| John Duncan 13:13 - Dec 18 with 15944 views | el_nino |
Was reading a thread below about attendances etc which inevitably turned to MM and better/worse managers than him.
I’ve noticed that people really didn’t rate John Duncan and put him down as one of our worst managers. Looking at the stats his win record was actually pretty decent, albeit in the second division (45% win rate which puts him up there). I didn’t start to watch Town until the end of the Lyall era in 1994, so I was wondering what was so bad about Duncan? Was it the manner of football played? His attitude? |  | | |  |
| John Duncan on 13:30 - Dec 18 with 9323 views | brazil1982 |
It was around that era I started to go regularly. He was a decent man. Expectations were high as we had not long been relegated, but our team was weak.
He had very little investment, and at times the football was quite poor - but we had some honest pro's - Stockwell, Milton, Zondervan etc who really cared for the club.
His win rate is quite surprising. |  | | |
| John Duncan on 13:31 - Dec 18 with 9318 views | farkenhell |
I think it was a combination of a few things. First, we had been spoiled over many years with the success of the Robson era, which was the benchmark for successive managers (Ferguson then Duncan). Secondly, there was a sense of entitlement that we ought to gain promotion from the second tier to the top division ("Ipswich is a first division club"). Thirdly, the disappointment that a promising young manager acquired from a lower league club couldn't deliver success.
Sits back and waits for the 5-pager... | | | |
| John Duncan on 13:38 - Dec 18 with 9303 views | farkenhell |
| John Duncan on 13:30 - Dec 18 by brazil1982 |
It was around that era I started to go regularly. He was a decent man. Expectations were high as we had not long been relegated, but our team was weak.
He had very little investment, and at times the football was quite poor - but we had some honest pro's - Stockwell, Milton, Zondervan etc who really cared for the club.
His win rate is quite surprising. |
Worth pointing out that we also saw Dozzell snr's progression into a first team regular and the emergence of Dalian Atkinson and Chris Kiwomya - admittedly alongside some fairly ropey signings.
Also, I think it's fair to say that Duncan's decision making was questionable. For example, signing an experienced international sweeper (Baltacher) but then persistently playing him out of position.
Warky's assesment of him in his autobiography makes for some interesting reading. | | | |
| John Duncan on 14:31 - Dec 18 with 9220 views | JimmyJazz |
| John Duncan on 13:38 - Dec 18 by farkenhell |
Worth pointing out that we also saw Dozzell snr's progression into a first team regular and the emergence of Dalian Atkinson and Chris Kiwomya - admittedly alongside some fairly ropey signings.
Also, I think it's fair to say that Duncan's decision making was questionable. For example, signing an experienced international sweeper (Baltacher) but then persistently playing him out of position.
Warky's assesment of him in his autobiography makes for some interesting reading. |
But he didn't like Dalian and ended up selling him for a pittance. Dalian was too flash and entertaining for a dull ole Duncan side |  |
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| John Duncan on 14:34 - Dec 18 with 9212 views | JimmyJazz |
Ipswich under John Duncan were just bang mid table average. Never any chance of finishing in the bottom half, but never troubling the top sides in the league. It only took Lyall maybe 18 months to turn us into champions | |
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| John Duncan on 14:41 - Dec 18 with 9201 views | ParisBlue |
| John Duncan on 14:31 - Dec 18 by JimmyJazz |
But he didn't like Dalian and ended up selling him for a pittance. Dalian was too flash and entertaining for a dull ole Duncan side |
Some decent players in that team but underachieved. Atkinson, Brennan, Dozzell, Gleghorn, Cranson, Forrest, Cranson, Linighan, Humes, Lowe, Zondervan, Stockwell, not forgetting Milton, Gayle, Wark and Thompson.
A better manager would have got much closer to promotion as John Lyall proved. He only really added Goddard and Whitton to the players he inherited. |  |
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| John Duncan on 15:28 - Dec 18 with 9141 views | GeoffSentence |
Mostly it was the contrast with what had gone before, I think. Only a few years had passed since the joys of the dutchmen, and passing football , winning major trophies and being one of the best clubs in Europe to being a mid table second tier club whose philosophy was to lump it into the box and see what happened.
On top of that he signed some right old shlt, like Harbey and Neil Woods. |  |
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| John Duncan on 15:42 - Dec 18 with 9116 views | Illinoisblue |
| John Duncan on 14:34 - Dec 18 by JimmyJazz |
Ipswich under John Duncan were just bang mid table average. Never any chance of finishing in the bottom half, but never troubling the top sides in the league. It only took Lyall maybe 18 months to turn us into champions |
we finished 8th, 8th, and 9th under Duncan so a little better than midtable although we never really threatened the top six on any sustained basis. |  |
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| John Duncan on 15:42 - Dec 18 with 9114 views | monty_radio |
| John Duncan on 14:41 - Dec 18 by ParisBlue |
Some decent players in that team but underachieved. Atkinson, Brennan, Dozzell, Gleghorn, Cranson, Forrest, Cranson, Linighan, Humes, Lowe, Zondervan, Stockwell, not forgetting Milton, Gayle, Wark and Thompson.
A better manager would have got much closer to promotion as John Lyall proved. He only really added Goddard and Whitton to the players he inherited. |
Arguably all of those would make today's squad which shows how unrealistic some people's expectation is for our current lot.
Curiously, on his return to Chesterfield, he took them to the F.A. cup semi-final. and a further promotion. | |
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| John Duncan on 15:43 - Dec 18 with 9115 views | Pendejo |
| John Duncan on 14:41 - Dec 18 by ParisBlue |
Some decent players in that team but underachieved. Atkinson, Brennan, Dozzell, Gleghorn, Cranson, Forrest, Cranson, Linighan, Humes, Lowe, Zondervan, Stockwell, not forgetting Milton, Gayle, Wark and Thompson.
A better manager would have got much closer to promotion as John Lyall proved. He only really added Goddard and Whitton to the players he inherited. |
Lyall also sold Bryan Gayle and brought back John Wark for 3rd stint with club in 91/92 and playing him at centre back, which was a masterstroke. |  |
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| John Duncan on 15:49 - Dec 18 with 9092 views | Illinoisblue |
| John Duncan on 15:28 - Dec 18 by GeoffSentence |
Mostly it was the contrast with what had gone before, I think. Only a few years had passed since the joys of the dutchmen, and passing football , winning major trophies and being one of the best clubs in Europe to being a mid table second tier club whose philosophy was to lump it into the box and see what happened.
On top of that he signed some right old shlt, like Harbey and Neil Woods. |
it was a remarkable decline; from league challengers and UEFA Cup winners to Harbey and co in Division 2 in the space of just six years. | |
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| John Duncan on 15:55 - Dec 18 with 9066 views | imsureazzure |
| John Duncan on 13:38 - Dec 18 by farkenhell |
Worth pointing out that we also saw Dozzell snr's progression into a first team regular and the emergence of Dalian Atkinson and Chris Kiwomya - admittedly alongside some fairly ropey signings.
Also, I think it's fair to say that Duncan's decision making was questionable. For example, signing an experienced international sweeper (Baltacher) but then persistently playing him out of position.
Warky's assesment of him in his autobiography makes for some interesting reading. |
His decision making varied depending which bottle of Scotch he was on.
He presented the awards for a boxing dinner show at the the Copdock hotel, rambling mess. |  | | |
| John Duncan on 15:56 - Dec 18 with 9058 views | hype313 |
| John Duncan on 15:55 - Dec 18 by imsureazzure |
His decision making varied depending which bottle of Scotch he was on.
He presented the awards for a boxing dinner show at the the Copdock hotel, rambling mess. |
Didn't he go from managing a professional club in the second division to a local high school PE teacher within a year? |  |
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| John Duncan on 15:58 - Dec 18 with 9050 views | BOjK |
| John Duncan on 15:43 - Dec 18 by Pendejo |
Lyall also sold Bryan Gayle and brought back John Wark for 3rd stint with club in 91/92 and playing him at centre back, which was a masterstroke. |
It wasn't intentional. He lucked into that decision, because Warky happened to be in the building.
Obviously Lyall was an excellent manager for us, but that wasn't as a result of any great planning on his part. |  |
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| John Duncan on 16:00 - Dec 18 with 9035 views | Lord_Lucan |
| John Duncan on 15:56 - Dec 18 by hype313 |
Didn't he go from managing a professional club in the second division to a local high school PE teacher within a year? |
I could be wrong but I thought it was the other way round.
My fading memory thinks he went from Ipswich to PE Teacher at Capel and then on to being cheated out of an FA Cup Final with Chesterfield. |  |
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| John Duncan on 16:01 - Dec 18 with 9031 views | BOjK |
| John Duncan on 15:42 - Dec 18 by Illinoisblue |
we finished 8th, 8th, and 9th under Duncan so a little better than midtable although we never really threatened the top six on any sustained basis. |
On at least on occasion we finished the season really strongly under him, taking 13 points from the last 15 IIRC. And we still weren't really close to the play-offs, so the recollection we had at the time wasn't that we were close and missed out, but that we were always a long way away and just got close to the play-offs when it was too late.
Ian Redford absolutely slated him in his book. | |
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| John Duncan on 16:02 - Dec 18 with 9026 views | GeoffSentence |
| John Duncan on 16:00 - Dec 18 by Lord_Lucan |
I could be wrong but I thought it was the other way round.
My fading memory thinks he went from Ipswich to PE Teacher at Capel and then on to being cheated out of an FA Cup Final with Chesterfield. |
Hadleigh High wasn't it?
Either way Capel or Hadleigh, John Duncan was blessed to be within the Ipswich-Shotley-Sudbury Golden Triangle. | |
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| John Duncan on 16:05 - Dec 18 with 9007 views | fabian_illness |
Lyall got us promoted but also saddled us with Mick Mcgiven. |  | | |
| John Duncan on 16:06 - Dec 18 with 9001 views | hype313 |
| John Duncan on 16:02 - Dec 18 by GeoffSentence |
Hadleigh High wasn't it?
Either way Capel or Hadleigh, John Duncan was blessed to be within the Ipswich-Shotley-Sudbury Golden Triangle. |
Hadleigh High School | |
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| John Duncan on 16:26 - Dec 18 with 8948 views | ITFC_Forever |
| John Duncan on 15:58 - Dec 18 by BOjK |
It wasn't intentional. He lucked into that decision, because Warky happened to be in the building.
Obviously Lyall was an excellent manager for us, but that wasn't as a result of any great planning on his part. |
Yep, after Humes got injured (had his teeth kicked out in the Churchmans penalty area) in his first game to try and make the position his own after Gayle was sold.
Wark says himself, he was about to go in the Job Centre on the Handford Rd / Portman Rd junction to sign on and couldn't bring himself to do it, so walked down PR, in to the ground through the Constantine Rd entrance to see who was about. His timing was impeccable as Humes had just suffered his injury and Lyall was desperate for another CB. The rest is history. |  |
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| John Duncan on 16:29 - Dec 18 with 8941 views | Illinoisblue |
| John Duncan on 16:26 - Dec 18 by ITFC_Forever |
Yep, after Humes got injured (had his teeth kicked out in the Churchmans penalty area) in his first game to try and make the position his own after Gayle was sold.
Wark says himself, he was about to go in the Job Centre on the Handford Rd / Portman Rd junction to sign on and couldn't bring himself to do it, so walked down PR, in to the ground through the Constantine Rd entrance to see who was about. His timing was impeccable as Humes had just suffered his injury and Lyall was desperate for another CB. The rest is history. |
if it did play out like that, it's amazing. A script so OTT that Roy of the Rovers would have turned it down. | |
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| John Duncan on 16:29 - Dec 18 with 8939 views | Deano69 |
| John Duncan on 14:34 - Dec 18 by JimmyJazz |
Ipswich under John Duncan were just bang mid table average. Never any chance of finishing in the bottom half, but never troubling the top sides in the league. It only took Lyall maybe 18 months to turn us into champions |
Sounds familiar |  |
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| John Duncan on 18:15 - Dec 18 with 8812 views | gainsboroughblue |
| John Duncan on 16:29 - Dec 18 by Illinoisblue |
if it did play out like that, it's amazing. A script so OTT that Roy of the Rovers would have turned it down. |
Must admit, it's the first I've heard of that but I do know that Warky was at a loose end and had been released by Boro. What cannot be doubted though, is his impact in that third spell. What a player he was. A true ITFC hero. |  |
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| John Duncan on 18:54 - Dec 18 with 8763 views | stonojnr |
I'd add to the rest that he had no relationship with the fans,and seemed to pick random players in random positions constantly square pegs in round holes, it never felt like teams were set out to win,the results just happened and we were just drifting | | | |
| John Duncan on 19:07 - Dec 18 with 8747 views | Pinewoodblue |
| John Duncan on 18:15 - Dec 18 by gainsboroughblue |
Must admit, it's the first I've heard of that but I do know that Warky was at a loose end and had been released by Boro. What cannot be doubted though, is his impact in that third spell. What a player he was. A true ITFC hero. |
Boro had a change of manager and the new bloke wanted players to live within a reasonable distance , and not hours away. Wark was already training with Town, to keep fit, and as he says was in the right place at the right time. |  |
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