacks for example aren’t exactly acceptable whatever grief you’ve been through). |
Not recently.
I have to say that on the face of it (going by the information in the article), that the assumed involvement of all those sentenced seems OTT to say the least.
Making threats and carrying them out are two very separate things and in this case the threats made didn't directly name the actual victims and were even intended for someone else altogether? I need to read it again in case that's wrong. I looked yesterday but haven't done so since.
There has been a bit of talk about this sort of sentencing lately, where people associated with people who have committed serious crime have been dealt with in a similar vein as the culprits themselves..
It will be interesting to see that happens over the next few months regarding appeals etc. [Post edited 2 Jul 2022 21:56]
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 21:53 - Jul 2 with 1371 views | jaykay |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 22:50 - Jul 1 by lowhouseblue |
i think that's pretty disgusting reporting by the guardian to be honest. it's the decision of a court - if you don't respect that then where are we? |
where are we : maybe ask the tories
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/supreme-court-tory-party-michael- |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 03:40 - Jul 4 with 1252 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 22:50 - Jul 1 by lowhouseblue |
i think that's pretty disgusting reporting by the guardian to be honest. it's the decision of a court - if you don't respect that then where are we? |
Careful! Guardian links are posted daily by TWTD users, I’m sure Phil might be hoping for some kind of lucrative deal soon. |  | | |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 08:31 - Jul 4 with 1192 views | Mullet |
Unfortunately these boys have made threats and joined in with some very dangerous and nasty people.
It is quite possible they are the stars portrayed, but they've chosen very poorly and this is why parents need to keep a close eye on their kids. This is why when we try and educate them about what they do online the message needs to be taken seriously.
The racism angle is understandable but in my opinion totally misplaced. It's no different to the Scuttlers in terms of it being a poverty and postcode problem. Trying to extricate bravado from very real criminality is an almost impossible job here and they've paid incredibly heavily you might argue.
But how do you know? |  |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 09:25 - Jul 4 with 1171 views | You_Bloo_Right |
How does one know indeed?
We assume that the jury was presented with compelling evidence that they were all part of a gang (which seemed to be a key part of the prosecution's case and strenuously denied by many of the young men) and not just messages which regurgitated rap lyrics. And yet just judging from some headlines that seemed to have been determined by the MEN before and during the trial.
Of course if one doesn't know for sure then isn't that "reasonable doubt"? | |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 09:58 - Jul 4 with 1139 views | ZXBlue |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 09:25 - Jul 4 by You_Bloo_Right |
How does one know indeed?
We assume that the jury was presented with compelling evidence that they were all part of a gang (which seemed to be a key part of the prosecution's case and strenuously denied by many of the young men) and not just messages which regurgitated rap lyrics. And yet just judging from some headlines that seemed to have been determined by the MEN before and during the trial.
Of course if one doesn't know for sure then isn't that "reasonable doubt"? |
A jury concluded beyond reasonable doubt that they were part of a conspiracy rather than just venting. They did so after hearing and seeing all the evidence. That evidence must have been very compelling indeed. Not sure how people who haven't seen and heard it all can conclude that it's not right.
We don't tend to have any objection to terrorist conspiracy leading to convictions... |  | | |
| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 16:17 - Jul 8 with 1007 views | You_Bloo_Right |
".... his appeal, which will claim the judge misdirected the jury in the eight-week trial." | |
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| Thought police....not just a twtd phenomena it seems! on 17:12 - Jul 8 with 990 views | jaykay |
i wonder how boris managed to get away with asking someone to beat up someone who he didn't like | |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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