| Jaden Philogene 23:11 - Feb 27 with 6871 views | quad |
I just want to share my concerns regarding Philogene based on my observations over the last couple of games. I'm not intending to slag him off and say we wasted 20 million and that he's no better than what we already had or to stir up all the nonsense surrounding his agent etc...
BUT... he clearly needs to improve. I'll be honest and say that his performance against Spurs was very, very poor. IMO he showed no threat whatsoever. He could not beat a man, passing was poor, he looked very lightweight, he did not press with any real conviction, he looked afraid to put in a tackle etc.
Hutch is small and slight as well, but he presses and put himself about so much better. You can see how much it means to him.
On to the Man U game and Philogene was slightly improved. However, I personally feel that both his goals were extremely fortunate and clouded another somewhat abject performance. In fairness, he did well to stay on his feet and avoid being wiped out by the keeper for the 1st, and it was a decent cross to Delap for the 2nd goal. Having said that, you would be lucky to score 2 goals like that over the course of a season let alone in the same game.
There is clearly a player there and given time I am sure that there is a good chance he will shine. Likewise with Jack Clarke. But we need it NOW.
On to my main concern which is this. He barely celebrated either goal IMO, and his whole body language appeared to indicate that he wasn't overly bothered. When Delap got his first goal for Ipswich you could see his elation and how much it meant to him. With Philogene it looked like the whole of both games was a training ground practise session. I appreciate that Cajuste was supposed to be marking Maguire for their 3rd, but Philogene was in and around that area and didn't even make a token gesture to genuinely challenge for the ball.
Some players clearly give their all and would run through a brick wall for the team. You can clearly see the effort from players like Delap, Morsy, Phillips and Burgess even if they are not playing well or things aren't going their way.
Could we genuinely say the same about Philogene based on the evidence of the last couple of games? Am I being overly critical or unfair? Or do other posters feel that he would not die for the cause or does not care as much as others? Thoughts? |  | | |  |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:23 - Feb 27 with 5089 views | badadski |
I’ll be honest I just don’t think we needed him and think that Clarke will be a better player in the long run on the left which is where philogene should be playing not on the right where his left foot let’s him down when cutting in. Would rather hutch, burns or ogbene on the right but seems we will have to persist with him based on money spent similar to muric even if he doesn’t look that good. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:32 - Feb 27 with 5037 views | quad |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:23 - Feb 27 by badadski |
I’ll be honest I just don’t think we needed him and think that Clarke will be a better player in the long run on the left which is where philogene should be playing not on the right where his left foot let’s him down when cutting in. Would rather hutch, burns or ogbene on the right but seems we will have to persist with him based on money spent similar to muric even if he doesn’t look that good. |
I agree. Clarke at least showed moments of class and a hunger for the game. His patchy form is not through lack of effort. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:36 - Feb 27 with 5011 views | positivity |
that's a bit unfair, not many players will give it the big one after scoring a goal like that, he works very hard off the ball.
it'll take him a little while to get fully up to speed with our patterns, and remember he came in injured, but there's definitely a player in there. 3 goals in his last 3 games shows he's getting in the right places [Post edited 27 Feb 23:46]
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| Jaden Philogene on 23:40 - Feb 27 with 4982 views | FoghornGleghorn |
Overthinking a bit, maybe - in his Hull highlights reel he's pretty muted in all his celebrations too, didn't even go quite as mad as you might expect when he'd just Rabona'd one of the goals of the season into the top corner. Just seems a bit of a quiet lad, and that's fair enough. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:49 - Feb 27 with 4928 views | quad |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:36 - Feb 27 by positivity |
that's a bit unfair, not many players will give it the big one after scoring a goal like that, he works very hard off the ball.
it'll take him a little while to get fully up to speed with our patterns, and remember he came in injured, but there's definitely a player in there. 3 goals in his last 3 games shows he's getting in the right places [Post edited 27 Feb 23:46]
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Appreciate your reply, I acknowledge that I probably am being incredibly unfair, just calling it as I've seen it over the last couple of games. I didn't realise he had been injured to be honest, just thought he hadn't been picked because he'd been poor in training. I will try and cut him some more slack, just frustrating cos we don't have time to bed players in, if we've got any chance of staying up we need to be 100% on it n all areas now, not in half a dozen games time. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:49 - Feb 27 with 4928 views | bournemouthblue |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:36 - Feb 27 by positivity |
that's a bit unfair, not many players will give it the big one after scoring a goal like that, he works very hard off the ball.
it'll take him a little while to get fully up to speed with our patterns, and remember he came in injured, but there's definitely a player in there. 3 goals in his last 3 games shows he's getting in the right places [Post edited 27 Feb 23:46]
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Yeh, I think he was almost a bit apologetic given the nature of it
Neither goal will feel quite the same as a goal he has totally earned I guess, even if it was at Old Trafford |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 23:52 - Feb 27 with 4900 views | quad |
| Jaden Philogene on 23:40 - Feb 27 by FoghornGleghorn |
Overthinking a bit, maybe - in his Hull highlights reel he's pretty muted in all his celebrations too, didn't even go quite as mad as you might expect when he'd just Rabona'd one of the goals of the season into the top corner. Just seems a bit of a quiet lad, and that's fair enough. |
OK, fair enough, I do tend to overthink things, it was just my first impressions. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 06:35 - Feb 28 with 4528 views | Blue_Heath |
Agree with most of what you said although I thought his tracking back was much better v Man U compared to Spurs.
Like you though the team spirit or lack of concerns me. | | | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 with 4227 views | ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:29 - Feb 28 with 4223 views | SomethingBlue |
Football fans are appalling judges of body language and this is the 386567874585438147813050784949th example. | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:29 - Feb 28 with 4210 views | SomethingBlue |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
Oh no ... | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:33 - Feb 28 with 4116 views | itfcjoe |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
Young black men always have to put up with this criticism |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:34 - Feb 28 with 4123 views | itfcjoe |
Philogene by itfcjoe 27 Feb 16:03We signed him because he’s one we’ve targeted for a long time who became available - timeline hurt us though….we signed Philogene prior to Man City game, then Enciso prior to Liverpool, and then Burns was injured…..I think fair to say had Burns been injured earlier in window we may have changed things but we tried to get players in early and maybe back fired.
It surprises, and saddens, me to see how much stick he is getting today when he was probably our best performer last night. He seems to be being judged incredibly harshly by some - he scored a couple of goals, pressed really hard, worked back really hard, but was maybe a bit too timid on the ball at times in the second half but took up good positions and stretched the game well.
He’s definitely a marked man (not by you Frimmers)
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:34 - Feb 28 with 4102 views | Mullet |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
Based on what exactly? |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 08:38 - Feb 28 with 4023 views | portmanking |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:33 - Feb 28 by itfcjoe |
Young black men always have to put up with this criticism |
I didn't like to say it, but I did fear the undertones from some fans re. Philogene. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:48 - Feb 28 with 3913 views | ghostofescobar |
Most of that seems a bit harsh. The only comment I would make, to pick up on one of your pints, is remember what Hutch was like when he got here. Hardly ever tackled, pressed, harried, didn't run his nuts off off the ball, lightweight, little end product....look what KM and the coaching staff have done with him in 18 months. Give him time. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:08 - Feb 28 with 3812 views | NthQldITFC |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
I had to log in and temporarily edit my ignore list to downvote and comment on this utterly sh!t post. Well done you. I probably shouldn't have bothered though.
Some of the sh!t on here appals me at the moment. I can't understand how actual Town fans (I know you are one, unlike some of the other fifth columnists around at the moment) can be so ungrateful and entitled and unsupportive.
This post may not go down well, but I'm thinking of leaving here anyway. |  |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:12 - Feb 28 with 3759 views | SomethingBlue |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:08 - Feb 28 by NthQldITFC |
I had to log in and temporarily edit my ignore list to downvote and comment on this utterly sh!t post. Well done you. I probably shouldn't have bothered though.
Some of the sh!t on here appals me at the moment. I can't understand how actual Town fans (I know you are one, unlike some of the other fifth columnists around at the moment) can be so ungrateful and entitled and unsupportive.
This post may not go down well, but I'm thinking of leaving here anyway. |
Quite aside from the undertones of that post, I agree with you – we seem to have some very harsh judges nowadays. Everything has to be "poor" if it's not brilliant. Time and patience at a premium. It's baffling. The mutterings about Philogene are a case in point. | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:14 - Feb 28 with 3720 views | NedPlimpton |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
What makes you think that he comes across as arrogant? |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:20 - Feb 28 with 3643 views | portmanking |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:12 - Feb 28 by SomethingBlue |
Quite aside from the undertones of that post, I agree with you – we seem to have some very harsh judges nowadays. Everything has to be "poor" if it's not brilliant. Time and patience at a premium. It's baffling. The mutterings about Philogene are a case in point. |
Somewhat bizarrely, these are mutterings about a player that's averaging a goal every other game for us! | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:24 - Feb 28 with 3576 views | witchdoctor |
I honestly haven’t looked at anything he’s done for previous clubs but what are his main attributes?..dribbling?…shooting?…combo of both?…just that up to now, in the limited time, he’s been with us , he hasn’t really shone in either. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:25 - Feb 28 with 3565 views | Nutkins_Return |
Or we could give him a chance as he's very recently joined a new team.
Did nobody watch anything of his career last season. On an individual basis very few of our team matched his performances last season!? Yes it was in the champ (as we're we) but he's such a talented lad and is young. McKenna/We are in a position where we have to build and sign this type of high potential. Please stop expecting them to be premier league world beaters when they walk through the door.
What we want and what some fans feel entitled to is not the reality of the market we are shopping in. Some will hit the ground running faster than others (Delap but even he had a pre-season and actually got better once season started). We needed a lot of luck this season with how quickly young lads could excel. | |
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| Jaden Philogene on 09:28 - Feb 28 with 3521 views | Suffolktractor |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:27 - Feb 28 by ArnieM |
Philogene comes across as arrogant to me. I could be wrong of course, but personally I wouldn't have him anywhere near the first team and see that £20m as a complete and utter waste of money. |
When did you speak to him to form your opinion that he is arrogant? What did you talk about?
Incredible put down off someone you have never met or interacted with.
He is a young man with bags of talent who has come into a team on a terrible run with confidence shot to pieces and yet it seems a number of our fans have decided to pick on the new boy. | | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:36 - Feb 28 with 3386 views | BloomBlue |
Personally as I've said on other posts I don't think Philogene is PL ready yet. But I will give him some credit for the 2 goals against ManU.
Yes the first one is a cockup by the ManU players, but he could have stood back and not chased the ball. If you watch the defender, he's looking over his shoulder constantly as he knows Philogene is right behind him, thus totally unaware the GK is coming out, resulting in the stupid back pass.
Second is a GK error but it's a great ball in. Right in the danger area, just far enough out for the GK to dive out and grab it, but close enough for the defenders to 1) think the GK might get it and 2) worry if they do put their foot on it they could direct it into the net. OK we got lucky with Delap's movement probably adding to the confusion. But fans spent most of the 2nd half bemoaning us putting a decent ball into the box, so I will give him credit for that re the 2nd goal. |  | | |
| Jaden Philogene on 09:45 - Feb 28 with 3283 views | ibbleobble |
| Jaden Philogene on 08:33 - Feb 28 by itfcjoe |
Young black men always have to put up with this criticism |
Although a neutral generalisation it does border on stereotyping with the word, "always". | | | |
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