| Sunday Thoughts 07:47 - Oct 27 with 4213 views | bsw72 |
The simple fact is currently we are not good enough to stay up, we are not making enough chances, giving away possession, soft goals and compounding all of that with far too many mistakes. In too many games this season, we have been the architect of our own downfall, we have given too many cheap goals to Man CIty, West Ham, Everton and now Brentford.
I think it all leads back to when we have the ball. Our passing lacks the decisiveness of the last 2 years (exception being the first 2 goals yesterday), we are taking an extra touch which in the PL you do not get the time/space, and as a result get closed down and subsequently give the ball away while players are often slightly out of position. As a result we put ourselves under pressure and then find ourselves scrambling at the back, making mistakes and giving goals away.
We have shown we can compete for periods, but rarely for the whole 90 mins - too often in games we have lost control and composure for a 5-10 minute period and conceded multiple goals in those periods.
I don't think it is down to just ability, our players have that, the bigger problem is now mental, and with every game without a win, the monkey on the back gets bigger.
Winning is a habit, but so is not winning - we have not seen how McKenna reacts in this situation as we have not been in this situation for the last few years - now is the time he needs to show how good a manager he really is, especially considering our injury list. |  | | |  |
| Sunday Thoughts on 07:54 - Oct 27 with 4155 views | Nutkins_Return |
I agree with the opening statement with the emphasis on 'currently'. I think the architects of our own downfall bit is something all fans say of their own team but the reality is the division is hard and the teams packed with quality. We are learning on the job and I think have to accept the standard of the opposition and players is a big part.
We are a young team and can evolve, learn, adapt and improve as the season goes on. We will need 2-3 signings in Jan. Striker, unfortunately Ogbene replacement and another CM for me.
McKenna showed this game what a good manager he is. Deplated squad, back to back defeats and we were brilliant first half until last couple of mins. Such a shame. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 07:54 - Oct 27 with 4155 views | Chrisd |
That's the long and the short of it currently. Our passing, although good on the eye, is so slow in comparison to a lot of the sides we have played this season. Along with not creating that many chances, we are far too easy to score against which puts us on the back foot when we concede first and makes the game an uphill challenge. I know many were moaning about the stats shared on MOTD last night, but what can't talk, can't lie and those figures made for concerning reading, however much you want to dismiss them. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 7:56]
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| Sunday Thoughts on 08:17 - Oct 27 with 4000 views | WeWereZombies |
I disagree with your second paragraph somewhat, I feel we are not taking enough touches when in possession and playing the ball too quickly at times. This leads to misplaced passes and loss of possession, forcing us into unproductive movement when we could control games more and build from the back. With a two man midfield we are always going to be vulnerable when our attacks break up so we need to minimise the number of times that happens. Would be more boring to watch but if we can manage that in games better results will follow. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 08:19 - Oct 27 with 3978 views | MK1 |
I wouldn't say we are not good enough to stay up, just that it is taking a while for all the squad to buy into McKenna's style. A few tweaks here and there and who knows. Yesterday was very encouraging I thought. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 08:33 - Oct 27 with 3939 views | bazza |
Show how good a manager he really is?? , some people are in cuckoo land.. we’ve got injuries which is costing us, and we’ve played some of the top teams in the Europe , with a squad of new players from the championship, and the rest from our league 1 season.. I really don’t understand why people are so confused by the position we are in, Everton still a top top side, West Ham still a top top side , toe to toe with Brentford, gave a good showing to city and Liverpool , toe to toe with Fulham , Villa and away to Brighton, nicked a draw at saints.. individual errors will cost us against teams in the best league in Europe .. we owe McKenna and that team, nothing but our full backing whatever the outcome this season.. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 8:34]
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| Sunday Thoughts on 08:39 - Oct 27 with 3866 views | blueasfook |
We scored 3 goals and gave away a 2 goal lead. That's the frustrating thing. We've never had a better chance of 3 pts this season. Defence is letting us down. We're just shipping goals too easily. I don't know what the fook Muric was doing for the fourth goal yesterday. Embarrassing. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 09:28 - Oct 27 with 3631 views | Garv |
The simple fact is actually we are good enough to stay up currently, we're 17th. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 09:41 - Oct 27 with 3545 views | Kev_W |
| Sunday Thoughts on 07:54 - Oct 27 by Nutkins_Return |
I agree with the opening statement with the emphasis on 'currently'. I think the architects of our own downfall bit is something all fans say of their own team but the reality is the division is hard and the teams packed with quality. We are learning on the job and I think have to accept the standard of the opposition and players is a big part.
We are a young team and can evolve, learn, adapt and improve as the season goes on. We will need 2-3 signings in Jan. Striker, unfortunately Ogbene replacement and another CM for me.
McKenna showed this game what a good manager he is. Deplated squad, back to back defeats and we were brilliant first half until last couple of mins. Such a shame. |
The team will certainly improve but can it do this in time to avoid relegation? A new core of a competitive team is beginning to become visible. Yesterday you could see the potential of the Philips -Cajuste partnership; Delap, Hirst, Szmodics all offer a goal threat; Davis, Greaves, Tuanzebe make 3 of a useful back four; Hutchinson and Clarke add to the attacking mix. That’s not to write off the others but another attacking option, a tough defensive leader and a box-to-box midfielder would make a big difference.
We do need those new players in January but it will be a very difficult transfer window especially for a team low in the PL table. The team is short on pace and physicality and these characteristics apply to almost every position to be recruited. | | | |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 09:54 - Oct 27 with 3461 views | Chrisd |
| Sunday Thoughts on 08:39 - Oct 27 by blueasfook |
We scored 3 goals and gave away a 2 goal lead. That's the frustrating thing. We've never had a better chance of 3 pts this season. Defence is letting us down. We're just shipping goals too easily. I don't know what the fook Muric was doing for the fourth goal yesterday. Embarrassing. |
If you watch that 4th goal again, I think Muric is anticipating a defender or striker might get a head on it, but equally he doesn't move his feet, just dives from where he is standing. If he got a quick half a step in, he would have tipped that round the post. | |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 09:56 - Oct 27 with 3447 views | Churchman |
| Sunday Thoughts on 08:33 - Oct 27 by bazza |
Show how good a manager he really is?? , some people are in cuckoo land.. we’ve got injuries which is costing us, and we’ve played some of the top teams in the Europe , with a squad of new players from the championship, and the rest from our league 1 season.. I really don’t understand why people are so confused by the position we are in, Everton still a top top side, West Ham still a top top side , toe to toe with Brentford, gave a good showing to city and Liverpool , toe to toe with Fulham , Villa and away to Brighton, nicked a draw at saints.. individual errors will cost us against teams in the best league in Europe .. we owe McKenna and that team, nothing but our full backing whatever the outcome this season.. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 8:34]
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I totally agree with your last sentence. Full backing required. Not happy clapping, just support. The club deserves that. That includes the keeper. Getting on his back Andy Marshall style won’t help.
McKenna is a quick learner and I suspect he had a grasp of the gap far better than most, including me. It’s a mile wide.
There is an aspect of your interesting post I have to disagree with I’m afraid. Everton and West Ham are not top PL sides. Everton possibly nearer mid table, but they are not Liverpool. We were beaten out of sight by both them and WHU.
As for Brentford, I’ve not seen the game so won’t comment but the result depressed the hell out of me - more than any other and I’m not sure why. Liverpool? Like a lower league team in the cup we gave it a go for an hour but by the end we’re lucky to hold it to 2-0. Man City got out of second gear and that was that.
Villa and Fulham, creditable draws. Again, we gave it a go and deserved a point. There was hope for me after the Villa game. We looked like we were coming together and did a lot of good things. But the last few games have slammed the door on that.
The simple fact is that we don’t control games for long enough and have a woeful defence. We look ‘light’ and easy to play against. Poor teams and ones without confidence will make errors. I don’t know why but they also seem to attract more injuries too (misplaced perception or because they’re on the back foot chasing?). Regardless we have the points and record we deserve after nine games and it’s short of what’s required at this level - at the moment.
I guess that’s why I advocate more of a return more to last years team. Ok, players might not be the best, but it had cohesion, life and above all grit. No second touches in that team because the players knew where each other were.
On the upside and to contradict myself, Greaves is a good acquisition, Delap obviously. Hutchinson, despite doubts by some, is going to be a fantastic player. J Clarke will also have a good career at this level. Davis is proving himself and in his brief appearances, so is Hirst. I’d like to see Broadhead in the team. Quick feet and footballing brain. I also think Woolfenden and Burgess are not the worst. Burns: better player than he looks. Midfielders? Taylor’s done ok, Morsy is Morsy.
Random thoughts. The trick of this is the first sentence of this motley ramble. Stay with it. McKenna and the crew know what they are doing and have more than earned our support. He’s the best young manager in the game and will learn more from this than any other period in his time here.
The more difficult things are, the harder you work and you never give up. As long as my team does that, I’ll be happy regardless of whether they’re relegated or survive. |  | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 10:14 - Oct 27 with 3346 views | bsw72 |
| Sunday Thoughts on 08:33 - Oct 27 by bazza |
Show how good a manager he really is?? , some people are in cuckoo land.. we’ve got injuries which is costing us, and we’ve played some of the top teams in the Europe , with a squad of new players from the championship, and the rest from our league 1 season.. I really don’t understand why people are so confused by the position we are in, Everton still a top top side, West Ham still a top top side , toe to toe with Brentford, gave a good showing to city and Liverpool , toe to toe with Fulham , Villa and away to Brighton, nicked a draw at saints.. individual errors will cost us against teams in the best league in Europe .. we owe McKenna and that team, nothing but our full backing whatever the outcome this season.. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 8:34]
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The point is that this squad and manager has only faced promotion races, because they are good; but a relegation battle needs a different mentality and approach which presents a very new challenge for him and this team, and how quickly this team's mentality can adapt to it under his leadership is critical.
Performances against Liverpool and Villa do give hope, as do the battling performance at Brighton. However toe to toe with Brentford maybe a positive but we lost, we lost to an average Everton side who had not won away for 10 months (we did not have a shot on target until the 80th minute), the performance against West Ham was very poor and we certainly need to be picking up more than a scraped point at Southampton.
We took a massive step backwards performance wise against both West Ham and Everton, but yesterday was more positive.
I never talked about not getting my full backing, I am delighted with the squad and McKenna, compared to where we were 24 months ago, but my point still stands, to stay up they will have to demonstrate quite how good a manager McKenna really is. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 10:15]
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| Sunday Thoughts on 10:22 - Oct 27 with 3294 views | bsw72 |
| Sunday Thoughts on 08:17 - Oct 27 by WeWereZombies |
I disagree with your second paragraph somewhat, I feel we are not taking enough touches when in possession and playing the ball too quickly at times. This leads to misplaced passes and loss of possession, forcing us into unproductive movement when we could control games more and build from the back. With a two man midfield we are always going to be vulnerable when our attacks break up so we need to minimise the number of times that happens. Would be more boring to watch but if we can manage that in games better results will follow. |
Not sure - watch how the more successful sides play out of the back - they do take more touches when building for the opportunity to split the next line of opposition defence, but as soon as that opportunity presents, it is one touch football.
It's a balance. | | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 10:44 - Oct 27 with 3180 views | victorysquad |
Fans like you are the problem. We need to move onto the next game and treat
Each game as learning. If you start to think like you are then i agree we are done for. But we should have gone 3-0 up and we would have won, then you
Are talking about how we can climb the league. These are fine margins and each incremental improvement will move us closer to a point where we can compete and win games. You just need to keep the faith, be patient and enjoy the ride | |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 10:52 - Oct 27 with 3147 views | Hipsterectomy |
We won’t beat Derby’s 12 points |  |
| Walter Smith's Barmy Army |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 11:51 - Oct 27 with 2982 views | ArnieM |
Cut out the weekly defensive gifts to our opponents and we definitely WILL stay up. The fact thst it's different players each week making these unforced errors ( some players more frequently than others), is a clear indicator that 100% concentration everso for 90+ mins IS the issue. Sort this, and we're good to go. . |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 11:59 - Oct 27 with 2954 views | carlo88 |
Concur with Churchman, that result was one of the most depressing for ages. More for what it might do for confidence and morale. Goalkeeper is a big problem. |  | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 12:21 - Oct 27 with 2904 views | Churchman |
| Sunday Thoughts on 11:51 - Oct 27 by ArnieM |
Cut out the weekly defensive gifts to our opponents and we definitely WILL stay up. The fact thst it's different players each week making these unforced errors ( some players more frequently than others), is a clear indicator that 100% concentration everso for 90+ mins IS the issue. Sort this, and we're good to go. . |
The trouble is that errors define poor teams. It’s what they do and why they lose most weeks and get relegated. I watched Sheffield U in a game last season. Had they cut out the comedy defending, they’d have been in the game. But the players were simply incapable of playing to the level required, so they got trampled on.
The table doest’t lie and nor does our points tally, or lack of them. It is what it is and we are what we are. However many we score, most teams will score more unless we improve individually and collectively. But that depressing comment is based on the here and now.
Next game or in the next few games, who knows. Football fortunes do change if you work at it and I’ve no doubt that McKenna and the players will do just that. Keep the faith. | | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 13:06 - Oct 27 with 2811 views | bsw72 |
| Sunday Thoughts on 10:44 - Oct 27 by victorysquad |
Fans like you are the problem. We need to move onto the next game and treat
Each game as learning. If you start to think like you are then i agree we are done for. But we should have gone 3-0 up and we would have won, then you
Are talking about how we can climb the league. These are fine margins and each incremental improvement will move us closer to a point where we can compete and win games. You just need to keep the faith, be patient and enjoy the ride |
Fans like me? You don’t know me, I’m voicing my opinion that now is the time for McKenna to show how good he is and adapt to a relegation battle rather than a promotion challenge.
I’ve never booed the team or shown anything less than 100% support.
Disappointing that you choose to look for division among the fan base rather than discuss the football challenge the team faces. | | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 14:10 - Oct 27 with 2657 views | victorysquad |
| Sunday Thoughts on 13:06 - Oct 27 by bsw72 |
Fans like me? You don’t know me, I’m voicing my opinion that now is the time for McKenna to show how good he is and adapt to a relegation battle rather than a promotion challenge.
I’ve never booed the team or shown anything less than 100% support.
Disappointing that you choose to look for division among the fan base rather than discuss the football challenge the team faces. |
This sort of comment “ now is the time he needs to show how good a manager he really is” is just nonsense. He has far the most difficult job in the League, Leicester and Soton had far better squads to start off with. It will take time and the only way we
Will succeed is by sticking with the process. Zero point sticking the boot in and over analysing, we need to literally take the lessons from the last three and move on, pretend it never happened. Next week we go again, it is a brand new game, what matters is what happens from now moving forward only. We cannot get stuck in a
Negative mental cycle. We are going to have the same mental challenges the players will have when we lose, but collectively we have to let them go because we need to be at it next saturday for 90 mins once more.
Next Saturday, great opportunity to get our first three points,
Take vardy out the game and we win. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 14:14]
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| Sunday Thoughts on 16:13 - Oct 27 with 2486 views | bsw72 |
| Sunday Thoughts on 14:10 - Oct 27 by victorysquad |
This sort of comment “ now is the time he needs to show how good a manager he really is” is just nonsense. He has far the most difficult job in the League, Leicester and Soton had far better squads to start off with. It will take time and the only way we
Will succeed is by sticking with the process. Zero point sticking the boot in and over analysing, we need to literally take the lessons from the last three and move on, pretend it never happened. Next week we go again, it is a brand new game, what matters is what happens from now moving forward only. We cannot get stuck in a
Negative mental cycle. We are going to have the same mental challenges the players will have when we lose, but collectively we have to let them go because we need to be at it next saturday for 90 mins once more.
Next Saturday, great opportunity to get our first three points,
Take vardy out the game and we win. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 14:14]
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So by your statement my point stands, it is time to show how good a manager he really is, doesn’t mean he is not doing well already but if he has the toughest of jobs as you say then he’ll have to be a hell of a manager to keep us up. I don’t get why you’re so riled by one sentence which is not exactly sticking the boot in?!? | | | |
| Sunday Thoughts on 16:16 - Oct 27 with 2471 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
I got as far as "we are not making enough chances".
I suppose most sides expect to score more than 3 away from home. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 16:29 - Oct 27 with 2401 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Sunday Thoughts on 08:33 - Oct 27 by bazza |
Show how good a manager he really is?? , some people are in cuckoo land.. we’ve got injuries which is costing us, and we’ve played some of the top teams in the Europe , with a squad of new players from the championship, and the rest from our league 1 season.. I really don’t understand why people are so confused by the position we are in, Everton still a top top side, West Ham still a top top side , toe to toe with Brentford, gave a good showing to city and Liverpool , toe to toe with Fulham , Villa and away to Brighton, nicked a draw at saints.. individual errors will cost us against teams in the best league in Europe .. we owe McKenna and that team, nothing but our full backing whatever the outcome this season.. [Post edited 27 Oct 2024 8:34]
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Probably goes back to
"We aren't here to make up the numbers"
Similar to when steed said watch out league 1. When we finished outside the top 6.
I'm surprised Ashton has been so quick to talk about levels when he was so adament we weren't going to be making up the numbers.. |  |
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| Sunday Thoughts on 16:33 - Oct 27 with 2376 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Sunday Thoughts on 09:28 - Oct 27 by Garv |
The simple fact is actually we are good enough to stay up currently, we're 17th. |
Erm | |
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