| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations 22:28 - Oct 12 with 27617 views | Blue_Heath |
All gone quite now after tonight.
Where are you? Let's be having you!
Fabio was devastating tonight, really hope he can get a fight at Portman Road now. |  | | |  |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 17:02 - Oct 16 with 1978 views | Reus30 |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 15:48 - Oct 16 by itfcjoe |
You get more points for kicking someone in the head in karate than kicking them in the legs, so it’s clearly incentivised to kick people in the head?! |
As someone kicked in the head whilst doing karate when I was younger, it sucks as much as a punch in the face.
However, nothing compares to a kick or punch (or even a tap) to the jewels. |  | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 17:04 - Oct 16 with 1970 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 15:48 - Oct 16 by itfcjoe |
You get more points for kicking someone in the head in karate than kicking them in the legs, so it’s clearly incentivised to kick people in the head?! |
You're being very pedantic today Joseph, while avoiding my wider points about less power, less likeliness of causing damage, less frequency and higher chance of blocking.
The reason you get more points for kicking someone in the head in karate is because it's very, very difficult. And much rarer than everywhere else, for the reasons I've explained. In boxing you're mostly aiming for the head, whilst also going for the body. In karate it's the other way round.
You may well have seen national tournament/Olympic level karate on youtube where there seem to be lots of kicks to the head. That's because a) Youtube videos focus on the 'best' bits, and b) Because people at that level can get their leg up that high and so quickly that they can score before you've barely noticed them move. Honestly, at an every-day level of karate in local dojos the vast majority aren't scoring with kicks to the head. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 17:12 - Oct 16 with 1941 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 17:02 - Oct 16 by Reus30 |
As someone kicked in the head whilst doing karate when I was younger, it sucks as much as a punch in the face.
However, nothing compares to a kick or punch (or even a tap) to the jewels. |
That's just nonsense, unless you're talking about one specific kick that happened to be a worldy, you were up against someone vastly more experienced, or you were just a bit cr@p. Either way, one kick is not statistically significant. As Joe's earlier video shows, people can be knocked out by kicks. It's obviously possible. But we're talking about how much it actually happens compared with boxing.
Also, how often have you actually been punched in the face? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 20:33 - Oct 16 with 1865 views | ibbleobble |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 10:09 - Oct 16 by eireblue |
You seem to have missed that nobody has dismissed that there are up sides.
All those upsides can be gained from activities that don’t have the addition risk that boxing does have.
You are asserting that additional risk is acceptable.
What is the additional upside you get, that outweighs the additional risk.
Your arguments make assumptions about the experience of posters that you have no knowledge of. |
You and Rorry are going to love this report from the BMJ, as I know there’s clamour for a good academic article. Blows everything you’ve been chatting about out of the water. If you had experience of boxing, you’d have had a different tune - still waiting to learn about your boxing experience, which is a long time coming.
https://www.bmj.com/content/335/7624/809
note: this is for amateur, which will also cover white collar. | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 21:09 - Oct 16 with 1844 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 20:33 - Oct 16 by ibbleobble |
You and Rorry are going to love this report from the BMJ, as I know there’s clamour for a good academic article. Blows everything you’ve been chatting about out of the water. If you had experience of boxing, you’d have had a different tune - still waiting to learn about your boxing experience, which is a long time coming.
https://www.bmj.com/content/335/7624/809
note: this is for amateur, which will also cover white collar. |
A US report from more than 17 years ago!
Got anything more recent?!
I've just googled "recent studies on boxing and brain injury" myself
This is what came up;
Cardiff University study - Found that men who boxed in their youth were twice as likely to have Alzheimer's-like impairment, and that dementia onset was almost five years earlier than those who didn't box.
Systematic review and meta-analysis - Found that boxers have a higher risk of concussions than other combat sports, and that many boxers experience cognitive disorders, dementia, or amnesia.
American Academy of Neurology study - Found that both current and retired boxers and mixed martial arts (MMA) fighters experience brain volume loss.
University of Stirling study - Found that routine sparring can cause short-term impairments in brain-to-muscle communication and decreased memory performance.
Resting-state EEG study - Found that boxers have weakened functional network efficiency and small-world characteristics.
Other studies have found that - 15-40% of ex-boxers have symptoms of chronic brain injury, and most professional boxers have some degree of brain damage.
Your move. [Post edited 16 Oct 2024 21:14]
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| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 23:13 - Oct 16 with 1770 views | eireblue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 20:33 - Oct 16 by ibbleobble |
You and Rorry are going to love this report from the BMJ, as I know there’s clamour for a good academic article. Blows everything you’ve been chatting about out of the water. If you had experience of boxing, you’d have had a different tune - still waiting to learn about your boxing experience, which is a long time coming.
https://www.bmj.com/content/335/7624/809
note: this is for amateur, which will also cover white collar. |
“Blows everything you’ve been chatting about out of the water.”
I think you need to go back and read my posts.
Let’s summarise where we started.
Your statements started with “The upsides from boxing far outweigh the downsides. If you’re not familiar with them then best to understand them first.”
Then you followed up with some other condescending comments, that didn’t respond in a way that represents martial arts or combat sports very well.
And since then, until now, you haven’t presented any evidence. Only anecdotes and opinion, when people have questioned you.
You want some anecdotes of my own experience, okay.
Here is an anecdote for you, about 30 years ago, we were training a child that was getting bullied at school, we didn’t usually train children and this was an exception.
But his father was very concerned, and had been looking around at different boxing clubs and martial arts classes. We explained part of our training approach, part of which was, most people in their lives will not be attacked physically, it is illogical to therefore get hit and risk injury on a regular basis, in order to learn to protect yourself from getting hit, so the father was reassured that his son would be a bit safer with us.
Anyhoo, we took the child on and he trained with us for a while. Long story short, one day the Father came in and said thanks, the bully had apparently shouted at his child “come over here so I can punch you” our guy simply replied “no, you will have to come over here to punch me”, he had enough confidence to say that. The bullying stopped that moment.
There are many benefits to learning some martial arts and combat sports.
You do not have to do sparring or get in a ring or compete to get all those benefits.
You don’t have to punch people, you don’t have to get punched or kicked.
Over all the years I have been training, nobody has sustained any injury greater than a scratch, mainly because some student hasn’t cut their nails, tut.
Professional boxing does glorify violence, it can breed more violence, as all violence tends to do.
It is a horrible brutal sport.
Some martial art clubs and many boxing clubs are very careful about who they let in, and conduct themselves responsibly and take peoples concerns seriously.
But, the risk does exist from taking blows to the head, there is no additional benefit from taking blows to the head. Taking blows to the head is part of the sport of boxing and scoring system.
I have done a couple of training sessions with, in boxing terms a bare knuckle fighter, he never hit anyone in training.
As an aside I started learning fighty stuff before I was a teenager.
Now I have told you all that, and there is more, does that make me an expert on injury to brains?
If you want to advocate for your sport, don’t be condescending, it makes some of us cringe and continues to give us a bad rep. |  | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 05:32 - Oct 17 with 1716 views | ibbleobble |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 23:13 - Oct 16 by eireblue |
“Blows everything you’ve been chatting about out of the water.”
I think you need to go back and read my posts.
Let’s summarise where we started.
Your statements started with “The upsides from boxing far outweigh the downsides. If you’re not familiar with them then best to understand them first.”
Then you followed up with some other condescending comments, that didn’t respond in a way that represents martial arts or combat sports very well.
And since then, until now, you haven’t presented any evidence. Only anecdotes and opinion, when people have questioned you.
You want some anecdotes of my own experience, okay.
Here is an anecdote for you, about 30 years ago, we were training a child that was getting bullied at school, we didn’t usually train children and this was an exception.
But his father was very concerned, and had been looking around at different boxing clubs and martial arts classes. We explained part of our training approach, part of which was, most people in their lives will not be attacked physically, it is illogical to therefore get hit and risk injury on a regular basis, in order to learn to protect yourself from getting hit, so the father was reassured that his son would be a bit safer with us.
Anyhoo, we took the child on and he trained with us for a while. Long story short, one day the Father came in and said thanks, the bully had apparently shouted at his child “come over here so I can punch you” our guy simply replied “no, you will have to come over here to punch me”, he had enough confidence to say that. The bullying stopped that moment.
There are many benefits to learning some martial arts and combat sports.
You do not have to do sparring or get in a ring or compete to get all those benefits.
You don’t have to punch people, you don’t have to get punched or kicked.
Over all the years I have been training, nobody has sustained any injury greater than a scratch, mainly because some student hasn’t cut their nails, tut.
Professional boxing does glorify violence, it can breed more violence, as all violence tends to do.
It is a horrible brutal sport.
Some martial art clubs and many boxing clubs are very careful about who they let in, and conduct themselves responsibly and take peoples concerns seriously.
But, the risk does exist from taking blows to the head, there is no additional benefit from taking blows to the head. Taking blows to the head is part of the sport of boxing and scoring system.
I have done a couple of training sessions with, in boxing terms a bare knuckle fighter, he never hit anyone in training.
As an aside I started learning fighty stuff before I was a teenager.
Now I have told you all that, and there is more, does that make me an expert on injury to brains?
If you want to advocate for your sport, don’t be condescending, it makes some of us cringe and continues to give us a bad rep. |
I have no idea what that long winded ramble was about to be honest and you don’t actually make your position clear. If you think my tone is condescending it’s probably because we’re 10 pages in before you talk about your experience of boxing and even then, you don’t. I offered up my reasons for stating the upsides, which you neglected to acknowledge and I repeatedly countered points.
Bottom line is the BMA want to ban boxing but have no grounds. The BMJ agree there’s no grounds so just everyone should just accept the fact and stop whinging on here every time there’s a box office fight.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51338829_Doctors_should_not_try_to_ban_ | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 08:20 - Oct 17 with 1635 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 05:32 - Oct 17 by ibbleobble |
I have no idea what that long winded ramble was about to be honest and you don’t actually make your position clear. If you think my tone is condescending it’s probably because we’re 10 pages in before you talk about your experience of boxing and even then, you don’t. I offered up my reasons for stating the upsides, which you neglected to acknowledge and I repeatedly countered points.
Bottom line is the BMA want to ban boxing but have no grounds. The BMJ agree there’s no grounds so just everyone should just accept the fact and stop whinging on here every time there’s a box office fight.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51338829_Doctors_should_not_try_to_ban_ |
EVERYONE has accepted the upsides to the boxing culture.
Those same upsides can be found in various forms of sport culture or even just gym culture.
What YOU have failed to do on purpose as you know you've lost your argument is WHAT is the upside to being punched in the face. Why can't you enjoy the upsides of boxing without the punch to the face....
So tell us. Why is it an upside to be punched or to punch people on the face. Until you answer that you've not actually countered anything just rambled on about the subject without adding the most important reasoning behind your opinion..
So let's try again for the 100th time
Why do you Need to punch or be punched to be able to enjoy the health benefits of boxing..... |  |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 08:29 - Oct 17 with 1631 views | eireblue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 05:32 - Oct 17 by ibbleobble |
I have no idea what that long winded ramble was about to be honest and you don’t actually make your position clear. If you think my tone is condescending it’s probably because we’re 10 pages in before you talk about your experience of boxing and even then, you don’t. I offered up my reasons for stating the upsides, which you neglected to acknowledge and I repeatedly countered points.
Bottom line is the BMA want to ban boxing but have no grounds. The BMJ agree there’s no grounds so just everyone should just accept the fact and stop whinging on here every time there’s a box office fight.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51338829_Doctors_should_not_try_to_ban_ |
Your tone was condescending before I joined the conversation. Your initial condescension is therefore not a function of my posts.
ChatGPT helped me list the upsides, in my first post.
But, well done on posting something from 26 years ago that suggests reform.
If this conversation happened 27 years ago, I would guess you would have been equally condescending in the way tried to defend your sport.
In that report you just posted, maybe you should have read it again, and anyone enjoying this discussion, should read, the last paragraphs, especially the part starting from
“And the sport of Boxing has already undergone similar restrictions by its own aficionados…”
And continues with phrases such as “into skilled sport without the savagery…blows to the Brain would be outlawed….light punches that successfully penetrated the opponent’s guard…”
Thanks for posting validation for the training I described in my previous post, and something I was doing before that research paper was published.
Shame you didn’t read that before starting your condescending defence of boxing.
But still neither of us are experts in brain damage, and who knows what further research will bring. [Post edited 17 Oct 2024 8:36]
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 08:32 - Oct 17 with 1625 views | eireblue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 11:30 - Oct 13 by gainsboroughblue |
This has got ten pager potential. |
How many points do I get?
I am saving up for an Audi….and I haven’t been doing well on the caption competitions recently. | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:43 - Oct 17 with 1537 views | smithy69 |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 08:20 - Oct 17 by FrimleyBlue |
EVERYONE has accepted the upsides to the boxing culture.
Those same upsides can be found in various forms of sport culture or even just gym culture.
What YOU have failed to do on purpose as you know you've lost your argument is WHAT is the upside to being punched in the face. Why can't you enjoy the upsides of boxing without the punch to the face....
So tell us. Why is it an upside to be punched or to punch people on the face. Until you answer that you've not actually countered anything just rambled on about the subject without adding the most important reasoning behind your opinion..
So let's try again for the 100th time
Why do you Need to punch or be punched to be able to enjoy the health benefits of boxing..... |
There is no upside of being punched in the face - but it’s a choice some people take. Personally I enjoyed it - and never felt it affected me from a cognitive point of view. It’s a personal choice
Why do people drink beer, smoke, eat processed foods or sugar when ultimately it has no benefits, it’s just a choice we make in life which we are happy with | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:46 - Oct 17 with 1527 views | LittleBoyBlue1 |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:43 - Oct 17 by smithy69 |
There is no upside of being punched in the face - but it’s a choice some people take. Personally I enjoyed it - and never felt it affected me from a cognitive point of view. It’s a personal choice
Why do people drink beer, smoke, eat processed foods or sugar when ultimately it has no benefits, it’s just a choice we make in life which we are happy with |
You enjoyed being punched in the face?
This isn't a place for masochists - or at least I suspect it hasn't been since the ME era!
To answer you point , smoking and drinking is something people do to themselves, there's nobody else you might deliver life impairing damage to.
beating another person in the face isn't the same. | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:49 - Oct 17 with 1516 views | smithy69 |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:46 - Oct 17 by LittleBoyBlue1 |
You enjoyed being punched in the face?
This isn't a place for masochists - or at least I suspect it hasn't been since the ME era!
To answer you point , smoking and drinking is something people do to themselves, there's nobody else you might deliver life impairing damage to.
beating another person in the face isn't the same. |
Surely if 2 adults get into a ring to spar or box - then they are doing it to themselves as a choice together
Not sure people who drink and drive can be classed as not affecting others - but that’s another chat I guess. 2nd hand smoking kills btw :) [Post edited 17 Oct 2024 12:52]
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 13:21 - Oct 17 with 1474 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:43 - Oct 17 by smithy69 |
There is no upside of being punched in the face - but it’s a choice some people take. Personally I enjoyed it - and never felt it affected me from a cognitive point of view. It’s a personal choice
Why do people drink beer, smoke, eat processed foods or sugar when ultimately it has no benefits, it’s just a choice we make in life which we are happy with |
"There is no upside of being punched in the face"
Exactly, therefore this whole argument about the importance of boxing because of the upsides of it doesn't wash, there's simply no need for it and shouldn't be glorified into being something exciting.
"Why do people drink beer, smoke, eat processed foods or sugar when ultimately it has no benefits, it’s just a choice we make in life which we are happy with"
You are correct, however more and more has been done to minimise or withdraw completly any glorification of these aspects to children, we don't see ITFC inviting junior blues along to find out how many pints the players like to drink. Or come and have a picture with ... smoking a ciggy.
Everyone has a choice I 100% agree with you, and if you yourself enjoy boxing, then that is entirely your decision and I applaud you for doing something you personally enjoy.
But there is absolutely no way in this day in age that combat sports where the aim is to punch the opponents head should be advertised, broadcasted and sold as sport to people of all ages and hopefully one day it will be banned as a broadcasted sport. | |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 14:00 - Oct 17 with 1444 views | Mullet |
Baffled this got to ten posts, let alone pages. Then had a read through. Some outstanding posts in here.
Kudos to the OP for turning dogsh1t to diamonds here with no real effort. |  |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 10:54 - Oct 25 with 1034 views | yorkshireblue |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 11:30 - Oct 13 by gainsboroughblue |
This has got ten pager potential. |
Ding ding |  | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 11:01 - Oct 25 with 1023 views | Ryorry |
Seems bonkers to me - however, these comments of hers were interesting -
“A lot of the injuries are superficial – they are cuts and not the same as taking repeated blows to the head with gloves which could end up in something serious.
Everyone says bare knuckle must be very dangerous and there is no protection, but I can honestly say that the pre-fight and after-fight medical care for my fight on Saturday was better than any boxing situation I have been in.“ [Post edited 25 Oct 2024 11:05]
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:05 - Oct 25 with 988 views | Mullet |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 11:01 - Oct 25 by Ryorry |
Seems bonkers to me - however, these comments of hers were interesting -
“A lot of the injuries are superficial – they are cuts and not the same as taking repeated blows to the head with gloves which could end up in something serious.
Everyone says bare knuckle must be very dangerous and there is no protection, but I can honestly say that the pre-fight and after-fight medical care for my fight on Saturday was better than any boxing situation I have been in.“ [Post edited 25 Oct 2024 11:05]
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Bar knuckle is really fascinating and niche. If you go back to the Victorian era and beyond it was massive as both a sport, and way to settle insults and disputes without duelling to the death. You also had Catch wrestling up this way as an alternative.
The thing is, you have to hit to the body more and box a lot more savvy with bare knuckle. The gloves in boxing really do give you a lot more leeway and potential to hit someone in the head repeatedly. With bare knuckle you just can’t do that ( as someone who broke his hand and now has it deformed, I speak from experience).
Much like the nonsense spoken about kicks to the head in this thread - there’s different types of fights that require different skills and dish out different punishment to the body. Pretending they’re all the same or safer is pretty futile, it’s just a case of picking your poison. | |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 13:12 - Oct 25 with 927 views | Ryorry |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:05 - Oct 25 by Mullet |
Bar knuckle is really fascinating and niche. If you go back to the Victorian era and beyond it was massive as both a sport, and way to settle insults and disputes without duelling to the death. You also had Catch wrestling up this way as an alternative.
The thing is, you have to hit to the body more and box a lot more savvy with bare knuckle. The gloves in boxing really do give you a lot more leeway and potential to hit someone in the head repeatedly. With bare knuckle you just can’t do that ( as someone who broke his hand and now has it deformed, I speak from experience).
Much like the nonsense spoken about kicks to the head in this thread - there’s different types of fights that require different skills and dish out different punishment to the body. Pretending they’re all the same or safer is pretty futile, it’s just a case of picking your poison. |
Interesting, thanks. | |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 19:25 - Oct 25 with 810 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 12:05 - Oct 25 by Mullet |
Bar knuckle is really fascinating and niche. If you go back to the Victorian era and beyond it was massive as both a sport, and way to settle insults and disputes without duelling to the death. You also had Catch wrestling up this way as an alternative.
The thing is, you have to hit to the body more and box a lot more savvy with bare knuckle. The gloves in boxing really do give you a lot more leeway and potential to hit someone in the head repeatedly. With bare knuckle you just can’t do that ( as someone who broke his hand and now has it deformed, I speak from experience).
Much like the nonsense spoken about kicks to the head in this thread - there’s different types of fights that require different skills and dish out different punishment to the body. Pretending they’re all the same or safer is pretty futile, it’s just a case of picking your poison. |
I think most people would understand the comments about kicks in this thread are general comments, not about every kick in every fight ever. Don't think anyone's pretending they're all the same.
It's a fact that boxers punch more to the head than karateka kick to it.
It's also a fact that your fists are closer to the opponent's head than your feet. [Post edited 26 Oct 2024 8:26]
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| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 22:28 - Oct 25 with 790 views | cressi |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 13:51 - Oct 16 by LittleBoyBlue1 |
Not glorified is it.
But, yes, the same principle applies. What benefits come from beating another human. Whether that be karate or, to a much great extent, boxing. Why would anyone want to get involved or watch such a thing. Completely unhinged behaviour.
Showing another violent sport isn't really the defence of boxing you think it is. |
The simple answer if you don't want to be punched Don't box get a job for 12 pound a hour for the next 45 yrs. | | | |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 08:26 - Oct 26 with 694 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Seem to recall a lot of people bashing Fabio during promotion celebrations on 22:28 - Oct 25 by cressi |
The simple answer if you don't want to be punched Don't box get a job for 12 pound a hour for the next 45 yrs. |
Are they the only two options? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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